Tuesday, May 21, 1996

5452 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 ALBANY, NEW YORK 9 May 21, 1996 10 3:05 p.m. 11 12 13 REGULAR SESSION 14 15 16 17 SENATOR JOHN R. KUHL, JR., Acting President 18 STEPHEN F. SLOAN, Secretary 19 20 21 22 23 5453 1 P R O C E E D I N G S 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 3 Senate will come to order. Ask the members to 4 find their places, the staff to find their 5 places. Ask everybody in the chamber to rise 6 and join with me in saying the Pledge of 7 Allegiance to the Flag. 8 (The assemblage repeated the 9 Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.) 10 In the absence of clergy, may we 11 bow our heads in a moment of silence. 12 (A moment of silence was 13 observed.) 14 Reading of the Journal. 15 THE SECRETARY: In Senate, 16 Monday, May 20th. The Senate met pursuant to 17 adjournment, Senator Kuhl in the Chair upon 18 designation of the Temporary President. The 19 Prayer by the Reverend Peter Young, Blessed 20 Sacrament Church, Bolton Landing. The Journal 21 of Sunday, May 19, was read and approved. On 22 motion, the Senate adjourned. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Hearing 5454 1 no objection, the Journal stands approved as 2 read. 3 Presentation of petitions. 4 Messages from the Assembly. 5 Messages from the Governor. 6 Reports of standing committees. 7 Reports of select committees. 8 Communications and reports from 9 state officers. 10 Motions and resolutions. 11 The Chair recognizes Senator 12 Tully. 13 SENATOR TULLY: Thank you, Mr. 14 President. 15 On behalf of Senator Levy, I wish 16 to call up his bill, Senate Print Number 7569, 17 which is now at the desk. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 19 Secretary will read the title. 20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 21 1221, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 7569, an act 22 to authorize the Roosevelt Union Free School 23 District. 5455 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 2 Tully. 3 SENATOR TULLY: Mr. President, I 4 now move to reconsider the vote by which this 5 bill was passed and ask that the bill be 6 restored to the order of third reading. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 8 Secretary will call the roll on reconsideration. 9 (The Secretary called the roll on 10 reconsideration.) 11 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 32. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 13 is restored. 14 Senator Tully. 15 SENATOR TULLY: Mr. President, I 16 now move to discharge from the Committee on 17 Rules Assembly Print Number 10688 and substitute 18 it for Senator Levy's identical bill. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 20 substitution is ordered. 21 SENATOR TULLY: I now move that 22 the substituted Assembly bill have its third 23 reading at this time. 5456 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 2 Secretary will read. 3 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 4 1221, by the Assembly Committee on Rules, 5 Assembly Print Number 10688, an act to authorize 6 the Roosevelt Union Free School District. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 8 roll -- the Secretary will read the last 9 section. 10 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 11 act shall take effect immediately. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 13 roll. 14 (The Secretary called the roll.) 15 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 32. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 17 is passed. 18 Senator Tully. 19 SENATOR TULLY: Mr. President, on 20 behalf of Senator Rath, on page 43, I offer the 21 following amendments to Calendar Number 943, 22 Assembly Print Number 7366-A, and ask that said 23 bill retain its place on the Third Reading 5457 1 Calendar. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 3 amendments to Calendar Number 943 are received 4 and adopted. The bill will retain its place on 5 the Third Reading Calendar. 6 Senator Tully. 7 SENATOR TULLY: Mr. President, on 8 behalf of Senator Maziarz, on page 20, I offer 9 the following amendments to Calendar Number 670, 10 Senate Print Number 6355-A, and ask that said 11 bill retain its place on the Third Reading 12 Calendar. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 14 amendments to Calendar Number 670 are received 15 and adopted. The bill will retain its place on 16 the Third Reading Calendar. 17 Senator Tully. 18 SENATOR TULLY: Mr. President, on 19 behalf of Senator Hannon, on page 50, I offer 20 the following amendments to Calendar Number 21 1010, Assembly Print Number 7428, and ask that 22 said bill retain its place on the Third Reading 23 Calendar. 5458 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 2 amendments to Calendar Number 1010 are received 3 and adopted. The bill will retain its place on 4 the Third Reading Calendar. 5 Senator Tully. 6 SENATOR TULLY: Mr. President, on 7 behalf of Senator Lack, on page 55, I offer the 8 following amendments to Calendar Number 1056, 9 Assembly Print Number 4757, and ask that said 10 bill retain its place on the Third Reading 11 calendar. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 13 amendments to Calendar Number 1056 are received 14 and adopted. The bill will retain its place on 15 the Third Reading Calendar. 16 Senator Tully. 17 SENATOR TULLY: Mr. President, on 18 behalf of Senator Cook, on page 23, I offer the 19 following amendments to Calendar Number 719, 20 Senate Print Number 3220-A, and ask that said 21 bill retain its place on the Third Reading 22 Calendar. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 5459 1 amendments to Calendar 719 are received and 2 adopted. The bill will retain its place on the 3 Third Reading Calendar. 4 Senator Tully. 5 SENATOR TULLY: Mr. President, on 6 behalf of Senator Maltese, on page 73, I offer 7 the following amendments to Calendar Number 8 1198, Senate Print Number 3086-A, and ask that 9 said bill retain its place on the Third Reading 10 Calendar. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 12 amendments to Calendar Number 1198 are received 13 and adopted. The bill will retain its place on 14 the Third Reading Calendar. 15 We have substitutions at the 16 desk, Senator Skelos. 17 SENATOR SKELOS: Make the 18 substitutions. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 20 Secretary will read the substitutions. 21 THE SECRETARY: On page 54, 22 Senator Holland moves to discharge from the 23 Committee on Rules, Assembly Bill Number 8158-B 5460 1 and substitute it for the identical Third 2 Reading Calendar 1040. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 4 substitution is ordered. 5 Senator Skelos. 6 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, 7 at this time may we please adopt the Resolution 8 Calendar. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 10 motion is to adopt the Resolution Calendar. All 11 those in favor signify by saying aye. 12 (Response of "Aye".) 13 Opposed, nay. 14 (There was no response.) 15 The Resolution Calendar is 16 adopted. 17 Senator Skelos. 18 SENATOR SKELOS: Would you please 19 recognize Senator Stachowski. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 21 Stachowski. 22 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Mr. 23 President, there's a privileged res... I believe 5461 1 there's a privileged resolution at the desk - 2 that's what I was thinking -- by Senator Smith. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There are 4 two privileged resolutions at the desk. 5 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Would you 6 waive the readings and read the titles. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 8 Secretary will read the title to the first 9 privileged resolution. 10 THE SECRETARY: By Senator Smith, 11 Legislative Resolution honoring Assistant Chief 12 Robert F. Burke for his outstanding leadership 13 and ceaseless dedicated service to the Patrol 14 Borough Queens South community on Wednesday, May 15 22nd, 1996. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 17 question is on the resolution. All those in 18 favor signify by saying aye. 19 (Response of "Aye".) 20 Opposed, nay. 21 (There was no response.) 22 The resolution is adopted. 23 The Secretary will read the title 5462 1 to the second privileged resolution. 2 THE SECRETARY: By Senator Smith, 3 Legislative Resolution honoring Deputy Chief 4 Jules Martin for his outstanding leadership and 5 ceaseless dedicated service to the Patrol 6 Borough Queens South community on Wednesday, May 7 22nd, 1996. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 9 question is on the resolution. All those in 10 favor signify by saying aye. 11 (Response of "Aye".) 12 Opposed, nay. 13 (There was no response.) 14 The resolution is adopted. 15 Senator Skelos, that brings us to 16 the calendar. 17 SENATOR STAFFORD: Finance 18 meeting, please, in Room 332. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There 20 will be an immediate meeting of the Senate 21 Committee on Finance in the Majority Conference 22 Room, Room 332. Immediate meeting of the Senate 23 Committee on Finance in the Majority Conference 5463 1 Room, Room 332. 2 Senator Skelos. 3 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, 4 at this time if we could have a reading of the 5 non-controversial calendar. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 7 Secretary will read the non-controversial 8 calendar. 9 THE SECRETARY: On page number 7, 10 Calendar Number 314, by Senator Holland, Senate 11 Print 213 - 12 SENATOR SMITH: Lay it aside, 13 please. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 15 bill aside. 16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 17 391, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 2595-A, an 18 act to amend the Social Services Law, in 19 relation to criminal screening. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 21 Secretary will read the last section. 22 THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This 23 act shall take effect on the 120th day. 5464 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 2 roll. 3 (The Secretary called the roll.) 4 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 39. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 6 is passed. 7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 8 691, by Senator Padavan, Senate Print 4216-A, an 9 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to auto 10 stripping. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 12 Secretary will read the last section. 13 THE SECRETARY: Section 10. This 14 act shall take effect on the first day of 15 November. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 17 roll. 18 (The Secretary called the roll.) 19 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 39. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 21 is passed. 22 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 23 701, by Senator DiCarlo, Senate Print 1984-A - 5465 1 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 3 bill aside. 4 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 5 702, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 2104, an 6 act to amend the Family Court Act, in relation 7 to evidence of child neglect. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 9 Secretary will read the last section. 10 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This 11 act shall take effect 120 days. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 13 roll. 14 (The Secretary called the roll.) 15 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 39. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 17 is passed. 18 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 19 703, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 2106, an 20 act to amend the Family Court Act, in relation 21 to dispositional alternatives. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 23 Secretary will read the last section. 5466 1 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 2 act shall take effect on the 120th day. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 4 roll. 5 (The Secretary called the roll.) 6 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 40. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 8 is passed. 9 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 10 715, by Senator Libous, Senate Print 6654-A, an 11 act to amend the Mental Hygiene Law, in relation 12 to providing for involuntary admissions. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 14 Secretary will read the last section. 15 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 16 act shall take effect immediately. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 18 roll. 19 (The Secretary called the roll.) 20 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 40. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 22 is passed. 23 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 5467 1 729, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 6518, an 2 act to amend the Executive Law and the General 3 Municipal Law, in relation to the classification 4 of offenses. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 6 Secretary will read the last section. 7 THE SECRETARY: Section 9. This 8 act shall take effect on the first day of 9 November. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 11 roll. 12 (The Secretary called the roll.) 13 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 40. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 15 is passed. 16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 17 735, by Senator Velella, Senate Print 6906-A, an 18 act to amend the Insurance Law, in relation to 19 marketing health maintenance organization 20 coverage. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 22 Secretary will read the last section. 23 THE SECRETARY: Section 9. This 5468 1 act shall take effect immediately. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 3 roll. 4 (The Secretary called the roll.) 5 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 40. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 7 is passed. 8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 9 787, by Senator Goodman, Senate Print 7102, an 10 act to amend the Executive Law, in relation to 11 providing a fraud tipster incentive. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 13 Secretary will read the last section. 14 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 15 act shall take effect immediately. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 17 roll. 18 (The Secretary called the roll.) 19 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 40. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 21 is passed. 22 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 23 863, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 6951, an 5469 1 act to amend the Penal Law and the Family Court 2 Act, in relation to conditions of probation. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 4 Secretary will read the last section. 5 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This 6 act shall take effect on the first day of 7 November. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 9 roll. 10 (The Secretary called the roll.) 11 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 13 is passed. 14 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 15 866, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 2597, an 16 act to amend the Family Court Act, in relation 17 to restitution and community service. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 19 Secretary will read the last section. 20 THE SECRETARY: Section 9. This 21 act shall take effect on the first day of 22 November. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 5470 1 roll. 2 (The Secretary called the roll.) 3 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 5 is passed. 6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7 873, by Senator Maziarz, Senate Print 6865, an 8 act to amend the State Administrative Procedure 9 Act, in relation to guidance documents. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 11 Secretary will read the last section. 12 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 13 act shall take effect on the 90th day. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 15 roll. 16 (The Secretary called the roll.) 17 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 19 is passed. 20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 21 884, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 2884, an act 22 to amend the Executive Law and the Estates, 23 Powers and Trusts Law. 5471 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 2 Secretary will read the last section. 3 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 4 act shall take effect immediately. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 6 roll. 7 (The Secretary called the roll.) 8 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 10 is passed. 11 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 12 885, by Senator Padavan, Senate Print 3091 - 13 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 15 bill aside. 16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 17 890, by Senator Marchi, Senate Print 6131, an 18 act to amend Chapter 759 of the Laws of 1973, 19 relating to the transfer of lands. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 21 Secretary will read the last section. 22 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 23 act shall take effect immediately. 5472 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 2 roll. 3 (The Secretary called the roll.) 4 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 6 is passed. 7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 8 892, by Senator Stafford, Senate Print 6585, an 9 act to amend the Executive Law, in relation to 10 towns and villages. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 12 Secretary will read the last section. 13 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 14 act shall take effect immediately. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 16 roll. 17 (The Secretary called the roll.) 18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 20 is passed. 21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 22 893, by Senator Kuhl, Senate Print 6738, an act 23 in relation to authorizing the conveyance of a 5473 1 permanent easement. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 3 Secretary will read the last section. 4 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This 5 act shall take effect immediately. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 7 roll. 8 (The Secretary called the roll.) 9 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 11 is passed. 12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 13 899, by Senator Marcellino, Senate Print 6904, 14 an act to amend the Environmental Conservation 15 Law, in relation to importation. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 17 Secretary will read the last section. 18 THE SECRETARY: Section 13. This 19 act shall take effect January 1. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 21 roll. 22 (The Secretary called the roll.) 23 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 5474 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 2 is passed. 3 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 4 933, by Senator Present, Senate Print 6854 - 5 SENATOR SMITH: Lay it aside. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 7 bill aside. 8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 9 934, by Senator Leibell, Senate Print 6859, an 10 act to amend the General Municipal Law, in 11 relation to the approval of urban renewal plans. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 13 Secretary will read the last section. 14 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 15 act shall take effect immediately. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 17 roll. 18 (The Secretary called the roll.) 19 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 21 is passed. 22 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 23 935, by Senator Hoblock, Senate Print 6936, an 5475 1 act to amend the General Municipal Law, in 2 relation to allowing for the use of fire 3 training centers. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 5 Secretary will read the last section. 6 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 7 act shall take effect immediately. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 9 roll. 10 (The Secretary called the roll.) 11 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 13 is passed. 14 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 15 937, by Senator Rath, Senate Print 6966, an act 16 to amend the Real Property Tax Law, in relation 17 to administrative review of assessments. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 19 Secretary will read the last section. 20 THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This 21 act shall take effect on the second day of 22 January. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 5476 1 roll. 2 (The Secretary called the roll.) 3 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 5 is passed. 6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7 963, by Senator Velella, Senate Print 7097, an 8 act to amend - 9 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 11 bill aside. 12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 13 972, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 7043, an 14 act to amend the Education Law and the 15 Retirement and Social Security Law, in relation 16 to loans to members. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 18 Secretary will read the last section. 19 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This 20 act shall take effect immediately. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 22 roll. 23 (The Secretary called the roll.) 5477 1 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 3 is passed. 4 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 5 973, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 7108, an 6 act to amend the Retirement and Social Security 7 Law, in relation to retirement benefits. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 9 Secretary will read the last section. 10 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 11 act shall take effect immediately. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 13 roll. 14 (The Secretary called the roll.) 15 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 17 is passed. 18 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 19 977, by Senator Maziarz, Senate Print 6191, an 20 act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in 21 relation to increasing penalties. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 23 Secretary will read the last section. 5478 1 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 2 act shall take effect on the first day of 3 November. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 5 roll. 6 (The Secretary called the roll.) 7 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 9 is passed. 10 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 11 978, by Senator Maziarz, Senate Print 6192, an 12 act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in 13 relation to the offense of operation. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 15 Secretary will read the last section. 16 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This 17 act shall take effect on the first day of 18 November. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 20 roll. 21 (The Secretary called the roll.) 22 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 5479 1 is passed. 2 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 3 979, by Senator DeFrancisco, Senate Print 6247, 4 an act to amend the Navigation Law, in relation 5 to the operation of a vessel. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 7 Secretary will read the last section. 8 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 9 act shall take effect immediately. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 11 roll. 12 (The Secretary called the roll.) 13 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 15 is passed. 16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 17 980, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 6609, an act 18 to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in 19 relation to the commission of a predicate 20 felony. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 22 Secretary will read the last section. 23 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 5480 1 act shall take effect on the first day of 2 September. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 4 roll. 5 (The Secretary called the roll.) 6 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 8 is passed. 9 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 10 981, by Senator Spano, Senate Print 7251, an act 11 to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in 12 relation to the effect of a prior out of state 13 conviction. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 15 Secretary will read the last section. 16 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 17 act shall take effect immediately. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 19 roll. 20 (The Secretary called the roll.) 21 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 23 is passed. 5481 1 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 2 983, by Senator Wright, Senate Print 7338, an 3 act to amend - 4 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 6 bill aside. 7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 8 1031, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 5572-A, an 9 act to amend the Local Finance Law, in relation 10 to the period of probable usefulness. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 12 Secretary will read the last section. 13 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 14 act shall take effect immediately. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 16 roll. 17 (The Secretary called the roll.) 18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 20 is passed. 21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 22 1096, by Senator Libous, Senate Print 4420-C, an 23 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to 5482 1 parole for certain sex offenders. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 3 Secretary will read the last section. 4 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. 5 This - 6 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 8 bill aside. 9 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 10 1098, by Senator Velella, Senate Print 4715, an 11 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to arson 12 in the first degree. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 14 Secretary will read the last section. 15 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 16 act shall take effect on the 30th day. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 18 roll. 19 (The Secretary called the roll.) 20 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 22 is passed. 23 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 5483 1 1100, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate 2 Print 5494-A, an act to amend the Criminal 3 Procedure Law and the Public Authorities Law, in 4 relation to peace officer status. 5 SENATOR LEICHTER: Lay it aside. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 7 bill aside. 8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 9 1115, by Senator Present, Senate Print 7032, an 10 act to amend the Public Housing Law, in relation 11 to creating the town of Allegany Housing 12 Authority. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 14 Secretary will read the last section. 15 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 16 act shall take effect immediately. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 18 roll. 19 (The Secretary called the roll.) 20 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 22 is passed. 23 Senator Skelos, that completes 5484 1 the calling of the controversial calendar. We 2 do have a report of the Finance Committee at the 3 desk. What's your pleasure? 4 SENATOR SKELOS: Please, if we 5 would return to reports of standing committees, 6 please read the report of the Finance Committee. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: We'll 8 return to the order of reports of standing 9 committees. 10 I'll ask the Secretary to read 11 the report of the Senate Finance Committee. 12 THE SECRETARY: Senator Stafford, 13 from the Committee on Finance, reports the 14 following bills directly to third reading: 15 Senate Print 7578, by the Senate Committee on 16 Rules, an act making appropriations for the 17 support of government; 18 Senate Print 7579, by the Senate 19 Committee on Rules, an act making appropriations 20 for the support of government. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 22 objection, all bills are directed directly to 23 third reading. 5485 1 Senator Skelos. 2 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, 3 if we could take up the controversial calendar. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 5 Secretary will read the controversial calendar 6 beginning with Calendar Number 314, by Senator 7 Holland. 8 THE SECRETARY: On page 7, 9 Calendar Number 314, by Senator Holland, Senate 10 Print 213, an act to amend the Penal Law, in 11 relation to the validity of a license to carry 12 or possess a pistol. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 14 Skelos. 15 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, 16 at this time on Calendar Number 314, would you 17 please recognize Senator Maziarz for the purpose 18 of voting. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 20 Secretary will read the last section. 21 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 22 act shall take effect on the first day of 23 November. 5486 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 2 roll. 3 (The Secretary called the roll.) 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 5 Maziarz, how do you vote? 6 SENATOR MAZIARZ: I vote in the 7 affirmative, Mr. President. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 9 Maziarz will be recorded in the affirmative. 10 The roll call is withdrawn. We're on debate on 11 Calendar Number 314. 12 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 14 Holland, an explanation of Calendar Number 314 15 has been asked for by the Acting Minority 16 Leader, Senator Paterson. 17 SENATOR HOLLAND: Senator, you, 18 of course, know this bill. It is introduced in 19 this house every year and passes this house 20 every year since either before or mid-Gene 21 Levy's term. What it does is try to make the 22 state one state, an equal and fair situation 23 with the carrying of licensed firearms. 5487 1 You know today that if you are 2 issued a licensed -- license to carry a firearm 3 in the city of New York, you can carry that in 4 any county in the state, but if you, on the 5 other hand, are issued a license to carry a 6 pistol, et cetera, in any of the 57 counties 7 outside of the state of New York, you cannot 8 carry that in the city of New York unless it is 9 in a locked box in your trunk and you do not 10 stop. I consider this unfair and many, many 11 other people do as well. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 13 Paterson. 14 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr. 15 President. 16 When I first came to the Senate, 17 this was actually one of my favorite debates 18 that Senator Gold and Senator Levy used to have, 19 and they would always talk about the times that 20 Senator Levy's wife was unable to bring her gun 21 to New York City. So in that spirit, if Senator 22 Holland would yield for a question. 23 SENATOR HOLLAND: Yes, sir. This 5488 1 is not one of your favorite debates anymore; is 2 that the idea? 3 SENATOR PATERSON: Well, I'm just 4 hoping, Senator Holland, that you and I can live 5 up to the standard that our predecessors have 6 set. 7 SENATOR HOLLAND: Certainly, sir. 8 SENATOR PATERSON: I wanted to 9 ask you as I'm sure a person who is an advocate 10 for a certain amount of control that local 11 governments would have why there would not be a 12 greater understanding of New York City's desire 13 to control the firearms that come into the 14 city? We love for people all around the state 15 to come to New York City, to come to shows, to 16 come to see the historic and cultural value that 17 New York City offers. We just kind of, in the 18 way that Wyatt Earp did, want everybody to check 19 their guns at the door, so to speak, and make 20 sure that only those individuals who had permits 21 within the City, or licensed law enforcement 22 would have that prerogative, and since it is 23 something that the local government has asked 5489 1 for among the states, since it is something that 2 Mayor Koch, Mayor Dinkins and Mayor Giuliani 3 have continued to advocate for, I just don't 4 understand why we continue to debate this bill 5 when it's clear that the residents of the City 6 have spoken and the residents of the City would 7 rather not have firearms being carried on the 8 premises. 9 SENATOR HOLLAND: Senator, I do 10 agree with you on the local control issue. 11 However, I -- people who have licensed - 12 licenses to carry pistols are not the people 13 that cause any problems, whether it's in the 14 city of New York or in the upstate 57 counties, 15 you know, and we've gone over this many times, 16 that anybody who applies for a pistol license 17 cannot get it for at least three months, 18 probably six months and their fingerprints must 19 go to the FBI. They must be checked out with 20 BCI, mental health. They must take a safety 21 course. Even in Rockland County they must have 22 a letter from their spouse of whether they 23 object to having the weapon carried, the license 5490 1 issued or not. 2 These people do not cause the 3 problems regardless of where they are, Senator, 4 and if they do, we have every bit of information 5 on them and we will take their weapon away from 6 them and never let them carry a weapon again, 7 and these are not the weapons that are causing 8 any problem in the city of New York or Buffalo 9 or Syracuse or wherever. Those weapons are 10 unlicensed and come from out of the state of New 11 York for the most part. 12 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr. 13 President. 14 If Senator Holland would continue 15 to yield. 16 SENATOR HOLLAND: Yes, sir. 17 SENATOR PATERSON: Senator, your 18 point is -- is correct, and in an overwhelming 19 amount of cases involving crimes that are 20 committed with firearms, you are absolutely 21 right, and I wouldn't want to mislead you or 22 anyone else into thinking that we believe that 23 the individuals who have licenses around the 5491 1 state are causing the problems in New York City 2 or contributing to any criminality or violent 3 crime in the City. 4 What we are simply saying is that 5 New York City as a local government has a set of 6 standards, a set of standards that varies from 7 other parts of this state. In fact, the issue 8 about the spouse writing a letter is something 9 that I don't believe exists in New York City, 10 and there are probably some standards that New 11 York City has set that may not be consistent 12 with policy all around the other 57 or so 13 counties around the state. 14 What we are saying is that the 15 point that you made, the stringent standard, the 16 three- to six-month waiting list for the other 17 requirements are something that are taken very 18 seriously, and the City has delineated what the 19 City believes to be the standard, again 20 supported by all three of our last mayors, going 21 back to 1977, that we would have this standard, 22 and we would just hope that other counties 23 around the state would understand that that's 5492 1 something in a city as large as New York City 2 that we would like to maintain. 3 The final question I just would 4 have for you is, you know, just relating to the 5 similarity of this desire that the City has with 6 the desires of other local governments around 7 the state that we vote for all the time. Do you 8 see the similarity? 9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 10 Paterson and Senator Holland, if you would 11 excuse for a moment an interruption, I would 12 just like to recognize Senator Johnson. 13 SENATOR JOHNSON: Thank you, Mr. 14 President. 15 I would just like to say that 16 this is a good bill. This bill has my support 17 as in the past. We should have one standard for 18 the state. We are a state, the united state of 19 the United States, and that provincialism is 20 sometimes overdone in the name of local 21 government. 22 Mr. President, at this time I 23 would also like you to recognize a group of high 5493 1 school students from the 4th Senate District in 2 my "Senate For a Day" program. They're here to 3 observe the proceedings, and I'm sure it will be 4 a very enlightened afternoon to them. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Thank 6 you, Senator Johnson, and it's our pleasure also 7 to welcome the students here to witness the 8 deliberations on this bill today. 9 Welcome to the state Capitol. 10 Excuse the interruption, Senator 11 Paterson and Senator Holland. 12 Senator Paterson, you have the 13 floor. 14 SENATOR HOLLAND: Senator, I do 15 agree with local control and I buy your 16 argument. On the other hand, would you think it 17 fair if the county of Westchester or the county 18 of Rockland or the county of Orange where many 19 of the major highways go, such as the Palisades 20 and the New York State Thruway go north out of 21 the city of New York, if they implemented the 22 same law that wouldn't allow licensed pistol 23 holders from the city of New York to carry their 5494 1 weapons in our counties; do you think that would 2 be fair? 3 I think this is a situation where 4 it should be a statewide law, and I learned 5 recently, Senator, that the reason this came 6 about in the first place is not the money 7 because the City charges $150 for the license 8 and the upstate charges are much less, but many 9 years ago, the people of the city of New York 10 used to go to the upstate counties and get their 11 licenses very quickly, very cheaply and then 12 carry them back into the city of New York. 13 That's why this was originated originally. 14 Today's it's much, much 15 different. Our judges won't give a license to 16 carry almost ever, and this is -- should be a 17 statewide bill. I certainly -- it's certain 18 that you agree that you wouldn't like 19 Westchester, Rockland or Orange to limit your 20 people in carrying weapons through our 21 counties. 22 SENATOR PATERSON: You're asking 23 me to yield for the question, Senator? 5495 1 SENATOR HOLLAND: No. I just 2 made a statement, Senator. 3 Thank you. 4 SENATOR PATERSON: No. I would 5 be happy it answer that. I think that -- I 6 understand the problem that individuals who are 7 licensed to carry firearms would come -- or 8 carry pistols would come into New York City on a 9 regular basis and it would be difficult. 10 Perhaps they're traveling. They can carry the 11 pistol in other counties of the state and maybe 12 they are forced due to business, investigators 13 from the Attorney General's Office or something 14 and they're now coming to New York City, that 15 there's a problem because once they cross the 16 line that they're in violation. 17 What I thought, Senator, is that 18 we had a remedy for those types of situations 19 where if they can show that there's a high 20 standard of a need or a use, that they could 21 still apply to have a permit when they come into 22 New York City. 23 In answer to your question about 5496 1 what the other localities are fairly or unfairly 2 determining, I think that it would be something 3 that is within the scope of the locality's 4 purview because the whole existence of weapons 5 and firearms in this society is one that is very 6 controversial. 7 There are good points to be made 8 on both sides as you have done in this debate, 9 Senator, and therefore, if that's what the 10 counties of Westchester, Rockland and Orange 11 County are -- are suggesting, then that's what 12 I'll do, and I'll promise you right here, 13 Senator, I will never carry a firearm in 14 Rockland County. 15 SENATOR HOLLAND: Thank you. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Any 17 other Senator wish to be heard on this bill? 18 (There was no response.) 19 Read the last section. 20 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 22 Paterson. 23 SENATOR PATERSON: May we have a 5497 1 slow roll call on this? 2 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Slow 3 roll call has been asked for. The Secretary 4 will call the roll. 5 THE SECRETARY: Senator Abate. 6 SENATOR ABATE: No. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the 8 last section. 9 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 10 act shall take effect on the first day of 11 November. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The 13 Secretary will call the roll and will the 14 Sergeant-at-Arms please get the members into the 15 chamber. Slow roll call. 16 THE SECRETARY: Senator Alesi. 17 (Affirmative indication) 18 Senator Babbush. Senator Babbush 19 excused. 20 Senator Bruno. 21 (Affirmative indication) 22 Senator Connor. 23 (There was no response.) 5498 1 Senator Cook. 2 SENATOR COOK: Yes. 3 THE SECRETARY: Senator 4 DeFrancisco. 5 (There was no response.) 6 Senator DiCarlo. 7 SENATOR DiCARLO: Aye. 8 THE SECRETARY: Senator 9 Dollinger. 10 (There was no response.) 11 Senator Espada. 12 SENATOR ESPADA: No. 13 Senator Farley. 14 SENATOR FARLEY: Aye. 15 THE SECRETARY: Senator Gold. 16 (There was no response.) 17 Senator Gonzalez excused. 18 Senator Goodman. 19 SENATOR GOODMAN: No. 20 THE SECRETARY: Senator Hannon. 21 (There was no response.) 22 Senator Hoblock. 23 SENATOR HOBLOCK: Yes. 5499 1 THE SECRETARY: Senator Hoffmann. 2 SENATOR HOFFMANN: Explain my 3 vote. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 5 Hoffmann to explain her vote. 6 SENATOR HOFFMANN: Thank you, Mr. 7 President. 8 I share the sentiment expressed 9 earlier by Senator Johnson on this issue. I too 10 believe that occasionally provincialism takes 11 over and -- in the name of local autonomy, and I 12 believe that there are many people in New York 13 State, certainly in the upstate region who 14 believe that they are, in fact, discriminated 15 against and that their local rules are being 16 discriminated against or ignored by the city of 17 New York. I think that it's long overdue that 18 we pass a statewide pistol permit and on behalf 19 of the people of Onondaga, Oneida and Madison 20 Counties, I will vote aye. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 22 Hoffmann in the affirmative. Continue the roll 23 call. 5500 1 THE SECRETARY: Senator Holland. 2 SENATOR HOLLAND: Yes. 3 THE SECRETARY: Senator Johnson. 4 SENATOR JOHNSON: Aye. 5 THE SECRETARY: Senator Kruger. 6 SENATOR KRUGER: No. 7 THE SECRETARY: Senator Kuhl. 8 (There was no response.) 9 Senator Lachman. 10 SENATOR LACHMAN: No. 11 THE SECRETARY: Senator Lack 12 excused. 13 Senator Larkin. 14 (Affirmative indication) 15 Senator LaValle. 16 (There was no response.) 17 Senator Leibell. 18 (There was no response.) 19 Senator Leichter. 20 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President, 21 just briefly. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 23 Leichter to explain his vote. 5501 1 SENATOR LEICHTER: On the bill. 2 This bill certainly has been aired over the 3 years, but I'm sort of amused when people get up 4 and say, Well, this is one state, and I keep on 5 seeing bill after bill after bill coming out of 6 the Majority which makes different rules for 7 Suffolk and different rules for Rockland and 8 Ulster. Senator Larkin just had a bill about, 9 Well, voting in Ulster is different now. Well, 10 you've got to realize, you know, there's 11 regional differences. There's variations, and 12 so on. 13 We have a very good reason for 14 saying we don't want people who are not licensed 15 by the city of New York to carry guns in the 16 City both for their protection. It always 17 scared me when Gene Levy got up and would say 18 about his wife going to the airport, and so on, 19 and I said God forbid that she ever runs into 20 some of the people in New York City where there 21 would be a confrontation, and so on, because she 22 would really be at risk and, in fact, the 23 statistics show that in many instances, maybe 5502 1 more than 50 percent where somebody who is 2 licensed to carry a gun, a bodega store owner, 3 and so on, tries to protect himself or herself 4 against some thugs, it's the bodega store owner 5 that gets shot. 6 So we have had mayors, Democratic 7 and Republican; we have had police commissioners 8 of every which stripe, Commissioner Bratton 9 being the most recent that says, For God's sakes 10 for the protection of the people of the city of 11 New York and for the protection of people who 12 come from upstate and who are licensed to use a 13 gun upstate may use it perfectly safely and well 14 and properly. It's a different situation in the 15 city of New York. Therefore, for the protection 16 of everyone, we need that special licensing 17 provision. There are, in this instance, as you 18 people argue for your pet little bills, 19 variations, regional differences that you need 20 to recognize. 21 Mr. President, I vote in the 22 negative. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 5503 1 Leichter in the negative. Continue the roll 2 call. 3 THE SECRETARY: Senator Levy. 4 SENATOR LEVY: Aye. 5 THE SECRETARY: Senator Libous. 6 SENATOR LIBOUS: Aye. 7 THE SECRETARY: Senator Maltese. 8 SENATOR MALTESE: Aye. 9 THE SECRETARY: Senator 10 Marcellino. 11 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Aye. 12 THE SECRETARY: Senator Marchi. 13 SENATOR MARCHI: Aye. 14 THE SECRETARY: Senator 15 Markowitz. 16 SENATOR MARKOWITZ: No. 17 THE SECRETARY: Senator Maziarz 18 voting in the affirmative earlier. 19 Senator Mendez. 20 (There was no response.) 21 THE SECRETARY: Senator 22 Montgomery. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 5504 1 Montgomery to explain her vote. 2 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes, Mr. 3 President. I just would like to be on record 4 once again absolutely opposing this notion that 5 we should for reasons that I can never reconcile 6 -- because if you are so fearful of coming into 7 the City that you need a gun, it means that you 8 obviously have the feeling that you're going to 9 have to shoot someone, if you come across the 10 bridge, the -- and the mayor has indicated his 11 opposition. 12 We do know that we already have 13 too many guns on the streets and not only do we 14 have too many guns on the streets, Mr. 15 President, but we have guns in the hands of 16 children, and that is a very big problem, and so 17 if Senator Holland happens to come into New York 18 and he has his pistol, even though he has a 19 license to do it and someone mugs him on the 20 street, takes his gun, he can't -- he's not fast 21 enough to shoot them. They take the gun and now 22 the gun is in the hands of the wrong person, and 23 what do we need with that? He hasn't gained 5505 1 anything and we haven't gained anything in New 2 York City. 3 So I'm opposed to this. It 4 serves no purpose. It does not protect anyone. 5 It is not in anyone's interest and especially it 6 is not in the interest of citizens in New York 7 City. 8 So, Mr. President, I vote no. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 10 Montgomery in the negative. Continue the roll 11 call. 12 THE SECRETARY: Senator Nanula. 13 SENATOR NANULA: No. 14 THE SECRETARY: Senator Nozzolio. 15 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Aye. 16 THE SECRETARY: Senator Onorato. 17 SENATOR ONORATO: No. 18 THE SECRETARY: Senator 19 Oppenheimer. 20 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: No. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 22 Oppenheimer, how did you vote? 23 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Oh, I said 5506 1 no. Sorry. I thought it was loud. 2 THE SECRETARY: Senator Padavan. 3 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 5 Paterson. 6 SENATOR PATERSON: No. 7 THE SECRETARY: Senator Present. 8 SENATOR PRESENT: Aye. 9 THE SECRETARY: Senator Rath. 10 SENATOR RATH: Aye. 11 THE SECRETARY: Senator Saland. 12 SENATOR SALAND: Aye. 13 THE SECRETARY: Senator Santiago. 14 SENATOR SANTIAGO: No. 15 THE SECRETARY: Senator Seabrook. 16 (There was no response.) 17 Senator Sears. 18 SENATOR SEARS: Aye. 19 THE SECRETARY: Senator Seward. 20 SENATOR SEWARD: Aye. 21 THE SECRETARY: Senator Skelos. 22 SENATOR SKELOS: Yes. 23 THE SECRETARY: Senator Smith. 5507 1 SENATOR SMITH: No. 2 THE SECRETARY: Senator Spano. 3 SENATOR SPANO: Aye. 4 THE SECRETARY: Senator 5 Stachowski. 6 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Yes. 7 THE SECRETARY: Senator Stafford. 8 SENATOR STAFFORD: Aye. 9 THE SECRETARY: Senator Stavisky 10 excused. 11 Senator Trunzo. 12 SENATOR TRUNZO: Yes. 13 THE SECRETARY: Senator Tully. 14 SENATOR TULLY: Aye. 15 THE SECRETARY: Senator Velella. 16 (There was no response.) 17 Senator Volker. 18 SENATOR VOLKER: Yes. 19 THE SECRETARY: Senator Waldon. 20 (Negative indication) 21 Senator Wright. 22 SENATOR WRIGHT: Aye. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The 5508 1 Secretary will call the absentees. 2 THE SECRETARY: Senator 3 DeFrancisco. 4 SENATOR DeFRANCISCO: Yes. 5 THE SECRETARY: Senator 6 Dollinger. 7 SENATOR DOLLINGER: No. 8 THE SECRETARY: Senator Gold. 9 (There was no response.) 10 Senator Hannon. 11 SENATOR HANNON: Yes. 12 THE SECRETARY: Senator Kuhl. 13 SENATOR KUHL: Yes. 14 THE SECRETARY: Senator LaValle. 15 (There was no response.) 16 Senator Leibell. 17 SENATOR LEIBELL: Aye. 18 THE SECRETARY: Senator Mendez. 19 (There was no response.) 20 Senator Seabrook. 21 (There was no response.) 22 Senator Velella. 23 SENATOR VELELLA: Yes. 5509 1 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: 2 Results. 3 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 36, nays 4 17. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The bill 6 is passed. 7 Senator Cook. 8 SENATOR COOK: Mr. President, I 9 know that we're breaking with tradition, 10 probably breaking rules, but we do have some 11 visitors from the state of Baden-Wurttemberg, 12 Germany, Rotary -- on a Rotary tour who are in 13 the gallery observing the proceedings today, and 14 I thought it might be appropriate if we could 15 recognize their presence and extend to them a 16 greeting. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: We'll 18 recognize the presence of the constituents of 19 Senator Cook. Hope you'll enjoy your visit to 20 the Capitol today. 21 Senator Padavan. 22 SENATOR PADAVAN: Mr. President, 23 could we reconsider the vote by which Senate - 5510 1 Calendar 691, Senate Bill 4216-A passed 2 earlier? Don't you need the motion? Recall 3 it. All right. Lay it aside for an amendment. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 5 Padavan, that bill is out of the house, but 6 we'll try to get it back for you to be 7 recalled. 8 SENATOR PADAVAN: Thank you. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The 10 Secretary will read Calendar Number 701. 11 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 12 701, by Senator DiCarlo, Senate Print 1984-A - 13 SENATOR COOK: Mr. President. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 15 Cook. 16 SENATOR COOK: Lest our guests 17 wonder why we are being -- having so much 18 levity, I would simply point out that the 19 presiding officer just included half of Germany 20 in my Senatorial District by virtue of the way 21 he introduced you, and that's what -- everybody 22 is quite amused by that. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 5511 1 Cook has a very diverse district, and he will 2 welcome votes from Germany or any place else he 3 can get them. So thank you for being here. 4 The Secretary will continue the 5 calendar. 6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7 701, by Senator DiCarlo, Senate Print 1984-A, an 8 act to amend the Executive Law, in relation to 9 qualifications of employment. 10 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: An 12 explanation has been asked for on Calendar 13 Number 701. 14 Senator DiCarlo -- could we 15 please have a little order in the chamber. Ask 16 the members to please take their seats. 17 Senator DiCarlo. 18 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 19 this bill prohibits the Division for Youth from 20 employing any direct care staff who's been 21 convicted of felonies and authorizes the 22 director to refuse to employ any direct care 23 staff who has been convicted of a misdemeanor. 5512 1 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the 2 last section. 3 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 4 act shall take effect immediately. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call - 6 Senator Montgomery, do you wish to be 7 recognized? 8 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes, I do. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 10 Montgomery. 11 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Thank you. 12 Mr. President, I am going to vote 13 no on this bill. I think that I may be the only 14 person in the chamber to do so, but I want to 15 explain my vote briefly. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 17 Montgomery, can we interrupt you for a second 18 and read the last section and then we'll 19 recognize you to explain your vote? 20 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Okay. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the 22 last section. 23 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 5513 1 act shall take effect immediately. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 3 Montgomery. 4 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call the 6 roll. I'm sorry. 7 (The Secretary called the roll.) 8 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 9 Montgomery. 10 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes. One, I 11 have voted for this bill in prior legislative 12 sessions because I have knowledge of a program, 13 a particular program. It is in my district and 14 it is also -- it started at the location of some 15 prisons in the state, one of them in Staten 16 Island. 17 It is a program that seeks to 18 rehabilitate prisoners in particular. The 19 primary people involved in the rehabilitative 20 process are former inmates themselves. I have 21 met some of those people, and I have been 22 extremely impressed with the fact of their 23 degree of intelligence and understanding and 5514 1 insight and motivation and commitment to helping 2 people reform themselves, and one of the 3 advantages of having them be a part of the 4 program is that they know more about the 5 personality that they deal with than someone who 6 has never had experience in the ways that they 7 have. 8 So I think it is really -- we are 9 losing a valuable resource when we summarily 10 legislate that they shall never be eligible or 11 this -- a person in that category is not 12 eligible any longer to work with people in this 13 -- in situations as this bill seeks to deal 14 with. 15 So I'm opposed to it. I think 16 that we need to have much more latitude and 17 flexibility, and certainly I think that we 18 should definitely allow for people who have this 19 kind of experience to give -- to share that 20 experience, especially since it's so successful 21 in the programs that I'm aware of. 22 So I vote no. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 5515 1 Montgomery in the negative. 2 Senator Abate to explain her 3 vote. 4 SENATOR ABATE: Yes. Last year I 5 voted against this bill because I felt that it 6 was written so broadly it did not define "direct 7 care". I feel strongly that individuals in DFY 8 that are there for security and supervision 9 purposes should not have prior felony records. 10 However, there are other employees that do not 11 have necessarily direct supervision over the 12 youth and it may not be as relevant to eliminate 13 these employees. 14 I'm also concerned about how 15 broadly it's written if someone was convicted of 16 a felony, possession of drugs 10, 15, 20 years 17 ago and they have been outstanding citizens. 18 They, in fact, provide drug counseling and drug 19 treatment, have redeemed themselves and maybe 20 even received a Certificate of Relief from the 21 courts. This would also eliminate that 22 individual. 23 So while I agree with the intent 5516 1 of the bill that it's important for those 2 positions that are similar to corrections staff 3 in DOCS be free of felony conviction, I believe 4 as the proposed legislation is crafted now, it 5 is much too broad and for those reasons, I 6 cannot support this legislation again this year. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 8 Abate in the negative. 9 Announce the results. 10 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 11 the negative on Calendar Number 701 are Senators 12 Abate, Kruger, Leichter, Montgomery, Paterson 13 and Smith. Ayes 51, nays 6. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The bill 15 is passed. 16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 17 885, by Senator Padavan, Senate Print 3091, an 18 act to amend the Executive Law, in relation to 19 cooperation between police agencies and the 20 United States Immigration and Naturalization 21 Service. 22 SENATOR PADAVAN: Read the 23 transcript from last year. You think that might 5517 1 suffice? No. I didn't think so. 2 Mr. President, this is a very 3 simple bill. What it says directly is if 4 someone is arrested for committing a crime and 5 the local police or district attorneys suspect 6 that that individual is an illegal alien, that 7 they notify INS for obvious reasons, and that's 8 what the bill does. Nothing more, nothing 9 less. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 11 Paterson. 12 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr. 13 President. 14 If Senator Padavan would yield 15 for a question. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 17 Padavan, will you yield? 18 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The 20 Senator yields. 21 SENATOR PATERSON: Senator, I did 22 make use of looking at last year's transcript, 23 and we were talking about the Executive Order 5518 1 124, which I'm sure you're familiar with, New 2 York City executive order which has existed back 3 since the days of Mayor Koch, continued by Mayor 4 Dinkins and further continued by Mayor Giuliani, 5 and you cited to me a case in the Bronx in which 6 an individual was not questioned by police after 7 he was found to be selling drugs, and it was a 8 pretty horrible incident that you described, and 9 in this particular case, it was pretty apparent 10 that there was not a check to see whether or not 11 this person was a citizen. In fact, they were 12 an illegal alien, and this is kind of the 13 landmark type of situation that your bill 14 addresses, but in our discussion, you seemed to 15 indicate that the executive order was being 16 amended, and my question is if the executive 17 order was amended, can you show me where it was 18 because as late as May 8th, I have been in 19 contact with the mayor's office and I just can't 20 find where they amended Executive Order 124. 21 SENATOR PADAVAN: All right, 22 Senator. First, the basis of my making that 23 statement to you was a media report which I 5519 1 realize from time to time can be inaccurate, but 2 I will quote the report that I'm reading from. 3 "Mayor Giuliani and Police Commissioner William 4 Bratton met Tuesday to discuss the news report 5 on the Rodriguez case and decided to change 6 current policy in which the police department 7 selectively notifies the Immigration and 8 Naturalization Service about illegal aliens who 9 are picked up on arrests. The aim of the 10 current policy based on a 1989 executive order" 11 -- it goes on to talk about that, which I'm 12 sure you realize. He said, "Giuliani had 13 directed Bratton to meet with INS Regional 14 Commissioner William Slattery to discuss better 15 coordination." 16 So, in effect, what he had done 17 is directed the police commissioner to meet with 18 INS to set up a system of coordination, that 19 when they arrested someone for obviously 20 committing a crime and they suspected that he 21 was an illegal alien, that they would 22 "coordinate" -- quote, "coordinate" with INS. 23 That was my reason for saying that to you, 5520 1 Senator. 2 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr. 3 President. 4 If Senator Padavan would continue 5 to yield. 6 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes. 7 SENATOR PATERSON: Well, let me 8 put it this way, Senator Padavan. Do you have 9 any information as to whether or not this 10 actually occurred, because I have a question 11 relating to the need for this bill if they 12 actually did that, but I guess I don't have to 13 answer it because you haven't given me any 14 indication that they have actually implemented 15 the amendment for this executive order and not 16 only that, aren't you glad we debated again this 17 year because, if not, you would have gone on 18 believing that news report that's been over a 19 year and now - 20 SENATOR PADAVAN: Senator, 21 whether or not -- may I answer your question? 22 You wish me to answer it? I don't want to 23 interrupt you. 5521 1 Senator, whether or not Executive 2 Order 124 was amended formally or the mayor by 3 direction to his commissioner told him to do 4 something is irrelevant because what we want to 5 do is put in law that irrespective of an 6 executive order that varies with a mayor and is 7 applicable outside the city of New York as well, 8 that we want local law enforcement agencies - 9 many do this as a matter of routine, but we want 10 it in law that they will. That's what 11 distinguishes this from any administrative 12 order. 13 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 15 Paterson. 16 SENATOR PATERSON: If Senator 17 Padavan would continue to yield. 18 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 20 Padavan yields. 21 SENATOR PATERSON: All right, 22 Senator. What we'll do is we'll talk about the 23 bill. I just thought it was good that we 5522 1 debated it again this year because perhaps Mayor 2 Giuliani would like to amend the executive order 3 now which would comply with what is really the 4 thrust of your legislation whether or not it 5 becomes law this particular year. That's why I 6 thought I might point it out. 7 Now, on the bill itself, if the 8 Senator would yield. 9 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes. 10 SENATOR PATERSON: We are talking 11 here, Senator, about individuals who have been 12 arrested for committing crimes. We do have a 13 law now that convicted criminals are 14 investigated as a matter of course to determine 15 whether or not they were citizens at the time of 16 their conviction; is that not correct? 17 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes. We have 18 about 4,000 of them in state prisons at the 19 current time, although this governor has begun a 20 process of deportation which is reducing that 21 number, but that is so just as you stated it. 22 SENATOR PATERSON: If the Senator 23 would continue to yield. 5523 1 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes. 2 SENATOR PATERSON: Then, Senator, 3 the probable cause that might be established 4 that the individual committed a crime relating 5 to their citizenship or the fact that they may 6 be illegal aliens, would you be willing to 7 explain for me what the relationship is? In 8 other words, if a person is arrested for 9 committing a crime, even if we determine that 10 there's a likelihood that they did, even if we 11 come to a subjective determination that they did 12 even though they haven't been convicted, how 13 does it help us during the time we're pursuing 14 the criminal case against them for us to know at 15 that point whether or not they are illegal 16 aliens? 17 SENATOR PADAVAN: Let's go back 18 to the -- how does it -- we know? I'm not 19 sure - 20 SENATOR PATERSON: No. You've 21 outlined in your explanation how we know. I'm 22 saying what is the need for us to know up to the 23 point of - 5524 1 SENATOR PADAVAN: Of conviction. 2 SENATOR PATERSON: -- of 3 conviction? 4 SENATOR PADAVAN: All right, 5 fine. Going back to the Rodriguez case, which 6 was a rather dramatic one, the young man, 20 7 year-old Dominican -- native of the Dominican 8 Republic was arrested for selling drugs. Now 9 he's brought into a court of law for an 10 indictment. The judge, not having been informed 11 of his -- or at least the information that the 12 police had relevant to his immigration status, 13 let him out on low bail or I think it may have 14 been his own recognizance. During the two-week 15 period following that, he killed a police 16 officer by the name of Sean McDonald. 17 Now, if the court had been aware 18 -- there are two things here: Number one, if 19 the court had been aware that he was an illegal 20 alien, I doubt if he would have let him out on 21 bail because obviously that individual was a 22 prime candidate to skip, but more importantly, 23 if this law had been in effect, the police would 5525 1 have been required to contact INS and retention 2 -- detention would have been initiated by INS, 3 and that individual would not have been out on 4 the street and today that police officer would 5 be alive. 6 So that's why it's important that 7 this operative procedure -- that this operative 8 procedure take place upon arrest. 9 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President, 10 if Senator Padavan would continue to yield. 11 Senator - 12 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes. 13 SENATOR PATERSON: -- on the 14 issue of the tragic and horrible murder of 15 Officer McDonald, you couldn't be more correct. 16 Had the judge known that this individual was an 17 illegal alien, obviously there would be another 18 procedure and, therefore, what probably would 19 have occurred is that the individual would have 20 been detained. So I accept totally what you're 21 saying and in that particular case, had that 22 been the case, perhaps the police officer's life 23 would have been spared, but what I'm asking you 5526 1 in the process of lawmaking and in drafting this 2 piece of legislation is that the actual way in 3 which we investigate illegal aliens, is that 4 something that you feel should accompany the 5 fact that somebody has been arrested -- which is 6 really a suspicion that the state has taken - 7 that they might have committed a crime? 8 SENATOR PADAVAN: Senator, you 9 are attempting to ask a question that has many, 10 many hooks in it, and I'm not about to bite any 11 of them. The fact of the matter is if someone's 12 arrested for committing a crime, that stands on 13 its own. 14 The second fact of this 15 legislation is that if, as the bill clearly 16 states, there is an indication that this person 17 is in this country illegally, that INS be 18 notified. To me, that's logical. There's 19 nothing in it offensive. It should be done and 20 is done in many instances already. We're simply 21 -- Senator, I don't know if you're listening to 22 me. I don't want to interrupt your counsel. 23 Did you hear what I said? I know it's hard to 5527 1 listen out of two ears. This is happening now 2 in many jurisdictions. We are attempting to 3 preclude anything falling into the cracks. The 4 individual in the case of Sean McDonald who was 5 killed was subject to detention by INS but they 6 weren't notified, so he wasn't detained. 7 Now, that's the genesis of this 8 bill. It's not very complicated. Someone's 9 arrested, they've committed a crime to the 10 extent of an arrest having been implemented. 11 That's when this kicks in, not before. 12 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, 13 Senator. 14 On the point of the specifics of 15 this particular bill, I think you are -- you've 16 made a very good point because your bill is 17 restricting itself to the actions of the police 18 and your bill is restricting itself to the 19 arrest, but you do know, Senator, that there are 20 other pieces of legislation, many of which that 21 you have sponsored that go beyond that and go 22 beyond -- go and analyze the duties of other 23 agencies as individuals attempt to receive 5528 1 assistance from those agencies, particularly in 2 the area of education. So all I'm saying to you 3 is - 4 SENATOR PADAVAN: Senator, I 5 don't know what bill you're particularly talking 6 about. We do not restrict in any bill that I'm 7 sponsoring elementary or secondary education for 8 anyone, illegal or legal. So if you're trying 9 to draw some analogies here, they escape me. I 10 would rather that we deal with this bill within 11 the framework and for the reasons that I have 12 presented it. 13 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, 14 Senator. 15 The area of education I was 16 thinking of was post-secondary education which 17 is one of the areas of education, if I'm not 18 correct, but the -- but what relates to this 19 bill, if we just stay on this particular point 20 is in trying to make sure that where there would 21 actually be a conclusion that might be reached, 22 that there's a probable cause that the use of 23 the immigration process to detain an individual 5529 1 might be a very salient idea in this particular 2 case that we aren't legislating the exception 3 which would have existed in that terrible 4 tragedy that you documented for us earlier and 5 that we are not in the situation where everyone 6 that gets arrested that is presumed by nature of 7 appearance or some language difficulty to be an 8 illegal alien is immediately investigated. 9 SENATOR PADAVAN: What is your 10 question, Senator? 11 SENATOR PATERSON: My question is 12 do you understand that we run the risk by 13 passing that -- this piece of legislation of 14 having that happen in a great number of 15 situations where we do have - 16 SENATOR PADAVAN: I'm not quite 17 sure when you're saying "that happen", what are 18 you referring to? 19 SENATOR PATERSON: What that is 20 is the assumption that an individual, due to 21 their appearance or some language difficulty or 22 something that might be common to individuals 23 who are not born or reared in the United States 5530 1 of America, that they may not be American 2 citizens because it's very possible that they 3 are. 4 SENATOR PADAVAN: That would be 5 unreasonable, Senator, and the bill specifically 6 uses the word "reasonably". Your -- the picture 7 you paint in my view is unreasonable, 8 particularly in the city of New York. 9 SENATOR PATERSON: All right. 10 That's very good, Senator. If that's 11 unreasonable, then would you give me the 12 criteria by which the individual who is being 13 arrested would be examined; and that would be my 14 last question. I would just like to know what 15 it is that would set the standard since we're 16 not taking anything that's not reasonable. What 17 is it that defines whether or not there should 18 be some intervention on the part of the 19 Immigration and Naturalization Service to 20 determine whether or not this person is a 21 citizen? 22 SENATOR PADAVAN: Senator, we 23 could probably debate or discuss by the hour the 5531 1 phrase "reasonable", but even a non-lawyer like 2 myself is aware of the fact that that phrase, 3 "reasonable" is found in many, many of our 4 criminal statutes and "reasonable" is reasonable 5 by definition. 6 Now, is "reasonable" abused? I'm 7 sure on occasion it is. Is "reasonable" 8 generally followed? I would say most of the 9 time it is, but if you read the bill, there are 10 specific requirements or procedures for a 11 verification process that could be done very 12 quickly by the police if they reasonably suspect 13 the individual is an illegal alien. So -- and 14 that's in lines 19 and beneath it. 15 So what I'm saying to you, 16 Senator, I cannot define in every conceivable 17 configuration or instance of every kind of 18 arrest that could exist in this state and apply 19 the word "reasonable" for you by definition, but 20 I know what reasonable is. You know what 21 reasonable is, and I think our law enforcement 22 agencies -- I don't think. I know -- they know 23 what reasonable is and, therefore, I think we 5532 1 have to be guided accordingly. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 3 Paterson. 4 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, 5 Senator Padavan. 6 Mr. President, on the bill. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 8 Paterson on the bill. 9 SENATOR PATERSON: We do have 10 federal law that guides us in this particular 11 area. We have a court case in 1928, Pyler v. 12 Doe. We have another which seems to very much 13 upset Senator Padavan, but we have a standard 14 that does exist in terms of these situations. 15 It's been raised and brought to 16 my attention a concern that has been brought 17 forth by a number of individuals who work in 18 western New York. They're farm workers. They 19 travel back and forth within that particular 20 area, and there's a feeling that they have been 21 arrested a number of times for charges that were 22 never sustained. Immediately upon their arrest, 23 there was some inquiry as to determine whether 5533 1 or not they were citizens, and all I'm trying to 2 describe is that what Senator Padavan seems to 3 feel is unreasonable and what may actually be 4 unreasonable does actually happen at times where 5 people who are American citizens are harassed 6 for reasons -- for reasons of their resemblance 7 to a different national origin, their 8 familiarity with a language that is foreign to 9 that of English which is spoken by Americans but 10 is also spoken by individuals who are citizens 11 of the United States and that there is a concern 12 on the part of these individuals that as 13 American citizens, they be treated with the full 14 respect and with the full dignity of other 15 Americans, and that in spite of the fact that 16 Senator Padavan illustrated to us a horrible 17 situation in which had there been INS 18 intervention, there might be a police officer 19 still serving us and still among his family to 20 this day. 21 What we're saying is that in 22 legislating to that end, we just want to make 23 sure that there is not undue harassment of 5534 1 individuals who are citizens and - 2 SENATOR PADAVAN: Mr. President, 3 would Senator Paterson yield to a question? 4 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 5 Paterson, will you yield to a question? 6 SENATOR PATERSON: Most 7 certainly, Senator. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 9 Padavan. 10 SENATOR PADAVAN: I'm not 11 familiar with the specifics of the case you 12 referred to of immigrant laborers, but I will 13 ask you this question: If any local law 14 enforcement agency had arrested these workers 15 for reasons other than were valid, would not 16 that local law enforcement agency be subjected 17 to action either by the U.S. Attorney or the 18 state Attorney General? Let me put it another 19 way. Would they, in fact, have been violating 20 the law themselves? 21 SENATOR PATERSON: Senator, in 22 that particular case -- and I'm very happy that 23 you would take an interest in it because other 5535 1 than that, you know, your bill, particularly - 2 the type of situation you're addressing in your 3 bill is quite valid. In that particular case, 4 there would certainly be an unwillingness or a 5 refusal or certainly an apprehension on the part 6 of those who had been injured to perhaps come 7 forward and report these types of situations. 8 I'm not going to represent to you that this is 9 the policy of a law enforcement agency anywhere 10 in the state. 11 SENATOR PADAVAN: Let me ask you 12 hypothetically. Would not their civil rights 13 have been violated if such a scenario had taken 14 place? 15 SENATOR PATERSON: Yes. 16 SENATOR PADAVAN: So, in other 17 words, you are using an illegality to justify 18 our not acting on something that is reasonable, 19 and I think that logic fails us, Senator. We 20 cannot be guided by the illegal actions of 21 anyone. 22 SENATOR PATERSON: Senator, what 23 I am trying to demonstrate to you is that there 5536 1 is a danger, and the fact that a situation is 2 illegal does not mean that we should be 3 precluded in this chamber from recognizing that 4 it might exist. That's why I was just saying a 5 moment ago that I am not going to tell you that 6 this is the policy of any law enforcement 7 organization in the state. 8 What I'm saying is that it may 9 very well be the actions of a few, and it always 10 is a very few, but under the protections of our 11 democracy and in writing legislation, I would 12 think that we would be sensitive to the fact 13 that there are abuses that do take place and 14 there are sometimes excessive use of power by 15 those who are authorized to administer it, and 16 that this kind of thing perhaps has happened. 17 It would be a lot easier if, as 18 you suggested, the individuals who feel they 19 have been victimized by it come forward, but as 20 long as I'm representing to you that it has 21 happened in some instances, I think that we 22 would be sensitive to it in our legislation and 23 wouldn't ignore the fact that it could be 5537 1 happening based on the fact that the individuals 2 who were afflicted didn't report it. It may be 3 an illegality, but the logic in it is that more 4 than an illegality, it's a danger that we're 5 opening the door to individuals who don't 6 deserve to be harassed. 7 And since Senator Padavan, by his 8 silence, implies consent, I guess I'll rest. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 10 Waldon -- Senator Waldon. 11 SENATOR PADAVAN: Are you asking 12 me to yield? 13 SENATOR WALDON: Thank you very 14 much, Mr. President. On the bill. 15 When I was a young man -- a young 16 boy, actually, we moved to Brooklyn around 1943, 17 and not too long after that, I had a job working 18 in Mr. Levy's delicatessen, and one the 19 beautiful experiences of running errands for his 20 grocery store was that I got to know someone who 21 was a recent immigrant to this country and who 22 was a very positive and caring human being and 23 who took a liking to me, and he marveled at what 5538 1 America meant to someone who had escaped from 2 the boot or the heel of Nazi Germany. 3 My second job was with a 4 gentleman named Percival Jones, and these were 5 all errand running jobs. I delivered the tailor 6 work, cleaning at his cleaning store and 7 basically made a couple of dollars in tips and 8 things like that so that my brothers and I could 9 go to a place called The Comet, which was a 10 movie theatre on Gates and Reid where you could 11 see 21 cartoons and a cowboy picture for a 12 dime. That's a long time ago, but Mr. Jones had 13 recently come to this country from Jamaica West 14 Indies, and he also marveled at what a nice 15 place this was that someone who had recently 16 arrived could own his own business, could be an 17 employer of people, not me, because I wasn't 18 truly an employee at that time, but could have 19 an opportunity to become somebody in a land that 20 was not the place of his origin. 21 Some years later in the garment 22 industry, I worked for a man named George 23 Nockdigal at an embroidery factory, and I can 5539 1 remember in front of those hot stoves -- I don't 2 know if anyone knows about embroidery work, but 3 there's a pattern and the ladies and gentlemen 4 would sew the pattern through the paper, and 5 you'd put it into an oven and it would heat up 6 and the paper would become easily removable by 7 just rubbing -- rubbing the garments, and I did 8 that for a whole summer, and the son of George 9 Nockdigal would tell me about how his father 10 explained to him what it was on the other side 11 when things were very, very tough, and to come 12 to America and then to own a business in the 13 garment district was a quantum leap from his 14 past. 15 What I'm trying to say with all 16 of this is that there was a time when this 17 nation opened its arms to everybody despite 18 color, despite place of origin, despite language 19 and said, Come here. We have a place for you, 20 and not that this bill specifically addresses 21 the concern that I raised with my remarks, but I 22 believe it is part and parcel of a philosophy 23 that I find troublesome, worrisome and 5540 1 meddlesome, and so I encourage you to do what 2 you have to do on this bill, but to recognize 3 that a restrictive exclusionary philosophy, in 4 my opinion, is un-American. 5 Thank you very much, Mr. 6 President, my colleagues. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the 8 last section. 9 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 10 act shall take effect on the 30th day. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call the 12 roll. 13 (The Secretary called the roll.) 14 THE SECRETARY: Ayes -- those 15 recorded in the negative on Calendar Number 885 16 are Senators Connor, Espada, Markowitz, 17 Montgomery, Paterson, Santiago, Smith and 18 Waldon. Ayes 49, nays 8. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The bill 20 is passed. 21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 22 933, by Senator Present, Senate Print 6854, an 23 act to amend the General Municipal Law, in 5541 1 relation to economic development zones. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 3 Smith. 4 SENATOR SMITH: Would the sponsor 5 be kind enough to give us an explanation of this 6 bill? 7 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 8 Present, will you yield for an explanation? 9 SENATOR PRESENT: Sure. Senator 10 Smith, under -- under existing law, if a 11 business wants to move into an economic 12 development zone, the municipality that houses 13 that business must hold a public hearing, post 14 it, take the testimony and go through the 15 procedures of a public hearing which is 16 expensive for the village and troublesome to the 17 business. All this bill does is delete the 18 public hearing portion. 19 SENATOR SMITH: Thank you. 20 I've spoken to some people who 21 sit on town boards and come from small towns and 22 villages, and it's my understanding that the 23 cost of placing an ad in the newspaper would be 5542 1 approximately 10 to $15 in most of these local 2 areas. Would that be accurate? 3 SENATOR PRESENT: I don't know. 4 I haven't placed a public notice in a long time. 5 SENATOR SMITH: Well, this is 6 according to some of the people that sit on the 7 boards in these areas, and the only concern that 8 I have -- on the bill, Mr. President. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 10 Smith, on the bill. 11 SENATOR SMITH: -- is that we're 12 willing to give up a public benefit and the 13 rights of people to have a say in what takes 14 place for 10 to $15, and I think that's too much 15 to pay. I believe that people should have a 16 right to have public comment, especially on 17 something as important as moving companies from 18 one place to another, especially when it has 19 been proven that most of these companies are not 20 hiring new people but just moving jobs from one 21 place to another into an EDZ. 22 Thank you. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the 5543 1 last section. 2 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 3 act shall take effect immediately. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call the 5 roll. 6 (The Secretary called the roll.) 7 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 56, nays 1, 8 Senator Smith recorded in the negative. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The bill 10 is passed. 11 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 12 963, by Senator Velella, Senate Print Number 13 7097, an act to amend the Insurance Law, in 14 relation to the holding of meetings. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the 16 last section. 17 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 18 act shall take effect immediately. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call the 20 roll. 21 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 22 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 57. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The bill 5544 1 is passed. 2 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 3 983, by Senator Wright, Senate Print 7338, an 4 act to amend Chapter 3 of the Laws of 1993. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the 6 last section. 7 Senator Wright, explanation is 8 being asked for. 9 SENATOR WRIGHT: Thank you, Mr. 10 President. 11 The bill before the Senate this 12 afternoon extends the provisions that we enacted 13 in 1993 to comply with what's referred to as the 14 Solomon amendment in conformance of state 15 statute with federal statute extending mandatory 16 suspension of drivers' licenses upon conviction 17 of certain drug-related offenses. 18 Annually for the past several 19 years we have extended this provision and 20 enacted it in state statute to ensure compliance 21 with the federal statutes and to secure receipt 22 of federal assistance, this year to the tune of 23 42 million -- excuse me, $43 million in federal 5545 1 highway aid linked to the state's conformance 2 with the federal requirements. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 4 Paterson. 5 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr. 6 President. 7 If Senator Wright would yield for 8 a question. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 10 Wright, would you yield? 11 SENATOR WRIGHT: Yes I would, Mr. 12 President. 13 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you. 14 Senator Wright, do you know how much it would 15 cost to implement this procedure that we have 16 before us? 17 SENATOR WRIGHT: No, Senator, I 18 do not know the cost of implementation because 19 it is, in fact, implemented now. We have had 20 this statute on the books since 1993, so the 21 cost of implementation at the time I'm not aware 22 of, but it is in effect, in place now. 23 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr. 5546 1 President. 2 The reason I'm asking the 3 question is that I wondered if it would not be 4 prudent for us to find out how much it costs if 5 we're going to be extending this legislation in 6 light of the fact that 31 states have opted out 7 of it, and we have the option of passing 8 resolutions in the Senate and the Assembly and 9 having it signed by the Governor. 10 Now, this is a remedy that we 11 would have if we don't want to lose the money in 12 federal highway assistance from the government. 13 The reason that I would think that we might do 14 this is because, as I see it, there is no nexus 15 between the actual crime and the punishment in 16 this case which is withdrawing someone's 17 license. 18 Certainly, the crime is serious 19 and the punishment has been serious as it's 20 prescribed under the criminal law. What I'm 21 saying is that it's very hard to vote against 22 this piece of legislation because inevitably 23 there can be made the relationship between an 5547 1 individual under the use of some substance 2 driving an automobile and injuring an innocent 3 party, and certainly the thought of that is very 4 frightening and any way that we would want to 5 thwart that, we should undertake. 6 The question is whether or not 7 this legislation is somewhat speculative and 8 remote to the actual process. Where is the 9 offense related to the operation of a motor 10 vehicle where a person who perhaps as a younger 11 person makes a mistake early in their life, 12 they've paid their debt to society, they've 13 sought counseling for their substance abuse 14 problem, they now would be unable to operate a 15 motor vehicle because of this conviction in the 16 past. 17 At the same time, they might 18 become one of many who abuses alcohol and can 19 drive a car, as people do all the time; and so 20 the point is not that the spirit of the 21 legislation is in any way flawed, but that the 22 actual law that we would be passing bears no 23 relationship, as I see it, to the crime that the 5548 1 individual has committed. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the 3 last section. 4 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 5 act shall take effect immediately. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call the 7 roll. 8 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 9 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 10 the negative on Calendar Number 983 are Senators 11 Connor, Mendez, Paterson and Smith. Excuse me. 12 Those recorded in the negative on Calendar 983 13 are Senators Connor, Paterson and Smith. Ayes 14 54, nays 3. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The bill 16 is passed. 17 Senator Mendez. 18 SENATOR MENDEZ: Mr. President, I 19 was out of the chambers when two roll calls were 20 taken, and I want the record to reflect that if 21 I would have been here, I would have voted "no" 22 on 314 and "no" on Calendar Number 885. 23 Thank you. 5549 1 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Without 2 objection. 3 Senator Mendez, without 4 objection, the record will indicate if you had 5 been in the chamber you would have been recorded 6 in the negative on Calendar Number 314, and also 7 the record will indicate, without objection, 8 your opposition to 885. 9 SENATOR MENDEZ: Thank you. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The 11 Secretary will continue the calendar. 12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 13 1096, by Senator Libous, Senate Print 4420-C, an 14 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to 15 parole for certain sex offenders. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the 17 last section. 18 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 19 act shall take effect on the 1st day of 20 November. 21 THE SECRETARY: Call the roll. 22 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 23 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 57. 5550 1 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The bill 2 is passed. 3 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 4 1100, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate 5 Print 5494-A, an act to amend the Criminal 6 Procedure Law and the Public Authorities Law. 7 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 9 Leichter. 10 SENATOR LEICHTER: Yes, Mr. 11 President, on the bill. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 13 Leichter, on the bill. 14 SENATOR LEICHTER: Yes. This 15 relates to the Javits Convention Center which is 16 in my district. 17 I think, as we all know from 18 newspaper reports, and the Senate actually had a 19 hearing on the Center, there have been some 20 serious problems at the Center in its 21 management. There have been allegations that 22 there was mob influence. There certainly seems 23 to be no question that the costs for an 5551 1 exhibition at the Convention Center seem to be 2 unreasonably high. 3 The Governor seems to have taken 4 some steps that maybe has made that Convention 5 Center more competitive. Actually, I had a lot 6 of questions and doubts, both as to the person 7 that he appointed and as to this way of 8 proceeding. I felt that the best way would have 9 been really to try to hire a private firm to 10 operate the Convention Center. 11 Well, I really haven't had any 12 special knowledge on it, but based on first 13 reports, other reports, there seem to be some 14 improvements in the Convention Center. The 15 Governor has now asked for a licensing or asked 16 us to approve a licensing system whereby the 17 Convention Center could license contractors, 18 employees, and so on, obviously with a viewpoint 19 of keeping out anybody with mob connections or 20 an unsavory background. 21 I've no problem with that in 22 principle, and I'm going to vote for this bill, 23 but I just want to point out there's some 5552 1 awfully broad powers that are given here to the 2 Convention Center which I think could be worri 3 some or could be used in a manner to break labor 4 unions, to really give the management or the 5 employer, if you will, such extreme powers, and 6 I just want to point out to you some of the 7 language that I think could be somewhat 8 troublesome. 9 In Section 5, "the corporation 10 board may refuse to issue or renew or may 11 suspend or revoke a license," and it goes on to 12 say if it finds out that the applicant or the 13 licensee that is participating in activities at 14 the Convention Center would be "inconsistent 15 with the public interest or the best interests 16 of the corporation". 17 That's awfully broad. It means 18 really that they can deny a license to anybody 19 for any reason that they want to or they could 20 revoke a license for anybody. Maybe somebody's 21 organized and maybe somebody has a fight with a 22 shop steward. His license can be revoked and, 23 while there's a provision for due process 5553 1 hearings, since this is a standard it's an 2 awfully broad standard. 3 And it goes on -- then in another 4 instance, it says the -- in the due process 5 hearing, "the corporation board shall not be 6 bound by the rules of evidence." Here again, I 7 think that's an unwise grant. I think all of us 8 certainly want to root out organized crime 9 wherever it is or any criminal activity, and we 10 certainly don't want it to impede economic 11 development activities such as the Convention 12 Center, and I think as I stated before that some 13 additional powers given to the corporation that 14 runs the Javits Center, a public benefit 15 corporation, is appropriate, but I think this 16 goes really beyond, I think, the powers that are 17 legitimate and reasonably given. 18 I'm going to vote for it because 19 I don't want anybody to say that I did anything 20 that impeded the fight against organized crime 21 and I think all of us certainly want to see that 22 any criminal activity is rooted out, but I just 23 say that this is really part of the trend that 5554 1 we've seen, particularly in this session where 2 bills that deal with issues that may be really 3 quite legitimate are written so broadly and give 4 such vast powers to law enforcement agencies or 5 to the government, that they really impinge on 6 individual liberties, and it always surprises me 7 that it comes from people in a party that says, 8 We want to assert and we want to protect the 9 rights of the individual. We don't want 10 government to take over. Then you write these 11 bills that give all of these super-powers to 12 governmental agencies, in this instance the 13 Javits Convention Center. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the 15 last section. 16 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This 17 act shall take effect immediately. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call the 19 roll. 20 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 21 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 57. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The bill 23 is passed. 5555 1 Senator Marcellino. 2 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Yeah, Mr. 3 President. May we please take up Calendar 4 Number 1222, Senate 7578, which has just been 5 reported from the Finance Committee. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: 7 Secretary will read Calendar 1222. 8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 9 1222, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate 10 Print 7578, an act making appropriations for the 11 support of government. 12 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Is there a 13 message of necessity and appropriation at the 14 desk? 15 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Yes, 16 there is. 17 SENATOR MARCELLINO: I move to 18 accept the messages of necessity and 19 appropriation. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: All 21 those in favor signify by saying aye. 22 (Response of "Aye.") 23 Opposed nay. 5556 1 The messages are accepted. 2 Senator Marcellino. 3 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Please read 4 the last section. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the 6 last section. 7 THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This 8 act shall take effect immediately. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call the 10 roll. 11 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 12 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 56, nays 13 one, Senator - 14 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr. 15 President. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The 17 negatives please raise their hands, Calendar 18 Number 1222, Senate 7578. 19 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 20 the negative on Calendar Number 1222 are Senat 21 ors Alesi, DiCarlo, Dollinger, Hoffmann, Libous, 22 Nozzolio and Oppenheimer. Ayes 50, nays 7. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The bill 5557 1 is passed. 2 Senator Marcellino. 3 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Yes, Mr. 4 President. May we please take up Calendar 5 Number 1223, Senate Number 7579. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: 7 Secretary will read Calendar Number 1223. 8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 9 1223, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate 10 Print 7579, an act making appropriations for the 11 support of government and to amend Chapter 63 of 12 the Laws of 1996. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 14 Marcellino. 15 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 16 President, are there any messages of necessity 17 and appropriation at the desk? 18 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: There's 19 a message at the desk. 20 SENATOR MARCELLINO: I move to 21 accept the messages of necessity and 22 appropriation. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: All 5558 1 those in favor signify by saying aye. 2 (Response of "Aye.") 3 Opposed nay. 4 (There was no response.) 5 The messages are accepted. Read 6 the last section. 7 THE SECRETARY: Section 12. This 8 act shall take effect immediately. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call the 10 roll. 11 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 12 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 57. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The bill 14 is passed. 15 Mr. President - 16 SENATOR HOFFMANN: Could we - 17 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 18 Hoffmann. 19 SENATOR HOFFMANN: Yes, since we 20 just had bills reported directly to the floor 21 for votes, I'd like to just clarify for several 22 of my colleagues, if I could please, the two 23 bills that were just passed, the "no" votes that 5559 1 you recorded, the vote on the pay bill for the 2 Governor and the Legislature, what is the number 3 on that bill, and do you have "no" votes 4 recorded for that one? 5 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 6 Marcellino. 7 SENATOR MARCELLINO: If the desk 8 could provide that answer to Senator Hoffmann, 9 we'd appreciate it. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 11 Hoffmann, Senate 7578, Calendar 1222. 12 SENATOR HOFFMANN: 7578, you have 13 "no" votes recorded on that bill which provides 14 $646,000 for salaries and Social Security 15 payments for the Governor, Lieutenant Governor, 16 Comptroller, Attorney General and members of the 17 Legislature for the May 29 payroll? 18 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: That's 19 correct. 20 SENATOR HOFFMANN: That is 21 correct, and I along with several of my 22 colleagues are reported -- in the upstate 23 conservative caucus are recorded in the negative 5560 1 on that calendar. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: You are 3 recorded in the negative. 4 SENATOR HOFFMANN: Thank you, Mr. 5 President, for that clarification. 6 Senator Marcellino. Senator 7 Wright? 8 SENATOR WRIGHT: I request to be 9 recorded in the negative on Calendar 1222 and 10 Senate 7578. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Without 12 objection, you will be recorded in the 13 negative. 14 Senator Marcellino. 15 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 16 President, there will be -- I am so pleased to 17 find out that we have an upstate conservative 18 caucus in this chamber, and Senator DiCarlo has 19 joined it. 20 Are there any -- is there any 21 housekeeping at the desk, sir? 22 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Yes, 23 there is. 5561 1 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Can we take 2 that up now, please. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator 4 Farley. 5 SENATOR FARLEY: Thank you, Mr. 6 President. 7 On page 29 I offer the following 8 amendments to Calendar Number 817, Senate Print 9 5792, and I ask that that bill retain its place 10 on the Third Reading Calendar. That's on behalf 11 of Senator Norman Levy. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: 13 Amendments are received. 14 SENATOR FARLEY: On behalf of 15 Senator Maltese, on page 32, I offer the 16 following amendments to Calendar 854, Senate 17 Print 4723, and I ask that that bill retain its 18 place. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: 20 Amendments received. 21 SENATOR FARLEY: On behalf of 22 myself, wait a second -- on behalf of himself, I 23 wish to star these three bills: Sponsor star, 5562 1 Calendar 1190, Senate Print 6265; Calendar 2 Number 1192, Senate Print 7271; Calendar 991, 3 Senate Print 7374. 4 On behalf of Senator Levy, Mr. 5 President, I wish to call up his bill, Print 6 Number 331, which was recalled from the Assembly 7 which is now at the desk. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: 9 Secretary will read. 10 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 11 41, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 331, an act to 12 amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law. 13 SENATOR FARLEY: I now move to 14 reconsider the vote by which this bill was 15 passed. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call the 17 roll on reconsideration. 18 (The Secretary called the roll on 19 reconsideration. ) 20 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 57. 21 SENATOR FARLEY: Mr. President, I 22 now offer the following amendments. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: 5563 1 Amendments received. 2 SENATOR FARLEY: On behalf of 3 Senator Padavan, Mr. President, I wish to call 4 up his bill, Senate Print 4216-A. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: 6 Secretary will read. 7 SENATOR FARLEY: Which is 8 recalled from the Assembly. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: 10 Secretary will read. 11 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 12 691, by Senator Padavan, Senate Print Number 13 4216-A, an act to amend the Penal Law, in 14 relation to auto stripping. 15 SENATOR FARLEY: Mr. President, I 16 now move to reconsider the vote by which this 17 bill passed. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call the 19 roll on reconsideration. 20 (The Secretary called the roll on 21 reconsideration. ) 22 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 57. 23 SENATOR FARLEY: I now offer the 5564 1 following amendments. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: 3 Amendments are received. 4 Any other housekeeping? 5 (There was no response. ) 6 Senator Marcellino. 7 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 8 President, there being no further business, I 9 move we adjourn until Wednesday, May 22nd, at 10 11:00 a.m. sharp. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Motion 12 of Senator Marcellino, the Senate will stand 13 adjourned until Wednesday, May 22nd. 14 (Whereupon at 4:45 p.m., the 15 Senate adjourned. ) 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23