Wednesday, May 22, 1996

5565 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 ALBANY, NEW YORK 10 May 22, 1996 11 11:01 a.m. 12 13 14 REGULAR SESSION 15 16 17 18 SENATOR JOHN R. KUHL, JR., Acting President 19 STEPHEN F. SLOAN, Secretary 20 21 22 23 5566 1 P R O C E E D I N G S 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 3 Senate will come to order. Ask the members to 4 find their chairs, staff to find their places. 5 Ask everybody in the chamber to rise and join 6 with me in saying the Pledge of Allegiance to 7 the Flag. 8 (The assemblage repeated the 9 Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.) 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: In the 11 absence of clergy, I'd ask that we all bow our 12 heads in a moment of silence. 13 (A moment of silence was 14 observed. ) 15 Reading of the Journal. 16 THE SECRETARY: In Senate, 17 Tuesday, May 21st. The Senate met pursuant to 18 adjournment. The Journal of Monday, May 20th, 19 was read and approved. On motion, Senate 20 adjourned. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Hearing 22 no objection, the Journal stands approved as 23 read. 5567 1 Presentation of petitions. 2 Messages from the Assembly. 3 Messages from the Governor. 4 Reports of standing committees. 5 Reports of select committees. 6 Communications and reports from 7 state officers. 8 Motions and resolutions. 9 Senator Skelos. 10 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, I 11 believe there's a privileged resolution at the 12 desk by Senator Trunzo. May we please have it 13 read in its entirety and move for its immediate 14 adoption. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is 16 a privileged resolution at the desk. I'll ask 17 the Secretary to read the resolution in its 18 entirety. 19 THE SECRETARY: By Senator 20 Trunzo, Legislative Resolution honoring the New 21 York State Professional Firefighters in 22 recognition of Professional Firefighters' Week, 23 May 20th to May 24th, 1996. 5568 1 WHEREAS, it is the sense of this 2 assembled body that the positive and salutary 3 definition of the communities of the state of 4 New York remains of unparalleled importance to 5 the discharge of our shared responsibilities; 6 There is no substitute, no 7 alternative to the full implementation of that 8 prerogative. On the contrary, the safe, sure 9 and positive definition of the communities of 10 the state of New York dictates that discretion 11 ary power inherent in governance be weighted in 12 favor of that commitment; 13 Consistent with that pledged 14 concern, it is the sense of this assembled body 15 to honor the New York State Professional 16 Firefighters in recognition of Professional 17 Firefighters' Week May 20 through May 24, 1996; 18 The New York State Professional 19 Firefighters have 25,000 members statewide; in 20 the 127-year history of paid professional 21 firefighters in New York State, 1450 have made 22 the supreme sacrifice in the line of duty while 23 protecting the lives and property of the 5569 1 citizens of the state of New York; 2 It is their concern for the 3 secure and safe definition of this Empire State 4 that recommends New York State's Professional 5 Firefighters for special commendation; 6 Through their valiant and heroic 7 commitment to the people of the state of New 8 York, professional firefighters have so 9 unselfishly advanced that spirit of united 10 purpose and shared concern which is the 11 unalterable manifestation of our American 12 experience; 13 NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED 14 that this legislative body pause in its 15 deliberations and most proudly honor the New 16 York State Firefighters in recognition of 17 Professional Firefighters' Week, May 20th 18 through the 24th, 1996, fully confident that the 19 professional firefighters of the state of New 20 York mirror that same commitment to excellence 21 which so distinguishes their long history; and 22 BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED that a 23 copy of this resolution, suitably engrossed, be 5570 1 transmitted to James McGowan, President, New 2 York State Professional Firefighters, 111 3 Washington Avenue, Albany New York. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Chair 5 recognizes Senator Trunzo on the resolution. 6 SENATOR TRUNZO: Mr. President, 7 it's with great pleasure for me to introduce 8 this resolution regarding Professional 9 Firefighters' Week. 10 There are many members of the 11 professional firefighters in the gallery today 12 which we'd like to acknowledge, and I'd like 13 them to know that every member of this Senate, 14 all 61 of us, have introduced that resolution. 15 It's a completely -- a resolution introduced by 16 all 61 members of the Senate and every one knows 17 about the risk that these dedicated men and 18 women in the fire professionals do for us day in 19 and day out and, as noted in the resolution, 20 1450 have passed away in the line of duty 21 protecting our people and during the past year 22 six firemen have died in the line of duty and 23 it's sad to say that two of those six were 5571 1 constituents of mine that died in New York - 2 New York City firemen, that passed away within 3 two or three weeks of each other. One was Lt. 4 John Clancy, of Oakdale, and the other 5 firefighter, James Williams, of Shirley, Long 6 Island. Both men heroically died as a result of 7 saving lives in their profession. 8 So it gives me great pleasure to 9 remember these men, as well as commending the 10 firefighters of the state of New York for the 11 tremendous -- the professional firefighters for 12 the tremendous job that they do for all of the 13 citizens of this state and, Mr. President, I 14 wish you would acknowledge the men and women of 15 the Professional Firefighters Association which 16 is up there in the gallery today. 17 Thank you. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair 19 recognizes Senator Marchi on the resolution. 20 SENATOR MARCHI: Mr. 21 President, I couldn't think of a more 22 appropriate resolution for a finer group of 23 people. I remember my days in my early teens, 5572 1 on three separate occasions I put together an 2 almanac for three widows of firefighters who had 3 lost their lives under the most serious 4 circumstances, and I made a collage of newspaper 5 articles at that time from the many newspapers 6 that had reported separate incidents. 7 During the course of the war, I 8 found myself several times being laid up by 9 excessive smoke inhalation which is only a 10 fraction of what they experience in life of a 11 very painful and difficult circumstance that 12 rivals even the time when I contracted amoebic 13 dysentery, but this was real physical suffering 14 and I only sampled it on a very -- in a very 15 minor way. 16 But you never hesitate. You 17 certainly don't throw discretion to the winds 18 but you do where human life is at stake. The 19 saga of bravery and courage that you exemplify, 20 I think, is a matter of common knowledge, and 21 the continuous availability to enormous 22 sacrifice that you make and the statistical 23 records which go beyond those who have made the 5573 1 supreme sacrifice, but scars that you carry 2 personally in many ways at many times all attest 3 to the fact that yours is a noble profession and 4 you -- you fulfill the highest expectations and 5 you are role models, I think, for people around 6 the state for the courage you exhibit, the 7 commitment that you bring to your 8 responsibilities and the debt of gratitude that 9 I think the people of the state of New York, I 10 think, collectively owe you. 11 Mr. President, this is a very 12 very fine resolution and certainly it attests - 13 it's attested to by the knowing and sense 14 feeling of every member of this chamber. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 16 DeFrancisco, on the resolution. 17 SENATOR DeFRANCISCO: I also rise 18 as a co-sponsor of this resolution to commend 19 the firefighters for their professional work 20 throughout this state. I've seen it at the 21 local level as a local official for many years, 22 and now I see that the fine firefighters that we 23 have in the Onondaga County/Syracuse area are 5574 1 true throughout the state. 2 One thing I think we should or I 3 should point out on a very serious note, I think 4 many of us in this room, including myself, think 5 that it's very important to privatize in many 6 ways and to consolidate, to try to save money, 7 but we've got to be very careful as do the local 8 governments that, when you're talking about 9 public safety and you're talking about police 10 and fire, there's a level of professionalism 11 that can't be bitten by the present system, and 12 we've got to be very careful in these efforts to 13 make certain that we maintain the professional 14 firefighters and the professional police 15 officers that we have at our localities and 16 throughout the state and, with that warning in 17 mind and with that admonition in mind, I want to 18 congratulate all of them for the fine work 19 they're doing and thank them for visiting me 20 personally this week. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Is there 22 any other Senator wishing to speak on the 23 resolution? 5575 1 Senator Alesi, on the 2 resolution. 3 SENATOR ALESI: Thank you, Mr. 4 President. 5 I join with my colleagues in 6 welcoming these professional firefighters to the 7 Capitol today. Last year I had the pleasure in 8 the other house to welcome them and acknowledge 9 some of the Rochester area firefighters on the 10 floor in the Assembly. Today I see that they're 11 joining us here in the Senate, although I don't 12 think they can see me. Not much of a loss, I'm 13 sure, for them. But I also had the pleasure, 14 the special pleasure I should add, of 15 acknowledging the presence of one of my family 16 members who is with the Rochester area 17 firefighters as well, and certainly appreciate 18 the fact that they've taken time to come join us 19 today and, more importantly, we appreciate what 20 they do for us on the 365 days a year and 21 appreciate the pleasure and the privilege of 22 welcoming them here today, Mr. President. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Any other 5576 1 Senator wishing to speak on the resolution? 2 Hearing none, the question is on 3 the resolution. All those in favor signify by 4 saying aye. 5 (Response of "Aye.") 6 Opposed nay. 7 (There was no response. ) 8 The resolution is unanimously 9 adopted. 10 On behalf of Senator Bruno, 11 Senator Trunzo and all 59 other members of the 12 Senate, we welcome you to Albany, congratulate 13 you on the wonderful thing that you do for the 14 people here in this chamber and all the people 15 of New York and, as Senator Marchi said, you 16 have the highest expectations of people in this 17 state. We expect big things of you. You're 18 doing a great job. Keep it up. We're proud of 19 you, and thanks for participating in today's 20 session in Albany. 21 (Applause) 22 Senator Rath. 23 SENATOR RATH: Mr. Chairman, I 5577 1 believe there is a resolution at the desk 2 sponsored by Senator Seabrook. If that title 3 could be read. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is 5 a privileged resolution at the desk. Ask the 6 Secretary to read the title. 7 THE SECRETARY: By Senator 8 Seabrook, Legislative Resolution commending Dr. 9 Frank G. Pogue, Vice-Chancellor of SUNY Office 10 of Special Programs for his years of service 11 upon his leaving of SUNY to become President of 12 Edinburgh College, to be presented at a farewell 13 ceremony on May 23rd, 1996. 14 SENATOR RATH: Move adoption of 15 the resolution. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Question 17 is on adoption of the resolution. All those in 18 favor signify by saying aye. 19 (Response of "Aye.") 20 Opposed nay. 21 (There was no response. ) 22 Resolution is adopted. 23 Senator Rath. 5578 1 SENATOR RATH: Mr. President, if 2 we could proceed with the non-controversial 3 calendar. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 5 Rath, we have a couple substitutions and some 6 motions, if we could take care of those. 7 SENATOR RATH: Mr. President, 8 please do the substitutions and motions at this 9 time. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Chair 11 recognizes Senator Padavan. 12 THE SECRETARY: On page 32, 13 Senator Maltese moves to discharge from the 14 Committee on Judiciary Assembly Bill Number 15 1770-A and substitute it for the identical 16 Senate Bill 4723-A. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 18 Substitution is ordered. Chair recognizes 19 Senator Nozzolio. 20 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr. President, 21 on page number 41, I offer the following 22 amendments to Calendar Number 945, Print Number 23 -- Senate Print Number 7368. 5579 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 2 Amendments to Calendar Number 945 are received 3 and adopted. 4 Senator Nozzolio. 5 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr. President, 6 I have two more. 7 Page number 23, I offer the 8 following amendments to Calendar Number 734, 9 Print Number 6749, on behalf of Senator Velella, 10 and I - 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 12 Amendments are received and adopted. The bill 13 will retain its place on the Third Reading 14 Calendar. 15 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Thank you, Mr. 16 President. 17 Last one, on page number 14, I 18 offer the following amendments to Calendar 19 Number 504, Print Number 5773, on behalf of 20 Senator Marcellino. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 22 Amendments to Calendar Number 504 are received 23 and adopted. Bill will retain its place on the 5580 1 Third Reading Calendar. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 3 Rath that brings us to the non-controversial 4 calendar. 5 Senator Rath. 6 SENATOR RATH: Mr. President, if 7 we could proceed with the reading of the non 8 controversial calendar. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 10 will read the non-controversial calendar. 11 THE SECRETARY: On page 8, 12 Calendar Number 355, by Senator Leibell, Senate 13 Print 2709, an act to amend the Labor Law, in 14 relation to establishing additional eligibility 15 requirements for unemployment insurance 16 benefits. 17 SENATOR LEIBELL: Lay aside, 18 please. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 20 bill aside for the day. 21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 22 485, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 5342-B, an 23 act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in 5581 1 relation to establishing an advisory committee 2 on truck weights. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 4 will read the last section. 5 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 6 act shall take effect immediately. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 8 roll. 9 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 10 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 42. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 12 is passed. 13 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 14 616, by the Committee on Rules, Assembly Bill 15 7545-A, an act to amend the Civil Practice Law 16 and Rules, in relation to disposition and use of 17 dispositions. 18 SENATOR GOLD: Is that 3785? 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Calendar 20 616 has just been read. 21 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 23 Gold, you just want to lay the bill aside? 5582 1 SENATOR GOLD: No, I just want to 2 get the record straight on something. I thought 3 it was read as Assembly Bill 7545-A, and my bill 4 here says 3785-A. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: It's 6 Senate Bill 3785-A which is substituted Calendar 7 Number 7545-A. The Assembly bill has been 8 substituted. 9 SENATOR GOLD: No problem. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 11 will read the last section. 12 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 13 act shall take effect immediately. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 15 roll. 16 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 17 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 43. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 19 is passed. 20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 21 704, by Senator Saland, Senate Print Number 22 2117, an act to amend the Family Court Act, in 23 relation to procedures for the temporary removal 5583 1 of a child. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 3 will read the last section. 4 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 5 act shall take effect on the 90th day. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 7 roll. 8 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 9 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 43. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 11 is passed. 12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 13 716, by Senator Libous, Senate Print 6659, an 14 act to amend the Mental Hygiene Law, in relation 15 to rules and regulations relating to a uniform 16 system of reports. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 18 will read the last section. 19 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 20 act shall take effect immediately. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 22 roll. 23 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 5584 1 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 44. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 3 is passed. 4 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 5 775, by Senator Present, Senate Print 471, an 6 act to amend the Public Lands Law, in relation 7 to state aid payments for certain state-owned 8 lands. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There's a 10 local fiscal impact note at the desk. Secretary 11 will read the last section. 12 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 13 act shall take effect immediately. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 15 roll. 16 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 17 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 44. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 19 is passed. 20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 21 814, by Senator DiCarlo, Senate Print 3362, an 22 act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law and the 23 Criminal Procedure Law, in relation to driving 5585 1 while under the influence of alcohol or drugs. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 3 will read the last section. 4 THE SECRETARY: Section 27. This 5 act shall take effect on the 1st day of 6 November. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 8 roll. 9 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 10 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 44. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 12 is passed. 13 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 14 832, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 6371, an 15 act to amend Chapter 509 of the Laws of 1995, 16 amending the Vehicle and Traffic Law, relating 17 to the issuance of special number plates. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 19 will read the last section. 20 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 21 act shall take effect immediately. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 23 roll. 5586 1 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 2 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 44. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 4 is passed. 5 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 6 848, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 7357, an act 7 to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in 8 relation to speeding violations committed within 9 a work area. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 11 will read the last section. 12 THE SECRETARY: Section 7. This 13 act shall take effect on the 30th day. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 15 roll. 16 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 17 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 44. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 19 is passed. 20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 21 856, by member of the Assembly Wright, Assembly 22 Bill 4304, an act to amend the Criminal 23 Procedure Law, in relation to warrants for 5587 1 violation of probation. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 3 will read the last section. 4 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 5 act shall take effect immediately. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 7 roll. 8 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 9 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 44. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 11 is passed. 12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 13 857, by Senator DeFrancisco, Senate Print 6436 14 A, an act to amend the Civil Practice Law and 15 Rules, in relation to the form of docketing 16 judgment. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 18 will read the last section. 19 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 20 act shall take effect immediately. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 22 roll. 23 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 5588 1 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 44. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 3 is passed. 4 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 5 858, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 6534-A, an 6 act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law, in 7 relation to orders of protection in youthful 8 offender cases. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 10 will read the last section. 11 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 12 act shall take effect immediately. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 14 roll. 15 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 16 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 44. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 18 is passed. 19 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 20 859, by Senator Wright, Senate Print 6630, an 21 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to 22 vehicular manslaughter in the first degree. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 5589 1 will read the last section. 2 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 3 act shall take effect on the 1st day of 4 November. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 6 roll. 7 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 8 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 44. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 10 is passed. 11 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 12 860, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 6695, an 13 act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law, in 14 relation to designating evidence and property 15 control specialists. 16 SENATOR GOLD: Lay it aside. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 18 bill aside. 19 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 20 861, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 6761-B, an 21 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to drug 22 free school grounds. 23 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay aside. 5590 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 2 bill aside. 3 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 4 864, by Senator Velella, Senate Print 7117, an 5 act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law, in 6 relation to expanding the types of documents 7 which may be electronically transmitted to a 8 grand jury. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 10 will read the last section. 11 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 12 act shall take effect on the 1st day of 13 November. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 15 roll. 16 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 17 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 45. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 19 bill's passed. 20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 21 872, by Senator Maziarz, Senate Print 6574, an 22 act to amend the State Administrative Procedure 23 Act, in relation to exempting certain commission 5591 1 rule makings. 2 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Lay aside. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 4 bill aside for the day at the request of the 5 sponsor. 6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7 883, by Senator Padavan, Senate Print Number 8 2793, an act to amend the State Finance Law, in 9 relation to contracts for engineering services. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 11 will read the last section. 12 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 13 act shall take effect on the 60th day. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 15 roll. 16 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 17 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 46. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 19 is passed. 20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 21 886, by Senator Kuhl, Senate Print 3357, an act 22 in relation to authorizing and directing the 23 Commissioner of General Services to study the 5592 1 feasibility of developing a master list of all 2 state publications. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 4 will read the last section. 5 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This 6 act shall take effect immediately. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 8 roll. 9 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 10 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 47. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 12 is passed. 13 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 14 891, by Senator Maziarz, Senate Print 6450, an 15 act to amend the Executive Law, the State 16 Administrative Procedure Act and the Legislative 17 Law, in relation to creating the Governor's 18 Office of Regulatory Reform. 19 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay aside. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 21 bill aside. 22 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 23 894, by Senator Kuhl, Senate Print Number 3077, 5593 1 an act to amend the Environmental Conservation 2 Law, in relation to permitting the discharge of 3 a firearm. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 5 will read the last section. 6 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 7 act shall take effect immediately. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 9 roll. 10 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 11 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 47. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 13 bill's passed. 14 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 15 896, by Senator Sears, Senate Print Number 5974, 16 an act to amend the Environmental Conservation 17 Law, in relation to including publicly owned 18 drinking water treatment plants. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There's a 20 local fiscal impact note at the desk. Secretary 21 will read the last section. 22 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 23 act shall take effect on the 30th day. 5594 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 2 roll. 3 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 4 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 47. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 6 bill's passed. 7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 8 898, by Senator Marcellino, Senate Print 6902, 9 an act to amend the Environmental Conservation 10 Law, in relation to removal of endangered, 11 threatened and protected plants. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 13 will read the last section. 14 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This 15 act shall take effect immediately. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 17 roll. 18 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 19 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 47. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 21 is passed. 22 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 23 902, by Senator Leibell, Senate Print 6462, an 5595 1 act to amend the Private Housing Finance Law, in 2 relation to the powers of the New York State 3 Housing Finance Agency. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 5 will read the last section. 6 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 7 act shall take effect immediately. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 9 roll. 10 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 11 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 47. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 13 bill's passed. 14 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 15 904 by Senator Nozzolio, Senate Print 4467, an 16 act to amend the Executive Law, in relation to 17 time periods for providing notice of preliminary 18 parole hearings. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 20 will read the last section. 21 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 22 act shall take effect immediately. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 5596 1 roll. 2 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 3 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 47. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 5 is passed. 6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7 905, by Senator Nozzolio, Senate Print 4473, an 8 act to amend the Executive Law, in relation to 9 final revocation hearings. 10 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Lay the bill 11 aside for the day. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 13 bill aside for the day at the request of the 14 sponsor. 15 THE SECRETARY: 929, by Senator 16 Goodman, Senate Print 6416, an act to amend the 17 Local Finance Law, in relation to the sale of 18 bonds and notes of the city of New York. 19 SENATOR GOLD: Lay aside. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 21 bill aside. 22 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 23 936, by Senator Rath, Senate Print Number 6965, 5597 1 an act to amend the General Municipal Law, in 2 relation to procedures for the issuance of 3 administrative search warrants. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 5 will read the last section. 6 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 7 act shall take effect immediately. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 9 roll. 10 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 11 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 47. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 13 is passed. 14 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 15 942, by Senator Rath, Senate Print 7364, an act 16 to amend the Real Property Tax Law and the Real 17 Property Law, in relation to taxation of 18 converted condominium units. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 20 will read the last section. 21 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 22 act shall take effect immediately. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 5598 1 roll -- lay the bill aside. 2 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 3 961, by Senator Velella, Senate Print 7012, an 4 act to amend the Insurance Law, in relation to 5 increasing the limit on the amount of credit 6 life insurance. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 8 will lead the last section. 9 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 10 act shall take effect immediately. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 12 roll. 13 (The Secretary called the roll.) 14 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 47. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 16 is passed. 17 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 18 967, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 4671-A, an 19 act to amend the Public Authorities Law, in 20 relation to clarifying the status of employees. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 22 will read the last section. 23 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 5599 1 act shall take effect immediately. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 3 roll. 4 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 5 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 47. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 7 is passed. 8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 9 996, by Senator DiCarlo, Senate Print Number 10 5584, an act to amend the General Business Law, 11 in relation to the sale and rental of films. 12 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay aside. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 14 bill aside. 15 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 16 1007, by member of the Assembly Gottfried, 17 Assembly Bill 9820, an act to amend Chapter 314 18 of the Laws of 1984, amending the Public Health 19 Law, relating to removing the statutory 20 exemption for municipally operated summer day 21 camps. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 23 will read the last section. 5600 1 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 2 act shall take effect immediately. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 4 roll. 5 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 6 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 48. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 8 is passed. 9 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 10 1040, by the Assembly Committee on Rules, 11 Assembly Print 8158-B, an act to authorize the 12 issuance of bonds by the town of Orangetown in 13 the county of Rockland. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There's a 15 home rule message at the desk. Secretary will 16 read the last section. 17 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 18 act shall take effect immediately. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 20 roll. 21 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 22 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 48. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 5601 1 is passed. 2 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 3 1053, by member of the Assembly Weprin, Assembly 4 Bill 4728-B, an act to amend the Estates, Powers 5 and Trusts Law. 6 SENATOR RATH: Lay aside for the 7 day. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 9 bill aside for the day. 10 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 11 1092, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 3065, an 12 act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law, the 13 Penal Law and the Family Court Act, in relation 14 to making persons 12 to 15 years of age eligible 15 for juvenile offender. 16 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay aside. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 18 bill aside. 19 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 20 1151, by Senator Johnson, Senate Print 6353, an 21 act to amend the Transportation Law, in relation 22 to granting the Department of Transportation the 23 power to assist certain employers. 5602 1 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay aside. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 3 bill aside. 4 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 5 1210, by Senator Hoblock, Senate Print Number 6 6890, an act to amend the Election Law, in 7 relation to special ballots. 8 SENATOR HOBLOCK: Lay aside. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 10 bill aside. 11 Senator Rath, that completes the 12 calling of the non-controversial calendar. 13 SENATOR RATH: Mr. President, if 14 we could proceed to the reading of the 15 controversial calendar. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 17 will read the controversial calendar, beginning 18 with Calendar Number 860. 19 THE SECRETARY: On page 32, 20 Calendar Number 860, by Senator Volker, Senate 21 Print 6695, an act to amend the Criminal 22 Procedure Law, in relation to designating 23 evidence and property control specialists. 5603 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 2 will read the last section. 3 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 4 act shall take effect immediately. 5 SENATOR GOLD: Senator Volker 6 yield to a question? 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 8 Volker, do you yield to a question from Senator 9 Gold? 10 SENATOR VOLKER: Senator Gold. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 12 Senator yields. 13 SENATOR GOLD: Senator, would you 14 do me one favor. There's a memo in opposition, 15 I think, from the city of New York. 16 SENATOR VOLKER: Senator, in all 17 candor, someone else mentioned that to me. We 18 do not have it. 19 SENATOR GOLD: Senator, do you 20 think you could give me just one day on this 21 until Monday, would you mind? 22 SENATOR VOLKER: Sure. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 5604 1 bill aside for the day. 2 Secretary will continue to call 3 the controversial calendar. 4 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 6 Gold, why do you rise? 7 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President, 8 yesterday I was called away on business and I'd 9 like the record to indicate that had I been 10 here, I would have voted "no" on Calendar Number 11 314, Senate Bill Number 213, by the 12 distinguished gentleman, Senator Holland, and 13 also on Calendar 701, Senate 1984, by that 14 distinguished Brooklynite, Senator DiCarlo. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 16 Gold, the record will reflect that had you been 17 here yesterday when the roll calls were taken on 18 Calendar Number 314 and Calendar Number 701, you 19 would have voted in the negative. 20 Secretary will continue to call 21 the controversial calendar. 22 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 23 861, by Senator Volker, Senate Print Number 5605 1 6761-B, an act to amend the Penal Law, in 2 relation to drug-free school grounds. 3 SENATOR VOLKER: Mr. President. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 5 Volker. 6 SENATOR VOLKER: The explanation 7 was requested in a whisper here to me. 8 This bill is a follow-up of the 9 drug-free school zone bill that we passed here, 10 I think last year, I don't remember for sure, or 11 maybe it was earlier in the year. 12 At any rate, it includes, in 13 addition to the schools, it was pointed out to 14 us that as part of school complexes there are 15 day care centers, pre-kindergarten and 16 kindergarten centers, as well as nursery 17 schools. What this bill does is basically 18 include those in the legislation or this amends 19 that legislation to include all those areas that 20 are traditionally considered to be part of the 21 school situation today, and that's what this 22 bill does. 23 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President. 5606 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 2 Paterson. 3 SENATOR PATERSON: Unfortunately, 4 we had a circumstance in my district about a 5 year and a half ago where a four-year-old was 6 actually threatened by drug dealers because the 7 four-year-old pointed out who the drug dealers 8 were to the police. So - 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 10 Paterson, you asking Senator Volker to yield to 11 a question? 12 SENATOR PATERSON: I was going to 13 tell him about this, and then I was going to ask 14 him to yield. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: All 16 right, fine. Senator Paterson, there's a lot of 17 activity, lot of motion, couple of Senators 18 taking a nap here. I'm just kidding. I'm just 19 kidding. Ask the Secretary, the Sergeant-at 20 Arms, could you shut the air conditioner off and 21 let's quiet down in the chamber so Senator 22 Paterson can be heard. 23 Senator Paterson. 5607 1 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President, 2 would Senator Volker yield for a question? 3 Senator, do you think that this 4 -- some of the legislation is becoming somewhat 5 superfluous since -- excuse me, in the greater 6 amount of cases, we're not seeing the same 7 situations for toddlers who are pretty much 8 being brought to school by their parents, and 9 day care centers, the children being dropped off 10 and picked up, so you're not having the kind of 11 intimidation that you would have when teenagers 12 are going to school and which is the original 13 intent of the drug-free zone for schools, and in 14 New York City the circumstance rises to a level 15 where you have pretty much covered every square 16 inch of New York City. 17 I'm not saying that there's 18 anything wrong with the bill, and I will vote 19 for the bill, but we're just raising the 20 question of about what maybe we just might want 21 to do is just raise the count for the actual 22 offense rather than setting up a special type of 23 legislation that's going to apply in some 5608 1 districts and in some areas to the -- almost the 2 entire region. 3 SENATOR VOLKER: Senator, I 4 frankly don't necessarily -- I don't disagree 5 with you. The problem is, though, that in the 6 area of criminal justice these days, perception 7 is so much, frankly, a part of the law, and 8 there seems to be an inclination on the part of 9 some people, if you name an area and if you say 10 this area absolutely needs to be protected, the 11 chances -- and I guess I'm being brutally frank 12 -- the chances of you being able to pass 13 legislation that covers that area specifically 14 is far better than doing a general bill which, 15 in all honesty, I would probably prefer, that in 16 effect would cover the area plus. 17 Now, the reason -- and, frankly, 18 your reaction to this legislation is about the 19 same that I had when I first thought -- I 20 thought, well, maybe it's a little bit overkill 21 except that when it was pointed out to me and 22 you just pointed out one of the incidents that 23 have occurred in New York City, and I understand 5609 1 they've occurred in Westchester, that there have 2 been a number of incidents involving 3 pre-kindergarten places or nursery schools that 4 are right adjacent to schools, and the people 5 who proposed this legislation have said that the 6 reason they want it is, in effect, to use the 7 same criteria for all of the entities that are 8 involved in school proper and because so many of 9 the schools today -- and you and I know probably 10 better than most people who criticize education, 11 but don't seem to realize that educators today 12 are parents almost. I mean, in fact, they are 13 parents because, in many cases, unfortunately 14 the kids don't have parents or parents that 15 don't care sometimes, and there have been - 16 these schools have become virtually the only 17 places where kids are taken care of and, in some 18 cases, fed, and almost and in some cases, 19 clothed, but, of course, it's an invitation for 20 people to prey on them, and what this 21 legislation is designed to do is, in effect, 22 hook in the entire areas of schools and include 23 it under the protections of the drug-free school 5610 1 zones. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 3 Paterson. 4 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, 5 Senator Volker. 6 Mr. President, on the bill. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 8 Paterson, on the bill. 9 SENATOR PATERSON: Senator 10 Volker, the only thing probably that surpassed 11 the horror of drug dealers threatening a 12 four-year-old child, in my opinion, is the fact 13 that the child was able to point out who they 14 were to the police. That there would be that 15 level of understanding at such a pure age is a 16 harsh commentary on our times and is perhaps the 17 reason why we have a lot of our criminal justice 18 legislation more or less driven by the 19 perceptions of what we would like to protect as 20 opposed to often the actual law enforcement that 21 we can provide. 22 I just feel, and I am voting for 23 the legislation, Mr. President, but I just feel 5611 1 that we've got to be careful that we don't 2 mislead the public. I think Senator Volker 3 thought this out very readily and, if this is 4 his determination, I'm certainly willing to 5 follow his lead and go along with it, but I just 6 think perhaps in other bills we have to be 7 careful that we are not playing to the public 8 more than really providing workable, sensible, 9 achievable legislation that would enure to our 10 benefit in terms of the administration of law 11 enforcement or such as in this bill in terms of 12 the calibration of the offense and the type of 13 justice that will be meted out to an offender. 14 I think that this bill is 15 probably all right, but I am feeling that I see 16 a lot of pieces of legislation come across this 17 desk in which we are probably playing more to 18 the perceptions than we are to actually 19 providing workable remedies. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 21 will read the last section. 22 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 23 act shall take effect on the 1st day of 5612 1 September. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 3 roll. 4 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 5 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 7 is passed. 8 Secretary will continue to call 9 the controversial calendar. 10 SENATOR HOLLAND: Mr. President. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 12 Holland, why do you rise? 13 SENATOR HOLLAND: Mr. President, 14 I know that we don't do this all the time, but 15 I'd like to make an exception here as sometimes 16 has been done in the past and welcome a group of 17 gentlemen up above my head. It's the New York 18 State Supreme Court Officers Association. 19 They're visiting Albany and educating us a 20 little bit, and they do a very difficult and 21 sometimes dangerous job. I know this to be a 22 fact because my son is a member of that group 23 and we wish to welcome them here to Albany 5613 1 today. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 3 Holland, thank you for bringing that to our 4 attention. We're always willing and pleased to 5 welcome members -- members of their family to 6 the chamber and certainly a distinguished group 7 of supreme court officers. 8 Thank you for being here. Thank 9 you for taking time to join with us and keep up 10 the good work. 11 Secretary will continue to call 12 the controversial calendar. 13 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 14 891, by Senator Maziarz, Senate Print Number 15 6450, an act to amend the Executive Law, the 16 State Administrative Procedure Act and the 17 Legislative Law, in relation to creating the 18 Governor's Office of Regulatory Reform. 19 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 21 Maziarz, an explanation of Calendar Number 891 22 has been asked for by the Acting Minority 23 Leader, Senator Paterson. 5614 1 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Thank you, Mr. 2 President. 3 Mr. President, this bill creates 4 the Governor's Office of Regulatory Reform and 5 provides for its powers and duties. Presently 6 this office is regulated under the -- I'm sorry, 7 is created under an executive order, and by 8 creating such an office it would provide a 9 comprehensive clearing house for business permit 10 information, new and simplified procedures for 11 applications, a review of existing and proposed 12 regulations and other coordinated activities 13 that would directly address the problems 14 business has with permits and other regulatory 15 difficulties within the state. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 17 Paterson. 18 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr. 19 President. 20 If Senator Maziarz would yield 21 for a question. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 23 Maziarz, do you yield? 5615 1 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Yes, Mr. 2 President. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 4 yields. 5 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr. 6 President. 7 First, I'd like to add my voice 8 to those -- to lend my voice which wasn't 9 working earlier, but to those who are welcoming 10 the Supreme Court Officers and also the 11 volunteer firefighters this morning. 12 And now, Senator Maziarz, I don't 13 have any problem with the office. I just have a 14 little problem with this piece of legislation 15 because you just said it was created by a 16 Governor's executive order. 17 So my question is very simple: 18 What do we need the legislation for? 19 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Senator, I 20 think we need the legislation because the 21 executive order is extremely brief and very thin 22 in its guidelines. For instance, as you are 23 aware, I was recently appointed as chairman of 5616 1 the Senate's Administrative Regulatory Review 2 Commission, and also there was a new chairperson 3 of the Assembly appointed to the Assembly's 4 Administrative Regulatory Review Commission, and 5 in the executive order does not provide for 6 agencies or for the Governor's Office of 7 Regulatory Reform to have our joint committee 8 review proposed regulations from the agencies. 9 So in order for us to do our job effectively, I 10 insisted that this be included in this 11 particular legislation. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 13 Paterson. 14 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, 15 Senator Maziarz. 16 Mr. President, on the bill. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 18 Paterson, on the bill. 19 SENATOR PATERSON: Again, Mr. 20 President, I just don't understand what we're 21 doing here which does not mean that it isn't 22 right nor does it mean that it may not even be 23 effective, but I would think that when we are 5617 1 creating an office, that we have a good idea of 2 why we're creating an office. 3 I don't understand why we create 4 an office, and then we -- we introduce 5 legislation later on after the office is being 6 created, to establish what it does. I thought 7 that the way regulation works is that that's 8 done in reverse, so I don't have a problem with 9 the fact that we're doing it. I just feel that 10 it's done in reverse order. It would have been 11 far more foresighted, in my opinion, had the 12 general and specific duties of this office been 13 laid out in the very beginning, and I think that 14 is often what is causing us to take more time to 15 discharge our duties than we actually need to, 16 and since I think I've explained this to my own 17 satisfaction, even if I'm the only one here who 18 feels that way, I guess I've used enough time as 19 well. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 21 will read the last section. 22 Oh, Senator Dollinger. 23 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Senator 5618 1 Maziarz yield to a couple questions? 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 3 Maziarz, will you yield to Senator Dollinger? 4 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Sure. 5 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Senator, is 6 it my understanding that this bill extends the 7 authority of the Governor's Office of Permits 8 and Regulatory Assistance? 9 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Yes. 10 SENATOR DOLLINGER: That 11 authority expired almost five months ago, did it 12 not? 13 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Yes. 14 SENATOR DOLLINGER: I guess my 15 question is, how did the group that's supposedly 16 bird-dogging all these regulations allow itself 17 to go out of business and didn't realize that 18 its own regulatory authority had been suspended 19 at the end of last year? 20 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Well, you had 21 the executive order continuing the office, 22 Senator. 23 SENATOR DOLLINGER: It was the 5619 1 executive order continued it? 2 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Yes. 3 SENATOR DOLLINGER: But the state 4 Legislature allowed it to expire; nobody came to 5 us and asked us beforehand to extend it last 6 year. 7 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Well, I 8 introduced this bill, Senator, much earlier this 9 year. 10 SENATOR DOLLINGER: I guess 11 that's one of the - 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Are you 13 asking Senator Maziarz to continue to yield, 14 Senator Dollinger? 15 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Yes, Mr. 16 President. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: I hate to 18 be left out of this triad here, Senator. 19 SENATOR DOLLINGER: I know, Mr. 20 President. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 22 Maziarz, you continue to yield? 23 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Yes, I do, Mr. 5620 1 President. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 3 yields. 4 SENATOR DOLLINGER: When did you 5 become aware, Senator, that the statutory 6 authority for the regulatory office had expired? 7 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Late last year, 8 Senator. 9 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Right, and 10 it's now - 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: You 12 continue to yield, Senator Maziarz? 13 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Yes, I do, Mr. 14 President. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 16 continues to yield. 17 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Thank you, 18 Mr. President. 19 And now it's the 22nd of May and 20 we're finally getting around to extending its 21 authority. 22 SENATOR MAZIARZ: That's correct. 23 SENATOR DOLLINGER: One other 5621 1 question. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 3 Maziarz, do you continue to yield? 4 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Yes, I do, Mr. 5 President. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 7 continues to yield. 8 SENATOR DOLLINGER: The statute 9 talks about -- well, I have two questions. Let 10 me ask the first one. In the description of the 11 charge that the Legislature gives, it says that 12 the proliferation of state agency rules impose a 13 burden on the people of this state. Could you 14 tell me, are those burdens derived from 15 legislation passed by this Legislature? 16 SENATOR MAZIARZ: For the most 17 part, I would say no, not this particular 18 Legislature, not this particular house of the 19 Legislature, but primarily from the other house, 20 but mostly I would say from the various state 21 agencies often when they promulgate rules and 22 regulations that conflict with each other. 23 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Again through 5622 1 you, Mr. President, just to clarify. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 3 Maziarz, you continue to yield? 4 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Yes, I do, Mr. 5 President. 6 SENATOR DOLLINGER: But, in fact, 7 all those burdens are a result of legislation 8 that was passed by this house as well because, 9 of course, they don't get to be laws unless the 10 Senate Majority puts them on the calendar and 11 the entire Senate passes them, so all those 12 burdens find their origin right here in this 13 room, isn't that correct? 14 SENATOR MAZIARZ: No, I didn't 15 say that, Senator, and that's not the way I 16 feel. You asked me my opinion. I feel that the 17 ones that are the problem are the ones passed by 18 the other house of the Legislature. I think 19 that the members, all the members of this 20 particular house are very clear thinking and 21 that they would not burden either the people of 22 this state or the business of this state with 23 cumbersome or difficult regulations. 5623 1 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Again through 2 you, Mr. President. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 4 Maziarz, you continue to yield? 5 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Yes, I do. 6 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Senator, I'm 7 just trying to understand. Are you saying that 8 the Assembly can make laws all by itself because 9 that seems to be what you're suggesting is that 10 the Assembly creates all those burdensome rules 11 and the Senate never creates burdensome rules? I 12 mean that's what I understand you to say. 13 SENATOR MAZIARZ: No, that's not 14 what I said, Senator. 15 SENATOR DOLLINGER: O.K. Let me 16 ask you one other technical question. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 18 Maziarz continue to yield? 19 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Yes, I do, Mr. 20 President. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 22 continues to yield. 23 SENATOR DOLLINGER: In the 5624 1 section of the bill that talks about the master 2 hearings, this bill sets up a process by which 3 the Office of Permits and Business Review will 4 assist in the applications. It will provide 5 conceptual assistance. It will provide 6 technical assistance, and then it says that they 7 will bring together in a master hearing all of 8 the state agencies that need to conduct hearings 9 and that this office will preside at those 10 hearings. 11 Doesn't this bill make this 12 office both the prosecutor, the defense and the 13 judge and jury in what happens in the permit 14 process, and isn't that an over-extension of the 15 powers that we want to have vested in any state 16 authority? 17 SENATOR MAZIARZ: I don't believe 18 so, Senator. I think what that does is, it 19 makes the process go much more smoothly and much 20 more comprehensive when you're dealing with all 21 those state agencies. 22 Now, Senator, if I could just use 23 by way of example, last Friday you and I toured 5625 1 an extremely well run, I think, company in the 2 Rochester area and, you know probably in going 3 through that building the different state 4 agencies that would have been involved - 5 Department of Labor, DEC, Department of Health 6 certainly. You know, I think that rather than 7 that particular company or a company like that 8 -- I don't use that as an example -- having to 9 go and getting them to sit down individually, 10 that to get them into a room to sit down 11 collectively and somebody has to, I think, chair 12 that procedure in order to keep those agencies 13 talking to each other. 14 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Again through 15 you, Mr. President. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 17 Maziarz, you continue to yield? 18 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Yes, I do, Mr. 19 President. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 21 continues to yield. 22 SENATOR DOLLINGER: But the due 23 process seems to assume that somewhere in the 5626 1 administrative process there will be a fair 2 hearing in which all sides will air their views 3 about business permits or business authorities 4 and that one of the indicia of a fair hearing is 5 an impartial tribunal. 6 How can you have an impartial 7 tribunal when the Office of Business Permits has 8 already met with the business and assisted them 9 in the technical advice which I think is a good 10 idea, it's already approved their conceptual 11 plan. It's already brought everybody together, 12 and the very same persons provided all that 13 assistance to the permit applicant is now 14 sitting there as the judge who is going to 15 preside in the case? 16 How do we meet the requirements 17 of an impartial tribunal when, in essence, what 18 we're doing is giving all this authority to one 19 person in one department? 20 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Well, I think 21 that their charge here is to speed the process 22 up, to make it more clearly defined. I think at 23 some times when you're dealing with a particular 5627 1 agency that that agency may be very parochial in 2 nature, and the Department of Health, let's say, 3 is only considered with health issues. They 4 don't worry about the DEC side of it, the 5 Department of Labor side of it, Senator. 6 I don't know, I'm not pre 7 disposed to think that these people would be 8 unfair at all. Our former governor thought very 9 highly of this particular office. 10 SENATOR DOLLINGER: O.K. Just one 11 final question, through you, Mr. President. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 13 Maziarz, you continue to yield to one question? 14 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Yes, I do, Mr. 15 President. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 17 continues to yield. 18 SENATOR DOLLINGER: This will be 19 my last point. Do you have any report from the 20 Office of Business Permits that shows what 21 regulations they have actually changed in the 22 year and a half that, in this administration, 23 this organization has been working? I know 5628 1 there's been been a lot of talk about earth 2 quakes in buildings but, to my knowledge, the 3 only ones that have been changed were those that 4 involved DEET. 5 Have any other regulations been 6 changed? Do you have anything to that effect? 7 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Yes, I do, 8 Senator. I don't have it with me, but I will 9 forward it to your office. 10 SENATOR DOLLINGER: All right. 11 Could you tell me what those regulations are 12 that have been actually changed or altered and 13 the process improved? 14 SENATOR MAZIARZ: No, not with 15 me, the list. 16 SENATOR DOLLINGER: On the bill, 17 Mr. President. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 19 Dollinger, on the bill. 20 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr. 21 President, I've raised what I think is more than 22 just a technical objection to the concept of 23 administrative hearings. This bill, it seems to 5629 1 me, could come close if not step over the line 2 of due process, and the due process requires 3 that there be impartial tribunals and that, as 4 part of those impartial tribunals you don't have 5 one person be advocating for the business, be 6 applying the compliance review, do all the 7 conceptual review, and then stand there as the 8 judge and jury when the decision has to be made 9 about whether the permit is going to be issued. 10 I have no problem with providing 11 businesses with assistance. I have no problem 12 providing a business applicant with conceptual 13 review and all those other aspects, but it seems 14 to me this may be a flaw in this bill if we 15 centralize too much authority. 16 However, because I know the 17 regulatory director, I'm prepared to let it go 18 for a year at least to see what happens, see 19 whether the process continues to bear fruit. 20 I'd point out, I guess, I'm astounded that 21 through all those maze of regulations that he's 22 supposedly working on, he didn't check the 23 regulation that extends his authority from the 5630 1 state Legislature and, sure enough, we're 2 actually doing it five months after it expires. 3 Maybe sometimes you find those 4 burdensome regulations are right under your nose 5 rather than out in those other agencies, so I'm 6 going to give it another crack, but I'm at least 7 skeptical about whether this is going to produce 8 the kinds of benefits in the long run that the 9 bill envisions. 10 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President. 11 SENATOR DOLLINGER: I'll be 12 voting in favor, Mr. President. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 14 Gold. 15 SENATOR GOLD: Yeah. Would the 16 sponsor yield to just one question? 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 18 Maziarz, do you yield to Senator Gold? 19 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Yes, I do. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 21 yields. 22 SENATOR GOLD: Yeah. I don't 23 know whether this was asked, but just very 5631 1 briefly, it was pointed out to me by my dis 2 tinguished colleague from Buffalo. This says it 3 shall be deemed that the act shall have been in 4 full force and effect since January, and maybe 5 you could just explain that. 6 Were there some actions taken 7 that may not have been legal, or why is that 8 language in there? 9 SENATOR MAZIARZ: The only 10 actions that have been taken are those covered 11 under the executive order, Senator. 12 SENATOR GOLD: Well, that's what 13 I'm trying to find out: Why is it important to 14 have that language? Why is it in there? Why 15 would it be important to have that? 16 SENATOR MAZIARZ: I think just a 17 continuation of the office from when it expired 18 at the end of 1995. I don't think it's meant to 19 put anything -- you know, to legitimize anything 20 that was done. 21 SENATOR GOLD: Well, if the 22 Senator would yield to one more question. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 5632 1 Maziarz? 2 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Yes. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 4 yields. 5 SENATOR GOLD: We, on very many 6 occasions, without a big fanfare legalize 7 actions of towns that may -- they thought they 8 had authority and whatever, and that doesn't 9 bother most of us. 10 What I'm curious about is the 11 office ended, you're saying, with December 12 31st. 13 SENATOR MAZIARZ: December 31st 14 of 1995, Senator. 15 SENATOR GOLD: Right, so if - 16 this talks about January 1st, '96 through now, 17 and all I'm saying is, in other words, there has 18 been in operation a department unauthorized and 19 acting in doing things. That's what you're 20 saying. 21 SENATOR MAZIARZ: I don't know if 22 you would say unauthorized, Senator. It is 23 authorized under an executive order. 5633 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 2 Gold. 3 SENATOR GOLD: Well, my last 4 question, and this is just a technical question 5 and I'm going to vote for it. I don't care 6 which way you go, but I'm just pointing this 7 out. Do you think there should be language some 8 place in the bill which says something to the 9 effect that any actions taken by, and name the 10 group, under executive order, will be continued 11 or deemed legalized or whatever? I don't know 12 whether there's anything that would be affected, 13 whether there's going to be any court cases. 14 There may be nothing, but just from the drafting 15 point of view, maybe there should be something 16 in the bill which explains that continuity. 17 SENATOR MAZIARZ: I think it's 18 already in there, Senator. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 20 will read the last section. 21 Senator Leichter. 22 SENATOR LEICHTER: Yes, Senator 23 Maziarz. 5634 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 2 Maziarz, you yield to a question from Senator 3 Leichter? 4 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Yes, I do. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 6 yields. 7 SENATOR LEICHTER: How many 8 members -- I'm sorry. 9 SENATOR BRUNO: I'm sorry for 10 interrupting, Mr. President. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Yes. 12 SENATOR BRUNO: Would you indulge 13 me. 14 I was told that that was the last 15 speaker, and I didn't want to interrupt. I 16 thought we were moving to a vote because what I 17 have in mind is to ask that we stand at ease and 18 call an immediate Conference of the Majority and 19 then resume where we are, but if we were closing 20 down, then I was just going to wait a few 21 minutes. 22 SENATOR LEICHTER: Very brief. 23 SENATOR BRUNO: O.K. Yes, Mr. 5635 1 President, we certainly can be indulgent in this 2 chamber. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 4 Leichter, a question of Senator Maziarz. 5 SENATOR LEICHTER: Senator 6 Maziarz, how many people are there in this 7 Office of Regulatory Review? 8 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Approximately 9 40, Senator. 10 SENATOR LEICHTER: And what is 11 the budget, annual budget, for this office? 12 SENATOR MAZIARZ: I don't have 13 that figure offhand, Senator, but I am told that 14 it is less than it was under the prior 15 administration. 16 SENATOR LEICHTER: And, Senator, 17 do you know how much the budget for this office 18 in the -- in the executive budget for the year 19 1996-1997 is? 20 SENATOR MAZIARZ: No, I do not, 21 Senator. 22 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President, 23 just very briefly on the bill. 5636 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 2 Leichter, on the bill. 3 SENATOR LEICHTER: I understand 4 the Majority Leader wishes to call a 5 Conference. Let me just say I -- you know, part 6 of the problem I have with this bill is that 7 it's like the Governor saying, you know, "I 8 don't -- I'm not -- I'm not the Governor. I 9 don't have the powers, so please give me the 10 power over my own Executive Department." 11 Why didn't the Governor at the 12 present time -- he controls all these agencies. 13 He appoints their heads. I mean it's sort of 14 part of this distancing of the very people who 15 run government from government. We're running 16 against government, like the Legislature, Oh, 17 not me. I mean Senator Maziarz says, Oh, I had 18 nothing to do -- this Senate had nothing to do 19 with all these burdensome regulations. 20 Who passed it? Of course, it was 21 the Senate and the Assembly. The Governor says, 22 Oh, it's terrible, these agencies. They're - 23 they're delaying permits. They're delaying 5637 1 regulations. Wait a second, who's in charge? He 2 runs the Executive Department. He has all these 3 powers right now relating to the rules. 4 I just question, one, the 5 expense. Is it worth having this office? Do you 6 really need it? Secondly, aren't you just 7 adding another layer of bureaucracy because now 8 when a rule is issued or a permit is applied for 9 there may be instances now you've got to go to 10 the Office of Regulatory Review. That's going 11 to take more time. 12 I pointed out that we have a 13 budgetary expense. Now we've got an office of 14 40 people. I don't know, maybe 10 years from 15 now they'll set up another office to review the 16 work of the Office of Regulatory Review which is 17 reviewing the work of the agencies. 18 I just question whether we're not 19 really making government more cumbersome, more 20 expensive and -- and shedding our responsibility 21 and our accountability. 22 I'm going to vote against this 23 bill. 5638 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 2 will read the last section. 3 THE SECRETARY: Section 12. This 4 act shall take effect immediately. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 6 roll. 7 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce 9 the results. 10 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 52, nays 11 one, Senator Leichter recorded in the negative. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair 13 recognizes Senator Bruno. 14 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, 15 can we stand at ease, and I ask that the 16 Republican members join me in conference in Room 17 332. 18 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President. 19 SENATOR BRUNO: And the time 20 frame that we're talking about here at ease 21 somewhere in the neighborhood of 45 minutes. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 23 actually was passed. 5639 1 Senator Leichter. 2 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President, 3 just while the Majority Leader is on his feet, 4 Senator, is this an open conference? I know you 5 had one open conference with a lot of fanfare at 6 the beginning of the year, and I've been waiting 7 for you to invite me and the press and the media 8 in to more meaningful conferences like the one 9 that you're about to have? 10 SENATOR BRUNO: Thank you, 11 Senator. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 13 Senate stands at ease. 14 SENATOR BRUNO: While the 15 Majority has been waiting, I have been waiting 16 for you to open your Conference for one time as 17 we did, so that we could then continue the 18 process, and that has not happened yet. So 19 we're at ease. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senate 21 stands at ease. 22 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President, 23 I'd like to the Majority Leader to know that we 5640 1 did open a conference and nobody came. 2 (The Senate stood at east from 3 12:00 Noon until 12:50 p.m.) 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 5 Senate will come to order. 6 Senator Skelos. 7 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, 8 if we could return to motions and resolutions, I 9 believe there's a resolution at the desk by 10 Senator Seabrook. I'd ask that the title be 11 read and move for its adoption. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is 13 a privileged resolution at the desk. We'll 14 return to motions and resolutions. 15 The Secretary will read the title 16 to the privileged resolution. 17 THE SECRETARY: By Senator 18 Seabrook, Legislative Resolution commending Iris 19 W. King, mayor of Jamaica, West Indies. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 21 question is on the resolution. All those in 22 favor signify by saying aye. 23 (Response of "Aye".) 5641 1 Opposed, nay. 2 (There was no response.) 3 The resolution is adopted. 4 Senator Skelos. 5 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, 6 if we could go back to the controversial 7 calendar, regular order. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 9 Secretary will continue to call the 10 controversial calendar. 11 THE SECRETARY: On page 40, 12 Calendar Number 929, by Senator Goodman, Senate 13 Print 6416, an act to amend the Local Finance 14 Law, in relation to the sale of bonds and notes 15 of the city of New York. 16 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 18 Gold. 19 SENATOR GOLD: Yeah. Will 20 Senator Goodman yield to a question? 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 22 Goodman, do you yield to a question from Senator 23 Gold? 5642 1 SENATOR GOODMAN: Yes. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 3 Senator yields. 4 SENATOR GOLD: Yeah. Senator 5 Goodman, can you tell me what this bill has to 6 do with the fact that Deanna Greer, who is the 7 daughter of William T. Greer, is going to 8 graduate this Saturday from Cornell Veterinarian 9 School and we should all be very proud of that? 10 SENATOR GOODMAN: I can only say 11 to you, sir, that to the extent that this bill 12 affects that, it's a celebratory event and 13 something which brings much happiness to the 14 hearts of all of Mr. Greer's friends and 15 admirers and best wishes to his daughter. 16 SENATOR GOLD: That's what I 17 thought. 18 Thank you. 19 SENATOR GOODMAN: You're welcome. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 21 Secretary will read the last section. 22 THE SECRETARY: Section 7. This 23 act shall take effect immediately. 5643 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 2 roll. 3 (The Secretary called the roll.) 4 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 53. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 6 is passed. 7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 8 942, by Senator Rath, Senate Print 7364, an act 9 to amend the Real Property Tax Law and the Real 10 Property Law, in relation to the taxation of 11 converted condominium units. 12 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 14 Gold. 15 SENATOR GOLD: During the recess, 16 the many merits of this bill were explained to 17 me, and I would withdraw my objection. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 19 Secretary will read the last section. 20 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 21 act shall take effect immediately. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 23 roll. 5644 1 (The Secretary called the roll.) 2 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 53. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 4 is passed. 5 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 6 996, by Senator DiCarlo, Senate Print 5584, an 7 act to amend the General Business Law, in 8 relation to the sale and rental of films. 9 SENATOR ONORATO: Explanation. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 11 DiCarlo, an explanation of Calendar Number 996 12 has been asked for by the Acting Minority 13 Leader, Senator Onorato. 14 SENATOR GOLD: Thank you, Mr. 15 President. 16 This bill amends the General 17 Business Law to prohibit a library from lending 18 an 'R' or 'NC' 17 or other similarly rated film 19 to a minor unless the parent or guardian has 20 consented in writing. The parent only has to 21 consent once in person and then the library can 22 keep that on file. A violation of this section 23 is punishable by a civil penalty of not more 5645 1 than $100. 2 This bill came about probably as 3 most good legislation comes about by concerned 4 constituents and concerned parents in my 5 community. It was brought to my attention that 6 our local libraries had on the shelves not just 7 educational videos but they also had movies 8 which are often seen in our local movie 9 theatres. 10 The problem we have with that and 11 the parents have with that is that the type of 12 movie that is now on the shelves in a lot of the 13 libraries in the state of New York are movies 14 such as "Natural Born Killers", "Pulp Fiction" 15 and other 'R' rated movies. 16 I was amazed to find out that 17 there are absolutely no restrictions on children 18 going into movie theatres -- going into 19 libraries, rather, and bringing home 'R' rated 20 movies. I find that intolerable. I find that 21 wrong, and that's one of the reasons that this 22 bill is before us today. 23 I don't usually -- or I like to 5646 1 think that newspapers are often right, but I 2 would just put on the record that the Times 3 Union did an excellent editorial recently, and 4 I'll read briefly from it. Quote, "The idea 5 that some videos are not suitable for viewing by 6 children is hardly radical. On the contrary. 7 It is the height of common sense. Who really 8 can argue with it? Do the librarians oppose 9 this bill -- who oppose this bill think children 10 should be able to walk into neighborhood 11 libraries and borrow for two days movies 12 depicting graphic sexual act, bestiality and 13 so-called snuff films? Is that what the 14 librarians would have us do in this 15 Legislature?" 16 From the Daily Gazette in 17 Schenectady, "In an attempt to be all things to 18 all people, public libraries lately have been 19 adding more movie videos to their collections, 20 and they aren't just classics like Hamlet or 21 animated Disney films for kids but 'R' rated 22 titles. Even if one has no problem with 23 libraries spending scarce money on such 5647 1 materials, one should be concerned about 2 policies that let underaged children borrow them 3 without their parents' consent. 4 "A bill in both houses of the 5 Legislature would require libraries to get 6 parental approval before lending these movies to 7 children under 17, and it deserves passage." 8 A quote also from this editorial, 9 "Libraries are taxpayer-supported 10 institutions. While the decision ultimately 11 lies with parents, public policy ought to be 12 that children shouldn't be watching such 13 movies." 14 Now, this seems to be a very 15 common sense piece of legislation. I don't 16 understand why the Library Association of the 17 state of New York is taking such a strong 18 position opposed to this bill, but the bill 19 makes sense. It's the right thing to do in this 20 state, and let me also say that the taxpayers of 21 the state of New York this year are funding the 22 libraries in the state of New York to the tune 23 of $81.4 million. The libraries in this state 5648 1 have an obligation to the taxpayers and to the 2 parents and to the children of the state of New 3 York, and I would urge this bill's passage. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 5 Secretary will read the last section. 6 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This 7 act shall take effect immediately. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 9 roll. 10 (The Secretary called the roll.) 11 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 53. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 13 is passed. 14 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 15 1092, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 3065, an 16 act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law, the 17 Penal Law and the Family Court Act, in relation 18 to making persons 12 to 15 years of age eligible 19 for juvenile offender. 20 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Explanation. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 22 Larkin, an explanation of Calendar Number 1092 23 has been asked for by the Acting Minority 5649 1 Leader, Senator Stachowski. 2 SENATOR LARKIN: Mr. President, 3 this bill adds burglary of a dwelling to the 4 list of designated felony acts under the Family 5 Court Act when the burglary is committed by a 6 person of ages 12 to 15. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 8 Larkin, do you yield to a question from Senator 9 Stachowski? 10 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Actually, 11 Catherine had a couple of questions. Could we 12 hold this one for last? 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Any 14 problems with that, Senator Larkin? 15 (Senator Larkin shakes head.) 16 Lay the bill aside temporarily. 17 The Secretary will continue to 18 call the controversial calendar. 19 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 20 1151, by Senator Johnson, Senate Print 6353, an 21 act to amend the Transportation Law, in relation 22 to granting the Department of Transportation the 23 power to assist certain employers. 5650 1 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Explanation. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 3 Johnson, an explanation of Calendar Number 1151 4 has been asked for by Senator Stachowski. 5 SENATOR JOHNSON: The Clean Air 6 Act bill that we passed in 1993 had a mandate 7 for employer trip reduction programs for any 8 employer of 100 or more people. That was 9 included in there because it was a federal 10 mandate, and we carried through on the state 11 level. The federal government has eliminated 12 that mandate, said if you want to do it, do it. 13 If you don't, don't. So we're doing the same 14 thing. 15 We're saying that the state shall 16 be helpful. DEC, Economic Development, Motor 17 Vehicles will cooperate and help any employers 18 who would like to do a trip reduction program, 19 car pooling program for their employees. It is 20 not required to do so. This bill has an awful 21 lot of support, including the Business Council, 22 the Association of Counties, many other groups 23 and individuals as well who find it inconvenient 5651 1 or impossible to do. 2 I might say one of the 3 interesting things about the program was that 4 though the counties were mandated and the 5 employees were mandated to file all their 6 paperwork to show how they were going to do 7 this, there was no real requirement that it ever 8 be accomplished, and the amount of clean air 9 reduction was very minimal, and the DEC has 10 assured us that they can make up that small 11 amount of air quality improvement in other ways 12 without any particular imposition on any more 13 businesses. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 15 Secretary will read the last section. 16 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 18 Leichter. 19 SENATOR LEICHTER: Yeah. Would 20 Senator Johnson yield, please? 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 22 Johnson, do you yield? 23 SENATOR JOHNSON: Yes, Mr. 5652 1 President. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 3 Senator yields. 4 SENATOR LEICHTER: Thank you. 5 Senator, as I understand it - 6 please tell me if I'm correct -- you're making 7 voluntary a program that is now mandatory, is 8 that correct? 9 SENATOR JOHNSON: That's correct. 10 SENATOR LEICHTER: And isn't the 11 current program which is mandatory part of the 12 efforts of the state of New York to meet federal 13 clean air standards which in parts of New York 14 State, as you know, are not in compliance with 15 federal law? 16 SENATOR JOHNSON: That's correct. 17 SENATOR LEICHTER: And, 18 therefore, Senator, would not your bill deter 19 and impede New York State's compliance with 20 federal law? 21 SENATOR JOHNSON: The federal law 22 has changed. Therefore, we don't have this 23 mandate from the federal government. Yes, we 5653 1 still have other clean air standards to achieve, 2 and I would say this, that -- you probably heard 3 my explanation where everyone was required - 4 the employees over 100 were required to file a 5 plan. The counties were required to coordinate 6 it, but there was no requirement that that 7 plan's objectives ever be achieved and so, 8 therefore, was no guarantee that there would be 9 any particular saving. 10 In fact, Senator, you may find it 11 intriguing when I explain to you that since our 12 bill passed, more than 100,000 jobs have been 13 lost in the Long Island/Westchester area and, 14 therefore, there are many fewer cars on the 15 road. So we've already achieved the nirvana in 16 clean air. 17 SENATOR LEICHTER: Yes, Mr. 18 President. If Senator Johnson would continue to 19 yield. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 21 Johnson, do you continue to yield? 22 SENATOR JOHNSON: Yes. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 5654 1 Senator continues to yield. 2 SENATOR LEICHTER: Senator, it's 3 your position that under recent amendments to 4 the Clean Air Act, car pools could be 5 voluntary. Do I understand you correctly? 6 SENATOR JOHNSON: Yes, of 7 course. They have always been allowed to be 8 voluntary, but what the bill does now, it says 9 the county shall help an employer who wants to 10 file a plan, help him do so, help show him how 11 to do it, help him coordinate his plans. So the 12 government will be active for people who would 13 like to do it. 14 SENATOR LEICHTER: But, Senator 15 Johnson, there's no requirement in the federal 16 legislation that you make voluntary -- that you 17 make mandatory programs voluntary. We're still 18 free if we feel that in order to comply with 19 clean air standards, that a program should be 20 mandatory, that we can so require. 21 SENATOR JOHNSON: Senator, this 22 particular provision of the federal law has been 23 removed. There is no mandate to do trip 5655 1 reductions. 2 SENATOR LEICHTER: Okay. 3 SENATOR JOHNSON: The DEC has 4 said the small amount of reduction which may 5 have resulted from this will be made up in other 6 ways without any particular inconvenience. They 7 will still be in accord with the clean air plan 8 which they've filed and have to conform with. 9 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 11 Leichter. 12 SENATOR LEICHTER: Just briefly 13 on the bill. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 15 Leichter, on the bill. 16 SENATOR LEICHTER: I think 17 Senator Johnson is correct that federal mandates 18 have now been lifted, and we are free to convert 19 some of these mandatory programs into voluntary 20 programs. The question is do we wish to do 21 that? 22 I mean, it's clear to me that 23 there's no real incentive for employers to go to 5656 1 the expense and the trouble of setting up a car 2 pool system. So I don't believe a voluntary 3 program is going to work, and I just want to 4 point out that what we're dealing with is the 5 health of New Yorkers. 6 We have a terrible problem in the 7 city of New York, for instance, with asthma, 8 people who are sick. People die of asthma. 9 Their lives are seriously impaired. All of that 10 is due to the serious problem we have in air 11 quality that does not meet safe standards. 12 So we're saying that you've got 13 to compel employers to do the right things. 14 It's not a big burden. It's not a big expense, 15 but it is a big benefit to the public, which is 16 going to have better and cleaner air. 17 It's for that reason I just want 18 to point out to you that the Environmental 19 Planning Lobby or the Environmental Advocates as 20 they now call themselves has come out against 21 this bill. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 23 Oppenheimer. 5657 1 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Yes, if I 2 may. I'm going to be voting for this bill. The 3 Environmental Advocates do advocate against this 4 bill. However, we have seen -- and, of course, 5 I do support the federal Clean Air Act 6 Amendments of 1990 almost totally. However, 7 this is a unique situation that causes extreme 8 hardship and will cause extreme hardship in my 9 county, Westchester County. 10 The Employee Commute Options 11 Program which is in effect in the entire 12 metropolitan area which, of course, includes 13 Westchester County requires a reduction of 25 14 percent of the number of employees arriving at 15 the corporate headquarters that are spread 16 across Westchester County. There are other 17 means to reduce the small amount of additional 18 pollutants that would cause much less hardship. 19 We figure that it would -- this alone is 20 responsible for about one half of one percent of 21 the pollutants, and we know at the state level 22 that we will have to totally meet the mandate of 23 the federal government, and we feel that there 5658 1 are other ways to meet this one half of one 2 percent reduction. 3 The fact is it is almost 4 impossible to get our employees to the corporate 5 headquarters coming from Putnam, coming from 6 Columbia, coming from different parts of 7 Westchester County. It seems almost impossible 8 for them to get together to arrange joint 9 commuting. 10 It poses such an extreme hardship 11 that I feel the state will have -- will -- and 12 after all it is under mandate -- to look for 13 another way to meet this one half of one percent 14 pollution without causing such extreme hardship 15 to our businesses in Westchester County. 16 So I, for once, will be voting 17 against the Environmental Advocates and for the 18 businesses in Westchester who are simply having 19 an impossible time trying to meet this 20 particular mandate. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 22 Dollinger? 23 The Secretary will read the last 5659 1 section. 2 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 3 act shall take effect immediately. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 5 roll. 6 (The Secretary called the roll.) 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce 8 the results when tabulated. 9 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 10 the negative on Calendar Number 1151, Senators 11 Abate, Connor, Dollinger, Goodman, Lachman, 12 Leichter, Levy, Onorato, Paterson, Stachowski 13 and Tully. Ayes 42, nays 11. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 15 is passed. 16 The Secretary will continue to 17 call the controversial calendar. 18 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 19 1210, by Senator Hoblock, Senate Print 6890, an 20 act to amend the Election Law, in relation to 21 special ballots. 22 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Explanation. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 5660 1 Hoblock, an explanation of Calendar Number 1210 2 has been asked for by the Acting Minority 3 Leader, Senator Stachowski. 4 SENATOR HOBLOCK: Mr. President, 5 this bill adds a section to the Election Law 6 which provides for the casting of a special 7 ballot for persons who are victims of domestic 8 violence. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 10 Secretary will read the last section. 11 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 12 act shall take effect immediately. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 14 roll. 15 (The Secretary called the roll.) 16 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 53. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 18 is passed. 19 The Secretary will call Calendar 20 Number 1092. 21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 22 1092, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 3065, an 23 act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law, the 5661 1 Penal Law and the Family Court Act, in relation 2 to making persons 12 to 15 years of age eligible 3 for juvenile offender. 4 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Explanation. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 6 Larkin, an explanation has been asked for by 7 Senator Stachowski. 8 SENATOR LARKIN: Mr. President, 9 this bill adds burglary of a dwelling to a list 10 of designated felony acts. Currently, crimes 11 considered in this category are murder in the 12 first degree for age 13, kidnapping in the first 13 degree, arson in the first, manslaughter, 14 robbery in the first, robbery in the first with 15 a deadly weapon, burglary second at age 14. 16 What we're trying to do here is 17 to ensure that we can address an issue of crime, 18 crime that every day we see in the newspapers, 19 crime that the Attorney General said unless we 20 act now to stop young people from choosing a 21 life of crime, the beginning of the 21st Century 22 will be a disaster. 23 Right now what we have in this 5662 1 age group without being considered for a 2 designated felony act, the Family Court may only 3 punish the minor by designating juvenile, a 4 person in need of supervision or by granting an 5 ACD. What we want to do is to place something 6 in (b) so we can address the crimes that are 7 committed by individuals in this age group. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair 9 recognizes Senator Abate. 10 SENATOR ABATE: Yes. Senator, 11 would you yield to a question? 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 13 Larkin, do you yield to Senator Abate? 14 SENATOR LARKIN: Yes, Mr. 15 President. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 17 Senator yields. 18 SENATOR ABATE: Thank you, 19 Senator. 20 Am I correct in saying that right 21 now if a juvenile is either 12 years old, they 22 cannot be treated -- if a juvenile is 12 years 23 old, they cannot be treated as an adult under 5663 1 current law? 2 SENATOR LARKIN: That's right. 3 SENATOR ABATE: And if a juvenile 4 is 13, the only way they could be prosecuted as 5 an adult is if they're charged with murder? 6 SENATOR LARKIN: That's the way 7 the current law reads, and then the other group 8 that I read you were for the 14-year-olds. 9 SENATOR ABATE: Right. So what 10 this law would do now is prosecute 12- and 11 13-year-olds for the crime of burglary as an 12 adult. 13 SENATOR LARKIN: Yes. 14 SENATOR ABATE: There's the 15 potential for a prosecutor to pursue those cases 16 in Criminal Court. 17 SENATOR LARKIN: Senator Abate, 18 if you read the bill, it very clearly states 19 that they get three cracks at it before they're 20 into this thing. 21 The first time -- there must be 22 two prior offenses and upon the third occasion, 23 the Family Court can address this under the 5664 1 designated - 2 SENATOR ABATE: And when you say 3 "two prior occasions", is that two prior 4 arrests or two prior convictions? 5 SENATOR LARKIN: Convictions. 6 SENATOR ABATE: So placements. 7 SENATOR LARKIN: Yes. 8 SENATOR ABATE: That they have 9 been placed. 10 SENATOR LARKIN: And on the third 11 time, they can be placed in a Division for Youth 12 facility. 13 SENATOR ABATE: So if someone has 14 a prior -- no prior juvenile record and they're 15 either 12 or 13, they could not be treated as an 16 adult under your law. 17 SENATOR LARKIN: That's right. 18 SENATOR ABATE: Excuse me, 19 Senator. Obviously, Senator, you know the bill 20 better than I do, but I don't find the language 21 in the bill that talks about two prior 22 occurrences in the juvenile courts. 23 SENATOR LARKIN: In the Family 5665 1 Court Act for designated felonies, and that's 2 what we're following through on. 3 SENATOR ABATE: But is there 4 anything in the bill that says that they have to 5 have had two prior dispositions in Family Court 6 before this legislation kicks in, because I 7 didn't see anything. 8 SENATOR LARKIN: It's already in 9 the law. We're adding this added procedure - 10 or, excuse me -- part so that they will be 11 treated at the third incident. 12 SENATOR ABATE: See, I'm not 13 aware of any place in the law that says that 14 this is -- the third time someone's before 15 Family Court as a juvenile delinquent or a 16 designated juvenile offender, that they would be 17 treated as an adult the third time. 18 SENATOR LARKIN: Under the 19 current law, there is the first and second 20 incident, and the third incident is what we're 21 looking for so that the Family Court can address 22 them. Right now they can't. 23 SENATOR ABATE: But I guess if 5666 1 you're referring to another statute that would 2 allow the juvenile to now be treated as an adult 3 the third time around, I just don't know where 4 that statute is. I'm not familiar with that 5 statute in law because as you said, there's 6 nothing within this legislation that addresses 7 that issue. You're referring to already 8 existing law. 9 SENATOR LARKIN: Because all 10 we're doing, Senator Abate, is taking these 12 11 to 15-year-olds in that category and adding to 12 -- them to the existing ones that are there so 13 that when the third offense occurs, the Family 14 Court can interact and then place them. 15 SENATOR ABATE: Senator, I have 16 to plead my ignorance. Do you know where in the 17 law it says that after the third time - 18 SENATOR LARKIN: I don't have the 19 section with me, but it's there. Believe me. 20 SENATOR ABATE: No. I do believe 21 you. I'm just totally ignorant to that. So is 22 that statute that already exists in law the 23 third time around the prosecutor? 5667 1 SENATOR LARKIN: The third part 2 is the new part. They're going to be -- all 3 we're doing is -- saying is this category, when 4 that incident happens on the third time, we're 5 giving the latitude to the judge and this 6 individual fits into that category of the 7 designation. 8 SENATOR ABATE: Right. 9 SENATOR LARKIN: And we're just 10 adding to what is already in the Family Court 11 and we're taking this into consideration. I 12 wasn't at the Codes Committee, but when someone 13 asked any questions, it was never discussed by 14 the Codes. So I presumed that all the lawyers 15 on the Codes Committee were quite familiar with 16 this Family Court Act. 17 SENATOR ABATE: Senator, just a 18 -- if you would yield. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Do you 20 continue to yield, Senator Larkin? 21 SENATOR LARKIN: Yes. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 23 Senator continues to yield. 5668 1 SENATOR ABATE: Why is this bill 2 limited to burglary? As you know, Senator 3 Hoblock had a bill not so long ago that would 4 allow the prosecution of juveniles as young as 5 11, 12 and 13 -- and there was an enumerated 6 list of felonies. Why did you choose burglary 7 and not robbery or assault or arson or murder? 8 I mean, I guess why I ask that, because right 9 now, if this passed -- and please correct me - 10 if this passed, a 12- and 13-year-old could be 11 prosecuted as an adult for burglary but they 12 couldn't be prosecuted as a 12-year-old for 13 murder, and that's - 14 SENATOR LARKIN: That's correct. 15 SENATOR ABATE: Why did you 16 choose burglary and not murder? 17 SENATOR LARKIN: I did this last 18 year, Senator Abate, and I did it based on what 19 information was brought to me by law enforcement 20 officials in my specific district, and I 21 followed up on cases, and I talked to Family 22 Court judges and they said the problem is that 23 these young people, some of them are being used 5669 1 by adults to break in, and what happens is we 2 have no way of addressing this issue, and I just 3 read you what the United States Attorney General 4 said that if we don't address this with these 5 young people, it's going to get worse. 6 What we're saying here is that 7 these 12-year-olds, there is a selection for 8 them, and we're also affording the Family Court 9 judge an opportunity to address this which he 10 doesn't have right now. 11 SENATOR ABATE: Thank you, 12 Senator. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 14 Secretary will read the last - 15 SENATOR ABATE: On the bill, very 16 briefly. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 18 Abate on the bill. 19 SENATOR ABATE: I share your 20 concern that we need to punish severely young 21 people who commit heinous and violent crimes. 22 I'm not sure that this bill in kind of a partial 23 fashion addresses the issue. 5670 1 I'm concerned that burglary is 2 selected, and under the law of this -- if this 3 became law, the very same individuals would be 4 in Family Court for murder and would be treated 5 as an adult if they were prosecuted for 6 burglary. It doesn't seem that burglary is the 7 kind of heinous -- it could be in certain 8 circumstances, but I don't understand the 9 selection of burglary when we're not even 10 addressing the murder instance, and I happen to 11 believe when you deal with 12- and 13-year-olds, 12 we need to fashion solutions within Family Court 13 that are tough. Maybe it means that juveniles 14 need to be placed for longer periods of time. 15 Maybe we have to evaluate the programs in DFY. 16 Clearly, no one is suggesting that juveniles who 17 commit these crimes should not be punished. 18 I do not think at a time when 19 we're talking about all juvenile justice reform, 20 we should take a piecemeal and what I think is a 21 Band-Aid approach to juvenile justice, 22 particularly when we're just throwing in one 23 crime and not looking at a whole host of 5671 1 solutions, reforms within Family Court and 2 reforms in terms of programming. 3 There is a New York Times 4 editorial also this week that compared similarly 5 situated juveniles who committed the same 6 crimes, and they looked at the recidivism rate 7 for the juveniles who were treated as juveniles 8 in Family Court and then compared to similarly 9 situated juveniles who were treated as adults, 10 and there are a number of studies, one in New 11 Jersey, another in Florida where the recidivism 12 rates for the juveniles who are treated as 13 adults was much higher, and that's why we have 14 to take a very close look at the benefits of 15 prosecuting juveniles as young as 12 years old 16 for burglary. We want them to be punished. I'm 17 not convinced that the Family Court system 18 cannot deal with them in a tough manner, place 19 them for an extended period of time where they 20 can get the resources and treatment perhaps to 21 turn around their lives. 22 So I'm not sure, although I 23 understand the intent -- the good intentions of 5672 1 the author, that this is a bill to advance 2 public safety. I believe it may have the 3 opposite effect, and I think -- I urge this 4 Legis... this chamber to really come forward 5 with a whole package around juvenile justice 6 reform and not be as selective as this piece of 7 legislation. 8 So for the reasons I've 9 enumerated, I cannot support the legislation 10 today. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 12 Secretary will read the last -- Senator 13 Montgomery. 14 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes, Mr. 15 President. Would the sponsor yield for a 16 question of clarification for me, please? 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 18 Larkin, do you yield to Senator Montgomery? 19 SENATOR LARKIN: Yes, Mr. 20 President. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 22 Senator yields. 23 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Thank you. 5673 1 Senator Larkin, in the support 2 memo that I have with the legislation, it says 3 that it's an act to amend the Criminal Procedure 4 Law, Penal Law and Family Court Act, in relation 5 to making persons 12 to 15 eligible for juvenile 6 offender treatment for burglary of a dwelling. 7 In other words, this makes them eligible for 8 being tried as an adult for burglary without any 9 other charges connected with it? 10 SENATOR LARKIN: Under the 11 designation -- there will be listed in the same 12 category -- as I just briefly said on the group 13 of ages 13 and age 14, they will be into that 14 category and then the Family Court judge will 15 have the option -- he will have a latitude in 16 dealing with that, the first offense, the 17 second, the third one, and that will allow him 18 to place them into a facility. 19 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: All right. 20 Now, if you would continue to yield for another 21 question I have. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 23 Larkin, do you continue to yield? 5674 1 SENATOR LARKIN: Yes, Mr. 2 President. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 4 Senator continues to yield. 5 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Thank you. 6 Senator Larkin, the DCJS has a 7 recent report out giving us the crime statistics 8 for the state, and I don't have it in front of 9 me, but the level of violent felonies is going 10 down dramatically across the state. There are a 11 couple of regions where there's an increase, but 12 by and large statewide, violent felonies -- or 13 arrests for violent felonies have decreased. 14 Where there is an increase, however, is in 15 arrests for misdemeanors. 16 So I'm just wondering whether or 17 not this law, if it's passed, making 12-year 18 olds and up eligible for juvenile offender 19 treatment, whether or not that will cause an 20 escalation in -- in the trend of having more and 21 more arrests of young children for essentially 22 misdemeanors. I'm not implying that this is a 23 misdemeanor, but certainly it just adds to that 5675 1 pool of young people who will now be going into 2 the criminal justice system and in this case, 3 for a burglary, they are now being eligible to 4 be tried as an adult. 5 SENATOR LARKIN: Senator 6 Montgomery, two things: One, I think some of us 7 took the guidance from the Attorney General of 8 the United States, as I said before, when she 9 said that if we don't address these issues now, 10 we're going to pay a heavier price later, but 11 here we are giving an opportunity for a 12 12-year-old to get some assistance and treatment 13 in a Division for Youth facility. I can't speak 14 for your neck of the woods, but I can speak from 15 my area and as I said, I talked to law 16 enforcement officers. They said one of the 17 biggest problems with youthful individuals, 18 gangs or acting separately is they get involved 19 in a burglary of a house and then they're 20 successful, and they know that there's no way 21 that anyone is going to move in on them or do 22 something with them. 23 What we're trying to do here is 5676 1 two fold. We're trying to establish this so the 2 Family Court judge can act responsible and maybe 3 put this individual into a facility and treat 4 him and get him back on the road to recovery 5 rather than slap him on the wrist, turn him 6 loose and let him continue to commit crime. 7 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Now, if the 8 Senator would continue to yield. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 10 Larkin, do you continue to yield? 11 SENATOR LARKIN: Yes, Mr. 12 President. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 14 Senator continues to yield. 15 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Are we - 16 it's my understanding that in the event -- what 17 this bill will deal with is the Criminal Court 18 decision, the prosecutor in Criminal Court. 19 This is not -- we're not really talking about 20 the Family Court judge, are we? 21 SENATOR LARKIN: We're talking 22 Family Court, Senator. 23 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: The 5677 1 prosecutor has the option of going into Criminal 2 Court versus going into Family Court, is that - 3 the prosecutor really is the person that makes 4 the decision here. 5 SENATOR LARKIN: That's true, but 6 if you - 7 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: And so once 8 it goes into Criminal Court - 9 SENATOR LARKIN: What we're 10 trying to do is give the judge some latitude in 11 here and the prosecutor. 12 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: So you're 13 giving the pros... 14 SENATOR LARKIN: What we're 15 saying here is we have an element of crime that 16 is not on the decrease. What you've read and 17 what we've all read is that in certain types of 18 crime there is a decrease, but there is no 19 decrease in burglaries by juveniles, by this 12 20 to 15-year-old group, and what we're trying to 21 do is to address this and give those who are 22 making the decisions on the future of these 23 young people some way that they can move 5678 1 forward, address the issues and try to put 2 somebody in a facility where they can be 3 rehabilitated, and that's the whole purpose of 4 this bill. 5 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: So, Senator, 6 what we're doing is giving the prosecutor the 7 option of making the decision to send a 8 12-year-old into the adult criminal justice 9 system, into the adult prison system. That 10 seems to be what we're giving the - 11 SENATOR LARKIN: Yes. 12 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Okay. Now, 13 Senator, the -- every report that I've read 14 regarding juvenile -- problems with juveniles in 15 relationship to the criminal justice system is 16 that the big difference in whether or not we can 17 turn them around is the extent to which they 18 have supports such as counseling, job training 19 and other -- other interventions which help them 20 to change their behavior. So it's more behavior 21 modification that is important to juveniles and 22 which determines whether or not they will 23 continue along the same path or whether or not 5679 1 they will change their behavior and become 2 productive citizens. 3 So you're sending them into the 4 adult system which does not have the same kind 5 of focus or support for them. So what is your 6 prediction for the future? Obviously this is 7 not what is going to make it possible - 8 SENATOR LARKIN: Senator, you 9 made a great case for my bill because you said 10 you want them to get treatment. You want them 11 to do all of that which will rehabilitate them, 12 and that's what the Division for Youth 13 facilities are all about, and this individual 14 would go into a Division for Youth facility 15 instead of a state prison. You just enumerated 16 all of the things that I believe are essential 17 in addressing this issue and for them to go and 18 be assigned to a Division for Youth facility 19 where they have all of the facilities and makeup 20 in order to try to rehabilitate the individual, 21 and that's exactly what our purpose is. 22 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: On the bill 23 -- on the bill, Mr. President. 5680 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 2 Montgomery, on the bill. 3 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: This really 4 is a very troublesome piece of legislation 5 because I think that what is missing here is the 6 support of the state to rehabilitate young 7 people or to habilitate them, and so while we 8 move from the budget and from the department 9 that is supposed to be dealing with these young 10 people at a point before they become recidivists 11 or repeat offenders or become habitual criminals 12 of one sort or another, we are sending them into 13 the system, treating them as adults, trying them 14 as adults and treating them as if it's not ever 15 possible to hope that they would have a future. 16 We've cut DFY services. We're 17 closing DFY facilities. We are essentially 18 turning away from any attempt to redirect the 19 lives of troubled young people, and this really 20 is a -- it's not only downstate, although that's 21 where the majority of problem teens may be but 22 certainly throughout this entire state, what 23 we're saying to young people is that if you're 5681 1 12 and up and you make a mistake, the state is 2 going to treat you as if there was no hope for 3 you as a person ever being a viable and 4 productive citizen by virtue of the fact that 5 we're going to support your changing your 6 behavior by giving you treatment and counseling 7 and other supports and opportunities. 8 So I think this is a bad bill. 9 It makes a statement of hopelessness on our part 10 for our young people. We should not be saying 11 this but rather we should be saying that we are 12 going to invest much more in young people so 13 that hopefully they won't go into the criminal 14 justice system. They won't become involved in 15 this kind of behavior and certainly if they do, 16 we're going to reach out to them very early, 17 very quickly so that they will turn around 18 because we have hope that they can and that they 19 will do so. 20 So, Mr. President, for those 21 reasons, I'm voting no against this bill. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 23 Paterson. 5682 1 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr. 2 President. 3 Most of what I have said has been 4 covered quite thoroughly by Senator Montgomery, 5 but I just have one question if - 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 7 Larkin, do you yield to a question from Senator 8 Paterson? 9 SENATOR LARKIN: I would be 10 delighted, Mr. President. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 12 Senator yields. 13 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you. 14 Senator Larkin, earlier -- I just 15 wanted to clarify something. Earlier in 16 conversation with Senator Abate, you said that 17 although it doesn't exist in this bill, it 18 exists in law that this would apply to the third 19 offense for the youthful offender, and I just 20 wanted to clarify that because I just cannot 21 find anywhere in the law where it actually says 22 that. So my concern, and I imagine yours as 23 well would be that this would be applied on the 5683 1 first offense to a 12-year-old. 2 SENATOR LARKIN: Mr. President - 3 Senator Paterson, I don't have the book with me, 4 but I'll be glad to send it down to you, but 5 that's taken exactly from the book, and what 6 we're saying is that when this individual 7 reaches this point and the prosecutor does it 8 and the court does it, they will have the 9 opportunity, the judge will in his proceedings, 10 to make the designation of what will happen to 11 this individual. We've designated it so that he 12 will have an opportunity. Today without the 13 designation, he can put a person into a person 14 in need of supervision, commonly referred to as 15 PINS. Under PINS, we have never seen anything 16 positive for a young person. 17 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr. 18 President. 19 I would certainly welcome any 20 additional information that Senator Larkin might 21 provide. I did look in the book. As a matter 22 of fact, I was at the library a little while ago 23 and I just didn't see it, and so I'm just saying 5684 1 I think it affects the status of the 2 legislation. Just one moment. Information is 3 coming in as I speak. 4 Senator Gold lost his library 5 card previously for using it and -- but I just 6 wanted to point out that I think that that 7 affects the real strength of the legislation, 8 and if I'm wrong, I stand corrected. I'd like 9 to vote against the bill feeling that I'm right, 10 but if additional information disproves what I'm 11 saying, then I certainly would like to have it 12 made available. 13 On the bill, Mr. President. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 15 Paterson, on the bill. 16 SENATOR PATERSON: I just think 17 we're sending the wrong message to young 18 people. I think that the biggest problem that 19 people that run youth facilities tell us about 20 is not their inability to correct the problems 21 of younger people in the majority of cases. 22 It's the recidivism that occurs when they go 23 back to the same environments that were the 5685 1 catalyst for their detainment in the first 2 place. 3 There are a lot of young people, 4 many of them that live in the communities that I 5 represent and that Senator Montgomery 6 represents, and if you knew them when they were 7 eight, nine and ten, you really would know that 8 they could go either way just depending on what 9 their treatment is in terms of their families 10 and schools and that kind of thing, and these 11 are the values that we believe and these are the 12 values of recovery, the values of 13 rehabilitation. 14 It may have been lost as a 15 concept in the last decade, but it really is 16 something that does exist when there is a 17 feeling that the young people are worth it, and 18 for that reason, I would like to vote against 19 the legislation. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Is there 21 any other Senator wishing to speak on the bill? 22 (There was no response.) 23 Hearing none, the Secretary will 5686 1 read the last section. 2 THE SECRETARY: Section 7. This 3 act shall take effect on the first day of 4 November. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce 6 the results when tabulated. 7 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 8 the negative on Calendar Number 1092, Senators 9 Abate, Connor, Gold, Leichter, Mendez, 10 Montgomery, Paterson. Ayes 46, nays 7. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 12 is passed. 13 Senator Leibell. 14 SENATOR LEIBELL: Mr. President, 15 I would like to ask for unanimous consent to be 16 recorded in the negative on Calendar 1151. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 18 objection. Hearing no objection, Senator 19 Leibell will be recorded in the negative on 20 Calendar Number 1151. 21 Senator Paterson, why do you 22 rise? Senator Paterson, why do you rise? 23 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President, 5687 1 when I was out of the chamber at the library, I 2 ran into a few people from the Motion Picture 3 Association who, as I, can't understand why a - 4 the government would take the proviso of an 5 advisory committee and apply it as law without 6 due process, and so for that reason, I would 7 like to be recorded in the negative on Calendar 8 Number 996. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 10 objection. 11 (There was no response.) 12 Hearing no objection, Senator 13 Paterson will be recorded in the negative on 14 Calendar Number 996. 15 Senator Gold, why do you rise? 16 SENATOR GOLD: I was out of the 17 chamber, but since they took my library card, I 18 was in a different place. I would like to be 19 recorded in the negative on 996. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 21 objection. 22 (There was no response.) 23 Hearing no objection, Senator 5688 1 Gold will be recorded in the negative on 2 Calendar Number 996. 3 Senator Montgomery. 4 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes, Mr. 5 President. I would also like unanimous consent 6 to be recorded in the negative on Calendar 996. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 8 objection. 9 (There was no response.) 10 Hearing no objection, Senator 11 Montgomery will be recorded in the negative on 12 Calendar Number 996. 13 Senator Holland. 14 SENATOR HOLLAND: Housekeeping, 15 Mr. President? 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Yes, we 17 do. We'll return to motions and resolutions. 18 The Chair recognizes Senator 19 Libous. 20 SENATOR LIBOUS: Thank you, Mr. 21 President. 22 On behalf of Senator Skelos, I 23 wish to call up Calendar Number 1053, Assembly 5689 1 Print Number 4728-B. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 3 Secretary will read the title. 4 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 5 1053, by Member of the Assembly Weprin, Assembly 6 Bill 4728-B, an act to amend the Estates, Powers 7 and Trusts Law. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 9 Libous. 10 SENATOR LIBOUS: Mr. President, I 11 now move to reconsider the vote by which this 12 Assembly bill was substituted for Senate Print 13 Number 3449-C on May 8th. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 15 Secretary will call the roll on reconsideration. 16 (The Secretary called the roll on 17 reconsideration.) 18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 53. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 20 Libous. 21 SENATOR LIBOUS: Thank you, Mr. 22 President. 23 I now move that Assembly Bill 5690 1 Number 4728-B be committed to the Committee on 2 Rules and that the Senate bill be restored to 3 the order of Third Reading Calendar. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 5 Assembly bill is recommitted. The Senate bill 6 is restored to third reading. 7 SENATOR LIBOUS: Mr. President, I 8 offer up the following amendments. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 10 amendments are received and adopted. 11 Senator Libous. 12 SENATOR LIBOUS: Mr. President, 13 on behalf of Senator Hoblock, on page 64, I 14 offer the following amendments to Calendar 15 Number 1161, Senate Print Number 7083, and ask 16 that said bill retain its place on the Third 17 Reading Calendar. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 19 amendments to Calendar Number 1161 are received 20 and adopted. The bill will retain its place on 21 the Third Reading Calendar. 22 Senator Libous. 23 SENATOR LIBOUS: Mr. President, 5691 1 on behalf of Senator Rath, on page 48, I offer 2 the following amendments to Calendar Number 3 1014, Senate Print Number 7150, and ask that 4 said bill retain its place on the Third Reading 5 Calendar. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 7 amendments to Calendar Number 1014 are received 8 and adopted. The bill will retain its place on 9 the Third Reading Calendar. 10 Senator Libous. 11 SENATOR LIBOUS: Mr. President, 12 on behalf of myself, on page 74, I offer the 13 following amendments to Calendar Number 364, 14 Senate Print Number 4440-A, and ask that said 15 bill retain its place on the Third Reading 16 Calendar. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 18 amendments are received and adopted. The bill 19 will retain its place on the Third Reading 20 Calendar. 21 Senator Libous. 22 SENATOR LIBOUS: On behalf of 23 Senator Levy, on page 63, I offer - 5692 1 SENATOR HOLLAND: Mr. President. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 3 Holland. 4 SENATOR HOLLAND: I just want to 5 make an announcement so nobody leaves. There 6 will be an immediate conference of the Majority 7 following adjournment today. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 9 Libous to continue on motions and resolutions. 10 SENATOR LIBOUS: As I said, on 11 behalf of Senator Levy, on page 63, I offer the 12 following amendments to Calendar Number 1155, 13 Senate Print Number 6742, and ask that said bill 14 retain its place on the Third Reading Calendar. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 16 amendments are received and adopted. The bill 17 will retain its place. 18 SENATOR LIBOUS: On behalf of 19 Senator Tully, on page 7, I offer the following 20 amendments to Calendar Number 306, Senate Print 21 Number 4578-A, and ask that said bill retain its 22 place on the Third Reading Calendar. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 5693 1 amendments are received and adopted. The bill 2 will retain its place on the Third Reading 3 Calendar. 4 Senator Libous. 5 SENATOR LIBOUS: Mr. President, 6 on behalf of Senator Wright, on page 46, I offer 7 the following amendments to Calendar Number 8 1005, Senate Print Number 6629, and ask that 9 said bill retain its place on the Third Reading 10 Calendar. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 12 amendments to Calendar 1005 are received and 13 adopted. The bill will retain its place on the 14 Third Reading Calendar. 15 Senator Holland. 16 SENATOR HOLLAND: Again, Mr. 17 President, there will be an immediate meeting of 18 the Majority Conference following adjournment, 19 and there being no further business, I move we 20 adjourn until Tuesday, May 28th, at 3:00 p.m., 21 intervening days to be legislative days. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There 23 will be an immediate meeting of the Majority 5694 1 Conference in the Majority Conference Room, Room 2 332. An immediate meeting of the Majority 3 Conference in the Majority Conference Room, Room 4 332, and without objection, the Senate stands 5 adjourned until Tuesday, March -- excuse me - 6 May 28th at 3:00 p.m. 7 (Whereupon, at 1:50 p.m., the 8 Senate adjourned.) 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23