Thursday, June 1, 1995

7086 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 ALBANY, NEW YORK 10 June 1, 1995 11 10:06 a.m. 12 13 14 REGULAR SESSION 15 16 17 18 SENATOR JOHN R. KUHL, JR., Acting President 19 STEPHEN F. SLOAN, Secretary 20 21 22 23 7087 1 P R O C E E D I N G S 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 3 Senate will come to order. Members please take 4 their places, staff their places. I'd ask 5 everybody in the chamber to rise and join me in 6 saying the Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag. 7 (The assemblage repeated the 8 Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.) 9 In the absence of clergy, may we 10 bow our heads in a moment of silence. 11 (A moment of silence was 12 observed. 13 Reading of the Journal. 14 THE SECRETARY: In Senate, 15 Wednesday, May 31st. The Senate met pursuant to 16 adjournment, Senator Kuhl in the Chair upon 17 designation of the Temporary President. The 18 Journal of Tuesday, May 30th, was read and 19 approved. On motion, Senate adjourned. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Hearing 21 no objection, the Journal stands approved as 22 read. 23 Presentation of petitions. 7088 1 Messages from the Assembly. 2 Messages from the Governor. 3 Reports of standing committees. 4 Reports of select committees. 5 Communications and reports from 6 state officers. 7 Motions and resolutions. The 8 Chair recognizes Senator DiCarlo. 9 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 10 on my behalf, please remove the sponsor's star 11 on Calendar 195. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: At the 13 request of the sponsor, the star will be removed 14 on Calendar Number 195. 15 SENATOR DiCARLO: On behalf of 16 Senator Goodman, please place a sponsor's star 17 on Calendar 98. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Calendar 19 Number 98 will be starred at the request of the 20 sponsor. 21 Senator DiCarlo. 22 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 23 on page 46, I offer the following amendments to 7089 1 Calendar Number 494, Senate Print 3155, and ask 2 that said bill retain its place on Third Reading 3 Calendar on behalf of Senator Cook. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 5 Amendments to Calendar Number 494 are received 6 and adopted. Bill will retain its place on the 7 Third Reading Calendar. 8 Senator DiCarlo. 9 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 10 on behalf of Senator Seward, I wish to call up 11 his bill, Print Number 2016, recalled from the 12 Assembly which is now at the desk. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 14 will read the title. 15 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 16 197, by Senator Seward, Senate Print 2016, an 17 act to amend the Tax Law, in relation to 18 eliminating the expiration of provisions. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 20 DiCarlo. 21 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 22 I now move to reconsider the vote by which this 23 bill was passed. 7090 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 2 will call the roll on reconsideration. 3 (The Secretary called the roll on 4 reconsideration. ) 5 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 35. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 7 DiCarlo. 8 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 9 I now offer the following amendments. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 11 Amendments are received and adopted. 12 Senator Farley. 13 SENATOR FARLEY: Mr. President, 14 on behalf of Senator Velella on page 48, I offer 15 the following amendments to Calendar Number 764, 16 Senate Print 2587, and I ask that that bill 17 retain its place on the Third Reading Calendar. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 19 Amendments to Calendar Number 764 are received 20 and adopted. Bill will retain it place on the 21 Third Reading Calendar. 22 Senator Farley. 23 SENATOR FARLEY: On behalf of 7091 1 Senator Seward, Mr. President, on page 9, I 2 offer the following amendments to Calendar 3 Number 307, Senate Print 2825, and I ask that 4 that bill retain its place. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 6 Amendments to Calendar Number 307 received and 7 adopted. The bill will retain its place on the 8 Third Reading Calendar. 9 Senator Farley. 10 SENATOR FARLEY: Mr. President, 11 on behalf of Senator Holland, I wish to call up 12 his bill, Senate Print Number 32, which was 13 recalled from the Assembly which is now at the 14 desk. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 16 will read the title. 17 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 18 565, by Senator Holland, Senate Print 32, an act 19 to amend the Highway Law, in relation to 20 increasing bonded indebtedness in the town of 21 Ramapo. 22 SENATOR FARLEY: I now move to 23 reconsider the vote by which this bill was 7092 1 passed. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 3 will call the roll on reconsideration. 4 (The Secretary called the roll on 5 reconsideration. ) 6 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 35. 7 SENATOR FARLEY: I now offer the 8 following amendments. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 10 Amendments are received and adopted. 11 Senator Farley. 12 SENATOR FARLEY: On behalf of 13 Senator Seward, I wish to call up his bill, 14 Print Number 3827A, which was recalled from the 15 Assembly which is now at the desk. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 17 Secretary will read the title. 18 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 19 743, by Senator Seward, Senate Print 3827A. 20 SENATOR FARLEY: I now move to 21 reconsider the vote by which this bill was 22 passed. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 7093 1 will call the roll on reconsideration. 2 (The Secretary called the roll on 3 reconsideration. ) 4 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 38. 5 SENATOR FARLEY: I now offer the 6 following amendments. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 8 Amendments are received and adopted. 9 Senator Hoblock. 10 SENATOR HOBLOCK: Mr. President, 11 Calendar Number 736, Senate Bill 1633, I'd like 12 to star that, please. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Calendar 14 Number 736 is starred at the request of the 15 sponsor. 16 The Chair recognizes Senator 17 Bruno. 18 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, 19 can we call an immediate meeting of the Finance 20 Committee in Room 332. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There 22 will be an immediate meeting of the Senate 23 Finance Committee in Room 332, the Majority 7094 1 Conference Room. Immediate meeting of the 2 Senate Finance Committee, Room 332. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 4 DiCarlo, why do you rise? 5 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 6 I have a privileged resolution at the desk. I 7 waive the reading. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 9 DiCarlo, there is a privileged resolution at the 10 desk. I'll ask the Secretary to read the 11 title. 12 THE SECRETARY: By Senator 13 DiCarlo, Legislative Resolution, commending the 14 Bay Ridge Community Council at the 44th Annual 15 Dinner Dance, June 2nd, 1995. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Question 17 is on the resolution. All those in favor 18 signify by saying aye. 19 (Response of "Aye.") 20 Opposed nay. 21 (There was no response. ) 22 The resolution is adopted. 23 Senator Wright. 7095 1 SENATOR WRIGHT: Mr. President, I 2 would request that a sponsor's star be placed on 3 Calendar Number 730, Senate 2258. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Calendar 5 Number 730 will be starred at the request of the 6 sponsor. 7 The Chair recognizes Senator 8 Bruno. 9 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, 10 can we at this time recognize Senator Maziarz 11 for a resolution. Would you please read the 12 title? 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is 14 a privileged resolution by Senator Maziarz at 15 the desk. I'll ask the Secretary to read the 16 title. 17 THE SECRETARY: By Senator 18 Maziarz, Legislative Resolution praising the 19 value of the Niagara Falls Air Reserve Station 20 and memorializing the Base Realignment and 21 Closure Commission to remove the station from 22 its list of bases being considered for closure 23 or realignment. 7096 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 2 Maziarz, on the resolution. 3 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Mr. President, 4 on Saturday, the base -- federal Base Closure 5 Commission is going to be meeting in Boston, 6 Massachusetts, to consider the closure of some 7 six bases in the United States, one of which is 8 the last remaining Air Force base in New York 9 State which is located in Niagara Falls, New 10 York, more specifically in the town of Niagara 11 in Niagara County, and I know that Governor 12 Pataki plans to appear before that commission 13 along with myself and several of the Assemblymen 14 from the Niagara region to convince the 15 commission that this base is an important 16 employer and an important base for the security 17 of the whole northeastern United States, and I 18 would move its adoption, Mr. President. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Question 20 is on the resolution. All those in favor 21 signify by saying aye. 22 (Response of "Aye.") 23 Opposed nay. 7097 1 (There was no response. ) 2 The resolution is adopted. 3 Senator Bruno. 4 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, 5 can we at this time read the title of a 6 resolution by Senator Michael Hoblock. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is 8 a privileged resolution by Senator Hoblock at 9 the desk. Secretary will read the title. 10 THE SECRETARY: By Senator 11 Hoblock, Legislative Resolution commending Very 12 Reverend Archbishop Daniel Donovan, Pastor of 13 St. Basil Orthodox Church, Maplewood, Watervliet 14 upon the occasion of his designation for special 15 honor on June 4th, 1995. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Question 17 is on the resolution. All those in favor 18 signify by saying aye. 19 (Response of "Aye.") 20 Opposed nay. 21 (There was no response. ) 22 The resolution is adopted. 23 Senator Bruno, that brings us to 7098 1 the calendar. 2 SENATOR BRUNO: And now, Mr. 3 President, can we take up the non-controversial 4 calendar. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 6 will read the non-controversial calendar. 7 THE SECRETARY: On page 6, 8 Calendar Number 164, by Senator Marchi, Senate 9 Print 2198A, an act to amend the Not-for-Profit 10 Corporation Law, in relation to not-for-profit 11 corporations formed to construct, develop, plan, 12 site, lease, operate or own municipal 13 facilities. 14 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside, 15 please. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 17 bill aside. 18 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 19 198, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 2655A, an 20 act to amend the Tax Law, in relation to the 21 timing of consideration of mortgage recording 22 tax revenues. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 7099 1 will read the last section. 2 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This 3 act shall take effect immediately. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 5 roll. 6 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 7 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 9 is passed. 10 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 11 402, by Senator Kuhl, Senate Print 2314. 12 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay aside. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 14 bill aside. 15 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 16 423, by Senator Johnson, Senate Print 1987, an 17 act to amend the Domestic Relations Law, in 18 relation to visitation rights to infant grand 19 children. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 21 will read the last section. 22 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 23 act shall take effect immediately. 7100 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 2 roll. 3 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 4 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 6 is passed. 7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 8 424, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 2107, an 9 act to amend the Domestic Relations Law, in 10 relation to making a technical change with 11 respect to conferring visitation rights. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 13 will read the last section. 14 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 15 act shall take effect 90 days. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 17 roll. 18 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 19 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 21 is passed. 22 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 23 425, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 2113A, an 7101 1 act to amend the Family Court Act, in relation 2 to authorizing the court to permit a petitioner 3 or respondent in cases involving family 4 violence. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 6 will read the last section. 7 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 8 act shall take effect on the 90th day. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 10 roll. 11 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 12 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 14 is passed. 15 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 16 427, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 2594, an 17 act to amend the Social Services Law, in 18 relation to child abuse and maltreatment 19 hearings. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 21 will read the last section. 22 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 23 act shall take effect on the 1st day of 7102 1 January. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 3 roll. 4 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 5 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 7 is passed. 8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 9 428, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 3474, an 10 act to amend the Social Services Law and the 11 Domestic Relations Law, in relation to venue and 12 termination of parental rights. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 14 will read the last section. 15 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 16 act shall take effect immediately. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 18 roll. 19 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 20 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 44. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 22 is passed. 23 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7103 1 592, by Senator Wright, Senate Print 2261, an 2 act to amend the Education Law and the Mental 3 Hygiene Law, in relation to education regarding 4 alcohol and drugs. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 6 will read the last section. 7 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 8 act shall take effect September 1st. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 10 roll. 11 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 12 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 44. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 14 is passed. 15 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 16 605, by Senator Hannon, Senate Print 3540, an 17 act to amend the emergency - 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 19 bill aside. 20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 21 634, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 320, an act 22 in relation to authorizing a review of current 23 drug-impaired driving education and establishing 7104 1 a public information campaign for pedestrian 2 safety. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 4 will read the last section. 5 THE SECRETARY: Section 7. This 6 act shall take effect immediately. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 8 roll. 9 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce 11 the results when tabulated. 12 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 43, nays 13 one, Senator Rath recorded in the negative. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 15 is passed. 16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 17 658, by Senator Cook, Senate Print 3154, an act 18 to amend Chapter 564 of the Laws of 1994 19 relating to the creation of a temporary state 20 coordinating council. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 22 will read the last section. 23 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 7105 1 act shall take effect immediately. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 3 roll. 4 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 5 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 44. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 7 is passed. 8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 9 659, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 3579, an 10 act to amend the Executive Law, in relation to 11 the community services block grant program for 12 the distribution of funds. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 14 will read the last section. 15 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This 16 act shall take effect immediately. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 18 roll. 19 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 20 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 44. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 22 is passed. 23 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7106 1 710, by Senator Rath, Senate Print 3904A, an act 2 to amend the State Administrative Procedure Act, 3 in relation to model plans or documents. 4 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 6 bill aside. 7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 8 731, by Senator Wright, Senate Print 3266, an 9 act to amend the Executive Law, in relation to 10 the drug abuse resistance education program. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 12 will read the last section. 13 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 14 act shall take effect immediately. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 16 roll. 17 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 46. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 20 is passed. 21 Senator Farley. 22 SENATOR FARLEY: Mr. President, 23 I'd like to be recorded in the negative on 634. 7107 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 2 objection, hearing no objection, Senator Farley 3 will be recorded in the negative on Calendar 4 Number 634. 5 Secretary will continue to call 6 the non-controversial calendar. 7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 8 745, by Senator Kuhl, Senate Print 3909A, an act 9 in relation to authorizing the city of Elmira, 10 county of Chemung, to transfer a portion of 11 Diven Park. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is 13 a home rule message at the desk. Secretary will 14 read the last section. 15 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 16 act shall take effect immediately. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 18 roll. 19 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 20 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 46. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 22 is passed. 23 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7108 1 747, by Senator Kuhl, Senate Print 4218, an act 2 in relation to authorizing the city of Elmira, 3 county of Chemung to transfer park land. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There's a 5 home rule message at the desk. Secretary will 6 read the last section. 7 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 8 act shall take effect immediately. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 10 roll. 11 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 12 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 46. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 14 is passed. 15 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 16 770, by Senator DeFrancisco, Senate Print 4228. 17 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay aside. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 19 bill aside. 20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 21 789, by Senator DeFrancisco, Senate Print 3649A, 22 an act authorizing the town of Camillus to 23 discontinue use as park lands certain lands 7109 1 heretofore acquired for park and other public 2 purposes. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There's a 4 home rule message at the desk. Secretary will 5 read the last section. 6 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This 7 act shall take effect immediately. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 9 roll. 10 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 11 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 46. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 13 is passed. 14 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 15 791, by Senator Kuhl, Senate Print 4116A, an act 16 to amend the Real Property Tax Law, in relation 17 to providing an exemption from real property 18 taxation. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There's a 20 local fiscal impact note at the desk. 21 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Lay aside. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 23 bill aside. 7110 1 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Is that 790. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: That's 3 791; is that the bill you wished to lay aside? 4 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Yes. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 6 bill aside. 7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 8 803, by Senator DiCarlo, Senate Print 4635, an 9 act to amend Chapter 993 of the Laws of 1981 10 relating to senior citizens employment. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 12 will read the last section. 13 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 14 act shall take effect immediately. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 16 roll. 17 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 46. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 20 is passed. 21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 22 815, by Senator Kruger, Senate Print 1871, an 23 act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law, in 7111 1 relation to the definition of auxiliary police 2 officer. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 4 will read the last section. 5 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 6 act shall take effect immediately. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 8 roll. 9 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 10 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 46. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 12 is passed. 13 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 14 926, by member of the Assembly Vitaliano, 15 Assembly Print 2225, an act to amend Chapter 929 16 of the Laws of 1986, amending the Tax Law, 17 relating to the Metropolitan Transportation 18 Authority. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 20 will read the last section. 21 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 22 act shall take effect immediately. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 7112 1 roll. 2 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 3 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 46. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 5 is passed. 6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7 936, by Senator Goodman, Senate Print 4002, an 8 act to amend the Public Buildings Law, in 9 relation to deleting the value limitations on 10 contracts authorized to be let. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 12 will read the last section. 13 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 14 act shall take effect immediately. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 16 roll. 17 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 46. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 20 is passed. 21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 22 946, by Senator Leibell, Senate Print 2614, an 23 act to amend the Executive Law, in relation to 7113 1 providing and maintaining alarms. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 3 will read the last section. 4 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 5 act shall take effect immediately. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 7 roll. 8 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 9 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 46. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 11 is passed. 12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 13 949, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 3470, an 14 act to amend the Domestic Relations Law, in 15 relation to confidentiality of records. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 17 will read the last section. 18 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 19 act shall take effect on the 90th day. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 21 roll. 22 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 23 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 46. 7114 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 2 is passed. 3 Senator Bruno, that completes the 4 non-controversial calendar. 5 The Chair recognizes Senator 6 Rath. 7 SENATOR RATH: Yes, Mr. 8 Chairman. I'd like to be recorded in the 9 negative on 926. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 11 objection, and hearing no objection, Senator 12 Rath will be recorded in the negative on 13 Calendar Number 926. 14 Senator Bruno. 15 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, 16 can we at this time take up the controversial 17 calendar. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 19 will read the controversial calendar. 20 Senator Paterson, why do you 21 rise? 22 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President, 23 a point of order. We have several committee 7115 1 meetings going on at the point that we are now 2 in deliberation on controversial bills and 3 yesterday we adjourned at a point that we 4 started committee meetings running and we had 5 members who were unable to vote on this side for 6 legislation to which they were opposed. 7 Unless we are going to stand at 8 ease at the end of the session for a 9 considerable period of time to give those 10 members the opportunity to come back here and 11 vote no, then I have to object to taking up the 12 calendar, the controversial calendar, at this 13 time, because it is limiting the opportunity for 14 those who want to express their disagreement 15 because they are attending committee meetings. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 17 Bruno, would you like to speak to that? 18 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, 19 we're very conscious of some of the changes in 20 schedules for the day and for the most recent 21 days. I think presently we have a Finance 22 Committee meeting. We're trying, based on the 23 lateness of the hour in terms of doing a state 7116 1 budget, we're trying to move the process along 2 towards our date by calendar of June 15th which 3 is our adjournment day in this house, and unless 4 we do more in terms of committee meetings, 5 holding sessions, we will be here in September, 6 never mind July. 7 So all of us recognize that we 8 want an orderly procedure. We want to be in 9 formed. We want to be able to vote and we want 10 this chair to be cooperative in that. 11 But I would appreciate my 12 colleagues understanding that we are contending 13 with some very complex and difficult times and 14 an extra day in keeping this budget from the 15 people of this state is not in the best 16 interests of the majority of the people of this 17 state. So that's all that we're trying to do, 18 Mr. President, is move the process forward, and 19 I appreciate my colleague, Senator Paterson, in 20 his concerns and we will recognize those and we 21 will defer to those whenever we can because 22 we're both interested in the same things, an 23 orderly process giving members an opportunity to 7117 1 vote and know what they're voting on. We 2 totally concur in that. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 4 Paterson, does that take care of your concern? I 5 think the Majority Leader has indicated he wants 6 to be cooperative, but he also wants to meet a 7 regular schedule. He wants to make sure that 8 you get home on June 16th to be with your 9 family. 10 SENATOR PATERSON: Well, Mr. 11 President, that's actually a very good idea, and 12 all we were suggesting, we're not really 13 objecting. The process -- as a matter of fact, 14 the process this year has been far more orderly 15 than at any time and we've started and adjourned 16 and it has made it a lot easier for schedules 17 and we'd really like to commend the Majority 18 Leader for that, and in raising this what we - 19 what I actually did, rather than the sort of 20 pedantic sense of just complaining, I offered an 21 alternative which is that had we just stood at 22 ease rather than adjourned to give the members 23 time to come back and cast their votes 7118 1 yesterday, that would have been quite 2 sufficient. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 4 Bruno. 5 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, we 6 will accept that, and that's a valid 7 recommendation and we will do that for those of 8 you that are aware, that have to be at committee 9 meetings, and can't be in two places, we will 10 keep the calendars open for those specific 11 purposes so people can vote at an appropriate 12 time, and if that doesn't work for any reason, 13 then we'll talk about it and make whatever 14 adjustments are necessary to accommodate the 15 members. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 17 will -- Senator Paterson, I assume now that you 18 are agreeable to that, to your suggestion? The 19 Majority Leader has indicated he will do that. 20 SENATOR PATERSON: Absolutely, 21 Mr. President, without a doubt, without any 22 reservation -- excuse me. 23 THE SECRETARY: On page 6, 7119 1 Calendar Number 164, by Senator Marchi, Senate 2 Print Number 2198A, an act to amend the 3 Not-for-Profit Corporation Law, with relation to 4 not-for-profit corporations formed to construct, 5 develop, plan, site, lease, operate or own 6 municipal facilities. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 8 Paterson. 9 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President, 10 may we lay that aside just temporarily for 11 Senator Jones, who is out of the chamber. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: I think 13 Senator Marchi is at a Senate Finance Committee 14 also, so we'll lay the bill aside. 15 SENATOR PATERSON: Would you 16 recognize Senator Montgomery who has a committee 17 meeting and would like to cast a vote on a 18 previous bill. 19 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Thank you. 20 Mr. Chairman, Mr. President, I would like to be 21 recorded in the negative on Calendar Number 427. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 23 objection and hearing no objection, Senator 7120 1 Montgomery will be recorded in the negative on 2 Calendar Number 427. Senator DeFrancisco, why 3 do you rise? 4 SENATOR DeFRANCISCO: I would 5 request unanimous consent to be recorded in the 6 negative on Calendar Number 634. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 8 objection, and hearing no objection, Senator 9 DeFrancisco will be recorded in the negative on 10 Calendar Number 634. 11 Senator Holland, why do you rise? 12 SENATOR HOLLAND: May I also be 13 recorded in the negative on Calendar Number 634, 14 please. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 16 objection, hearing no objection, Senator Holland 17 will be recorded in the negative on Calendar 18 Number 634. 19 The Secretary will continue to 20 call the controversial calendar. 21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 22 402, by Senator Kuhl, Senate Print 2314, an act 23 to amend the General Obligations Law, in 7121 1 relation to the liability for negligence of 2 owners or operators of pools. 3 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 5 bill aside for the day. 6 Senator Bruno. 7 SENATOR BRUNO: I believe, Mr. 8 President, there is a resolution by Senator 9 Gold. Can we have it read at this time and move 10 its adoption. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: We'll 12 return to resolutions and motions. There is a 13 privileged resolution by Senator Gold at the 14 desk. I'll ask the Secretary to read the title. 15 THE SECRETARY: By Senator Gold, 16 Legislative Resolution, commemorating the 25th 17 Anniversary of the OHEL Children's Home and 18 Family Services and honoring Ruth Schoenfeld on 19 the occasion of her designation for special 20 commendation. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 22 question is on the resolution. All those in 23 favor signify by saying aye. 7122 1 (Response of "Aye.") 2 Opposed nay. 3 (There was no response. ) 4 The resolution is adopted. 5 Return to the controversial 6 calendar. Secretary will continue to read. 7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 8 605, by Senator Hannon, Senate Print Number 9 3540, an act to amend the Emergency Tenant 10 Protection Act of 1974 and the Administrative 11 Code of the city of New York. 12 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 14 Hannon, an explanation has been asked for of 15 Calendar Number 605. 16 SENATOR HANNON: This bill, Mr. 17 President, would amend the city administrative 18 code to provide that when a foreclosure action 19 on a mortgage has been taken to its conclusion 20 on a cooperative building and cooperative 21 ownership status, that instead of the building 22 reverting to a rent controlled status -- rent 23 stabilized status, that instead the building 7123 1 would not revert to rent stabilized status. 2 This bill does not apply to 3 tenants who are still rental tenants. It only 4 would apply to the units that are cooperatives. 5 This is designed to make sure that the law does 6 not work in an unfair fashion and it is designed 7 to, in essence, reverse the holding in a case in 8 state court called DiSantis, as well as a 9 holding in federal court, Federal Home Loan 10 Mortgage versus the State Division. 11 And why this drastic thing is 12 important? It's because every cooperative in the 13 city and the state has been adversely affected 14 by the status of these cases. How have they 15 been adversely affected? Well, the value of 16 those mortgages, if these cases continue, has to 17 be much less than were previously supposed and 18 if the value of those mortgages are much less, 19 the banks don't want to hold them, and 20 furthermore, the banks don't want to give any 21 further loans to those cooperatives. 22 Now, the net effect is not 23 because we love the cooperatives so much, but 7124 1 rather we want to be fair to the individuals who 2 purchased those cooperatives and have an equity 3 stake in them and through no fault of their own 4 perhaps a downturn in the real estate market, 5 the building itself has gone to foreclosure. So 6 this law is designed to work a fairness towards 7 the owners of these cooperatives. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 9 Secretary will read the last section. 10 SENATOR PATERSON: A minute. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 12 Paterson. 13 SENATOR PATERSON: Senator, I'm 14 sorry. I thought an announcement was going to 15 be made. 16 SENATOR HANNON: Could we finish 17 the bill, Mr. President, if that's possible. 18 SENATOR BRUNO: We're going to 19 just announce a committee meeting in Room 123, 20 the Elections Committee, called in behalf of 21 Senator Maltese. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There 23 will be an immediate meeting of the Elections 7125 1 Committee in Room 123 of the Capitol, immediate 2 meeting of the Elections Committee in Room 3 Number 123 of the Capitol. 4 Thank you for the interruption, 5 Senator Paterson. Senator Paterson. 6 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr. 7 President, and if Senator Hannon would spare 8 just a brief question. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 10 Hannon, do you yield to Senator Paterson for a 11 question? 12 SENATOR HANNON: That I will. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 14 yields. 15 SENATOR PATERSON: Senator, there 16 are two cases that apply to this particular 17 legislation that you're probably familiar with, 18 DiSantis versus White Rose and FHLMC, Federal 19 Housing Loan Mortgage Corporation versus New 20 York State Division of Housing, and if I'm not 21 correct, it would appear that they cover pretty 22 much what's being set forth in your legislation, 23 and so the only question I have would be that 7126 1 which would alleviate my confusion as to where 2 this legislation goes beyond the court dicta to 3 establish any new law that has already been 4 resolved in those previous cases. 5 SENATOR HANNON: Well, this is to 6 change that law. This is to say that the 7 valuation -- first of all, directly it's to 8 change the law so that you don't have the 9 reversion and, by the way, those cases are 10 probably correctly reasoned given the current 11 phrasing of the statute, but it is to change 12 that law directly, and second, in the federal 13 court case, there was dicta that said all of the 14 existing mortgages on co-ops must be -- will be 15 valued in a certain way, which had the net 16 effect of decreasing the value of those 17 mortgages and that means those banks holding 18 that portfolio have no desire to (a) hold the 19 portfolio and (b) to grant any new mortgages, so 20 that this is a -- it is dicta, but it is a 21 disruptive factor in the entire co-op market in 22 the city of New York. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 7127 1 Paterson. 2 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President, 3 I'm going to yield to allow us to read the last 4 section and allow Senator Smith, who has an 5 elections Committee to cast her vote. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 7 will read the last section. 8 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 9 act shall take effect immediately. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 11 roll. 12 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 14 Smith, how do you vote? 15 SENATOR SMITH: No. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 17 Smith will be recorded in the negative. Roll 18 call is withdrawn. Senator Paterson to continue 19 on debate? Senator Paterson. 20 SENATOR PATERSON: No further 21 questions, Mr. President. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 23 Secretary will read the last section. 7128 1 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 2 act shall take effect immediately. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 4 roll. 5 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce 7 the results when tabulated. 8 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 9 the negative on Calendar Number 605 are Senators 10 Abate, Connor, Espada, Goodman, Kruger, 11 Markowitz, Onorato, Paterson and Smith. Ayes 12 42, nays 9. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 14 is passed. 15 The Chair recognizes Senator 16 Bruno. 17 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, 18 can we at this time take up Calendar Number 770 19 by Senator DeFrancisco. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 21 will read Calendar Number 770. 22 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 23 770, by Senator DeFrancisco, Senate Print 4228, 7129 1 an act to amend the Lien Law, in relation to 2 notice of lien on account of public 3 improvements. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 5 will read the - 6 SENATOR PATERSON: Just a moment. 7 Explanation. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 9 DeFrancisco, an explanation of Calendar 770 has 10 been asked for by Senator Paterson. 11 SENATOR DeFRANCISCO: Yes. This 12 leg... this bill would provide for a change in 13 the notice requirement, the filing requirement 14 for a notice of mechanic's lien on public 15 improvement projects -- public improvement 16 projects only. 17 The reason is that current law 18 provides that a contractor has to file a lien to 19 preserve any type of security in the fund that 20 is being used to pay subcontractors within 30 21 days after the completion of the job. 22 What has happened in practice is 23 that, because of this very short window, those 7130 1 subcontractors who are the last ones on the job 2 site virtually have to file a lien as a matter 3 of course, whether or not they ultimately get 4 paid because the window is so short to determine 5 whether or not payment is likely to be had 6 within that 30 days. It's an incredible burden 7 on the subcontractors and it becomes a -- an 8 unnecessary process if you can expand it and 9 provide the subcontractors with a reasonable 10 opportunity to file a lien, to make sure they're 11 going to get paid properly rather than just as a 12 matter of course filing a lien because of the 13 short period of time. 14 So it's just an opportunity to 15 have subcontractors have reasonable security and 16 a reasonable opportunity to make a decision 17 whether that lien is necessary or not. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 19 Paterson. 20 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. 21 Presidents, on the bill. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 23 Paterson, on the bill. 7131 1 SENATOR PATERSON: Senator 2 DeFrancisco might want to comment on this, but I 3 really don't have a question. 4 I'd just like to make the point 5 that the General Building Contractors of New 6 York have an objection to this legislation 7 feeling that by the time the 90-day period has 8 expired that the fund may have been deleted of 9 all payments that could have been used to pay 10 the subcontractor, so although Senator 11 DeFrancisco is right that the original window is 12 very small, and I can understand what he's 13 trying to address, the fact remains that, with 14 the additional 60-day period, you might have a 15 situation now where the subcontractor will now 16 be going against the contractor and you don't 17 have any protection to the subcontractor because 18 the funds have been deleted. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 20 DeFrancisco. 21 SENATOR DeFRANCISCO: On the 22 bill. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: On the 7132 1 bill. 2 SENATOR DeFRANCISCO: I would 3 like to comment on that. 4 That may be what the memo sounds 5 like. It isn't really what the general 6 contractors are concerned about. 7 If there's a 90-day window, the 8 only way that the public fund can be depleted is 9 if the general contractor gets the whole fund 10 and doesn't pay the subcontractors and that's 11 what we're concerned about, the subcontractors, 12 making sure that they have an ample opportunity 13 to file the lien during that period of time when 14 there is a fund and the only way a fund is going 15 to be depleted is if the general contractors 16 don't pay the subs, that the city pays the 17 general and they don't pay the subs, and that's 18 the problem. 19 They acknowledge in their memo 20 that -- that this defensive posture, namely 21 automatically filing liens is better than not 22 filing a notice of lien at all. That's fine, 23 but it's -- it's a process that would be 7133 1 unnecessary if they have time to get paid 2 properly. It says, in other words, the 3 subcontractor or supplier needs to make a hard 4 business decision for each and every project and 5 should not be concerned about the feelings of 6 the general contractor. 7 Believe me, I'm sure subs don't 8 care about the general contractors' feelings. 9 They just want to get paid and -- and I think 10 that these objections are misplaced, and I think 11 it's an adequate balance and gives the 12 subcontractor an adequate time to make that 13 reasonable business decision that general 14 contractors seem to be concerned about. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 16 will read the last section. 17 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 18 act shall take effect immediately. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 20 roll. 21 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 22 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 52. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 7134 1 is passed. 2 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr. President. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Chair 4 recognizes Senator Nozzolio. 5 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Please call up 6 Calendar Number 710. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 8 will read the title of Calendar Number 710. 9 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 10 710, by Senator Rath, Senate Print 3904A, an act 11 to amend the State Administrative Procedure Act, 12 in relation to model plans or documents. 13 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 15 Rath, an explanation of Calendar Number 710 has 16 been asked for by the acting Minority Leader, 17 Senator Paterson. 18 SENATOR RATH: Yes, Senator 19 Paterson. This bill is, as you look at the 20 history of it, something that has been here 21 several times. 22 It has changed substantially by 23 way of language to go along with the discussions 7135 1 that we've had with Assemblyman Seabrook. There 2 is a memorandum in support, I'd like to read 3 just a little bit from it. But let me just 4 basically tell you. 5 The bill, upon request, asks on 6 the request of a regulated party, asks that a 7 guidance document be prepared and submitted such 8 as a model document, because so often we have 9 found that not only municipalities but the 10 regulated public submits what they think the 11 state is asking for, but indeed it isn't and it 12 goes back and forth any number of times until 13 the correct kind of document is presented and so 14 what people have asked for is a model document 15 and the support of this bill by the New York 16 State Conference of Mayors says quote, "This 17 bill represents an extremely practical approach 18 to assist municipalities in complying with what 19 -- with what would otherwise be a regulatory 20 mandate, and so their final comment is that for 21 the above reasons and for a number of them, 22 their members strongly support the bill and urge 23 that it would be endorsed by the Legislature. 7136 1 If you have other questions 2 regarding some of the specifics of the bill, I'd 3 be more than glad to answer them. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 5 Paterson. 6 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President, 7 if Senator Rath would yield for a brief 8 question. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 10 Rath, do you yield to Senator Paterson? 11 SENATOR RATH: Yes. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 13 yields. 14 SENATOR PATERSON: Senator Rath, 15 there is a concern that this legislation would 16 put an unnecessary burden on the agencies, 17 rendering the agencies really incapable of any 18 kind of supervision. I just wanted to know what 19 your feelings on that were. 20 SENATOR RATH: Yeah. We see 21 this, Senator, as actually a cost savings 22 because the agencies as they send out model 23 documents will not have to go through a 7137 1 continuous dialogue by mail or by FAX machine or 2 however the correspondence might occur in order 3 to get what they really need from the regulated 4 public, and so a good deal of personal time and 5 energy will be saved not only by the agencies 6 but by the regulated public. 7 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr. 8 President. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 10 Dollinger. 11 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Just one 12 question for Senator Rath if she'd yield. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 14 Rath, would you yield to Senator Dollinger? 15 SENATOR RATH: Surely. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 17 yields. 18 SENATOR DOLLINGER: In reviewing 19 the legislative history of this bill, it was 20 vetoed apparently by a former governor in 1993. 21 SENATOR RATH: Yes. 22 SENATOR DOLLINGER: What was the 23 basis for that veto? 7138 1 SENATOR RATH: Well, there was 2 some discussion actually on the floor last 3 year. I recall Senator Gold questioning that 4 and there was what some people felt was 5 confusing language. That has been changed and 6 adjusted along with Assemblyman Seabrook, who is 7 the Assembly sponsor, and it appears that there 8 is no problem with it any more. 9 SENATOR DOLLINGER: O.K. So that 10 the objections of Governor Cuomo have been taken 11 care of with respect to the language of that? 12 SENATOR RATH: Yeah. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 14 will read the last section. 15 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 16 act shall take effect on the 1st day of October. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 18 roll. 19 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 20 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 52. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 22 is passed. 23 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7139 1 791, by Senator Kuhl, Senate Print 4116A, an act 2 to amend the Real Property Tax Law, in relation 3 to providing an exemption from real property 4 taxation. 5 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr. President. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There's a 7 local fiscal impact note at the desk. 8 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Which bill is 9 this? 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: This is 11 791, Senator Dollinger. 12 SENATOR DOLLINGER: This is just 13 one question of the sponsor. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 15 bill aside for the day. 16 Senator Nozzolio. 17 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr. President, 18 I'd like to remind the members that there is a 19 Health Committee meeting at 11:00 a.m., Room 20 123, the Capitol. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There's a 22 Health Committee meeting at 11:00 a.m. in Room 23 123 of the Capitol. 7140 1 The Chair recognizes Senator 2 Nozzolio. 3 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr. President, 4 the house will stand at ease. 5 SENATOR WALDON: Mr. President. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Before 7 the house stands at ease, the Chair recognizes 8 Senator Waldon. 9 SENATOR WALDON: I was out of the 10 chamber. In regard to Calendar 605, I 11 respectfully request unanimous consent to be 12 recorded in the negative. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 14 objection, hearing no objection, Senator Waldon 15 will be recorded in the negative on Calendar 16 Number 605. 17 SENATOR WALDON: Thank you. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 19 Rath. 20 SENATOR RATH: Yes, Mr. President. 21 On behalf of Senator Cook, I would like, on page 22 number 5, to offer the following amendments to 23 Calendar Number 108, Senate Bill 1538A, and ask 7141 1 that said bill retain its place on the Third 2 Reading Calendar. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 4 Amendments to Calendar Number 108 are received 5 and accepted. The bill will retain its place on 6 the Third Reading Calendar. 7 SENATOR RATH: Mr. President. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 9 Rath. 10 SENATOR RATH: On behalf of 11 Senator Lack, I would like to call up his bill, 12 Print Number 3632, recalled from the Assembly 13 which is now at the desk. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 15 will read the title. 16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 17 397, by Senator Lack, Senate Print 3632, an act 18 to amend the Public Authorities Law, in relation 19 to authorizing the Dormitory Authority to 20 construct and finance all necessary and related 21 facilities. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 23 Rath. 7142 1 SENATOR RATH: Mr. President, I 2 now move to reconsider the vote by which this 3 bill was passed. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 5 will call the roll on reconsideration. 6 (The Secretary called the roll on 7 reconsideration. ) 8 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 53. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 10 Rath. 11 SENATOR RATH: Mr. President, I 12 now offer the following amendments. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 14 amendments are received and adopted. 15 Senator Espada. 16 SENATOR ESPADA: Thank you, Mr. 17 President. 18 On page 12, I offer the following 19 amendments to Calendar Number 420, Senate Print 20 Number 2601, and ask that said bill retain its 21 place on Third Reading Calendar. Thank you. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 23 Amendments to Calendar Number 420 received and 7143 1 accepted; the bill will retain its place on the 2 Third Reading Calendar. 3 Senator Nozzolio. 4 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr. President, 5 in fairness to all the housekeeping, the house 6 shall stand at ease pending the report of the 7 Finance Committee. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The house 9 will stand at ease pending a report of the 10 Senate Finance Committee. 11 (Whereupon at 10:53 a.m., the 12 Senate stood at ease until 11:07 a.m.) 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 14 Senate will come to order. 15 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr. President. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 17 Nozzolio. 18 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr. President, 19 I understand there is a report from the Finance 20 Committee at the desk. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is. 22 I'll ask the Secretary to read. 23 THE SECRETARY: Senator Stafford, 7144 1 from the Committee on Finance, reports the 2 following nomination: 3 Frank A. Nocerino, of North 4 Massapequa, member of the Republic Airport 5 Commission. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 7 Nozzolio. 8 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr. President, 9 I'd like to move the nomination. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Motion is 11 to confirm the nominee, Frank Nocerino, as a 12 member of the Republic Airport Commission. All 13 those in favor of the nomination signify by 14 saying aye. 15 (Response of "Aye.") 16 Opposed nay. 17 (There was no response. ) 18 The nominee is confirmed. 19 Secretary will continue to read. 20 THE SECRETARY: Senator Stafford, 21 from the Committee on Finance, reports the 22 following nomination: Charlotte C. Geyer, of 23 West Babylon, member of the Republic Airport 7145 1 Commission. 2 SENATOR LEVY: Yes, Mr. 3 President. I move the nomination. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Motion is 5 to confirm the nomination of Charlotte Geyer as 6 a member of the Republic Airport Commission. 7 All those in favor of the nomination signify by 8 saying aye. 9 (Response of "Aye.") 10 Opposed nay. 11 (There was no response. ) 12 The nominee is confirmed. 13 Senator Paterson, why do you 14 rise? 15 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President, 16 without any malice at all toward the nominee who 17 I'm voting for and have read the nominee's 18 resume, which is extensive and the nominee seems 19 well qualified and I would venture to suggest 20 that no one on this side feels that the nominee 21 is not qualified, but again, I would just like 22 to raise the point that we have very few members 23 in the chamber. We have committee meetings that 7146 1 are in process right now, and I just feel that 2 it does a disservice to the nominee for us to be 3 taking up this and other nominations at this 4 time at a point that we are considering other 5 pieces of legislation. In a sense, we're doing 6 two things at the same time in a seasonable way 7 to try to speed the process as much as we can, 8 but I think that there does come a point that we 9 supersede our own process and actually in many 10 ways lose the real impact of confirming the 11 nominees, and I just wanted to put it on the 12 record. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Thank 14 you, Senator Paterson. 15 Secretary will continue to read 16 the report. 17 THE SECRETARY: Senator Stafford, 18 from the Committee on Finance, reports the 19 following nomination: Thomas J. Murphy, of 20 Latham, Director of the Facilities Development 21 Corporation and member of the New York State 22 Medical Care Facilities Corporation. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair 7147 1 recognizes Senator Hoblock. 2 SENATOR HOBLOCK: Mr. President, 3 I move the nomination of Thomas J. Murphy for 4 both positions, Director of the Facilities 5 Development Corporation and as a member of the 6 New York State Medical Care Facilities Finance 7 Agency. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Motion is 9 to confirm the nominee, Thomas J. Murphy, as a 10 Director of the Facilities Development 11 Corporation. All those in favor of the motion 12 signify by saying aye. 13 (Response of "Aye.") 14 Opposed nay. 15 (There was no response. ) 16 The nominee is confirmed. 17 Secretary will continue to read. 18 THE SECRETARY: Senator Stafford, 19 from the Committee on Finance, reports the 20 following nomination: Anthony C. Imbarrato, 21 Esq., of Garden City, member of the New York 22 State Employment Relations Board. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 7148 1 Paterson. 2 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President, 3 am I -- I guess I would say I'm starting to 4 sound like a broken record but they don't have 5 records any more. I guess I'm starting to sound 6 like an infected CD, but the point that I'd like 7 to make is that the Finance Committee, from 8 which these nominations have arisen, is still 9 meeting, isn't it? 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: I don't 11 believe so, Senator Paterson. I'm informed by 12 the members at the desk that the Finance 13 Committee has concluded its work. The only 14 committee meeting right now would be the Health 15 Committee, and I see that Senator Hannon is 16 here, so that committee must be concluded too. 17 SENATOR HANNON: No, it hasn't 18 started. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Hasn't 20 started yet, so there's no reason why the full 21 body should not be in the chamber at the time, 22 Senator Paterson. 23 SENATOR PATERSON: Well, Mr. 7149 1 President, where are the Finance Committee 2 members? 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 4 Skelos? 5 SENATOR SKELOS: I'm a member of 6 the Finance Committee, and I'm in the chambers 7 ready to vote on the confirmation. 8 SENATOR PATERSON: But isn't it 9 true that the Finance Committee is still going 10 on? 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: We have 12 the entire report at the desk, so I'm told by 13 the clerk, Senator Paterson, so if the entire 14 report is here, I assume that the business has 15 been concluded. 16 SENATOR PATERSON: Well, I'm not 17 trying to be antagonistic, Mr. President. I am 18 just saying that we have members that would like 19 to discuss this particular nomination and 20 they're not in the chamber, and I would assume 21 that they are out of the chamber because they 22 were in the chamber previously and I would 23 assume that they're out of the chamber -- upon 7150 1 information and belief and what they just told 2 me, Mr. President, Senator Gold who right now is 3 acting as the ranking on Finance, asked Senator 4 Stafford, who is the chair of the Finance 5 Committee, to please hold the nominations until 6 the Finance Committee had adjourned and neither 7 Senator Gold or Stafford are here, so I -- I 8 just assume that it's not over, and I'm making 9 the point because it would appear that we're 10 just taking up nominations where members would 11 like to speak at a point that we really aren't 12 affording those members the opportunity to 13 express their viewpoint. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 15 Paterson, you're scoring very heavily today. 16 Senator Bruno acknowledged your first point and 17 was -- opened up a roll call. We're going to 18 acknowledge the fact that Senate Finance 19 Committee is still meeting, so I stand to be 20 corrected, but what we would like to do with 21 your permission would be to let Senator Hannon 22 speak on this particular confirmation, and then 23 I assume -- I think I'm getting direction from 7151 1 the Majority Leader -- that we'll hold this 2 waiting for those members of the Finance 3 Committee to come back to the chamber so that 4 they can speak on the nomination also. 5 Now, do you have any objection to 6 Senator Hannon speaking on the nomination so he 7 can then go and conduct his Health Committee 8 meeting? 9 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President, 10 when Senator Hannon speaks, we all listen, and 11 that's why we are able to determine how we feel 12 about the actual nominee. What will happen is 13 we will have members who are speaking on the 14 nomination in the dark because they haven't had 15 the benefit of Senator Hannon's speaking. 16 Senator Hannon has never made any 17 records, has no CDs on the market, so we have no 18 way of knowing what Senator Hannon really is 19 about to tell us, so I would suggest that with 20 Senator Hannon's indulgence, that we wait until 21 all the members are here before we take up one 22 nomination so that we don't have members coming 23 in and going out during the actual nomination 7152 1 or, Mr. President, I've got a better idea. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Would you 3 like to hear Senator Hannon twice rather than 4 have him return and talk again? 5 SENATOR PATERSON: Why don't we 6 stand at ease, Mr. President, let Senator Hannon 7 go ahead and conduct the committee, the Health 8 Committee, and then when he's finished he can 9 come back and he can address us and we will all 10 be in attendance. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 12 Nozzolio. 13 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr. President, 14 by consultation with Senator Hannon, because 15 it's very difficult for him to be in two places 16 at once, because he wishes to speak on this 17 nomination, and because the Health Committee has 18 been scheduled to meet off the floor, he's asked 19 the desk, the Chair, to ask this body to stand 20 at ease until he can conclude the Health 21 Committee agenda, so we would respectfully 22 request we hold this nomination. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: We will 7153 1 hold the nomination aside temporarily. Senator 2 Nozzolio, we do have a Calendar Number 791 that 3 there was an objection that has now been removed 4 that we could take up if you want to do that. 5 Also I see Senator Levy is standing. He would 6 like to say something. 7 Senator Levy, why do you rise? 8 SENATOR LEVY: Yes, Mr. President 9 I was out of the chamber when the nomination of 10 Frank Nocerino came before the body and was 11 approved. I'd like to the record to reflect 12 that the nomination was confirmed on my motion. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 14 record will so reflect. 15 Senator Nozzolio. 16 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr. President, 17 I'd like to call up Calendar Number 791. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Ask the 19 Secretary to read the title of Calendar Number 20 791. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Calendar 22 Number 791, by Senator Kuhl, Senate Print 4116A, 23 an act to amend the Real Property Tax Law, in 7154 1 relation to providing an exemption from real 2 property taxation. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 4 will read the last section. 5 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 6 act shall take effect immediately. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 8 roll. There's a local fiscal impact note at the 9 desk. Call the roll. 10 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 11 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 54. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 13 is passed. 14 Senator Nozzolio. 15 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr. President, 16 I'd like to announce an immediate meeting of the 17 Committee on Cities in Room 332. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There 19 will be an immediate meeting of the Committee on 20 Cities in the Majority Conference Room, Room 21 332, immediate meeting of the Committee on 22 Cities in Room 332. 23 Senator Nozzolio. 7155 1 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr. President, 2 the Senate should stand at ease. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 4 Senate will stand at ease. 5 (Whereupon at 11:18 a.m., the 6 Senate stood at ease. ) 7 ...At 11:21 a.m.... 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 9 Senate will come to order. 10 The Chair recognizes Senator 11 Nozzolio. 12 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Thank you, Mr. 13 President. I'd like to call up Calendar Number 14 164. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 16 will read the title of Calendar 164. 17 THE SECRETARY: Calendar 164, by 18 Senator Marchi, Senate Print 2198A, Not-for 19 Profit Corporation Law, in relation to not-for 20 profit corporations formed to construct. 21 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 23 Marchi, an explanation has been asked for by 7156 1 Senator Paterson, also Senator Stachowski. 2 SENATOR MARCHI: Mr. President, 3 under local laws, certain municipalities are 4 required to subject their land to certain land 5 use requirements before starting to construct 6 certain city facilities. 7 Under a parallel arrangement non 8 profits are, by bringing it -- by moving through 9 non-profits, they evade the application of this 10 requirement. The law that is proposed here that 11 if there is ten percent or more of the proposed 12 cost of the improvement, that it then must 13 comply with the law. 14 I realize that there are a number 15 of -- a number of entities that object, the city 16 of New York, the Federation of Protestant 17 Welfare Agencies, the New York State Catholic 18 Conference, but nevertheless, I don't see and I 19 understand that their motives are of the highest 20 but, on the other hand, I don't see dispensing 21 government or even ecclesiastical activities 22 with the highest motivation to be dispensed from 23 the operation of the law. 7157 1 The law -- the law is for all of 2 us - 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 4 Marchi. 5 SENATOR MARCHI: -- and believe it 6 should - 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 8 Marchi, would you suffer an interruption? It's 9 awfully noisy in the chamber, lot of discussions 10 going on. Could we quiet it down, please. You 11 have discussions you have to have, take them out 12 of the chamber. 13 SENATOR MARCHI: So the 14 circumvention of the law - 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 16 Marchi. 17 SENATOR MARCHI: -- by making - 18 going through or utilizing a non-profit agency, 19 even though the bulk of the money is and the 20 actual functions being carried out under public 21 auspices is a circumvention which I don't think 22 operates fairly, and I believe that if we have 23 public policy governing planning, operating and 7158 1 purchasing and construction of what is, in 2 essence, city facilities that they shouldn't be 3 able to circumvent the plain and direct intent 4 of the law. 5 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Mr. 6 President. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 8 Stachowski. 9 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Will Senator 10 Marchi yield for a question or two? 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator, 12 do you yield to Senator Stachowski? 13 SENATOR MARCHI: Yes. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 15 yields. 16 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Senator I am 17 -- I understand that you're concerned about 18 bringing these not-for-profits into the same 19 plans that the city goes through now if they 20 wanted to build a facility. However, since it's 21 not that all these not-for-profits have a 22 tremendous amount of problem with this and that 23 they consider this a terrible burden and since 7159 1 these not-for-profits provide a tremendous 2 service to their localities by taking care of 3 all these different groups that they deal with, 4 the poor people, the disabled, et cetera, what 5 if, because of this burden these not-for-profits 6 then decide not to build these facilities in 7 these municipalities and just say, We're not 8 going to build these facilities? We may have to 9 withdraw our services and let the cities, 10 states, towns, villages of the state of New York 11 who desire to put this extra burden on us, 12 provide those services themselves. 13 SENATOR MARCHI: If we -- if we 14 want to adopt our public policy to -- to promote 15 the very concerns that you're deciding, then we 16 ought to have legislation which is available to 17 everyone. The non-profits are exempt, and they 18 remain exempt under this act, but if ten percent 19 or more is -- comes from them, why not repeal 20 the whole thing, that there is no requirement if 21 the city is exempt from these regulations? 22 I don't think anybody here wants 23 to urge that, but it's this use of the 7160 1 non-profit agency to escape the -- the 2 dispositions that have been made on planning, 3 operating and purchasing. It just -- it just 4 doesn't add up. 5 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Would the 6 Senator yield for another question? 7 SENATOR MARCHI: Yes. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 9 continues to yields. 10 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Is this bill 11 the result of some sort of problem we're having 12 with the not-for-profits doing things out of 13 code, doing things that would be considered are 14 not on the up and up, doing things that possibly 15 would border on illegal or some other gross 16 misconduct situation that we suddenly have to 17 bring them under this regulation that seems to 18 be causing them so much trouble that they're all 19 against it? 20 SENATOR MARCHI: Well, there are 21 a number of -- for instance, local sites that 22 have been picked out for various purposes, 23 public purposes -- housing -- and at least an 7161 1 opportunity under the provisions of this act 2 that there would be a requirement to respond to 3 a hearing and to -- but to do this 4 surreptitiously and circumvent the purposes of 5 the law now -- why do we put those strictures on 6 -- on state and on the cities now? I mean then 7 all of a sudden a device is developed that, if 8 you just go through a non -- a fictitious or 9 quasi-fictitious strategem of a non-profit 10 agency, they circumvent the law. 11 They have -- it makes hash of the 12 law that we have today that where a city or a 13 public entity has to respond. They have to 14 justify it by -- through a hearing process and 15 the rest of it. I understand -- I understand 16 your position. I mean I'm not unsympathetic to 17 it, but exemption certainly makes for a lot of 18 bad blood. Many communities feel aggrieved. 19 They've had no opportunity to respond. 20 I think it's just a bad situation 21 at this point. There may be other approaches 22 which might accommodate both of our concerns, 23 but this certainly, the present arrangement does 7162 1 not, because a community has no way to respond 2 and something takes place which would otherwise 3 go through a hearing process, is plainly unfair, 4 I think, to the resident community and that 5 resident community is so essential to the 6 success of any planned introduction of a 7 facility in their midst, this is not the way to 8 serve that purpose. 9 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Mr. 10 President. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 12 Stachowski. 13 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: If Senator 14 Marchi will continue to yield to me for one more 15 question. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator, 17 do you continue to yield? 18 SENATOR MARCHI: Yes. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 20 continues to yield. 21 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Senator 22 Marchi, maybe if you could give me an example of 23 some sort of facilities and what it was the 7163 1 facility was to do that was put in, maybe a 2 community that you represent that circumvented 3 this process, and you can give me an example of 4 what it was, how they did it, something of that 5 nature, maybe I'd get a better understanding of 6 why you'd find it necessary to do this 7 legislation because somehow I'm missing it. 8 SENATOR MARCHI: You may have a 9 halfway house for drug rehabilitation, you may 10 have it for substance abuse, so to circumvent 11 any possible objection to it, a public entity 12 will use the subterfuge of a -- of a -- some 13 clips here. Plan to Move Recovering Substance 14 Abusers into a New Springfield House Has Some 15 Residents There in Surrounding Communities in an 16 Uproar. 17 The Project Hospitality proposal 18 to expand its traditional housing program into 19 an area by purchasing a two-family home got a 20 cool reception from Community Board 2, and so 21 forth. I have some of that are near my area and 22 I've encouraged it, but plainly, I think that 23 should we -- should we open the door to all 7164 1 state, all municipalities and to avoid this 2 process by just going through the non-profit? I 3 mean, that's what we're doing in effect. 4 It's a device, a device because 5 the law operating on its own would require a 6 public hearing if it's introduced by a public 7 entity. By merely getting a -- a not -- a 8 non-profit instrumentality, they get around it 9 completely. All that -- the only bar is the ten 10 percent here that does provide for -- for a ten 11 percent of those circumstances where they're 12 under ten percent, but if they're over ten 13 percent they're -- this would be barred and then 14 you would have to live by the law that we have. 15 Maybe we ought to repeal all the 16 restrictions that we have on city planning and 17 municipalities. Then we would face the problem 18 realistically and then we can debate it, but to 19 do it by trick and device, I don't think is good 20 government. You automatically alienate people 21 in that fashion. 22 Candor -- candor would be the 23 answer. In other words, cities are prohibited 7165 1 from doing it, they must go through a process, a 2 ULURP process that is the law today, but with 3 this little subterfuge, with minimal 4 participation by the non-profit, all of a sudden 5 they're out from under. I don't -- I don't see 6 any justification for that. 7 You want to abolish the whole 8 thing and let the city do what they want, 9 assuming that the democratic, small "d", process 10 will keep it within bounds, that's something 11 else, but this is just a device to get around 12 existing law. It is a device to get around the 13 plain and simple meaning of the existing 14 statutes and laws. 15 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Well, Mr. 16 President. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 18 Stachowski, can I interrupt you just a minute? 19 The Chair recognizes Senator 20 Nozzolio. 21 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr. President, 22 on behalf of Senator Leibell, I'd like to call 23 an immediate meeting of the Housing Committee in 7166 1 Room 332. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There 3 will be an immediate meeting of the Housing 4 Committee in Room 332. Immediate meeting of the 5 Housing Committee in the Majority Conference 6 Room, Room 332. 7 Senator Leichter, why do you 8 rise? 9 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President, 10 on a point of information. I don't know the 11 extent to which this has been raised. I know a 12 lot of people have been talking about it in the 13 cloakroom, but it's extremely difficult to 14 conduct the business on the floor with 15 committees being called all the time. 16 I -- I don't happen to be on the 17 Housing Committee, but yesterday I was running 18 around to three different committees while the 19 Senate proceeded. There were bills I wanted to 20 be recorded on; I didn't have the opportunity to 21 do it, and I would suggest that if important 22 committees have to be held, that we recess while 23 they have their meeting. 7167 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 2 Leichter, your point that you've raised was 3 raised just about 45 minutes ago by Senator 4 Paterson. The Chair would, just as a point of 5 information, the last meeting that we called is 6 going to be the last committee meeting for the 7 day at this point, so if you can just bear with 8 us, we'll try to move through this. 9 Senator Gold, why do you rise? 10 SENATOR GOLD: Well, because I 11 think that the information you gave us is very 12 important and very significant and adds to the 13 significance of what Senator Leichter said. 14 Since we will not have any other meetings and we 15 will not have this problem any more, then I 16 would suggest that we do now, in fact, recess. 17 We'll only be doing it once, we won't have to do 18 it any more, and let the people go to their 19 Housing Committee and then come back and deal 20 with the bills. I can not feel that the members 21 of the Majority believe that the legislation 22 that they are putting out, since they control 23 the calendars, is that insignificant that it 7168 1 doesn't deserve full attention of all of the 2 members, so I would suggest that at this point 3 we do a simple small standing at ease, let our 4 members go to the meeting and then we'll be able 5 to return uninterrupted for the rest of the 6 day. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 8 Nozzolio. 9 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Please, Mr. 10 President, call on Senator Markowitz in terms of 11 voting. 12 SENATOR MARKOWITZ: I agree with 13 Senator Gold one hundred percent. However, 14 since I'm the ranking member of the Housing 15 Committee, I have no choice but to vote at this 16 time in the negative on Number 164. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 18 will read the last section of Calendar 164. 19 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Yes, 21 Senator Gold. Why do you rise? Senator 22 Markowitz, don't leave yet. 23 SENATOR GOLD: Well, I would just 7169 1 say, Mr. President, that there is a technique 2 which basically says that, if you don't like the 3 question, you don't answer it, just ignore it 4 and go on, so let's do it a different way. I 5 would, with most respect to the Majority Leader, 6 move that we now stand at ease for a very short 7 but indefinite time until the Housing Committee 8 completes its work. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Do you 10 want to let Senator Markowitz vote first before 11 you make your motion? 12 SENATOR MARKOWITZ: I'll yield to 13 Senator Gold on the vote. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: All 15 right. The motion is to stand at ease. 16 SENATOR SKELOS: Point of - 17 point of order. I don't know where in our rules 18 book there's such a thing as a motion to stand 19 at ease, so I would respectfully submit to the 20 President that Senator Gold's motion is -- is 21 totally out of order. 22 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President, Mr. 23 President. 7170 1 SENATOR SKELOS: If Senator Gold 2 would request that perhaps we get a total 3 picture of what's happening right now that the 4 Senate stands at ease that's a lot different 5 than making a motion that we stand at ease. 6 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President, 7 speaking to the Chair, I appreciate the remarks 8 of Senator Skelos, and that's what I was trying 9 to do before I made the motion. Unfortunately, 10 the -- the Deputy Majority Leader did not 11 respond until this point. 12 I don't want to make the motion. 13 I would rather have it be the initiative of the 14 Majority to understand a problem which has been 15 articulated by our Deputy Minority Leader and by 16 Senator Leichter, and have us stand at ease for 17 a very short time. At your insistence, we'll 18 give you the credit. The record will indicate 19 you get the credit, but let's do that, and I 20 don't have to make motions. We don't have to 21 have points of order. We don't have to have 22 people debating for nothing, and we do it in the 23 orderly business way that you would like to do 7171 1 it. 2 SENATOR SKELOS: Senator Gold, 3 I'm not looking for credit, but we can stand at 4 ease temporarily. Are we voting on Senator 5 Marchi's bill? 6 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Yes. We have 7 not voted. 8 SENATOR SKELOS: Senator 9 Markowitz, do you want to vote on this bill? 10 SENATOR MARKOWITZ: Not if I 11 don't have to. 12 SENATOR SKELOS: Not if you don't 13 have to. Perhaps -- perhaps what we can do is 14 we can continue the debate on Senator Marchi's 15 bill. Senator Markowitz could vote on it since 16 it's -- it's the practice of the house on 17 relatively non-controversial bills to continue 18 the session rather than breaking every time and 19 certainly if there is a major committee meeting 20 and many of you wish to come back into the 21 chamber such as the request was adhered to by 22 Senator Paterson, that you want to speak on the 23 nomination of Mr. Imbarrato, we held up the 7172 1 nomination coming before the house. 2 I think we can proceed. Senator 3 Markowitz can vote. We can accommodate him, 4 proceed with the debate of this relatively 5 non-controversial bill, have a vote, and then we 6 can at that point see whether we should continue 7 to stand at ease or we can go on to some other 8 business. 9 SENATOR GOLD: Yeah, Mr. 10 President. I don't have any problem with what 11 was just suggested if that's agreeable to 12 Senator Markowitz, other than to clear the 13 record on one item. 14 Senator Skelos, you said that at 15 the request of Senator Paterson, the nomination 16 was held so that I could speak. I think the 17 record should indicate that the nominee came 18 before the committee and before the committee 19 meeting ended, there was an attempt to bring the 20 nomination to the floor while the members of the 21 committee who had an interest in the nomination 22 were still being held out of the chamber during 23 a committee meeting, so let's not give ourselves 7173 1 a pat on the back for that procedure. 2 I appreciate the fact that 3 Senator Stafford was totally cooperative, and 4 made sure that the nomination was held. So 5 let's forget that, but the answer is, if Senator 6 Markowitz wants to vote now, we want to finish 7 this one bill, that's fine with me, but I think 8 that we ought to stand at ease after that. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 10 will read the last section. 11 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 12 act shall take effect immediately. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 14 roll. 15 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 17 Markowitz, how do you vote? 18 SENATOR MARKOWITZ: In the 19 negative. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 21 Markowitz will be recorded in the negative. 22 Senator Stachowski, why do you 23 rise? 7174 1 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Just to 2 continue. I have the floor. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: All 4 right. The roll call is withdrawn. Debate on 5 Calendar 164 will continue. 6 Chair recognizes Senator 7 Stachowski. 8 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Thank you, 9 Mr. President. 10 Just on the bill, I can 11 understand Senator Marchi's problem and that may 12 be very well the case in his area where people 13 are hiding through not-for-profits to put in 14 maybe unwelcome facilities, but it's strange 15 because in our area, at least in my district, it 16 seems like the not-for-profits are more 17 cooperative with the people from the community 18 in educating them, talking to them, maybe 19 relocating the facility -- at least in my 20 district that's been the case -- much more 21 cooperative than any department that is under 22 the state of New York. OMR/DD, OMH in 23 particular don't do any type of educational 7175 1 process. They hold a hearing where the people 2 that are sent there by the state of New York 3 listen to people talk about the many reasons or 4 problems with putting that facility in that 5 community, and then come -- I normally have the 6 worst of attitudes toward the people testifying, 7 the worst of attitudes towards dealing with the 8 local officials and the worst of attitudes as 9 far as the best interests of the communities 10 are. 11 They have -- they go under the 12 premise which, rightfully so, the federal law 13 now says that if you want to put a facility 14 anywhere you want to put it, you can put it 15 there because if you try to stop it you're tech 16 nically discriminating against people of a 17 handicapped nature whether -- whatever the 18 physical challenge or mental challenge that 19 those people have and that makes them qualified 20 to live in that facility. 21 But it seems that, in our area at 22 least or in mine in particular, we get a lot 23 more cooperation from many of the not-for 7176 1 profits, so it's -- that's why I'm having so 2 much trouble understanding the situation and 3 that's why I asked you for an example. So I 4 mean I wish we could say that the state of New 5 York would have to do a better -- better job of 6 following the laws that they fall under and 7 maybe have a better attitude of dealing with the 8 people, but that's not the bill. The bill is 9 dealing with non-profits. See that these 10 non-profits are against it, and I'm not sure I'm 11 going to be able to support this bill. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Chair 13 recognizes Senator Espada. 14 SENATOR ESPADA: Thank you, Mr. 15 President. 16 I certainly would like to ensure 17 and assure Senator Stachowski that his 18 experience with not-for-profits in his district 19 is not an isolated experience. In fact, I think 20 that throughout the state not-for-profits have 21 not only made their name in terms of human 22 service delivery but also in terms of keeping 23 communities intact. Moreover, the economic 7177 1 impact of not-for-profits is certainly not being 2 taken into consideration. It would be a 3 perceptive glimpse into the obvious to note that 4 we have a fragile economy. It would be worse to 5 not acknowledge the economic contributions of 6 the burgeoning not-for-profit sector which 7 employs millions of people throughout the 8 state. Certainly not enough has been said about 9 the crippling effect that this bill would have 10 on that type of economic positive impact that 11 we're experiencing. 12 And so for all those reasons, but 13 especially because the impact to the community, 14 we talk about notice and we talk about the rare 15 exception that -- of some horror story of some 16 -- of some substance abuse center or some other 17 horrific thing being placed in our community. 18 The fact of the matter is that the Mayor of the 19 city of New York, the Catholic Conference, the 20 Federation of Protestant Welfare Agencies, 21 Neighborhood Preservation Coalitions throughout 22 the state, have -- who are the people in the 23 community with the impact on services, are 7178 1 telling us that it's a really bad idea and so, 2 as we're trying to really deregulate government 3 and down-size government, this is the worst 4 thing we can do. 5 It is, I think, fashionable to 6 take the not-for-profit sector for granted. We 7 would be complicating a horrific error here if 8 we were to pass this bill and leave the market, 9 the laissez faire attitude to prevail. No, I 10 think that there's enough regulation in place. 11 The Mayor of the city of New York, through the 12 charter section 203, already takes impact, local 13 impact, into consideration. This will unduly 14 elongate that process and provide no positive 15 yield. 16 Thank you. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair 18 recognizes Senator Dollinger. 19 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr. 20 President, just briefly on the -- Senator 21 Waldon, you want to - 22 SENATOR WALDON: I'm sorry. I 23 had asked earlier. 7179 1 SENATOR DOLLINGER: I'll yield to 2 Senator Waldon, Mr. President. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 4 Waldon. 5 SENATOR WALDON: Thanks, Mr. 6 President. I appreciate that courtesy, Senator 7 Dollinger. The kindness of the people in the 8 Rochester area never ceases to amaze me. 9 Would the kind Senator and 10 learned Senator from Staten Island, Richmond 11 County - 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Can we 13 have a little order in the chamber? Senator 14 Waldon is right next to me, and I'm having a 15 very difficult time hearing him. 16 Senator Markowitz, could you take 17 your conversation out of the chamber, please. 18 Senator Waldon. 19 SENATOR WALDON: Would Senator 20 Marchi, the learned gentleman from Richmond 21 County, yield to a question or two? 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 23 Marchi, do you yield to Senator Waldon? 7180 1 SENATOR MARCHI: Certainly. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 3 yields. 4 SENATOR WALDON: Thank you, Mr. 5 President. 6 Senator, when these LDCs are 7 created, are they not subject to the decisions 8 of the local community planning boards? They 9 have to go through the planning board? 10 SENATOR MARCHI: We are talking 11 not-for-profit. They are subject to your 12 Uniform Land Use Review Process. They are 13 subject to it. There's no problem there. They 14 observe the law and they carry it through so 15 that it, whether it's -- whether it's an LDC or 16 the city of New York or whatever, whatever the 17 municipality, they're all subject to the land 18 review process. 19 I'm saying that if they are 20 subject to it, the non-profits are not, 21 non-profits are not subject to any of these 22 regulations. 23 I'm just saying that the city or 7181 1 the public agency, to circumvent, has 90 percent 2 of the money and everything else going into the 3 construction, that I'm suggesting that at that 4 point they -- they are, in substance, a public 5 agency evading and avoiding the operation of 6 existing law. 7 Now, we want to propose something 8 else, you know. It's possible that there are 9 other answers to this, other legislation that 10 might be passed, but today it's restriction and 11 the public sees a process take place which would 12 otherwise be subject to a hearing process. All 13 of a sudden, they're deprived of that and I 14 think that the host community is entitled to 15 have a say in it. They do in all other 16 circumstances. 17 SENATOR WALDON: Mr. President, 18 if I may ask the Senator to yield. If the 19 Senator would yield again. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 21 Marchi, do you want to yield? 22 SENATOR MARCHI: Yes, Senator. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 7182 1 continues to yield. 2 SENATOR WALDON: I thank you for 3 your response, Senator Marchi. 4 What I'm really looking at, 5 though, what I'm trying to discover is who will 6 pay for this process meaning the burden on the 7 local development corporations to conform if 8 this becomes law. Who will pay? Where will the 9 resources come from to pay for this process, 10 this conformance, or will this legislation be 11 amended at some future date and include in it 12 money, because this is mandating action, money 13 so that these local development corporations 14 which are so vital in Southeast Queens don't go 15 under from the burden of paying for mandated, 16 required services to conform, who will pay for 17 it? 18 SENATOR MARCHI: Well, any 19 improvement that the City introduces or - 20 SENATOR WALDON: I'm sorry. 21 SENATOR MARCHI: I say any 22 improvement that the City introduces, or an LDC 23 has to -- the expense has to comply with the 7183 1 ULURP, the Uniform Land Use Review Process, has 2 to be complied with, that's part of their cost 3 of initiating an improvement. 4 I'm talking about a situation 5 where they say, Well, we can get around this. 6 We'll get -- we'll get a non-profit organization 7 which will have a minuscule piece of that and 8 with that device they can present the 9 application, and they're exempt from any hearing 10 process. 11 My suggestion, Senator, is that 12 we -- we could amend, I suppose amend the law so 13 that we're not stooping to devices to deprive 14 people of a hearing which is implicit in the law 15 today. That's not playing fair with the public. 16 If we have -- if we, together, I mean this 17 chamber and the other chamber and the Governor 18 agree that some latitude ought to be given to 19 the City in these processes, well, we can debate 20 that, but I don't see where this avoidance and 21 evasion -- avoidance sometimes is permitted, but 22 evasion, I think it's an evasion of an opportun 23 ity to inform that community. I can't see any 7184 1 justification for it. 2 SENATOR WALDON: If I may 3 continue, Mr. President. I apologize for 4 elongating this process in terms of trying to 5 obtain information from Senator Marchi. I just 6 don't know any other way to do it than to ask 7 questions. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 9 Marchi, do you continue to yield? 10 SENATOR MARCHI: Yes. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 12 Senator continues to yield. 13 SENATOR WALDON: Senator Marchi, 14 the reason I'm pursuing this is that I've 15 watched the local development corporations 16 evolve in the communities I serve and if they 17 had to, from the small amounts of start-up money 18 that I've been able to give a number of them 19 with that thing called -- that no-no of today, 20 member items, they wouldn't be able to start up 21 let alone to evolve and exist, and what you're 22 saying is that with this legislation, there 23 would be a requirement -- there would be a 7185 1 requirement in the evolution or at some point in 2 time regarding structures and -- and buildings 3 to conform to whatever is required by local 4 ordinance, laws, et cetera, et cetera, in terms 5 of this process. 6 Somebody has to pay for that, and 7 we have organizational structures in Southeast 8 Queens which have little or no money, people who 9 break their backs volunteering, hoping one day 10 to receive adequate money from either the 11 private sector or the governmental sector so 12 that they can truly service, whether it be Meals 13 on Wheels or whatever, to the people of South 14 east Queens. 15 I foresee this as an unnecessary 16 burden. The -- are these people violating the 17 law so grossly or are they, in fact, violating 18 the law currently? Is that why you propose this? 19 I'm still worried about where will the money 20 come from to pay for the required legal services 21 and/or accounting services and/or any other form 22 of service necessitated to conform to what you 23 want us to pass today? 7186 1 SENATOR MARCHI: Well, the cost 2 of complying with building requirements, zoning 3 requirements, this is a -- there is a condition 4 that everybody operates under except 5 not-for-profits. You might want to sponsor a 6 bill that -- to exempt LDCs, for instance, from 7 some -- from that very same operation. 8 The present law today doesn't 9 exempt the City at all. They are commanded to 10 do this, but by this simple device, with only a 11 minuscule participation by the part -- on the 12 part of a -- a not-for-profit, they completely 13 circumvent the law so, you know, if it's a bad 14 law, let's address it on its own terms and do - 15 and do the forthright thing. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 17 Waldon, you have the floor. 18 SENATOR WALDON: I realize I'm 19 going around Robin Hood's barn, but we'll come 20 to a closure in just a minute. 21 Senator, these are fictions 22 created by this Legislature some time ago, 23 meaning the LDCs, to accomplish the purpose that 7187 1 they've accomplished to date. By that, I mean 2 it was put into law to do what it does so that 3 it wouldn't have to be burdened with the cost 4 that you're talking about, and what you're 5 saying now is you're no longer satisfied with 6 the way in which they operate and you want to 7 change the mode or the modality or the manner in 8 which these not-for-profits operate, but you're 9 not giving them any money to deal with the 10 burden you're putting on them. 11 I thought you said a few moments 12 ago, Well, we could amend or we could pass some 13 thing that would either give them an exception 14 or perhaps give them some money. Why would we 15 do that in the future when you can just pull 16 this back, amend it, put some dollars in it in a 17 percentage fashion that will take care of this 18 need and then we can look at it again. 19 SENATOR MARCHI: I yield -- I 20 yield to the Senator, so I might be able to in 21 corporate my feelings here. 22 SENATOR ABATE: Yes, I'd like to, 23 on the bill, I'd like to address why I think 7188 1 this is an important bill. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 3 Marchi - 4 SENATOR WALDON: You know, out of 5 order. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 7 Abate, I think Senator Waldon has the floor and 8 Senator Dollinger is next, so - 9 SENATOR WALDON: I would defer to 10 you. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Things 12 are confusing enough as they are today. 13 SENATOR WALDON: I would not like 14 to violate the rules of the house and the - 15 SENATOR ABATE: All right. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 17 Waldon, you have the floor. 18 SENATOR WALDON: Thank you, sir. 19 I asked a question, I believe. 20 SENATOR MARCHI: Senator, out of 21 my respect for you, and I know that you're 22 totally sincere and genuinely sincere about 23 this, I'll lay this aside for one day, and 7189 1 examine it from the -- from the point of view of 2 the -- of the LDC. I -- my feeling is that 3 their -- their participation is so minuscule 4 it's not -- because the ones I've seen are - 5 involve state and local agencies, not LDCs that 6 perhaps they might be exempted, you know. 7 SENATOR WALDON: On the bill, Mr. 8 President. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 10 Marchi said he's going to lay the bill aside, I 11 believe. 12 SENATOR MARCHI: I will lay it 13 aside. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: So that 15 will end debate on this matter. 16 SENATOR MARCHI: Yes, I will lay 17 the bill aside. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 19 bill aside at the request of the sponsor. 20 Chair recognizes Senator 21 Nozzolio. 22 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr. President, 23 would you please call up and return to the 7190 1 report of the Finance Committee. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: We'll 3 return to the reports of standing committees. 4 There is a Finance Committee report at the desk. 5 I'll ask the Secretary to read. 6 THE SECRETARY: Senator Stafford, 7 from the Committee on Finance, reports the 8 following bill, 5236, Budget Bill, an act to 9 amend a chapter of the laws of 1995, entitled an 10 act to provide for payments to municipalities 11 and to providers of medical services. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: We'll lay 13 that aside. 14 There's another report of Finance 15 dealing with a confirmation. Ask the Secretary 16 to read that. 17 THE SECRETARY: Senator Stafford, 18 from the Committee on Finance, reports the 19 following nomination: Anthony C. Imbarrato, 20 Esq., of Garden City, member of the New York 21 State Employment Relations Board. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Chair 23 recognizes Senator Hannon on the confirmation. 7191 1 SENATOR HANNON: Yes, Mr. 2 President. I'd like to move this appointment 3 for confirmation by this house and speak briefly 4 in regard to the appointee. 5 Anthony C. Imbarrato not only is 6 a constituent but has been a respected member of 7 the community, in the central part of Nassau 8 County for a number of years, a father, a 9 practicing attorney, a leader in both civic and 10 political affairs. He's been well recognized as 11 an outstanding individual who, I think that the 12 best thing that can be said as an attorney is 13 he's been a successful attorney, successful 14 attorney in dealing with many individual needs, 15 corporate needs throughout the length and 16 breadth the of the practice of law and, when you 17 do that, you get a chance to be recognized for 18 inherent good judgment, sagacity of -- and 19 wisdom in regard to how you practice fairness in 20 dealing and you don't get to be successful if 21 people don't come back, and obviously people 22 have come back. 23 In addition to being a successful 7192 1 attorney, Mr. Imbarrato has been a legislative 2 counsel to Senator Speno many years ago, but at 3 a time when the entire field of transportation 4 in this state was far more nascent than it is 5 now. He was also counsel to the Senate's Codes 6 Committee, and along with a number of other 7 important functions. 8 When it comes to fulfilling the 9 membership in the Public Employees' Relations 10 Board, this important function in dealing with 11 the labor relations between public employees and 12 public employers requires somebody who has 13 experience, requires somebody who has good 14 judgment, requires somebody who is respected, 15 who can sit for sometimes many long hours with 16 complicated legal issues, with complicated human 17 issues, and to draw those together. 18 It has been an innovation, the 19 Public Employees' Relations Board under Governor 20 Rockefeller. It has served quite well, has 21 served quite well because of individuals serving 22 on it such as Mr. Imbarrato. I can't recommend 23 anyone more highly to this body for confirmation 7193 1 than him. 2 Thank you, Mr. President. 3 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair 5 recognizes Senator Levy. 6 SENATOR LEVY: Mr. President, 7 thank you very much, Mr. President. It's really 8 a genuine honor and privilege to have the 9 opportunity to rise and to join with Senator 10 Hannon, and I know many of our other colleagues 11 in moving the confirmation of the nomination of 12 Tony Imbarrato. 13 I've known Tony and his lovely 14 wife Vicki, who is with us today, for more than 15 30 years and, when it comes to Tony, as with 16 dealing with other nominees because many times, 17 many times for each of us when the Governor 18 proposes a nominee we don't know the nominee and 19 we have a resume and we get the opportunity to 20 look at a resume or we may have a snapshot 21 opportunity to talk to the nominee at a 22 committee meeting. But unlike that, as I've 23 said I've known Tony for 30 years. I've had the 7194 1 opportunity to observe him, and I know of my own 2 knowledge that he -- he has outstanding ability 3 and he's an extraordinary attorney with an 4 impeccable reputation, an impeccable integrity. 5 I've seen him in action as a 6 community leader. He was a distinguished 7 elected official for many years, as a council 8 person in the town of Hempstead and, as Mike 9 Tully said when we were in Finance just a few 10 minutes ago, as young prosecutors, we both had 11 the opportunity to see him in action on the 12 other side of the table and the characteristics 13 that we always saw were a person who was able, 14 experienced, a tough negotiator and he was 15 always fair and balanced. 16 He brings unique experience and 17 unique ability to this position, and the 18 Governor is to be commended for this out 19 standing nomination. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The chair 21 recognizes Senator Gold. 22 SENATOR GOLD: Thank you very 23 much. 7195 1 Mr. President, I make no pretense 2 of knowing Mr. Imbarrato as closely as the 3 Republican members from Nassau County, and I 4 have no reason to doubt that he is an intelli 5 gent attorney. 6 I think that the confirmation 7 process places an obligation upon us and that 8 obligation is not very, very broad. It's really 9 pretty narrow. The obligation is not whether we 10 would have selected the individual but whether 11 or not the Governor is presenting to us someone 12 who is qualified. It may not be my person, your 13 person. Is the person qualified? If the person 14 is qualified, be it a Democrat, Republican or 15 whatever, I think the obligation is to give the 16 Governor his or her choice. 17 I'm only dealing, in my mind, 18 with the issue of qualification, but the issue 19 of qualification for this job is a serious one 20 in my mind. The State Employment Relations Board 21 is a serious board and, as was pointed out by 22 Senator Leichter in the committee, the work of 23 that board deals with laws which have a 7196 1 specialty unto themselves. 2 There are people who apply to be 3 judges in specified and specific courts, and we 4 ask legitimate questions. For people who want 5 to be in the Family Court, what is your 6 experience in the Family Court? Have you ever 7 been there? And when people want to be judges 8 in criminal cases, we like to feel that somehow 9 they have some knowledge of the subject. 10 At any rate, Mr. Imbarrato has 11 been involved in governmental affairs for a 12 period of time, and one thing is very clear from 13 his resume. He is a very loyal Nassau County 14 Republican, and I want to tell you that's 15 something I respect. I respect loyalty; but I 16 think when you're dealing with government, you 17 draw a line sometimes and in Nassau County maybe 18 they draw lines in different places. 19 So, for example, Senator Levy 20 said -- and I believe Senator Levy -- that Mr. 21 Imbarrato, serving as a councilman in Nassau 22 County, did an excellent job and was an 23 excellent councilman and I am prepared to 7197 1 believe that. Of course, that being the case, 2 one wonders why he stepped down voluntarily when 3 asked by Mr. Margiotta, the county leader at the 4 time, to step aside and Mr. Imbarrato said, 5 Well, there was a nice up and coming young man 6 named Mondello who they thought might want that 7 job, so Mondello got the job and he stepped 8 aside. That's loyalty. Of course, it's the 9 kind of loyalty that raises some questions in my 10 mind. 11 Of course, Mr. Imbarrato was not 12 left out in the cold because loyalty should be 13 rewarded, and he became the counsel to the 14 Hempstead IDA, and I guess he held that job, I 15 think, for about ten years if I remember, and we 16 found out some interesting things about that 17 job. 18 Now, the job gives a retainer and 19 the retainer, I think, was originally 10,000. 20 At one point I think it was 20,000, but it's 21 only a retainer, as against time. 22 The SIC, which investigated the 23 surrounding circumstances of a transaction 7198 1 dealing with Roosevelt Raceway, criticized the 2 situation that Mr. Imbarrato was involved with, 3 with receiving an annual retainer as well as 4 transaction fees by project developers. Mr. 5 Imbarrato made an analogy at the committee 6 meeting. He says, Anybody who goes into a bank 7 gets charged by the bank for their lawyer's 8 fees, and I'm sure that everybody here knows 9 that when you get a mortgage, the bank attorney 10 is one of the fees that you deal with and it can 11 be a few hundred dollars, and there is no doubt 12 in anybody's mind that, when you go to a closing 13 at the bank, the bank attorneys -- God bless 14 you. 15 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Thank you. 16 SENATOR GOLD: -- have nothing to 17 do with the mortgage process. They just deal 18 with the closing. I think that it's a little bit 19 different than a situation where you deal with 20 IDAs and in, for example, the Roosevelt Raceway 21 situation, I believe that the amount of money 22 they got was $25,000 from that particular 23 project. It sounds to me like you could be 7199 1 having a $25,000 project fee here and a 10,000 2 there and a 5,000 there, and that might not be 3 too bad a job and maybe, if I was a councilman 4 I'd want to give that up if I was going to 5 become the attorney for an IDA who not only got 6 a retainer but on the other side of the coin 7 there was this opening to get project fees as 8 the IDA went along; but at any rate he is a 9 loyal person certainly and he did do that. 10 I am concerned, though, on the 11 issue of judgment with his handling the job with 12 the IDA, and in asking him some questions at the 13 committee meeting, I unfortunately felt that 14 there was a selective memory that was applied. 15 Now, in all fairness to Mr. Imbarrato, he said 16 that it was a long time ago and if he reviewed 17 some records, maybe he could give better 18 answers, and I suggested that maybe we adjourn 19 the hearing, give him the opportunity to review 20 the records, and Senator Stafford, in his 21 judgment and wisdom, decided no, we are now on 22 the road and we go ahead. 23 Interestingly enough, however, 7200 1 when I raised some other issues later in the 2 meeting, his memory was very exact, and let me 3 just suggest something to you. Over the period 4 of time the Hempstead IDA, I'm sure, had a 5 number of matters that it dealt with. I don't 6 live in Nassau County or read the Nassau 7 editions of their papers, but I would be willing 8 to bet that, in the ten years, there wasn't one 9 situation that had as much public attention and 10 scrutiny as the Roosevelt Raceway transaction, 11 and I find it hard as a lawyer that if somebody 12 said to me, Can you remember all your cases, I'd 13 say, of course, I can't remember everything of 14 every case, but you mention one or two cases 15 that I've been involved in and, believe me, I 16 remember a lot of things about them. 17 In this particular situation, the 18 people who were involved with Roosevelt Raceway 19 filed varying financial forms. They varied in 20 the numbers that were submitted and he didn't 21 remember that, which is possible, and I'll take 22 his word for it, but it had legal effect. If 23 you valued the land at 20-some-odd million 7201 1 dollars you weren't capable, you weren't 2 qualified to be talking to the IDA whereas if 3 the land was only worth twelve-five, you could 4 talk to the IDA. 5 So on a piece of paper, they 6 changed the value of the land. The land is out 7 there, nothing happened. You changed the value 8 on a piece of paper and now you become eligible 9 for the loan. 10 Now, as Senator Hannon and others 11 have pointed out to me and they are accurate, 12 Mr. Imbarrato was not a member of the board and 13 didn't make the final decisions but he was 14 counsel, and I think it would be interesting to 15 know whether, as counsel, he said to the board, 16 Wait a minute, said to the IDA, Wait a minute, 17 something smells here. We're getting different 18 numbers, or whether, as a member, as counsel he 19 said, Look, if these guys change the number on 20 paper, they qualify and we can give it to 'em. 21 I don't know what he said, but I 22 think what he said is relevant to the issue of 23 competence. I'm not going to review the whole 7202 1 transaction. Believe me. Don't worry about 2 that, but let's get to the end of it. 3 In 1988, Roosevelt Raceway closed 4 down, and it remain -- and by the individuals 5 who got the IDA funding going to a private bank 6 and paying off the IDA bonds, they wound up with 7 the land and effectively had this beautiful 8 piece of real estate in the middle of Nassau 9 County which, at the time in 1988, the values 10 thrown around were some $200 million. 11 Now, somebody pointed out, by the 12 way, that why am I talking about this? The 13 people apparently didn't make any money on the 14 deal, and it didn't work out well, and I think 15 it was Senator Stachowski drew an interesting 16 analogy. If you rob a bank and the bag tears as 17 you walk out of the bank, and you don't have any 18 money when you get finished, it doesn't mean you 19 didn't rob the bank. I like that analogy. At 20 any rate, in 1988, whenever the track was 21 closed, after the track was closed, the district 22 attorney of Nassau County, Dennis Dillon, who at 23 times has been a Democrat and is now a 7203 1 Republican, wrote a letter to the chair of the 2 IDA saying, under certain provisions of your 3 lease, you can get -- you can get the land back. 4 You can get the Raceway back, maybe even 5 continue it, take care of it for the people of 6 Nassau. 7 Now, I asked Mr. Imbarrato about 8 that, and I said, you know, What did you advise 9 them? Did you tell them that they could protect 10 that land? and Mr. Imbarrato said to me that 11 that wouldn't have been prudent. There were 12 bondholders out there and to foreclose on the 13 land would have been terrible. 14 Now, maybe I'm wrong but, when 15 you have $200 million worth of security and you 16 foreclose on it, I think bondholders who have 50 17 million to worry about are pretty well 18 protected. 19 I promised you I wouldn't review 20 this too much, and -- and I won't. The -- the 21 SIC mentions Mr. Imbarrato, at page 492 of their 22 report and they mention the taking -- the 23 retainers and the fees and questioning the 7204 1 practice and, in my opinion, it's a practice 2 that is terrible, but if it was legal at the 3 time, I can not hold that against Mr. Imbarrato 4 and I don't hold that against Mr. Imbarrato, but 5 I was interested in his reaction as to whether 6 or not we, as a Legislature, should do something 7 about it, and apparently it's a matter of 8 philosophy even in 1995. He doesn't see 9 anything wrong. 10 But the bottom line of all of 11 this, I must say, were questions asked by 12 Senator Leichter because the bottom line is that 13 this is a field of special expertise. I am told 14 that, at the Labor Committee meeting, Mr. 15 Imbarrato made the comment that he does 16 matrimonial law and, if you can settle 17 matrimonial cases, you can settle labor problems 18 and while I have done matrimonial work in my 19 life and still do some of it, and I understand 20 exactly what he said, the fact that in the heat 21 of passion oftentime overrules the law and 22 logic. 23 This is a field of law that deals 7205 1 with laws and it deals with complicated issues. 2 I don't have a problem with a Republican 3 governor making appointments of loyal 4 Republicans, particularly from Nassau County 5 where we all know there's a great influence from 6 there, and that doesn't bother me. It's a 7 question of putting round pegs in square holes, 8 and I believe that, based upon his total lack of 9 experience in this field, they are picking the 10 wrong situation for Mr. Imbarrato. 11 I have my own questions about 12 judgment and how his judgment affected the 13 workings of the Hempstead IDA, and that is a 14 situation where it was "simple real estate", 15 quotes/unquotes. I have grave questions in my 16 mind as to how he would function in this 17 particular situation, and particularly as 18 chairman of the agency -- of the board. 19 Lastly, there was a situation 20 which involved Roosevelt Raceway where the 21 ticket takers brought an action because they 22 claimed an unfair labor practice in closing the 23 track and that seemed to be the one place where 7206 1 maybe the county of Nassau, the individuals 2 involved, maybe there would be some justice for 3 the people of Nassau County. 4 Mr. Imbarrato feels, in his 5 judgment, that the result which he indicates was 6 not favorable to the union was a fair result in 7 that situation. I have to disagree with, again, 8 his judgment. 9 So, based upon the comments that 10 I've made -- I'm sure the man is a delightful 11 man. I'm sure he's the kind of person who we 12 would all like to have dinner with, and he's a 13 person who may be very, very intelligent, and I 14 understand a successful lawyer. I think he's 15 the wrong person for this particular job, and I 16 intend to vote in the negative. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair 18 recognizes Senator Tully on the confirmation. 19 SENATOR TULLY: Thank you, Mr. 20 President. 21 As you may tell -- as I continue 22 to speak, I'm suffering from a slight case of 23 laryngitis and in most cases, I would not stand 7207 1 on my feet, but in this particular case, because 2 of the quality of the nominee, I find it most 3 important that my colleagues should know some of 4 the things that I know about him. 5 First, I might point out that 6 with respect to the comments made by Senator 7 Gold, that I notice the same stenographer who is 8 here present in this chamber was also present 9 during the course of the Finance Committee 10 meeting, at which I thought the nominee handled 11 himself extremely well. He answered all 12 questions cogently, clearly, and with great 13 satisfaction to me, although it may not have 14 been satisfactory to Senator Gold; but I think 15 what the nominee should know is most of my 16 colleagues who know -- who have been in this 17 chamber know that whenever Nassau County is 18 mentioned, Senator Gold seems to think of one 19 place in Nassau County, that great county that 20 we live in, and he thinks of Roosevelt Raceway, 21 and it doesn't matter whether it's a nomination 22 or it's a building. He says the same thing 23 about Roosevelt Raceway and IDA if it's a bill 7208 1 or a nominee. Now, we're used to hearing it 2 and, in this case, you got to hear it firsthand. 3 Senator Leichter's comments with 4 respect to the experience of the nominee, his 5 question, I think, was well taken. I think the 6 nominee was very candid when he said his legal 7 practice dealt with the field of matrimony, but 8 he was very humble in not explaining that he was 9 a duly elected official of the largest town in 10 New York State, larger than many of our cities, 11 if not all of the cities except New York City 12 and as an elected official, he served on the 13 board and negotiated contracts with the Civil 14 Service Employees Association of that particular 15 town, the town of Hempstead. He dealt on a 16 daily basis, I'm certain, with people who wanted 17 raises, with people who had objections to 18 certain things that took place in employment, 19 and he had that type of experience in one of the 20 largest municipalities in this state on an 21 ongoing basis. 22 Is he qualified, Mr. President? 23 I believe he is over-qualified. He is a compe 7209 1 tent trial attorney, as Senator Levy alluded to, 2 when both he and I were assistant district 3 attorneys and the nominee was on the other side 4 of the fence. He was a legal scholar. When he 5 quotes a case, you know the case exists and you 6 know he's done his homework in that regard. 7 He's someone, Mr. President, that 8 we're fortunate in having as a nominee because 9 he knows the workings of the Legislature. He 10 worked for one of our great former colleagues, 11 Senator Ed Speno. 12 I cannot understand why it is 13 that he's accepting this position, but I do 14 believe that all of us will be extremely 15 fortunate after he's confirmed to know that we 16 have someone of this quality serving us in the 17 public sector. 18 I welcome you back. 19 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 21 Skel... excuse me. Senator Gold, why do you 22 rise? 23 SENATOR GOLD: Would Senator 7210 1 Tully yield to one question? 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 3 Tully, do you yield? 4 SENATOR TULLY: No, I will not, 5 Mr. President. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 7 Senator refuses to yield. 8 The Chair recognizes Senator 9 Marcellino. 10 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 11 President, I rise in support of this nomina 12 tion. I'm not a lawyer. I have never served 13 with Mr. Imbarrato. I've never seem him in 14 action in the courtroom, but I do know of his 15 reputation in Nassau County. 16 He's got a fine reputation. It's 17 impeccable. His reputation for integrity and 18 honesty is unquestioned and cannot be questioned 19 by anyone who truly knows the situations and 20 truly knows the issues that have been raised by 21 Senator Gold. 22 I will support this nomination 23 and I urge all my colleagues to do likewise. 7211 1 Mr. Imbarrato, I think, will serve with 2 distinction and represent this state well. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair 4 recognizes Senator Skelos on the confirmation. 5 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, 6 I'm delighted to rise and join with my 7 colleagues in support of Mr. Imbarrato as a 8 member of the New York State Employee Relations 9 Board. As I mentioned in the Finance Committee, 10 I have known Tony and Vicki for over 20 years 11 and he certainly has been a good advisor to me 12 politically, governmentally and personally over 13 the years. 14 You know, it's very interesting 15 and in just following with some of Senator 16 Tully's comments, Nassau County is mentioned, 17 and it's almost like the old Abbott and Costello 18 movies with -- with Senator Gold, where they 19 mention Niagara Falls and it's "slowly I turn". 20 We've been hearing this lecture 21 from Senator Gold for at least the 11 years that 22 I have been in this Senate. Nassau County - 23 "slowly I turn", Roosevelt Field, IDA, on and 7212 1 on and on, innuendos, and certainly I don't 2 believe being fair to Mr. Imbarrato who is going 3 to be confirmed today, I'm fairly confident, and 4 will be a distinguished member of this board. 5 You know, as an attorney -- and I 6 know Senator Gold is an attorney, Senator 7 Leichter is an attorney -- we have an obligation 8 to our client and often there's an attorney 9 client privilege where we're not permitted to 10 answer certain questions which I'm sure Senator 11 Gold and Senator Leichter respect the attorney 12 client privilege, but we have an obligation to 13 make certain recommendations as attorneys to our 14 client and then the client makes a decision. 15 The IDA, which Senator Gold 16 neglected to mention, is an independent body 17 that made decisions. Mr. Imbarrato is not the 18 one that made any decisions concerning the IDA's 19 functioning; the board makes the decisions. 20 Tony is a bright attorney. He 21 has experience, as Mike mentioned, as a town 22 board member of the largest township in this 23 nation, larger than 12 or 13 states, thousands 7213 1 of employees that he was involved with, 2 negotiations, having contracts established with 3 the town of Hempstead, and certainly like any 4 attorney, he has -- or bright attorneys, he has 5 the ability to understand an issue, research an 6 issue and then be learned on that issue; and 7 certainly with all of his experience as an 8 attorney, as a town official, no question in my 9 mind that he will be a distinguished member of 10 the New York State Employment Relations Board. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 12 Leichter. 13 SENATOR LEICHTER: Yes. Mr. 14 President, my colleagues, I have never met Mr. 15 Imbarrato before today. I found him very 16 engaging. I found him very intelligent, and I 17 think he was forthright in answering questions 18 that were posed to him, but the one question 19 that he answered -- and I'm sure he answered it 20 very honestly, which is going to determine my 21 vote on the confirmation -- when I asked him 22 what experience have you had in Employment Law, 23 in Labor Relations Law, and I think his answer 7214 1 was "None". 2 Now, Senator Tully, who's, as we 3 all know, an extremely skillful debater and also 4 Senator Skelos, have brought in suddenly, "Well, 5 he was very active on the town board negotiating 6 contracts," and so on. The nominee didn't 7 mention anything of that sort, but even if 8 that's the case -- and I accept there's probably 9 a certain bit of self-effacement on the part of 10 the nominee, but I assume that as a member of 11 the town board he was involved to some extent in 12 reviewing contracts; and we, as members of the 13 Legislature, in some -- we have some 14 responsibility for labor relations too, but let 15 me tell you, my friends, that Labor Law and 16 Employment Law in the last ten, fifteen years 17 has become such a complex specialty. I know 18 because I was involved in a situation -- my firm 19 where we have some people handle employment law 20 -- and I sat in on a meeting and, frankly, I 21 understood nothing. 22 Now, Senator Tully goes back to 23 my days as a lawyer. We used to believe that if 7215 1 you have a law degree, by God, there isn't a 2 legal question that you can't handle, and maybe 3 that was true some years ago, but let me tell 4 you, Senator Skelos, it isn't a matter now, "Oh, 5 well, now I'm going to do employment law. I'll 6 just open the books. I'll look up cases. I'll 7 look under "E", employment law, and read a few 8 cases and I can handle this field." 9 You can't. It's an extremely 10 complex, intricate field, and I am concerned 11 that we have here a nominee who has back- ground 12 whatsoever in this particular field, I'm sorry 13 to say, but I've seen this Governor send up 14 nominees, frankly, whose main qualification 15 seems to be their activity within the Republican 16 Party. While that should never bar anybody - 17 and some activity in political parties can be 18 very useful in government, but when you are 19 appointed to a position that requires 20 experience, knowledge, skill in a specialized 21 area, it's just not enough to say, "Well, this 22 was a person who was extremely active in the 23 Republican Party in his community. He's a 7216 1 bright lawyer." That's just not enough. 2 We have an obligation here to 3 advise and consent, and I think that consent has 4 to be exercised judiciously, carefully, with 5 constraint, but it can't become a dead letter. 6 We're not a rubber stamp here. 7 It's not enough for me, frankly, 8 that my colleagues from Nassau County get up and 9 say this is a person of integrity, veracity, 10 good intentions. I would assume that, and I 11 accept that from what you say, and I can think 12 of a number of positions where this particular 13 nominee would probably be very well qualified 14 because of these human characteristics and the 15 experience in the community and politics that he 16 has, but we better look at his experience in 17 this particular field, and there the experience 18 he stated in a very honest manner is nil. It 19 just doesn't exist. He's just not qualified for 20 this position. 21 I understand what Senator Gold 22 said on the ques... the issues relating to 23 Roosevelt Raceway and the judgment of this 7217 1 nominee, and I think it's a close question, and 2 if that were the only issue, I don't know how I 3 would vote on this nomination; but when the 4 issue becomes background, experience, knowledge, 5 I don't think anybody can say this is a 6 qualified nominee. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair 8 recognizes Senator Dollinger on the 9 confirmation. 10 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr. 11 President, I haven't met Mr. Imbarrato and I 12 wasn't at the Finance Committee. I don't 13 believe that the activities on behalf of the 14 Republican Party disqualify any nominee. We 15 have approved several judges in the last couple 16 of weeks who were active in the Republican Party 17 who might not have views that mirrored mine, but 18 they were qualified for the positions. 19 I am most troubled by the point 20 that Senator Leichter made, and that is, if you 21 had a case that you were going to litigate 22 before the Public Employees Relation Board, if 23 you were a client and you went to Mr. Imbarrato 7218 1 and said, "We need to litigate this case before 2 the Public Employees Relation Board; we need a 3 labor practitioner who knows public sector labor 4 law," my question is, would you hire Mr. 5 Imbarrato? And I think he rightfully - 6 right... 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 8 Stafford -- excuse me, Senator Dollinger. 9 Senator Stafford, why do you 10 rise? 11 SENATOR STAFFORD: I try never to 12 interrupt anyone, but I'm sure that the speaker 13 would want to be corrected. This is not the 14 Public Employees Review Board. It's the oppo 15 site; it's in the private sector. 16 SENATOR DOLLINGER: This is the 17 State Employment Relations Board, correct? 18 Okay. Excuse me. 19 The question becomes -- even if 20 that were the case, would you hire Mr. Imbarrato 21 to do this job, a job to litigate in front of 22 this board? Does he have the qualifications? I 23 think through his own mouth -- and I appreciate 7219 1 his candor -- I think he rightfully so said, "I 2 don't do this work. I'm a matrimonial lawyer. 3 I divorce people. I go through the difficult, 4 complicated, particular issues involved in a 5 divorce," whether it's devolution of property 6 and divvying up the estate or handling child 7 custody -- very, very complicated issues, all of 8 which he sounds like a very excellent 9 practitioner in. 10 The question is, is he a 11 practitioner in this particular area? 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Excuse 13 me, Senator Dollinger. 14 Senator Skelos, why do you rise? 15 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, 16 would Senator Dollinger yield for a question? 17 SENATOR DOLLINGER; I will, Mr. 18 President, after I'm finished. I'm just going 19 to be a short second. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: All 21 right. He will. 22 Senator Mendez, why do you rise? 23 SENATOR MENDEZ: I was wondering 7220 1 if you would just yield for one question in 2 reference to what you're saying. It's sort of a 3 clarification. 4 SENATOR DOLLINGER: I would, 5 Senator, but I'd appreciate it if I could finish 6 my statement, then I'd be glad to. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 8 Senator refuses to yield at this time, Senator 9 Mendez. 10 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr. 11 President, it seems as though there's a 12 complicated series of specialty issues that 13 could come before this board which Mr. Imbarrato 14 has acknowledged that he has no experience in, 15 so it seems to me that there may be complicated 16 issues that may arise in the Governor's agenda 17 for the future. There may be complicated issues 18 that we face as we change from an agenda set by 19 an administration to an agenda set by this 20 administration with respect to employment law. 21 There are going to be very 22 complicated and very, perhaps, cutting edge 23 issues; and yet we have a nominee who is a good 7221 1 man, who he has done good things both as a 2 Republican and as a community service who may be 3 qualified to do all kinds of things in this 4 state. He may be qualified to sit on all kinds 5 of boards but, I think, by his own admission, he 6 is not qualified to sit on this one. 7 I think we need some level of 8 competence from nominees to particular specialty 9 positions, and under those circumstances I think 10 that this kind of Labor Law practice requires 11 someone who has experience in this area and, 12 therefore, I'm prepared to vote no. 13 Senator Mendez, I believe I 14 should yield in protocol to Senator Skelos. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 16 Skelos, are you asking Senator Dollinger to 17 yield? 18 SENATOR SKELOS: Senator 19 Dollinger, there's a -- often with attorneys, 20 legislators, perhaps yourself, there's a desire 21 to become a judge some day, be a Supreme Court 22 judge. If you become a Supreme Court judge, 23 they handle a whole gamut of types of cases. 7222 1 Would you say that any Supreme 2 Court judge that perhaps did not actively 3 practice a certain area of the law would totally 4 be disqualified to hear cases that a Supreme 5 Court judge would hear? 6 SENATOR DOLLINGER: In response, 7 Mr. President, I think that any judge ought to 8 have trial experience. You ought to know what 9 goes on in a courtroom. You ought to know how 10 to make decisions in a courtroom. He ought to 11 have some familiarity with negligence law, with 12 family matrimonial decisions. He ought to have 13 a broad base of legal expertise so that he can 14 handle issues that come before him as a judge. 15 It seems to me that that's 16 exactly what you would want from someone who 17 sits on the Employment Relations Board. You 18 would want some broad experience in labor law so 19 that they would know the issues, they would have 20 some familiarity with the issues, as they come 21 before them. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 23 Skelos, why do you rise? 7223 1 SENATOR SKELOS: I believe that, 2 Senator Dollinger, it was pointed out, both on 3 the floor and at the Finance Committee, that Mr. 4 Imbarrato, as a town councilman of the largest 5 township in this nation, larger than perhaps 12 6 or 13 states, where the town board members, the 7 supervisor are actively involved in negotiating 8 union contracts, dealing with employees on an 9 annual basis, thousands of employees, that 10 certainly there is an experience, a more 11 practical experience, that Senator -- that Mr. 12 Imbarrato does have; and you take into account 13 his abilities as an attorney, the fact that he's 14 a bright, articulate person, I think that's more 15 than sufficient in terms of the worldliness you 16 would require of Supreme Court judges, for him 17 to serve on this board. 18 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr. 19 President, I'd just point out, I guess, in 20 response to that, if we were looking for a labor 21 practitioner, someone who would handle labor law 22 cases, we wouldn't go to a matrimonial lawyer. 23 This is a position where the 7224 1 familiarity of those base issues, I think, is 2 critically important in handling these cases. 3 This is why the issue of competence -- it's not 4 an issue of his capabilities as a lawyer, his 5 capabilities as a person. It appears as though, 6 based on his resume, he's performed -- and I 7 understand Senator Gold may have some questions, 8 but my evidence is -- and I take the testi 9 monials of both Senator Tully and Senator Levy, 10 that this man has good skills, that this man's 11 an intelligent man. I don't hold any of that 12 against him. 13 The question is whether he is 14 specifically competent for this particular 15 position and it seems to me that the Governor 16 probably has a whole choice of people who are 17 also good Republicans with the same good 18 community base that Mr. Imbarrato has that would 19 be well qualified for this position. 20 Now I'll yield to Senator Mendez. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 22 Mendez, Senator Dollinger yields. 23 SENATOR MENDEZ: Thank you, Mr. 7225 1 President. 2 Senator Dollinger, would you say 3 that a lawyer who is in private practice and 4 goes to court, has clients that are either 5 workers or employers that have practiced law in 6 the labor area by representing clients that are 7 either workers or employers, would that -- would 8 that be experience? Would you say that that 9 person is an experienced lawyer in the labor 10 field if that person has done that consistently 11 in big quantities? 12 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr. 13 President, I would say that a lawyer who 14 represents employees in relationships and in 15 litigation with their employer, whether it's 16 unfair labor practice charges or grievances and 17 arbitrations, discrimination cases, all those 18 relationships that relate to employment is just 19 the kind of foundation that this position needs, 20 and I think that someone with those 21 qualifications would be well qualified for this 22 position. 23 The problem is that someone who 7226 1 has a matrimonial background is dealing with a 2 very different set of issues -- legal issues. 3 SENATOR MENDEZ: This is the 4 point of clarification that I wanted to make. 5 I was in the Finance Committee. 6 The nominee was asked, "Have you practiced Labor 7 Law?" And he said -- being in his private 8 practice, and he said, "I practice matrimonial 9 law. However," he also added, "I have 10 represented workers and employers" in cases of 11 the clients that he has, so that it appears that 12 that specific detail that he had practiced law 13 representing clients on both sides of being - 14 being -- whether it be employers or workers has 15 been lost in our arguments, and I felt it was 16 very important to clarify that aspect of him, 17 because the point that you're making is a good 18 one. 19 I understand by -- and everybody 20 has stated so here, and I was in the -- in the 21 -- in the Finance Committee meeting and every 22 body says that he is a very brilliant lawyer, 23 vast legal -- great legal mind and everything 7227 1 else, but the issue of -- I'm referring to just 2 the issue of qualifications, based only on 3 having practiced, let's say, just matrimonial 4 law versus the other, I wanted, Mr. President 5 and Senator Dollinger, to clarify that point, 6 because otherwise you will be very unfair to the 7 nominee. 8 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Right. I'd 9 just point out for the benefit of Senator 10 Mendez, divorcing someone from their spouse and 11 defending them when they're terminated from 12 their employer are two very different legal 13 circumstances. 14 SENATOR MENDEZ: That's why I'm 15 clarifying the situation, so we know why this 16 man is being approved or disapproved as the 17 nominee of the Governor would, in fact, be given 18 a fair chance, because he has practiced law but 19 as a private lawyer, not only just matrimonial 20 law. I think that I have to make that 21 clarification. 22 Thank you. 23 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President. 7228 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 2 Leichter. 3 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President, 4 if Senator Mendez would be good enough to 5 yield - 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Actually, 7 Senator Mendez didn't have the floor. 8 SENATOR LEICHTER: But I'm -- I'm 9 -- I'm asking her now to yield. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 11 Mendez, do you yield to Senator Leichter? 12 SENATOR MENDEZ: Yes. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 14 Senator yields. 15 SENATOR LEICHTER: Senator, I was 16 interested in what you had to say, because I was 17 the one who asked the nominee about his back 18 ground and you seem to have heard something that 19 nobody else heard, which is very interesting and 20 may be useful because you seem to know things 21 that nobody else heard. You seem to have heard 22 things that the nominee didn't say, and maybe 23 you had some other information -- that's what I 7229 1 want to ask you, Senator -- that you could help 2 us on, because we have a transcript here. We 3 have a record here, Senator, and we're going to 4 look at the record - 5 SENATOR MENDEZ: What do you 6 question - 7 SENATOR LEICHTER: Let me finish, 8 please. Let me finish. Let me finish, 9 Senator. 10 We're going to look at the -- at 11 the record, the transcript. 12 Now, are you telling this body 13 that in the Finance Committee that this nominee 14 said, "I have represented workers in court, in 15 employer/employee disputes"? 16 SENATOR MENDEZ: I am saying, 17 yes, that you -- somebody -- especially you, did 18 ask the gentleman -- was it you who asked the 19 question to him - 20 SENATOR LEICHTER: Yes. 21 SENATOR MENDEZ: -- as to whether 22 or not he had practiced labor law, and he said, 23 "No, matrimonial law," but then he added -- and 7230 1 this is -- look, I know that with the years all 2 of us get a little bit with a -- some loss of 3 hearing. I think that in this case, yours is 4 going to be greater than mine -- and he added 5 that he had represented workers and employers as 6 his clients. 7 That's what I had -- maybe we 8 could ask some of the other people that were in 9 the Finance Committee to see if they heard the 10 same. 11 SENATOR LEICHTER: Well, Mr. 12 President - 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: You're 14 asking Senator Mendez to continue to yield? 15 SENATOR LEICHTER: Senator Mendez 16 to yield. 17 Senator, I think that I had a 18 loss of hearing. I think the one thing that 19 hasn't happened to me with age is that my 20 imagination has grown and that I hear things 21 that weren't said and, in fact, Senator, I did 22 do exactly what you said. I asked a couple 23 members who were in the Finance Committee to 7231 1 check my recollection and they did not hear what 2 you said. I thought it was interesting that 3 those people on the other side of the aisle, 4 Senator, who were -- who know this nominee and 5 who were defending his background, his record, 6 never mentioned what you thought you heard. So 7 maybe it's a matter of my hearing or maybe it's 8 a matter of your imagination. 9 SENATOR MENDEZ: But my -- my - 10 my imagination, Senator Leichter, does not work 11 overtime. You're worse because you are such a 12 creative person, is all the time in high gear 13 and working overtime, and we all appreciate that 14 enormously. 15 I think that there is a record 16 over there and I think that we have to check a 17 little -- maybe we could ask the nominee. 18 Did you hear that? Excuse me. 19 I'm going to check, Mr. President, with some of 20 the other members that were there. I heard it. 21 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 23 Gold, why do you rise? 7232 1 SENATOR GOLD: Yes. I just want 2 to make a few comments, if I may. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Wait just 4 a minute. Senator Mendez had the floor. Can we 5 just wait until she confirms the conversation 6 and then - 7 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 9 Paterson, why do you rise? 10 SENATOR PATERSON: I -- I just 11 wanted to know, Mr. President, who had the 12 floor. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 14 Mendez has the floor right now. I have been 15 reserving it for her, then we're going to go to 16 Senator Gold. 17 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 19 Mendez, would you like to continue? Senator 20 Mendez, would you like to continue on the floor 21 or would you waive at this time? 22 SENATOR MENDEZ: Yes. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 7233 1 Mendez has the floor. 2 SENATOR MENDEZ: Mr. President, 3 he said -- he first answered the question by 4 saying that he had -- was practicing matrimonial 5 law, and then he added and he said that he had 6 represented in court employers and workers, but 7 I was told now nothing -- not specifically in 8 labor disputes; but he, in fact, did say that he 9 had clients -- clients, employers and workers, 10 maybe on other matters but not on labor 11 disputes. 12 Is that an accurate description? 13 Yes. 14 So, Mr. President, I just wanted 15 for the record to have it straightened out that 16 it is not a question of -- of hearing what has 17 not been said. It is not a question of having a 18 superactive imagination. It is a question of 19 pursuing the subject matter to clarify -- to 20 clarify the situation, and my intervention here 21 was precisely in an effort to clarify that 22 situation that appeared to be -- to me to be - 23 to being given more attention than all the other 7234 1 qualities that the gentleman -- experiences in 2 the world of work that the gentleman has shown 3 in his resume. 4 Thank you. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair 6 recognizes Senator Gold on the confirmation. 7 SENATOR GOLD: Thank you very 8 much. 9 I just wanted to clarify 10 something that Senator Dollinger was dealing 11 with, and I think, well -- but I want to expand, 12 because Senator Skelos left a very unfair 13 impression. 14 If someone is elected to the 15 Supreme Court, Senator Skelos, after that is 16 done, they go to work in the particular 17 department, in a particular area, and there are 18 administrative judges, and just so you know, 19 Senator Skelos, it is the practice in many 20 areas, certainly the ones that I know about in 21 the City, where if there is a condemnation case, 22 it goes to one judge, because that is an area 23 which is his specialty, and there is one judge. 7235 1 There are areas in the city of 2 New York where they have special calendars for 3 cases involving the city of New York, and it 4 goes to one judge. 5 There are cases that deal in a 6 very complicated field called matrimonial law, 7 which this nominee knows very well, and this 8 nominee can tell you, Senator, that in many 9 areas there are one or two, maybe three, if the 10 case loads are very large, judges that take the 11 burden of the matrimonial calendar and they 12 develop a certain expertise. 13 There are judges, Supreme Court 14 judges, who are assigned almost permanently to 15 the criminal calendars of that particular 16 department or district, and there are judges who 17 you wouldn't let near a criminal case and they 18 don't want to be near a criminal case, and 19 although they are elected Supreme Court judges 20 and can do any case, they only do civil cases. 21 Now, in electing a Supreme Court 22 judge, we elect a judge into a system where 23 there is an administrative judge who will then 7236 1 find the niche for the judge for the best 2 interests of society, but that's not what's 3 happening here. We're -- we're asked to confirm 4 someone to be, in effect, a judge in a very 5 specific area, and once we confirm this nominee 6 we can't take him and say, "Well, all right. He 7 was confirmed, but we're going to put him in the 8 matrimonial part of the State Employment 9 Relations Board." There is no matrimonial part 10 to that board. 11 Not only that, it hasn't been 12 mentioned yet, but the Governor says he will 13 make this individual the chair, which means not 14 only will someone who very candidly says he has 15 no experience will be acting in a judicial 16 capacity, he's going to be the head, and he is 17 going to be leading people in an area of which 18 he knows not. 19 Now, that is nuts. 20 Now, Senator Levy and Senator 21 Hannon and Senator Tully say that the individual 22 is a man of integrity. If that is true, listen 23 to him. If he tells you he has no experience, 7237 1 isn't that enough? 2 And his experience does not come 3 from the machinations of Senator Skelos and 4 Senator Tully who say, "Well, you know, if you 5 were on the board, you had to do this and you 6 had to do that." 7 If the nominee is as bright as 8 you say, if the nominee is as -- a person of the 9 highest integrity, accept his answer. Accept 10 his answer. He knows nothing of this field. He 11 is in the wrong cubicle, and we should free him 12 of that impediment and vote no. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair 14 recognizes Senator Levy. 15 SENATOR LEVY: Yes. Thank you 16 very much, Mr. President. 17 I think that the analogy that 18 Senator Skelos raised with the Supreme Court 19 judge really goes right to the core of the 20 discussion here, Senator Gold, and using myself 21 as an example and evaluating what you said, I 22 have to say that at times -- at times all of us 23 become very, very parochial; and when -- when 7238 1 you talk in terms of the judiciary and how it 2 operates in the city of New York, we certainly 3 can't say that that's the way the judiciary 4 operates all throughout the state of New York 5 where you don't have a huge judiciary. 6 I have to say, I'm sure some of 7 my colleagues from upstate that don't have the 8 luxury of the talent bank that we have on Long 9 Island, that you have in the City, that sits on 10 a court, that they don't have -- Senator 11 Stafford, I was saying in terms of numbers -- in 12 terms of numbers, we can go, Senator Gold, to 13 parts of this state where we have elected 14 Supreme Court justices who have on occasion come 15 before them the most complicated, involved, 16 complex matters that they never, ever have had 17 any experience, and I'm sure we can look at the 18 record and see judicial determinations by good 19 lawyers who have no experience in a field that 20 will stand as it relates the logic and fairness 21 and quality with any decision, not only in the 22 state, but anywhere in the country, and that's 23 really what we're talking about here. 7239 1 I've heard -- I've heard in 2 listening to some of the remarks that were made 3 on this floor, at one point, there was some that 4 tried to -- tried to hold the nominee to the 5 standard of making decisions when he wasn't even 6 a member of the IDA board but merely the lawyer 7 for the board and they were his client. 8 This discussion that we've had 9 here this afternoon, we really -- take a look at 10 what we're talking about. It would almost 11 appear that the argument against the nominee is 12 based upon a set of facts that really is not a 13 true set of facts, and that is, Mr. Imbarrato 14 has been nominated to a board. He's not -- he 15 hasn't been nominated to a position where he is 16 the only person that is going to serve in that 17 position. There is a board. The board has a 18 qualified staff; and as I sat and I listened to 19 the discussion here, I thought of the field that 20 I have responsibility for. 21 I will be happy to yield when I'm 22 finished, Senator Gold. 23 My responsibility is 7240 1 transportation, and I have worked with chairs 2 who have served as -- served as Commissioners of 3 Transportation in this state, and let me just - 4 let me just tell you about three of them: 5 Number 1, Jim LaRocca. Jim 6 LaRocca was a fine Commissioner of Transporta 7 tion, never did anything whatsoever in the 8 transportation field. 9 John Egan. I have to tell you 10 that before -- before our colleague, Senator 11 Daly, was nominated to be the Commissioner of 12 Transportation, I hoped that John Egan stayed on 13 as Commissioner of Transportation, and the man 14 had never done anything or had any experience in 15 the field of transportation, and I have to tell 16 you when you look back at his record, albeit it 17 was over a short period of time, he goes down in 18 history as one of the finest Commissioners of 19 Transportation that we've had in this state and 20 he had no experience whatsoever in that field. 21 And the same thing with our own 22 friend and colleague, Senator Daly, who is now 23 the Commissioner of Transportation, no exper 7241 1 ience in the field and he's doing an outstanding 2 job. 3 The bottom line is - 4 particularly when you have a board of the scope 5 of the board that this nominee has been nomin 6 ated to serve on, the bottom line is, are you 7 dealing with a person of ability, a person of 8 experience, a person who has been a negotiator, 9 and the key quality is, is that person fair? Is 10 that person balanced as to all of those 11 qualities? 12 I have to tell you, on my 13 experience, enthusiastically, this nominee has 14 all of these qualities, and we'll look back 15 after he's confirmed and on the job that he 16 does, I'm sure they are going to think of him 17 the same way that we think about John Egan and 18 the job that he did in Transportation. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 20 Paterson. 21 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President, 22 I am listening to this discussion and I think 23 that some of the points that have been made have 7242 1 been a little bit misunderstood. 2 The actual ability of the 3 individual who's being nominated is not a 4 question here, and I think that Senator Gold has 5 stated that and restated that. What we're 6 actually talking about, really, is the process. 7 Senator Levy is correct, there 8 have been many who have been nominated and 9 served admirably and served with distinction in 10 areas with which they weren't originally 11 familiar, but the nomination itself begs the 12 question when the individual is willing honestly 13 to state that they are not significantly 14 familiar with the area as to why the nomination 15 occurred in the first place. The answer could 16 well be that we take very talented people and we 17 distribute these talented people among agencies 18 and hope that their natural abilities flourish 19 in those agencies; but the reason that we have 20 committees, the reason that we engage in the 21 advice and consent as we are in this chamber 22 today, is on the basis of some assumption that 23 we make that there are a number of talented 7243 1 people in the pool of those who would have been 2 qualified to serve and among those talented 3 people, there are many who are significantly 4 embellished in the knowledge of this particular 5 area. 6 I think the point that Senator 7 Gold and Senator Leichter and also Senator 8 Dollinger were trying to make without any malice 9 toward this nominee is that in this chamber we 10 are deliberating as not to whether or not we can 11 forecast what the inevitable results will be of 12 the confirmation of this particular candidate, 13 but whether or not this particular candidate may 14 have been the best that our state can offer. 15 With a number of individuals who 16 are significantly familiar with the employment 17 area, the question might be asked, why are we 18 passing over them in favor of a highly qualified 19 person who might better serve our state in 20 another area? 21 That is a valid question. It 22 does not mean that you have to vote against this 23 nomination if you don't choose to, but if it is 7244 1 a valid question, and it has always been a 2 question that occurs over and over in the 3 selection not only of individuals who have been 4 appointed by the Governor but even in elections, 5 it is the balance between qualification and 6 ability, qualification being the definition of 7 the actual -- the actual accomplishments that 8 the individual may have and the resume and the 9 distinctions that the individual has shown in 10 the past in this particular area as balanced by, 11 perhaps, an individual who shows that they are 12 distinguished in a number of areas and we can 13 then presume that in this case, moving into the 14 labor area, that they would be as adequate as 15 they have been previously; but I think that the 16 discussion is being lost on -- in a sense, a 17 concentration on what would be an individual 18 situation, and as far as this nomination is 19 concerned, we have a nominee who may inevitably 20 have shown the greatest distinction by his 21 honestly answering the question as to compare 22 the anxiety that occurs in matrimonial actions 23 being greater than that in what occurs in labor 7245 1 disputes, but it's not really the pain test that 2 we're looking for. It's actually the ability to 3 distinguish between the elements of those two 4 separate areas of the law, and I think that what 5 Senator Gold's pointing out is to say that where 6 we can as a government and particularly where 7 administrative judges are concerned and even in 8 law enforcement and in the district attorneys' 9 offices now, there is an attempt to match up 10 cases with the qualities and the abilities of 11 the assistant district attorneys who work on 12 those particular cases. 13 And so, when we look at this 14 whole situation, I would admonish all of us that 15 it is not wrong to have a problem with a 16 nomination because the individual has not 17 demonstrated a real ability or demonstrated any 18 history of familiarity with a particular area. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair 20 recognizes Senator Tully. 21 SENATOR TULLY: Thank you, Mr. 22 President. 23 Again, squeaky voice and all, 7246 1 some question was made with respect to the 2 particular expertise with members of the 3 judiciary and cases being assigned to them but 4 -- because of the their particular expertise in 5 the field, but those of us who are trial 6 attorneys know that in many of our counties - 7 and I speak specifically of Nassau County -- the 8 calendars are so crowded and we have so few 9 judges that many times you have a County Court 10 judge who is well versed in the field of 11 criminal law who is called upon to be an acting 12 Supreme Court justice to sit on cases in the 13 civil sector involving labor relations, 14 involving matrimonial law, involving everything 15 except criminal law in most cases, and they 16 serve well. They do the job. They're fairly 17 competent because of their educational 18 background, because of their knowledge of the 19 law. 20 I think it's been clearly demon 21 strated that this particular candidate has an 22 excellent knowledge of the law. His background 23 in public service is unparalleled, and I think 7247 1 it goes without saying that the process being 2 what it is, as we have in the past, we will 3 judge this candidate on the totality of his 4 credentials and his background and we will make 5 the right decision. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 7 Stafford to close debate. 8 SENATOR STAFFORD: Mr. President, 9 you, a number of times, have heard me say this 10 since Governor Pataki was elected, that we have 11 had excellent nominees before us. 12 I again today say that Anthony C. 13 Imbarrato is among the best. 14 We go back 30 years -- I 15 mentioned earlier today that he was counsel to 16 Ed Speno and those were the days when we weren't 17 paid very well and we always went to Codes 18 because Ed Speno had such a good lunch. We 19 didn't have to eat for a couple of days. I 20 might add that since then a number of -- all, 21 including myself, have carried on that 22 tradition. I assure you when I had it it was 23 not the same as Ed Speno's. 7248 1 I want to share with my Senator 2 from Harvard. If you sat in on a labor meeting 3 and you couldn't understand it, I suggest you 4 send your degree back to Harvard, because I 5 would suggest that as Harry Wilmer Jones said, 6 who taught contracts and labor law, the whole 7 job is finding the issues. You have to know 8 what has to be decided, then you can always get 9 people to find the law for you, but it's the 10 good lawyers who know what the issues are. 11 I would suggest that in a 12 practice -- let's look at it this way. You 13 know, we can argue either side; that's what 14 we're trained for. Maybe it's better that we 15 don't put people into specialties where they've 16 practiced. They may have decided which side 17 they should be on. Maybe on purpose we should 18 make sure that we don't put a lawyer -- if he's 19 had a certain practice, maybe he or she 20 shouldn't really be put in that field. 21 Now, I do say, as has been said 22 here earlier, that with the reputation and those 23 of us who know him -- I had a long talk with the 7249 1 nominee and his good wife today -- anyone who 2 has had a practice, I suggest that they can go 3 into these fields and do very well, just as 4 Senator Skelos said, just as Senator Levy -- I 5 could go on and on; and I would also say this, 6 that, you know, I'm beginning to really 7 understand -- and this is no criticism of 8 anybody because we have the right to say how we 9 think, how we feel when we're serving in the 10 Senate. If we don't, we're not doing our job; 11 but I would just say to all of us -- to all of 12 us, I think every time had been difficult and, 13 lo and behold, we know that we're now living in 14 a time when we have a situation where sometimes 15 we wonder why anybody wants to serve in public 16 life, why anybody wants to run for office, and I 17 would caution us all that we should always 18 remember that. We should always remember that. 19 We have here a nominee who 20 through the years has worked in the private 21 sector -- and that's what I like, by the way. 22 That's what I like. We have these people 23 constantly coming before us that have been in 7250 1 the public sector for their entire life and some 2 -- sometimes don't understand what it's like to 3 -- at the end of a week in a law firm to have 4 more money left than what you spent. I think we 5 need some more of that in government, and that's 6 what we have with this -- with this nominee. 7 I said today, to close on a 8 lighter vein, we have these various days in 9 Albany. Some days you can pick any bill up and, 10 gosh, you don't seem to have anybody say too 11 much and then we have these rocky days; and I 12 checked with the moon and I -- you know, you 13 sometimes -- you sometimes can find out a lot. 14 I want to make sure that I join 15 in supporting Anthony C. Imbarrato, and I'm sure 16 he will serve well. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 18 Stafford, would you like to share with the 19 members what the moon said? 20 SENATOR STAFFORD: There was an 21 indication last night, but beware in three 22 nights, 4:00 in the morning. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Thank 7251 1 you, Senator Stafford. 2 The question is on the nomination 3 of Anthony C. Imbarrato to become a member of 4 the New York State Employment Relations Board. 5 All those in favor signify by saying aye. 6 (Response of "Aye".) 7 SENATOR PATERSON: Slow roll 8 call. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Are there 10 five members standing who request a slow roll 11 call? 12 The Secretary will read the roll 13 slowly. 14 SENATOR SKELOS: Ring the bells 15 too. I know the Minority likes to hear the 16 bells too, so we'll add the bells. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bells 18 are ringing, Senator Skelos. 19 The Secretary will call the 20 roll. 21 THE SECRETARY: Senator Abate. 22 SENATOR ABATE: Yes. 23 THE SECRETARY: Senator Babbush. 7252 1 SENATOR BABBUSH: No. 2 THE SECRETARY: Senator Bruno. 3 (Affirmative indication.) 4 Senator Connor. 5 (Negative indication.) 6 THE SECRETARY: Senator Cook. 7 Senator Cook, excused. 8 Senator DeFrancisco. 9 SENATOR DeFRANCISCO: Yes. 10 THE SECRETARY: Senator DiCarlo. 11 SENATOR DiCARLO: Aye. 12 THE SECRETARY: Senator 13 Dollinger. 14 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr. 15 President, to explain my vote. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 17 Dollinger to explain his vote. 18 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr. 19 President, I'm mindful of the comments made by 20 Senator Levy and others about the competence of 21 a lawyer and the competence of a lawyer that you 22 generally assume can be very broad based, but 23 one thing we look at in determining qualifica 7253 1 tions is we use past qualifications as a 2 predictor for future competence, and I think 3 that's something we do as lawyers. I think it's 4 something that our clients do as consumers. 5 When they come to us and someone says to me, "I 6 need a matrimonial dispute", I say, "I don't do 7 matrimonial work. I do general litigation. I 8 don't do that. Go to someone else," and I think 9 that what we see here is the past qualifications 10 don't provide, at least to me, an indication of 11 the competence level to be able to handle the 12 following: 13 Disputes over strikes, disputes 14 over picketing, McKay Radio and the issue of 15 permanent replacements and when they're 16 appropriate, subcontracting issues and whether 17 they constitute unfair labor practices, 18 secondary boycotts -- secondary boycotts is a 19 big issue -- the issues involved in the Hudgins 20 case, that is of the access of labor 21 representatives on private property and 22 balancing private property rights with those - 23 with First Amendment rights to get information 7254 1 out about union contracting, all of the issues 2 relating to union contracting. 3 Those are the kinds of issues 4 that this board will hear. That is a very 5 sophisticated -- I practiced in the labor 6 field. Those are very sophisticated, very 7 complicated issues of federal and state labor 8 law, and I think although Mr. Imbarrato has lots 9 of experience as a general practitioner, lots of 10 experience as a matrimonial practitioner, and 11 believe me, there's nothing I've heard today - 12 and I won't -- I won't comment on what Senator 13 Gold -- there's nothing that creates any 14 inference that he isn't a qualified, good man 15 for many jobs perhaps in this administration and 16 as a lawyer, but for this particularly highly 17 skilled area, I don't believe he has the 18 qualifications. 19 I'll vote no. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 21 Dollinger will be recorded in the negative. 22 The Secretary will continue to 23 call the roll. 7255 1 THE SECRETARY: Senator Espada. 2 (Negative indication.) 3 THE SECRETARY: Senator Farley. 4 SENATOR FARLEY: Aye. 5 THE SECRETARY: Senator Galiber, 6 excused. 7 Senator Gold. 8 SENATOR GOLD: No. 9 THE SECRETARY: Senator Gonzalez. 10 (There was no response.) 11 Senator Goodman. 12 (There was no response.) 13 Senator Hannon. 14 SENATOR HANNON: To explain my 15 vote. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 17 Hannon to explain his vote. 18 SENATOR HANNON: Given the 19 standards that we've heard enunciated by Senator 20 Dollinger, Senator Paterson, I think we should 21 be confirming very enthusiastically Mr. 22 Imbarrato, because the very nature of the law to 23 be practiced requires the type of judgment, 7256 1 intelligence, experience that an individual such 2 as he possesses, and given those standards I 3 could not more highly recommend to this body 4 that we vote in the affirmative, as I do. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 6 Hannon in the affirmative. 7 The Secretary will continue to 8 call the roll. 9 THE SECRETARY: Senator Hoblock. 10 SENATOR HOBLOCK: Yes. 11 THE SECRETARY: Senator Hoffmann. 12 (There was no response.) 13 Senator Holland. 14 (There was no response.) 15 Senator Johnson. 16 SENATOR JOHNSON: Yes. 17 THE SECRETARY: Senator Jones. 18 SENATOR JONES: No. 19 THE SECRETARY: Senator Kruger. 20 (There was no response.) 21 Senator Kuhl. 22 SENATOR KUHL: Aye. 23 THE SECRETARY: Senator Lack. 7257 1 (There was no response.) 2 Senator Larkin. 3 (There was no response.) 4 Senator LaValle. 5 SENATOR LAVALLE: Aye. 6 THE SECRETARY: Senator Leibell. 7 SENATOR LEIBELL: Aye. 8 THE SECRETARY: Senator Leichter. 9 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 11 Leichter to explain his vote. 12 SENATOR LEICHTER: Just briefly, 13 I don't know how we got into this long 14 discussion about judges, and so on, because it's 15 just not analogous to this nominee and the 16 position to which he's being nominated. 17 This is a board. It does hear 18 cases, but there are also -- particularly since 19 he's going to be the chairman -- administrative 20 functions. It has a certain role to play as far 21 as defining the nature of the dispute, how the 22 matter is going to be handled which are totally 23 different from the way judges handle cases and, 7258 1 therefore, I totally reject the idea, Well, 2 since any lawyer can be a judge just about, then 3 anybody can serve on the Employment Relations 4 Board. That just is not the case. 5 Let's look for people who know 6 what they're doing. I think we owe that and 7 this Governor owes that to the people of the 8 state of New York. 9 I vote no. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 11 Leichter in the negative. 12 The Secretary will continue to 13 call the roll. 14 THE SECRETARY: Senator Levy. 15 SENATOR LEVY: Aye. 16 THE SECRETARY: Senator Libous. 17 SENATOR LIBOUS: Aye. 18 THE SECRETARY: Senator Maltese. 19 (There was no response.) 20 Senator Marcellino. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 22 Marcellino to explain his vote. 23 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 7259 1 President, to use the words of Senator Leichter 2 before, this nominee possesses the qualities of 3 honesty, integrity and intelligence. What more 4 could you want? 5 I vote aye. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 7 Marcellino in the affirmative. 8 The Secretary will continue to 9 call the roll. 10 THE SECRETARY: Senator Marchi. 11 SENATOR MARCHI: Aye. 12 THE SECRETARY: Senator 13 Markowitz. 14 SENATOR MARKOWITZ: No. 15 THE SECRETARY: Senator Maziarz. 16 (There was no response.) 17 Senator Mendez. 18 SENATOR MENDEZ: Yes. 19 THE SECRETARY: Senator 20 Montgomery. 21 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: No. 22 THE SECRETARY: Senator Nanula. 23 SENATOR NANULA: No. 7260 1 THE SECRETARY: Senator Nozzolio. 2 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Aye. 3 THE SECRETARY: Senator Onorato. 4 (There was no response.) 5 Senator Oppenheimer. 6 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: To explain 7 my vote. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 9 Oppenheimer to explain her vote. 10 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: It's going 11 to be a rare occasion but I'm going to take my 12 husband's advice. 13 I should disclose, I guess, that 14 my husband heads the Labor-Management Department 15 of Proskauer, and his advice has always been 16 that he would much prefer someone who was 17 energetic and intelligent coming into the 18 department than someone necessarily who had a 19 considerable amount of background but did not 20 have that intelligence and that energy that he 21 was looking for. 22 It seems to me that this 23 gentleman before us, though no -- has no 7261 1 background in this field and was readily 2 admitting to that fact, that he seems to have 3 the intelligence and the capability that will 4 make him assume this post with -- with 5 considerable skill and energy, and so I'm going 6 to be voting in the affirmative. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 8 Oppenheimer in the affirmative. 9 The Secretary will continue to 10 call the roll. 11 THE SECRETARY: Senator Padavan. 12 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes. 13 THE SECRETARY: Senator Paterson. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 15 Paterson to explain his vote. 16 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President, 17 I actually lived in the town of Hempstead when 18 Mr. Imbarrato was the councilman between 1969 19 and 1979. I'm sure that he will do a fine job, 20 and I understand what Senator Oppenheimer is 21 saying. 22 The reason that I would want to 23 vote no on this confirmation is that, though we 7262 1 might prefer an energetic person who is intelli 2 gent to then just someone who has the experience 3 I'm suggesting that we must somewhere around 4 here have an energetic person who has the 5 experience. 6 So we may have the brightest, but 7 we may not have the best in the sense that while 8 Mr. Imbarrato is trying to learn, a person that 9 is equally as qualified but more familiar with 10 the subject could be moving forward, but I 11 understand what Senator Hannon said and I 12 understand what Senator Stafford said and I'm 13 voting no, but maybe the moon is influencing me; 14 but the Minority has changed its position, Mr. 15 President. We don't want to hear the bells 16 during slow roll call; we would rather hear a 17 rendition of Moon River by Andy Williams. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 19 Paterson in the negative. 20 The Secretary will continue to 21 call the roll. 22 THE SECRETARY: Senator Present. 23 SENATOR PRESENT: Aye. 7263 1 THE SECRETARY: Senator Rath. 2 SENATOR RATH: Aye. 3 THE SECRETARY: Senator Saland. 4 SENATOR SALAND: Aye. 5 THE SECRETARY: Senator Santiago, 6 excused. 7 Senator Sears. 8 SENATOR SEARS: Aye. 9 THE SECRETARY: Senator Seward. 10 SENATOR SEWARD: Yes. 11 THE SECRETARY: Senator Skelos. 12 SENATOR SKELOS: Yes. 13 THE SECRETARY: Senator Smith. 14 SENATOR SMITH: Yes. 15 THE SECRETARY: Senator Solomon. 16 (There was no response.) 17 Senator Spano. 18 SENATOR SPANO: Mr. President. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 20 Spano to explain his vote. 21 SENATOR SPANO: Explain my vote. 22 As the chairman of the Labor 23 Committee, we have had an opportunity to have 7264 1 extensive conversations with this nominee. 2 I have had a chance to have him 3 appear before the Committee, talk to the members 4 of the Committee, and was recommended favorably 5 without any objection to the Senate Finance 6 Committee from that Labor Committee. 7 He's someone -- I don't have to 8 go through everything that has been said this 9 afternoon. My colleagues have more than 10 adequately spoken about his capabilities, about 11 his background, the fact that he is an 12 established attorney, as a local official 13 certainly has got more than enough background to 14 chair this agency. 15 I enthusiastically vote yes for 16 this nominee and question, this is one -- I 17 think the only time that I've seen that we are 18 having a slow roll call on an appointment -- on 19 an appointment to the chairman or members of the 20 State Employment Relations Board. Don't quite 21 understand that. There's something else going 22 on here today. Maybe you could share it with 23 us, but I'll tell you, Tony Imbarrato who is up 7265 1 there, he's a gentleman and will do us all very 2 proud serving the Governor and all of the people 3 of the state. 4 I vote aye. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 6 Spano in the affirmative. 7 The Secretary will continue to 8 call the roll. 9 THE SECRETARY: Senator 10 Stachowski. 11 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: No. 12 THE SECRETARY: Senator Stafford. 13 SENATOR STAFFORD: Aye. 14 THE SECRETARY: Senator Stavisky. 15 SENATOR STAVISKY: No. 16 THE SECRETARY: Senator Trunzo. 17 SENATOR TRUNZO: Yes. 18 THE SECRETARY: Senator Tully. 19 SENATOR TULLY: Aye. 20 THE SECRETARY: Senator Velella. 21 SENATOR VELELLA: Mr. President. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 23 Velella to explain his vote. 7266 1 SENATOR VELELLA: Being at the 2 end of the alphabet, I have the luxury of being 3 the 31st vote I understand on this nomination, 4 but let me say, I have listened very intently to 5 the issues that were raised by the Minority, and 6 every single day that we come to work in this 7 chamber, all of us vote on a variety of bills, 8 dealing with the Labor Law, the Banking Law, the 9 Insurance Law, the health codes, a battery of 10 issues. 11 Are we all pompous enough to 12 believe we are perfect experts on every phase of 13 the law? We take a look at the issues, we 14 examine the bills, we do the research necessary 15 to make an educated judgment. That's all we can 16 ask of any public official. I think we can get 17 that with this nominee. 18 I vote aye, as the 31st vote. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 20 Velella in the affirmative. 21 The Secretary will continue to 22 call the roll. 23 THE SECRETARY: Senator Volker. 7267 1 SENATOR VOLKER: Yes. 2 THE SECRETARY: Senator Waldon. 3 (There was no response.) 4 Senator Wright. 5 SENATOR WRIGHT: Aye. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 7 Secretary will call the absentees. 8 THE SECRETARY: Senator Gonzalez. 9 (There was no response.) 10 Senator Goodman. 11 (There was no response.) 12 Senator Hoffmann. 13 (There was no response.) 14 Senator Holland. 15 SENATOR HOLLAND: Yes. 16 THE SECRETARY: Senator Kruger. 17 SENATOR KRUGER: No. 18 THE SECRETARY: Senator Lack. 19 (There was no response.) 20 Senator Larkin. 21 SENATOR LARKIN: I proudly vote 22 yes. 23 THE SECRETARY: Senator Maltese. 7268 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 2 Maltese to explain his vote. 3 SENATOR MALTESE: Just very, very 4 briefly, Mr. President. 5 I am proud to cast my vote aye. 6 As a member of the Sons of Italy, as someone who 7 is active in Italian-American affairs, I think 8 he will make a fine nominee with a balanced, 9 dedicated approach. 10 I'm proud to vote aye. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 12 Maltese in the affirmative. 13 THE SECRETARY: Senator Maziarz. 14 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Yes. 15 THE SECRETARY: Senator Onorato. 16 (Affirmative indication.) 17 Senator Solomon. 18 (There was no response.) 19 Senator Waldon. 20 (There was no response.) 21 Senator Lack. 22 SENATOR LACK: Aye. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce 7269 1 the results. 2 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 39, nays 14. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 4 nomination of Anthony C. Imbarrato is 5 confirmed. 6 We're very, very pleased to be 7 joined by Mr. Imbarrato and his wife Vicki, who 8 are seated in the gallery to your left, my 9 right. 10 Welcome. Good luck. 11 (Applause.) 12 Senator Skelos. 13 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, 14 could you call up Calendar Number 1056, Senate 15 5236? 16 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 18 Leichter, why do you rise? 19 SENATOR LEICHTER: Yeah. May I 20 take this opportunity to ask unanimous consent 21 to be recorded in the negative on Calendar 605 22 and 710? 23 SENATOR GOLD: Without 7270 1 objection. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 3 objection, Senator Leichter will be recorded in 4 the negative on Calendar Number 605. 5 Senator Gold, why do you rise? 6 SENATOR GOLD: Yes. Without 7 objection, may I be recorded in the negative on 8 Calendar 605? 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 10 objection. Hearing no objection, Senator Gold 11 will be recorded in the negative on Calendar 12 605. 13 Senator Mendez. 14 SENATOR MENDEZ: Mr. President, I 15 request unanimous consent to be recorded in the 16 negative on Calendar Number 605. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 18 objection. Hearing no objection, Senator Mendez 19 will be recorded in the negative on Calendar 20 605. 21 Senator Nanula. 22 SENATOR NANULA: Mr. President, 23 I'd like to request unanimous concent to be 7271 1 recorded in the negative on Calendar Numbers 605 2 and 770. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 4 objection, Senator Nanula -- hearing no 5 objection, Senator Nanula will be recorded in 6 the negative on Calendar Number 605 and 770. 7 Senator Stavisky. 8 SENATOR STAVISKY: Mr. President, 9 without objection, I should like to be recorded 10 in the negative on Calendar Number 605. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 12 objection. Hearing no objection, Senator 13 Stavisky will be recorded in the negative on 14 Calendar 605. 15 Senator Padavan. 16 SENATOR PADAVAN: Similarly, Mr. 17 President, negative vote on 605. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 19 objection. Hearing no objection, Senator 20 Padavan will be recorded in the negative on 21 Calendar 605. 22 Senator Oppenheimer. 23 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Ditto. 7272 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 2 objection. No objection being heard, Senator 3 Oppenheimer will be recorded in the negative on 4 Calendar Number 605. 5 Senator Montgomery. 6 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Negative on 7 605, Mr. President. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 9 objection. Hearing no objection, Senator 10 Montgomery will be recorded in the negative on 11 Calendar Number 605. 12 Senator Babbush, without 13 objection. Hearing no objection, Senator 14 Babbush will be recorded in the negative on 15 Calendar Number 605. 16 Senator Velella. 17 SENATOR VELELLA: Mr. President, 18 my bill, Senate 2587, Calendar Number 764, would 19 you remove the star, please? 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: At the 21 sponsor's request, the star will be removed on 22 Calendar Number 764. 23 SENATOR GOODMAN: Mr. President. 7273 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 2 Goodman. 3 SENATOR GOODMAN: I was listening 4 attentively to the debate on the nominee just 5 approved but was called away for a moment. May 6 I please, without objection, be recorded in the 7 affirmative on the slow roll? 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 9 record will reflect, Senator Goodman, that had 10 you been present, you would have voted in the 11 affirmative on Calendar Number -- excuse me - 12 on the confirmation of Anthony Imbarrato. 13 Senator Skelos. 14 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, I 15 believe there's a report of the Finance 16 Committee at the desk, if we could have it read 17 at this time. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Ask the 19 Secretary to read the report of the Finance 20 Committee. 21 THE SECRETARY: Senator Stafford, 22 from the Committee on Finance, reports the 23 following bill: 7274 1 Senate Print 5236, Budget Bill, 2 an act to amend a chapter of the laws of 1995 3 entitled, "An act to provide for payments to 4 municipalities and to providers of medical 5 services under the Medical Assistance Program." 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 7 Skelos. 8 SENATOR SKELOS: At this time, 9 could we please vote on Calendar Number 1056, 10 Senate 5236? 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 12 objection, the Finance Committee report is 13 received. The bill is reported directly to 14 Third Reading. 15 The Secretary will read Calendar 16 Number 1056. 17 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 18 1056, Budget Bill, 5236, an act to amend a 19 chapter of the laws of 1995 entitled, "An act to 20 provide for payments to municipalities and 21 providers of medical services under the Medical 22 Assistance Program." 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 7275 1 Secretary will read the last section. 2 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 3 act shall take effect on the same date as such 4 chapter of the laws of 1995. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 6 roll. 7 (The Secretary called the roll.) 8 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 57. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 10 is passed. 11 Senator Skelos. 12 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, I 13 believe there's a privileged resolution at the 14 desk by Senator Present. I ask that it be read 15 in its entirety and that it be adopted. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator, 17 there is a privileged resolution by Senator 18 Present at the desk. I'll ask the Secretary to 19 read it in its entirety. 20 THE SECRETARY: By Senator 21 Present, Legislative Resolution memorializing 22 Governor Pataki to proclaim the week of June 2nd 23 through 9th, 1995 as "Manufacturing Week" in the 7276 1 state of New York. 2 WHEREAS, it is the sense of this 3 assembled body that those who give positive 4 definition to the profile and disposition of the 5 communities of the state of New York do so 6 profoundly strengthen in our shared commitment 7 to the exercise of freedom; and 8 WHEREAS, attendant to such 9 concern and fully in accord with its 10 long-standing traditions, it is the intent of 11 this assembled body to memorialize Governor 12 Pataki to proclaim the week of June 2 through 9, 13 1995 as "Manufacturing Week" in the state of New 14 York. 15 Manufacturing provides employment 16 for nearly one million people in New York 17 State. 18 Manufacturing jobs pay an average 19 of 23 percent more than other jobs. 20 Manufacturing has a significant 21 effect whereby every 100 new manufacturing jobs 22 creates an additional 135 other jobs. 23 Manufacturing employment has 7277 1 fallen below one million for the first time 2 since the turn of the century. 3 The state has lost more than 4 one-third of its manufacturing employment in the 5 last three decades. In the 1950s, one out of 6 every three jobs was in manufacturing. Now it 7 is one in every eight. 8 The survival of a vibrant 9 manufacturing sector of the economy enhances the 10 opportunity for an improved quality for the 11 citizens of this region; and 12 WHEREAS, industry is critical to 13 maintaining a high quality of life in New York 14 State; now, therefore, be it 15 RESOLVED, that this legislative 16 body pause in its deliberations and note that it 17 is the policy of New York State to develop and 18 implement programs and policies that encourage 19 the growth, retention and attraction of 20 manufacturing investment; and be it further 21 RESOLVED, that this legislative 22 body memorialize Governor Pataki to join with 23 scores of individual communities and proclaim 7278 1 the week of June 2 through 9, 1995 as 2 "Manufacturing Week" in the state of New York; 3 and be it further 4 RESOLVED, that a copy of this 5 resolution, suitably engrossed, be transmitted 6 to Governor George E. Pataki. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 8 Present, several members have indicated that 9 they would like to co-sponsor this. Would you 10 like to open it up for sponsorship? 11 SENATOR PRESENT: Mr. President. 12 I understand that a number of co-sponsors 13 already -- certainly, open it up to anyone who 14 desires. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Why don't 16 we do as we have in the past. We'll place all 17 the members on as co-sponsors unless they 18 indicate to the desk that they don't wish to be 19 on, okay? That will be done. 20 The question is on the 21 resolution. All those in favor signify by 22 saying aye. 23 (Response of "Aye".) 7279 1 Opposed, nay. 2 (There was no response.) 3 The resolution is adopted. 4 Senator Farley. 5 SENATOR FARLEY: Thank you, Mr. 6 President. 7 On behalf of Senator Libous, 8 please remove the sponsor's star from Calendar 9 938. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: At the 11 request of the sponsor, the star will be removed 12 on Calendar Number 938. 13 SENATOR FARLEY: On behalf of 14 Senator Velella, on page 7, I offer the 15 following amendments to Calendar 222, Senate 16 Print 2764-A, and I ask that that bill retain 17 its place. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 19 amendments to Calendar Number 222 are received 20 and adopted. The bill will retain its place on 21 the Third Reading Calendar. 22 Senator Farley. 23 SENATOR FARLEY: On page 22, on 7280 1 behalf of Senator Levy, I offer the following 2 amendments to Calendar 728, Senate Print 973-B 3 and I ask that that bill retain its place on the 4 Third Reading Calendar. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 6 amendments to Calendar Number 728 are received 7 and adopted. The bill will retain its place on 8 the Third Reading Calendar. 9 SENATOR FARLEY: On behalf of 10 Senator Trunzo, on page 21, I offer the 11 following amendments to Calendar 692, Senate 12 Print 4057, and I ask that that bill retain its 13 place. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 15 amendments to Calendar Number 692 are received 16 and adopted. The bill will retain its place on 17 the Third Reading Calendar. 18 SENATOR FARLEY: Again on behalf 19 of Senator Trunzo, on page 21, Calendar Number 20 689, Senate Print 3577, I offer the following 21 amendments and I ask that that bill retain its 22 place. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 7281 1 amendments to Calendar Number 689 are received 2 and adopted. The bill will retain its place on 3 the Third Reading Calendar. 4 Senator Skelos -- excuse me. 5 Senator Mendez. 6 SENATOR MENDEZ: Thank you, Mr. 7 President. 8 Please, there will be an 9 immediate conference of the Minority. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There 11 will be an immediate conference of the Minority 12 in the Minority Conference Room. Immediate 13 conference of the Minority in the Minority 14 Conference Room. 15 Senator Skelos. 16 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, 17 is there any other housekeeping at the desk? 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: No. 19 We're all clear, Senator Skelos. 20 SENATOR SKELOS: Then the Senate 21 will stand at ease, and there will be an 22 immediate conference of the Majority in the 23 Majority Conference Room. 7282 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There 2 will be an immediate conference of the Majority 3 in the Majority Conference Room, Room 332. 4 Immediate meeting of the Majority Conference in 5 the Majority Conference Room, Room 332 and the 6 Senate will stand at ease. 7 (Whereupon the Senate stood at 8 ease from 1:34 p.m. until 9:03 p.m.) 9 SENATOR JOHNSON: The Senate 10 please will come to order for the purposes of an 11 announcement. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Chair 13 recognizes Senator Johnson calling the chamber 14 to order for an announcement. The Chair would, 15 for the benefit of the members, would note that 16 the Majority Leader has requested that all of 17 you be in the chamber at 9:15, 11 minutes from 18 now, when the Senate will reconvene. 19 The members will be provided with 20 a revised active list. There will be several 21 bills that we will attempt to take up this 22 evening. So at 9:15, the Senate will be called 23 back to order. 7283 1 Senator Paterson. Why do you 2 rise? 3 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President, 4 first of all, I never sat down. I -- I'd like 5 to hear the gavel, Mr. President. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: You'd 7 like to see the gavel. 8 SENATOR PATERSON: No, I'd like 9 to hear it. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Well, 11 we're really not in session at this moment, Mr. 12 Paterson, just talking amongst ourselves 13 providing a little information for the insight 14 of the members. Would you like to provide the 15 members with some information, those ears on 16 your side of the aisle? 17 SENATOR PATERSON: Yes. The 18 Senate will come to order at 9:15 like you said, 19 Mr. President. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: We're 21 harmonious in our thoughts, Senator Paterson. 22 Thank you. 23 SENATOR PATERSON: I understand. 7284 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senate 2 will come to order at 9:15, ten minutes away. 3 (The Senate stood at ease from 4 9:10 to 9:20 p.m.) 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 6 Senate will come to order. 7 SENATOR JOHNSON: Mr. President. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Members 9 please find their places, staff please find 10 their places. 11 SENATOR JOHNSON: Mr. President. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair 13 recognizes Senator Johnson. 14 SENATOR JOHNSON: May we proceed 15 with the Supplemental Calendar, calling up the 16 first bill, Calendar Number 317. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Ask the 18 Secretary to read Supplemental Calendar. 19 THE SECRETARY: On page 9, 20 Calendar 317, by Senator DiCarlo, Senate Print 21 1984A, an act to amend the Executive Law, in 22 relation to qualifications of employment for 23 direct care staff in the Division for Youth. 7285 1 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 3 bill aside. 4 Secretary will continue to call 5 the non-controversial. 6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7 573, by Senator Levy, Senate Print Number 392A, 8 an act to amend the Transportation Law, in 9 relation to requiring common rail carriers to 10 adopt hazardous material emergency preparedness 11 plans. 12 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 14 bill aside. 15 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 16 594, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 2595, an 17 act to amend the Social Services Law, in 18 relation to criminal screening of child day care 19 providers. 20 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 22 bill aside. 23 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7286 1 734, by Senator Hoblock, Senate Print 4211, an 2 act to amend the Alcoholic Beverage Control Law, 3 and others, in relation to compensatory 4 service. 5 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 7 bill aside. 8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 9 804, by Senator DiCarlo, Senate Print 4687, an 10 act to amend the Executive Law, in relation to 11 increasing income eligibility level for persons 12 employed by Green Thumb Environmental 13 Beautification, Incorporated. 14 SENATOR PATERSON: Oh, hold 15 that. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 17 bill aside. 18 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 19 870, by Senator Levy, Senate Print Number 4857, 20 an act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in 21 relation to increasing fines associated with 22 passing school buses. 23 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation. 7287 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 2 bill aside. 3 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 4 950, by Senator Saland, Senate Bill Number 3475, 5 an act to amend the Family Court Act and the 6 Domestic Relations Law, in relation to service 7 of temporary orders of protection. 8 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 10 bill aside. 11 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 12 951, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 3612, an 13 act to amend the Domestic Relations Law, the 14 Criminal Procedure Law and the Family Court Act, 15 in relation to imposing a mandatory surcharge. 16 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 18 bill aside. 19 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 20 952, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 3953A, an 21 act to amend the Family Court Act and the Civil 22 Practice Law and Rules, in relation to 23 jurisdiction over non-residents. 7288 1 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 3 bill aside. 4 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 5 953, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 4013, an 6 act to amend the Family Court Act, in relation 7 to law guardian representation. 8 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 10 bill aside. 11 Senator Johnson, that completes 12 the non-controversial calendar. 13 SENATOR JOHNSON: Mr. President, 14 is there any housekeeping at the desk? 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: We have 16 quite a few pieces of housekeeping at the desk, 17 Senator Johnson. Would you like to take that up 18 at the present time? 19 SENATOR JOHNSON: Yes. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: We'll 21 return to motions and resolutions. 22 Chair recognizes Senator Farley. 23 SENATOR FARLEY: Thank you, Mr. 7289 1 President. 2 On behalf of Senator Holland, on 3 page 50, I offer the following amendments to 4 Calendar 1014, Senate Print 68, and I ask that 5 this bill retain its place on the Third Reading 6 Calendar. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 8 Amendments to Calendar Number 1014 received and 9 accepted. The bill will retain its place on the 10 Third Reading Calendar. 11 Senator Farley. 12 SENATOR FARLEY: On behalf of 13 Senator Stafford, on page 48, I offer the 14 following amendments to Calendar Number 660, 15 Senate Print Number 4056, and I ask that that 16 bill retain its place on the Third Reading 17 Calendar. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 19 Amendments to Calendar Number 660 will be 20 received and accepted. Bill will retain its 21 place on the Third Reading Calendar. 22 Senator Maziarz. 23 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Thank you, Mr. 7290 1 President. 2 On behalf of Senator Cook, please 3 remove the sponsor's star from Calendar Number 4 494. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: At the 6 request of the sponsor, a star will be removed 7 from Calendar Number 494. 8 Senator Maziarz. 9 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Mr. President, 10 on page number 8, I offer the following 11 amendments to Calendar Number 247, Senate Print 12 Number 2271, and ask that said bill retain its 13 place on the Third Reading Calendar. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 15 Amendments to Calendar Number 247 are received 16 and adopted. Bill will retain its place on the 17 Third Reading Calendar. 18 Senator Marcellino. 19 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 20 President, I ask to remove the star on my bill, 21 Senate Print Number 4951, the sponsor's star. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Calendar 23 Number? 7291 1 SENATOR MARCELLINO: 957. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: At the 3 request of the sponsor, the star will be removed 4 from Calendar Number 957. 5 Senator Marcellino. 6 SENATOR MARCELLINO: And on that 7 same page number 50, I offer the following 8 amendments to Calendar Number 957, Senate Print 9 4951. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 11 Amendments to Calendar Number 957 are received 12 and accepted. Bill will retain its place on the 13 Third Reading Calendar. 14 Senator Marcellino. 15 SENATOR MARCELLINO: On behalf of 16 Senator Goodman, I wish to call up Print Number 17 3424, recalled from the Assembly which is now at 18 the desk. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 20 will read the title. 21 THE SECRETARY: 740, by Senator 22 Goodman, Senate Print 3424, an act to amend the 23 Administrative Code of the city of New York, in 7292 1 relation to a credit against the unincorporated 2 business tax. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 4 Marcellino. 5 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 6 President, I now move to reconsider the vote by 7 which this bill passed. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Motion is 9 to reconsider the vote by which this bill 10 passed. Secretary will call the roll on 11 reconsideration. 12 (The Secretary called the roll on 13 reconsideration.) 14 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 57. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 16 Marcellino. 17 SENATOR MARCELLINO: I now offer 18 the following amendments. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 20 Amendments are received and adopted. 21 Senator Johnson, also there is a 22 substitution if you'd like to take that up at 23 this time. I'll ask the Secretary to read. 7293 1 Secretary will read. 2 THE SECRETARY: Senator Rath 3 moves to discharge from the Committee on Rules 4 Assembly Print Number 2817 and substitute it for 5 the identical Calendar Number 706. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 7 Substitution is ordered. 8 That completes the housekeeping, 9 Senator Johnson. 10 SENATOR JOHNSON: Now proceed 11 with the controversial calendar. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 13 will read the controversial calendar beginning 14 with Calendar Number 317. 15 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 16 317, by Senator DiCarlo, Senate Print Number 17 1984A, an act to amend the Executive Law, in 18 relation to qualifications of employment for 19 direct care staff in the Division for Youth. 20 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 22 DiCarlo, an explanation of Calendar Number 317 23 has been asked for by the Acting Minority 7294 1 Leader, Senator Paterson. 2 SENATOR DiCARLO: Thank you, Mr. 3 President. 4 This bill sets forth 5 qualifications for the DFY for direct care 6 staff. Those persons who are convicted of 7 felonies would not be employed. The Director of 8 the Division for Youth also in terms of 9 misdemeanors has the discretion for those 10 positions which he feels are positions that are 11 in direct care in the Division for Youth. 12 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Chair 14 recognizes Senator Abate. 15 SENATOR ABATE: Yes. Would 16 Senator DiCarlo yield to a question? 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 18 DiCarlo yields to Senator Abate for a question. 19 SENATOR ABATE: My recollection 20 is that we passed a similar bill not so long 21 ago; is that correct? 22 SENATOR DiCARLO: Yes, it is. 23 SENATOR ABATE: And how is this 7295 1 bill -- this bill is amended. How is the bill 2 different that was passed previously? 3 SENATOR DiCARLO: This bill -- I 4 believe without - 5 SENATOR ABATE: Again, that's my 6 recollection. 7 SENATOR DiCARLO: Yeah, but I 8 believe what this bill does that is different 9 than the prior bill is that we're also taking 10 into account those people convicted of 11 misdemeanors where the Director of the Division 12 for Youth feels that they are in positions with 13 direct oversight of those people in the Division 14 for Youth. This adds into the categories. 15 SENATOR ABATE: My -- again, I 16 mean it is your bill, but my recollection of the 17 other bill had a broader category, all Division 18 for Youth aides, and it did not delineate what 19 those aides are. So is this a more restrictive 20 bill? This is only individuals that are involved 21 in the custody of the juveniles? 22 SENATOR DiCARLO: Yeah. 23 SENATOR ABATE: And not 7296 1 counselors, not drug treatment providers. 2 SENATOR DiCARLO: Yeah. What 3 this -- what this bill does, it allows the 4 Director of the Division for Youth to decide 5 what positions of those positions where these 6 people should not be employed. 7 SENATOR ABATE: There's nothing 8 in the bill that delineates who these 9 individuals are; they will be described some 10 time later by the director? 11 SENATOR DiCARLO: Director of 12 DFY, correct. 13 SENATOR ABATE: For Youth. So 14 this could include not only custody staff but 15 treatment staff. 16 SENATOR DiCARLO: Yes. 17 SENATOR ABATE: Include anyone 18 who works within the Division for Youth. 19 SENATOR DiCARLO: Direct contact, 20 yes. 21 SENATOR ABATE: So that just for 22 clarification, almost anyone who goes into a 23 facility could be described as having direct 7297 1 contact with the individuals? 2 SENATOR DiCARLO: Yeah, the 3 Director of the Division for Youth will make 4 those -- those decisions. 5 SENATOR ABATE: And again you 6 don't remember what the language, specific 7 language, changes are between the last bill and 8 this bill? 9 SENATOR DiCARLO: Not 10 specifically, no. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Chair 12 recognizes Senator Dollinger. 13 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Will the 14 sponsor yield to a question, please? 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 16 DiCarlo, do you yield to Senator Dollinger? 17 SENATOR DiCARLO: Yes. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 19 yields. 20 SENATOR DOLLINGER: What effect 21 will this extension have on the Civil Service 22 Law? 23 SENATOR DiCARLO: I don't believe 7298 1 any, Senator. 2 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Well, suppose 3 you're on a civil service list and you were 4 entitled to an appointment or a promotion and 5 this now puts a new requirement into the Civil 6 Service Law, but I notice that it doesn't - 7 doesn't change the Civil Service Law. It 8 changes the Executive Law. 9 SENATOR DiCARLO: Yes, the answer 10 is I stand by what I just said in my answer that 11 I don't believe it affects it whatsoever. 12 SENATOR DOLLINGER: O.K. But 13 again through you, Mr. President, if Senator 14 DiCarlo will yield. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 16 DiCarlo, do you continue to yield to Senator 17 Dollinger? 18 SENATOR DiCARLO: Yes. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 20 continues to yield. 21 SENATOR DOLLINGER: There isn't 22 any section that changes the Civil Service Law 23 in this state? 7299 1 SENATOR DiCARLO: I believe it 2 just establishes qualifications for the Division 3 of Youth. 4 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Again through 5 you, Mr. President, you might know it's my 6 understanding the Civil Service Law contains 7 provisions for the appointment and the 8 circumstances and the qualifications for the 9 testing for employees throughout the state 10 service, and we have in the Executive Law and in 11 other places, we may have additional 12 qualifications for employees in particular 13 departments. 14 What we usually have in the Civil 15 Service Law is an express provision that incor 16 porates those changes, makes those changes and 17 applies them to specific executive departments. 18 This bill doesn't do that, though? 19 SENATOR DiCARLO: I -- I -- what 20 you say, I don't know whether you're right or 21 wrong, and basically the answer that I gave you 22 is the answer to your question that I still 23 stand by. 7300 1 SENATOR DOLLINGER: O.K. Again 2 through you, Mr. President, on another topic. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 4 DiCarlo, you continue to yield? 5 SENATOR DiCARLO: Yeah. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 7 continues to yield. 8 SENATOR DOLLINGER: This bill 9 requires a placement in the event of a felony or 10 misdemeanor. How would the state Division for 11 Youth find out whether the applicant or the 12 potential transferee is either a felon or a mis 13 demeanant? How will they -- how would they 14 know? 15 SENATOR DiCARLO: By the honesty 16 of the applicant. 17 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Is it - 18 again through you, Mr. President. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 20 continues to yield. 21 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Is it your 22 intention to change the application form, the 23 civil service application form, for people that 7301 1 work for the Division of Youth or seek transfers 2 in it that will require them to disclose whether 3 they are -- have been guilty of a felony or 4 misdemeanor? 5 SENATOR DiCARLO: With a little 6 aid from the chairman of the Codes Committee, 7 right now, many of the employees are not civil 8 service, as he tells me, and also under the 9 legislation, I believe the background checks 10 would be conducted to follow this law. 11 SENATOR DOLLINGER: But through 12 you, Mr. President, do you have any -- do you 13 know what the cost of conducting those 14 background checks will be? My understanding is 15 those checks are not currently conducted. 16 SENATOR DiCARLO: I don't have an 17 exact estimate. I don't believe it would be too 18 expensive, and I think it would be worthwhile, 19 but I don't have any figures, no. 20 SENATOR DOLLINGER: O.K. Through 21 you, Mr. President, one other question on the 22 topic. Are you aware -- is the sponsor aware 23 that, under the Executive Law in the state of 7302 1 New York, it is now an impermissible inquiry in 2 the course of an application, to ask a potential 3 applicant whether they've been guilty of a mis 4 demeanor? You can ask them whether they've been 5 guilty of a misdemeanor but, under the current 6 rulings of the Division of Human Rights, you 7 cannot ask an applicant whether they've been 8 guilty of a misdemeanor. 9 SENATOR DiCARLO: Sounds like a 10 good recommendation and maybe that's something 11 we have to look at, and I'd like your input and 12 you can help co-sponsor it. 13 SENATOR DOLLINGER: I don't have 14 any further questions. One more question, Mr. 15 President, on the bill. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 17 DiCarlo, you continue to yield? 18 SENATOR DiCARLO: Yes. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 20 continues to yield. 21 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Is there any 22 provision in this bill that permits a court 23 review of a denial for an application? I note 7303 1 there is a provision that says that you may ask 2 the director to review the denial of a position 3 either on the basis of the fact that they were 4 guilty of a misdemeanor and that that 5 misdemeanor would mean it would not be in the 6 best interests of the agency, but there's no 7 provision in here that gives the courts 8 jurisdiction to review the denial of an 9 application if there were -- the decision was 10 made on improper information or the decision was 11 reversed on appeal, the felony was struck out, 12 there was a later habeas corpus petition that 13 expunged the felony, in all of those instances 14 there may be justifiable grounds for this 15 applicant or transferee to seek court review and 16 have the courts overturn what would be an 17 arbitrary and capricious exercise of discretion 18 on the part of the department, but that's -- is 19 there anything in this bill that affects that? 20 SENATOR DiCARLO: Well, I think 21 you already stated they already have the ability 22 and they would continue to have the ability to 23 bring an Article 78 proceeding, and I'll bring 7304 1 your attention to the last few para... lines in 2 the bill in terms of whether it can just be done 3 without any recourse and it says notwithstanding 4 the foregoing provisions of the section, no 5 person shall be disqualified on a discretionary 6 basis unless he or she shall have been provided 7 a written statement of the reasons for such 8 disqualification and afforded an opportunity by 9 the director or the director's designee to make 10 an explanation and to submit facts in opposition 11 thereto. 12 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Through you, 13 Mr. President, what is the -- is there a motive 14 under which those decisions would be made? Is 15 there an improper -- impartial hearing officer 16 will decide the question as we have in many 17 other parts of our -- our code, or is this going 18 to be something that the director will sort of 19 decide without the presence of counsel, without 20 impartial tribunals, without additional notice 21 of the time and place of the hearing? 22 Usually those kinds of 23 protections are tucked into these types of 7305 1 determinations and, in addition, I'd ask, what's 2 the standard of review in the court proceeding 3 assuming that this individual takes the denial 4 of the director and the denial of the review of 5 the administration process, takes it to the 6 court, what's the standard of review for this 7 decision? 8 SENATOR DiCARLO: This is an 9 administrative decision that is made by the 10 director and the person who is deemed 11 disqualified has legal recourse in this action. 12 SENATOR DOLLINGER: On the bill, 13 Mr. President. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 15 Dollinger, on the bill. 16 SENATOR DOLLINGER: I hope my 17 questions perhaps expressed my late hour's 18 skepticism for this bill. I think it has some 19 good intent. I think there may be some good 20 substance in here, but I think it needs a lot 21 more work. 22 I think we ought to amend the 23 Civil Service Law to expressly provide that this 7306 1 will now be a part of any civil service 2 determinations that are made in DFY. I think we 3 should look at the Human Rights Law and the 4 Executive Law which creates prohibitions on 5 asking certain questions of applicants regarding 6 their past criminal behavior, and I also think 7 that you need a better standard of review. 8 There's no description of the 9 standard of review. There's no description as 10 there are in many bills that we pass that says 11 all of this can be reviewed under an Article 78 12 proceeding, under which the standard will be 13 whether or not the director's determination was 14 arbitrary and capricious, a well accepted 15 standard in the law. 16 The bill goes part of the way to 17 solving what I think is a very complicated 18 problem. I don't think it goes quite far 19 enough. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 21 Abate. 22 SENATOR ABATE: Yes. Would 23 Senator DiCarlo yield to a question? 7307 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 2 yields. 3 SENATOR ABATE: I did find the 4 prior legislation that passed on April 24th and 5 perhaps you can clarify for me. It's the same 6 bill in essence. The first bill talked about 7 employment as a Youth Division aide and the 8 current bill talks about a direct care staff. 9 Could you explain to me the difference between a 10 Youth Division aide and direct care staff? 11 SENATOR DiCARLO: I think in the 12 first bill what it does is it limits the 13 director's discretion in terms of who is in 14 contact with those involved at the Division for 15 Youth and it broadens for the director and for 16 the DFY those people that they consider who are 17 in contact with the youngsters so that they have 18 a better idea and can make a better judgment on 19 who should not be employed by the DFY who have 20 contact with the youth. 21 SENATOR ABATE: So, in other 22 words, the Youth Division aide is a civil 23 service title; is that a civil service title 7308 1 that relates to a small subset of the staff that 2 work in the facility? 3 SENATOR DiCARLO: Well, I don't 4 know whether it's a civil -- civil service title 5 but it is a smaller subset within the DFY and I 6 think that the reason that we've made a change 7 in this legislation is for the director to have 8 more say in who should not be in contact, those 9 people who are convicted felons or those who are 10 misdemeanants who, in the -- in the 11 understanding of the director should not be in 12 contact with the youths within the Division of 13 Youth. 14 SENATOR ABATE: And it's my 15 understanding, then, from the last time I asked 16 the question that direct care staff will not 17 only include custody which are similar to 18 correction officers where I understand there is 19 a need to eliminate people with prior felony 20 convictions, but also includes treatment people, 21 people who have casual conduct -- contact, and 22 are not involved in the securing and the custody 23 of the youngsters; is that right? 7309 1 SENATOR DiCARLO: Well, I - 2 SENATOR ABATE: It would include 3 anyone? 4 SENATOR DiCARLO: Sure, anyone 5 who the Director of the -- of the Division 6 believes is in contact with those individuals in 7 DFY, who the Director and the Division for Youth 8 do not believe should be in contact, who are 9 felons or in some cases those who have committed 10 misdemeanors. It is at their discretion again. 11 SENATOR ABATE: And is there 12 anything in the bill that would allow the 13 director or mandate the director to look at how 14 long ago the person was convicted of this crime? 15 Let's say it occurred 25 years ago, that they 16 remain clean, they became law-abiding, they were 17 employed successfully elsewhere. Is there any 18 mandatory consideration when a court gives an 19 individual certificate of relief from 20 disability? None of that is in the statute? 21 SENATOR DiCARLO: If the 22 individual has committed a felony and has been 23 convicted of a felony, they can not be in those 7310 1 positions. If the person has been convicted of 2 a misdemeanor and the Director of the Division 3 for Youth believes that they are still and 4 should not be in contact with those in the 5 Division for Youth, they will not be, so it is, 6 to answer your question, no. 7 SENATOR ABATE: So under this 8 legislation the second piece of legislation 9 would mean just about anyone who is employed by 10 the Division for Youth - 11 SENATOR DiCARLO: That is - 12 SENATOR ABATE: -- could be 13 eliminated from employment if they have a prior 14 felony conviction. 15 SENATOR DiCARLO: That the 16 director believes they are in direct care, and 17 those are the words that are used, direct care 18 for those within the Division for Youth. 19 SENATOR ABATE: But there's no 20 definition for that within the statute. 21 SENATOR DiCARLO: No. That is 22 the director who will make that decision. 23 SENATOR ABATE: All right. Thank 7311 1 you. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 3 will read the last section. 4 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 5 act shall take effect immediately. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 7 roll. 8 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce 10 the results when tabulated. 11 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 12 the negative on Calendar 317 are Senators Abate, 13 Dollinger, Kruger, Leichter, Montgomery, 14 Paterson and Smith. Ayes 50, nays 7. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 16 is passed. 17 The Chair recognizes Senator 18 Johnson. 19 SENATOR JOHNSON: Mr. President, 20 is there any further housekeeping to be taken up 21 at this time? 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The desk 23 tells me that all the housekeeping has been 7312 1 taken care of, Senator Johnson. 2 SENATOR JOHNSON: Mr. President, 3 then, at this time I move that we adjourn to 4 reconvene tomorrow morning at 10:00 o'clock, 5 10:00 a.m. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 7 objection, the Senate stands adjourned until 8 tomorrow, Friday, June 2nd, at 10:00 a.m. Note 9 the time change, 10:00 a.m. 10 (Whereupon at 9:45 p.m., the 11 Senate adjourned.) 12 13 14 15 16