Monday, June 10, 1996

6855 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 ALBANY, NEW YORK 8 June 10, 1996 9 3:11 p.m. 10 11 12 REGULAR SESSION 13 14 15 16 SENATOR JOHN R. KUHL, JR., Acting President 17 STEPHEN F. SLOAN, Secretary 18 19 20 21 22 23 6856 1 P R O C E E D I N G S 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senate 3 will come to order. I ask all the members to 4 find their places and staff to find their 5 places. 6 If everybody would rise and join 7 with me in saying the Pledge of Allegiance to 8 the Flag, and please remain standing for the 9 invocation. 10 (The assemblage repeated the 11 Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.) 12 We're very pleased today to be 13 joined today by the Reverend Jerry Arduini, who 14 is the Pastor at Ossining Gospel Assembly in 15 Ossining, New York. 16 Reverend Arduini. 17 REVEREND JERRY ARDUINI, Pastor, 18 Ossining Gospel Assembly, Ossining, New York: 19 Thank you, sir. 20 Shall we pray. Heavenly Father, 21 this is the day that the Lord hath made; help us 22 to rejoice and be glad in it. 23 The scriptures admonish us, Lord, 6857 1 that requests, prayers, intercessions and 2 thanksgiving be made for those who are in 3 leadership, that we may live peaceful and quiet 4 lives in all Godliness and holiness. Today we 5 do just that. 6 I pray that Your divine wisdom 7 would come upon these honorable men and women 8 who have been entrusted with the responsibility 9 to help lead this great state. 10 Like Solomon of old who, when 11 asked by God, "Ask for whatever you want me to 12 give you," He responded, "Give me wisdom and 13 knowledge, that I may lead this people, for who 14 is able to govern this great people of Yours?" 15 I pray that the divine presence 16 of Your spirit may fill this chamber. We 17 acknowledge that there are times when human 18 wisdom is not enough. There are those moments 19 when our natural talents and abilities fail and 20 we must step into another realm, those moments 21 when only divine impartation gives balance and 22 leads to justice and good judgment. 23 We thank You, Lord. The 6858 1 scripture says, "Righteousness exalteth the 2 nation." Let the spirit of righteousness rest 3 upon each individual life here today. We pray, 4 Your servants, and as such, we surrender 5 ourselves to Your divine authority, understand 6 ing that You have the best interests of people 7 always in mind. 8 We cannot help but think of the 9 Lord's Prayer which says, "Our Father, which art 10 in heaven, hallowed be Thy name. Thy kingdom 11 come, Thy will be done, in earth as it is in 12 heaven. Give us this day our daily bread. 13 Forgive us our debts, as we forgive our detors, 14 and lead us not into temptation, but deliver us 15 from evil, for Thine is the kingdom and the 16 power and the glory forever." 17 May that be the desire of our 18 heart, a desire to see Thy kingdom come, to have 19 Thy will done in earth as it is in heaven. Give 20 us today the provisions we need, and may our 21 hearts be in right relationship with You and 22 with our fellowmen. 23 To You be glory, honor and praise 6859 1 forever more. Amen. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Reading 3 of the Journal. 4 THE SECRETARY: In Senate, 5 Sunday, June 9th, the Senate met pursuant to 6 adjournment. The Journal of Saturday, June 8, 7 was read and approved. On motion, Senate 8 adjourned. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Hearing 10 no objection, the Journal stands approved as 11 read. 12 Presentation of petitions. 13 Messages from the Governor. 14 Messages from the Assembly. 15 Reports of standing committees. 16 Reports of select committees. 17 Communications and reports from 18 state officers. 19 Senator Skelos. 20 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, 21 there will be an immediate meeting of the Rules 22 Committee in Room 332 of the Capitol. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There 6860 1 will be an immediate meeting of the Rules 2 Committee, immediate meeting of the Rules 3 Committee in the Majority Conference Room, Room 4 332. 5 Motions and resolutions. 6 Senator DiCarlo. 7 SENATOR DiCARLO: Thank you, Mr. 8 President. 9 On behalf of Senator Hoblock, I 10 wish to call up bill Print 6376, recalled from 11 the Assembly, which is now at the desk. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 13 will read. 14 THE SECRETARY: By Senator 15 Hoblock, Senate Print 6736, an act to amend the 16 Transportation Law. 17 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 18 I now move to reconsider the vote by which this 19 bill was passed. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 21 will call the roll on reconsideration. 22 (The Secretary called the roll on 23 reconsideration.) 6861 1 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 35. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 3 DiCarlo. 4 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 5 I now offer up the following amendments. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Amendments 7 received and adopted. 8 Senator DiCarlo. 9 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 10 on behalf of Senator Hoblock, I wish to call up 11 bill Print 6936, recalled from the Assembly, 12 which is now at the desk. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 14 will read. 15 THE SECRETARY: By Senator 16 Hoblock, Senate Print 6936, an act to amend the 17 General Municipal Law. 18 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 19 I now move to reconsider the vote by which this 20 bill was passed. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 22 roll on reconsideration. 23 (The Secretary called the roll on 6862 1 reconsideration.) 2 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 38. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 4 DiCarlo. 5 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 6 we would now like to star the bill on behalf of 7 the sponsor. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 9 is starred at the request of the sponsor. 10 Senator DiCarlo. 11 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 12 on behalf of Senator Libous, I wish to call up 13 bill Print Number 6899, recalled from the 14 Assembly, which is now at the desk. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 16 will read. 17 THE SECRETARY: By Senator 18 Libous, Senate Print 6899, an act to amend the 19 Mental Hygiene Law. 20 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 21 I now move to reconsider the vote by which this 22 bill was passed. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 6863 1 will call the roll on reconsideration. 2 (The Secretary called the roll on 3 reconsideration.) 4 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 38. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 6 DiCarlo. 7 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 8 I now offer the following amendments. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Amendments 10 received and adopted. 11 Senator DiCarlo. 12 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 13 on behalf of Senator Saland, I wish to call up 14 bill Print Number 6028, recalled from the 15 Assembly, which is now at the desk. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 17 will read. 18 THE SECRETARY: By Senator 19 Saland, Senate Print 6028, an act to amend the 20 Criminal Procedure Law. 21 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 22 I now move to reconsider the vote by which this 23 bill was passed. 6864 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 2 will call the roll on reconsideration. 3 (The Secretary called the roll on 4 reconsideration.) 5 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 38. 6 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 7 I now offer the following amendments. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Amendments 9 are received and adopted. 10 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 11 on behalf of Senator Saland, I wish to call up 12 bill Print Number 6534A, recalled from the 13 Assembly, which is now at the desk. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 15 Secretary will read. 16 THE SECRETARY: By Senator 17 Saland, Senate Print 6534A, an act to amend the 18 Criminal Procedure Law. 19 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 20 I now move to reconsider the vote by which this 21 bill was passed. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 23 will call the roll on reconsideration. 6865 1 (The Secretary called the roll on 2 reconsideration.) 3 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 38. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 5 DiCarlo. 6 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 7 I now offer the following amendments. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Amendments 9 received and adopted. 10 Senator DiCarlo. 11 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 12 on behalf of Senator Libous, I wish to call up 13 bill Print Number 7316A, recalled from the 14 Assembly, which is now at the desk. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 16 will read. 17 THE SECRETARY: By Senator 18 Libous, Senate Print 7316A, an act to amend the 19 Mental Hygiene Law. 20 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 21 I now move to reconsider the vote by which this 22 bill was passed. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 6866 1 will call the roll on reconsideration. 2 (The Secretary called the roll on 3 reconsideration.) 4 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 39. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 6 DiCarlo. 7 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President, 8 I now offer the following amendments. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Amendments 10 are received and adopted. 11 Senator Seward. 12 SENATOR SEWARD: Yes, Mr. 13 President, on behalf of Senator Stafford, I wish 14 to call up Calendar Number 1277, Assembly Print 15 Number 9757. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 17 will read. 18 THE SECRETARY: By Senator 19 Stafford, Senate Print 3312A, an act to amend 20 the Tax Law. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 22 Seward. 23 SENATOR SEWARD: I now move to 6867 1 reconsider the vote by which the Assembly bill 2 was substituted for Senator Stafford's bill, 3 Senate Print Number 3312A, on June 5th. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 5 will call the roll on reconsideration. 6 (The Secretary called the roll on 7 reconsideration.) 8 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 39. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 10 Seward. 11 SENATOR SEWARD: Yes. I now 12 move that Assembly Bill Number 9757 be 13 recommitted to the Committee on Rules and that 14 Senator Stafford's Senate bill be restored on 15 the order of Third Reading Calendar. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 17 Assembly bill will be recommitted. The Senate 18 bill will be restored. 19 Senator Seward. 20 SENATOR SEWARD: Yes. On behalf 21 of Senator LaValle, I wish to call up Calendar 22 Number 329, Assembly Print Number 5796B. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 6868 1 will read. 2 THE SECRETARY: By member of the 3 Assembly Canestrari, Assembly Bill 5796B, an act 4 to amend the Civil Rights Law and the Public 5 Health Law. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 7 Seward. 8 SENATOR SEWARD: I now move to 9 reconsider the vote by which this Assembly bill 10 was substituted for Senator LaValle's bill, 11 Senate Print Number 4293B, on April 29th. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 13 will call the roll on reconsideration. 14 (The Secretary called the roll on 15 reconsideration.) 16 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 39. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 18 Seward. 19 SENATOR SEWARD: I now move that 20 Assembly Bill Number 5796B be committed to the 21 Committee on Rules and that the Senate bill be 22 restored to the order of Third Reading Calendar. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 6869 1 Assembly bill will be committed to the Rules 2 Committee and the Senate bill is restored. 3 Senator Seward. 4 SENATOR SEWARD: Mr. President, 5 I now offer the following amendments. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 7 amendments are received and adopted. 8 Senator Marcellino. 9 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 10 President, on page number 48, on behalf of 11 Senator Volker, I offer the following amendments 12 to Calendar Number 32, Senate Print Number 4262, 13 and ask that said bill retain its place on the 14 Third Reading Calendar. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Amendments 16 to Calendar Number 32 are received and adopted. 17 The bill will retain its place - 18 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 19 President, would you also remove a star from 20 that bill? 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 22 will be amended and the bill will retain its 23 place on the Third Reading Calendar and the star 6870 1 is removed at the request of the sponsor. 2 Senator Marcellino. 3 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 4 President, amendments are offered to the 5 following Third Reading Calendar bills: 6 Sponsored by Senator Leibell, 7 page 4, Calendar 131, 3871, Senate Print Number; 8 Senator Holland, page number 12, 9 Calendar 529, Senate Print Number 5536B; 10 Senator Holland, page 15, 11 Calendar Number 643, Senate Print Number 6313; 12 Senator Cook, page number 24, 13 Calendar Number 926, Senate Print Number 6275; 14 Senator Rath, on page number 25, 15 Calendar 939, Senate Print Number 7153; 16 On behalf of Senator Velella, on 17 page number 26, Calendar Number 960, Print 18 Number -- Senate Print Number 6688; 19 On behalf of Senator Nozzolio, 20 page number 29, Calendar Number 1016, Senate 21 Print Number 7439; 22 On behalf of Senator Velella, on 23 page number 37, Calendar Number 1154, Senate 6871 1 Print Number 6497; 2 On behalf of Senator Hoblock, on 3 page number 37, Calendar Number 1161, Senate 4 Print Number 7083A; 5 On behalf of Senator Larkin, page 6 number 38, Calendar Number 1180, Senate Print 7 Number 5786; 8 On behalf of Senator Rath, page 9 Number 40, Calendar Number 1213, Senate Print 10 Number 6536A; 11 On behalf of Senator Present, on 12 page Number 42, Calendar 1303, Senate Print 13 Number 7028; 14 On behalf of Senator Holland, 15 page number 10, Calendar Number 452, Senate 16 Print Number 218; 17 On behalf of Senator Velella, 18 page number 26, Calendar Number 993, Senate 19 Print Number 3371B; 20 On behalf of Senator Volker, page 21 number 30 -- I'm sorry, page number 27, Calendar 22 Number 1000, Senate Print Number 1262A; 23 On behalf of Senator Maltese, 6872 1 page number 36, Calendar Number 1144, Senate 2 Print Number 4348; 3 On behalf of Senator Kuhl, page 4 number 45, Calendar Number 1332, Senate Print 5 Number 6576A; 6 On behalf of Senator Hoblock, 7 page number 38, Calendar Number 1175, Senate 8 Print Number 6916; 9 And last but not least, on behalf 10 of Senator LaValle, page Number 23, Calendar 11 Number 920, Senate Print Number 7226; 12 And, Mr. President, I now move 13 that these bills retain their place on the order 14 of third reading. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 16 amendments to all the bills will be received and 17 adopted, and all the bills will retain their 18 place on the Third Reading Calendar. 19 Senator Spano. 20 SENATOR SPANO: Thank you. Mr. 21 President, I understand we've got three 22 privileged resolutions at the desk. I ask that 23 the titles be read and passed. 6873 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 2 Secretary will read the titles to the three 3 resolutions. 4 THE SECRETARY: By Senator 5 Trunzo, Legislative Resolution paying tribute to 6 the New York State and Local Retirement Systems 7 and memorializing Governor George E. Pataki to 8 declare the week of June 9th through the 15th, 9 1996, as New York State and Local Retirement 10 Systems Week in the state of New York. 11 By Senator Levy, Legislative 12 Resolution in recognition of the Nassau County 13 American Legion 78th Annual Convention; and also 14 by Senator Bruno, Legislative Resolution 15 memorializing the Honorable George E. Pataki, 16 Governor of the State of New York, to proclaim 17 the week of June 10th through the 16th, 1996, as 18 New York City Firefighters' Week in the State of 19 New York. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Is there 21 any Senator wishing to speak on any of the 22 resolutions? 23 Senator Trunzo. 6874 1 SENATOR TRUNZO: Mr. Chairman, 2 on my resolution regarding the 75th anniversary 3 of the Retirement System, I would like to open 4 it up to all the members of the Senate that wish 5 to do so. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: If those 7 members would -- Do you want to put everybody on 8 the resolution, Senator Trunzo? Why don't we 9 put everybody on the resolution being offered by 10 Senator Trunzo, except those people who do not 11 wish to be on the resolution, if they would 12 indicate that to the desk. 13 The question is then on the 14 resolutions as read. 15 All those in favor, signify by 16 saying aye. 17 (Response of "Aye.") 18 Opposed nay. 19 (There was no response.) 20 The resolutions are adopted. 21 Senator Spano, we have four 22 substitutions at the desk. 23 SENATOR SPANO: Yes, can we 6875 1 please have the Secretary read. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 3 Secretary will read the substitutions. 4 THE SECRETARY: On page 42, 5 Senator Johnson moves to discharge from the 6 Committee on Water Resources, Assembly Bill 7 Number 1465, and substitute it for the identical 8 Senate Bill Number 1019. 9 On page 43, Senator LaValle moves 10 to discharge from the Committee on Investiga 11 tions, Assembly Bill Number 7839, and substitute 12 it for the identical Senate Bill 4607. 13 On page 44, Senator Maltese moves 14 to discharge from the Committee on Rules, 15 Assembly Bill Number 9038 and substitute it for 16 the identical Senate Bill 6476. 17 On page 45, Senator Stafford 18 moves to discharge from the Committee on Rules 19 Assembly Bill Number 9757 and substitute it for 20 the identical Senate Bill, 6744. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 22 substitutions are ordered. 23 Senator Spano, that brings us to 6876 1 the calendar. What's your pleasure? 2 SENATOR SPANO: Can we please go 3 to the non-controversial calendar. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 5 Secretary will read the non-controversial 6 calendar. 7 THE SECRETARY: On page 9, 8 Calendar Number 441, by Senator Volker, Senate 9 Print 4633B, an act to amend the Civil Practice 10 Law and Rules, in relation to personal service 11 by mail. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 13 the last section. 14 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 15 act shall take effect immediately. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 17 the roll. 18 (The Secretary called the roll.) 19 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 49. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 21 bill is passed. 22 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 23 618, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 3863B, an 6877 1 act to amend the Civil Practice Law and Rules, 2 in relation to summary judgments. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 4 the last section. 5 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 6 act shall take effect on the first day of 7 January. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 9 the roll. 10 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 12 bill is passed. 13 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 14 638, by the Assembly Committee on Rules, 15 Assembly Print 10463A, an act to amend the 16 Public Service Law and the General Business Law, 17 in relation to the protection of underground 18 facilities. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 20 the last section. 21 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 22 act shall take effect immediately. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 6878 1 the roll. 2 (The Secretary called the roll.) 3 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 5 bill is passed. 6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7 767, by Senator Maziarz, Senate Print 6388A, an 8 act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in 9 relation to violations involving passing a 10 stopped school bus. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 12 the last section. 13 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 14 act shall take effect immediately. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 16 the roll. 17 (The Secretary called the roll.) 18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 20 bill is passed. 21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 22 850, by Senator Padavan, Senate Print 7379, an 23 act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in 6879 1 relation to distributions of penalties. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 3 the last section. 4 THE SECRETARY: Section 7. This 5 act shall take effect in 90 days. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 7 the roll. 8 (The Secretary called the roll.) 9 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 11 bill is passed. 12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 13 1055, by Senator Lack, Senate Print 4606A, an 14 act to amend the Real Property Law, in relation 15 to discontinuing the system of title 16 registration. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 18 the last section. 19 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This 20 act shall take effect on the first day of 21 January. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 23 the roll. 6880 1 (The Secretary called the roll.) 2 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 4 bill is passed. 5 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 6 1060, by Senator Cook, Senate Print 6269C, an 7 act to amend the General Obligations Law. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Lay 9 the bill aside. 10 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 11 1117, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 5732A, an 12 act to amend the Family Court Act. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Lay 14 the bill aside. 15 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 16 1149, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 5782, an act 17 to amend the Transportation Law, in relation to 18 the investigation of accidents. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 20 the last section. 21 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 22 act shall take effect immediately. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 6881 1 the roll. 2 (The Secretary called the roll.) 3 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 5 bill is passed. 6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7 1164, by Senator Leibell, Senate Print 7274, an 8 act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in 9 relation to the service charge for distinctive 10 plates. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 12 the last section. 13 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 14 act shall take effect on the 60th day. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 16 the roll. 17 (The Secretary called the roll.) 18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 20 bill is passed. 21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 22 1170, by member of the Assembly Jacobs, Assembly 23 Print 9823A, an act to amend the Social Services 6882 1 Law. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 3 the last section. 4 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This 5 act shall take effect December 31st. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 7 the roll. 8 (The Secretary called the roll.) 9 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 11 bill is passed. 12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 13 1239, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 7577A, an 14 act to amend the Real Property Tax Law, in 15 relation to applications for exemption from real 16 property taxes. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 18 the last section. 19 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 20 act shall take effect immediately. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 22 the roll. 23 (The Secretary called the roll.) 6883 1 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 3 bill is passed. 4 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 5 1312, by Senator Padavan, Senate Print 701, an 6 act to amend the Social Services Law, in 7 relation to benefits for social service 8 benefits. 9 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Lay 11 the bill aside. 12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 13 1313, substituted earlier today by member of the 14 Assembly Weisenberg, Assembly Print 1465, an act 15 to amend the Public Health Law. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 17 the last section. 18 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 19 act shall take effect immediately. 20 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Lay 22 the bill aside. 23 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 6884 1 1315, by Senator Bruno, Senate Print 3654C, an 2 act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in 3 relation to authorizing issuance of distinctive 4 license plates. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 6 the last section. 7 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 8 act shall take effect immediately. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 10 the roll. 11 (The Secretary called the roll.) 12 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 14 bill is passed. 15 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 16 1316, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 3949, an 17 act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law, in 18 relation to fingerprinting of persons. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 20 the last section. 21 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 22 act shall take effect on the first day of 23 November. 6885 1 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 2 the roll. 3 (The Secretary called the roll.) 4 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 6 bill is passed. 7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 8 1317, by Senator Nozzolio, Senate Print 4004, an 9 act the amend the Correction Law and the 10 Executive Law. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 12 the last section. 13 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 14 act shall take effect immediately. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 16 the roll. 17 (The Secretary called the roll.) 18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 20 bill is passed. 21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 22 1318, by Senator DeFrancisco, Senate Print 4231, 23 an act to amend the Public Health Law. 6886 1 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Lay 3 that bill aside. 4 THE SECRETARY: Calendar 1319, 5 by Senator Nozzolio, Senate Print 4518A, an act 6 to amend the Executive Law, in relation to 7 preliminary hearings. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 9 the last section. 10 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 11 act shall take effect immediately. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 13 the roll. 14 (The Secretary called the roll.) 15 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 17 bill is passed. 18 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 19 1320, substituted earlier today, by the Assembly 20 Committee on Rules, Assembly Print 7839, an act 21 to amend the Executive Law. 22 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Lay 6887 1 the bill aside. 2 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 3 1321, by Senator DeFrancisco, Senate Print 4 4800A, an act to amend the Navigation Law, in 5 relation to jurisdiction over navigation. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 7 the last section. 8 THE SECRETARY: Section 9. This 9 act shall take effect immediately. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 11 the roll. 12 (The Secretary called the roll.) 13 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 15 bill is passed. 16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 17 1322, by Senator Marchi, Senate Print 5163A, an 18 act to provide additional service credit in the 19 New York City Teachers' Retirement System. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 21 the last section. 22 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This 23 act shall take effect immediately. 6888 1 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 2 the roll. 3 (The Secretary called the roll.) 4 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 6 bill is passed. 7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 8 1323, by Senator Spano, Senate Print 5290A, an 9 act to amend the Real Property Tax Law, in 10 relation to cooperative real property tax. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 12 the last section. 13 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 14 act shall take effect immediately. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 16 the roll. 17 (The Secretary called the roll.) 18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 20 bill is passed. 21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 22 1324, by Senator Hoblock, Senate Print 5299A, an 23 act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in 6889 1 relation to authorizing a residential parking 2 permit system. 3 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Lay 5 the bill aside. 6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7 1325, by Senator Marchi, Senate Print 5807, an 8 act authorizing the City of New York to reconvey 9 its interest in certain real property. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: There 11 is a home rule message at the desk. Read the 12 last section. 13 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This 14 act shall take effect immediately. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 16 the roll. 17 (The Secretary called the roll.) 18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 20 bill is passed. 21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 22 1327, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 5961B, an 23 act to amend Chapter 273 of the Laws of 1939. 6890 1 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 2 the last section. 3 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 4 act shall take effect immediately. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 6 the roll. 7 (The Secretary called the roll.) 8 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 10 bill is passed. 11 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 12 1328, by Senator Marcellino, Senate Print 6214A, 13 an act to amend the Environmental Conservation 14 Law, in relation to fish for free days. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 16 the last section. 17 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This 18 act shall take effect immediately. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 20 the roll. 21 (The Secretary called the roll.) 22 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 6891 1 bill is passed. 2 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 3 1329, by Senator Wright, Senate Print 6342, an 4 act to amend the Tax Law, in relation to refunds 5 for overpayment of highway use tax. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 7 the last section. 8 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 9 act shall take effect September 1st. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 11 the roll. 12 (The Secretary called the roll.) 13 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 15 bill is passed. 16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 17 1330, by Senator Marcellino, Senate Print 6394A, 18 an act to amend the Environmental Conservation 19 Law, in relation to exemptions for hazardous 20 packaging. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 22 the last section. 23 THE SECRETARY: Section 7. This 6892 1 act shall take effect on the 120th day. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 3 the roll. 4 (The Secretary called the roll.) 5 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 7 bill is passed. 8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 9 1331, substituted earlier today, by member of 10 the Assembly Connelly, Assembly Print 9038, an 11 act to amend the Education Law, in relation to 12 student aid programs for Vietnam veterans. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 14 the last section. 15 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 16 act shall take effect immediately. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 18 the roll. 19 (The Secretary called the roll.) 20 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 22 bill is passed. 23 THE SECRETARY: Calendar 1333, 6893 1 by Senator Marchi, Senate Print 6638B, an act to 2 amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in relation 3 to distinctive license plates. 4 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Lay 6 the bill aside. 7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 8 1334, by Senator Espada, Senate Print 6731, an 9 act authorizing the City of New York to reconvey 10 its interest in certain real property. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Home 12 rule message is at the desk. 13 Read the last section. 14 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This 15 act shall take effect immediately. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 17 the roll. 18 (The Secretary called the roll.) 19 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 21 bill is passed. 22 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 23 1335, substituted earlier today, by member of 6894 1 the Assembly D'Andrea, Assembly Print 9757, an 2 act to amend the Tax Law, in relation to 3 authorizing the county of Washington. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 5 the last section. 6 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 7 act shall take effect immediately. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 9 the roll. 10 (The Secretary called the roll.) 11 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 13 bill is passed. 14 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 15 1336, by Senator Alesi, Senate Print 6852, an 16 act to amend the Social Services Law, the Tax 17 Law, in relation to misuse of food stamps. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 19 the last section. 20 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This 21 act shall take effect on the first day of 22 November. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 6895 1 the roll. 2 (The Secretary called the roll.) 3 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 5 bill is passed. 6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7 1337, by Senator Alesi, Senate Print 6910, an 8 act to amend the real property Tax Law, in 9 relation to remitting tax levying bodies to 10 determine the maximum amount of tax. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 12 the last section. 13 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 14 act shall take effect immediately. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 16 the roll. 17 (The Secretary called the roll.) 18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 20 bill is passed. 21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 22 1338, by Senator Hoblock, Senate Print 6937, an 23 act to amend the Transportation Law, in relation 6896 1 to airport preservation. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 3 the last section. 4 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 5 act shall take effect immediately. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 7 the roll. 8 (The Secretary called the roll.) 9 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 11 bill is passed. 12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 13 1339, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 7105, an 14 act to amend the Penal Law and the Criminal 15 Procedure Law, in relation to providing for life 16 imprisonment. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 18 the last section. 19 THE SECRETARY: Section 7. This 20 act shall take effect on the first day of 21 November. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 23 the roll. 6897 1 (The Secretary called the roll.) 2 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 4 bill is passed. 5 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 6 1340, by Senator Holland, Senate Print 7120, an 7 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to 8 fixing sentences for persons committing crimes 9 while on parole. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 11 the last section. 12 THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This 13 act shall take effect on the first day of 14 November. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 16 the roll. 17 (The Secretary called the roll.) 18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 51. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 20 bill is passed. 21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 22 1341, by Senator DiCarlo, Senate Print 7178, an 23 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to 6898 1 increasing the criminal penalties for sexual 2 performances by a child. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 4 the last section. 5 THE SECRETARY: Section 7. This 6 act shall take effect on the first day of 7 November. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 9 the roll. 10 (The Secretary called the roll.) 11 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 51. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 13 bill is passed. 14 THE SECRETARY: Calendar 1342, 15 by Senator Saland, Senate Print 7245, an act to 16 amend the Penal Law, in relation to including 17 hospital emergency department personnel. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 19 the last section. 20 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 21 act shall take effect on the first day of 22 November. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 6899 1 the roll. 2 (The Secretary called the roll.) 3 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 51. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 5 bill is passed. 6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7 1343, by Senator LaValle, Senate Print 7298A, an 8 act to amend the Highway Law, in relation to 9 creating a temporary task force. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 11 the last section. 12 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 13 act shall take effect on the 30th day. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 15 the roll. 16 (The Secretary called the roll.) 17 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 51. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 19 bill is passed. 20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 21 1344, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 7306A, an 22 act in relation to transfers of certain eligible 23 members from improved career retirement plans. 6900 1 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: There 2 is a home rule message at the desk. 3 Read the last section. 4 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This 5 act shall take effect immediately. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 7 the roll. 8 (The Secretary called the roll.) 9 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 51. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 11 bill is passed. 12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 13 1345, by Senator DiCarlo, Senate Print 7494, an 14 act to amend the Public Authorities Law, in 15 relation to providing reduced rate tokens. 16 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Lay 18 the bill aside. 19 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 20 1346, by Senator Nozzolio, Senate Print 7545, an 21 act to amend the Real Property Law, in relation 22 to definition of manufactured home. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 6901 1 the last section. 2 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 3 act shall take effect immediately. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 5 the roll. 6 (The Secretary called the roll.) 7 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 51. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 9 bill is passed. 10 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 11 1347, by Senator Rath, Senate Print 7560, an act 12 to amend the Real Property Tax Law, in relation 13 to making technical and clarifying changes. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 15 the last section. 16 THE SECRETARY: Section 8. This 17 act shall take effect immediately. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 19 the roll. 20 (The Secretary called the roll.) 21 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 51. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 23 bill is passed. 6902 1 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 2 1348, by Senator DeFrancisco, Senate Print 7571, 3 an act authorizing the extension of the Geddes 4 Fire Protection District. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: There 6 is a home rule message at the desk. 7 Read the last section. 8 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This 9 act shall take effect immediately. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 11 the roll. 12 (The Secretary called the roll.) 13 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 51. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 15 bill is passed. 16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 17 1349, by Senator DiCarlo, Senate Print 7621, an 18 act to amend Chapter 602 of the Laws of 1982. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 20 the last section. 21 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 22 act shall take effect immediately. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 6903 1 the roll. 2 (The Secretary called the roll.) 3 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 51. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 5 bill is passed. 6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7 1350, by Senator Kuhl, Senate Print 7639, an act 8 to amend the Agriculture and Markets Law, in 9 relation to establishing an advisory committee. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 11 the last section. 12 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 13 act shall take effect immediately. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 15 the roll. 16 (The Secretary called the roll.) 17 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 51. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 19 bill is passed. 20 Senator Spano, that concludes the 21 reading of the non-controversial calendar. 22 SENATOR SPANO: Mr. President, 23 can we please proceed to the controversial 6904 1 calendar. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: 3 Secretary will read the controversial calendar. 4 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 5 1060, by Senator Cook, Senate Print 6269C, an 6 act to amend the General Obligations Law, in 7 relation to the use of lands for recreational 8 activities. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: 10 Senator Cook, Senator Paterson has asked for an 11 explanation. 12 SENATOR COOK: Of what? 13 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: 14 Calendar 1060. 15 SENATOR COOK: Yes. Thank you. 16 Mr. President, this bill really 17 ties in with an effort to try to stabilize and 18 improve the rural economy of the state by 19 providing some additional income to landowners, 20 specifically to farmers, by giving them some 21 protection from lawsuits. 22 The problem that we have is that 23 we're finding that - 6905 1 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Excuse 2 me, Senator Cook. If I just might interrupt. If 3 we could please have the attention of everyone 4 in the chamber. Please take your conversations 5 outside. Staff, please be seated. Take your 6 conversations outside. 7 Senator Cook. 8 SENATOR COOK: Mr. President, 9 the problem we're having is that because of the 10 fear of legal liability, people are increas 11 ingly not letting other individuals utilize 12 their land. We find that there was an Appellate 13 Division decision in the town of Webb, 14 apparently, in 1992 that really was the basis 15 for this legislation, that this legislation 16 actually tracks that court decision, so we're 17 not cutting a lot of new ground, except to 18 clarify in statute that indeed people do have 19 this protection from lawsuits, that hopefully 20 this will encourage people to let the general 21 public utilize their land for various 22 recreational purposes, and that in the process, 23 that the economy of the entire region will be 6906 1 improved. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: 3 Senator Paterson. 4 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you 5 very much, Mr. President. 6 If Senator Cook would be kind 7 enough to yield for a few questions. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: 9 Senator Cook, would you yield for a few 10 questions? 11 SENATOR COOK: Yes. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: 13 Senator yields. 14 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, 15 Senator. 16 In protecting the landowners who 17 allow for recreational activity on their proper 18 ty, is there any protection in the legislation 19 for those who have restricted activity on their 20 property, such as to put a"no trespass" sign, 21 because my fear, just looking at the legisla 22 tion, just from a technical viewpoint, is that 23 there are certain types of liability that even 6907 1 if you had a sign restricting access, that you 2 would still be held to a certain standard 3 because it's not really spelled out in the 4 legislation. 5 And yet, if you allow for 6 recreational activity as opposed to the limited 7 liability that already exists in law, Senator, 8 you have now added to that to such an extent 9 that almost -- I would imagine just about any 10 activity would protect the landowner. But, my 11 question is, have you protected the landowner 12 who recognizes a higher standard and has tried 13 to restrict access to their property through"no 14 trespass" signs or any sort of barriers that 15 would indicate to individuals that there's a 16 desire not to have them move onto the property? 17 SENATOR COOK: Senator, the 18 existing law, and I think you already said that, 19 says that, "An owner, lessee, occupant of the 20 premises, whether or not posted as provided, 21 owes no duty to keep the premises safe for 22 others for," and then it says, "hunting, 23 fishing, organized gleaning," et cetera, et 6908 1 cetera, and we're simply adding the following 2 activities but not limited to, which means that 3 if somehow we forgot to add some of these - 4 some activity to the list, that people are not 5 going to be subject to lawsuits for something - 6 I don't see, for example, hiking in here, so 7 that hiking, for example, would not be a 8 protected activity which could be utilized - 9 for which the land could be utilized 10 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, 11 Senator. Would the Senator, Mr. President, 12 yield for another question? 13 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: 14 Senator Cook, do you continue to yield? 15 SENATOR COOK: Yes. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 17 Senator yields. 18 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, 19 Senator. 20 So just to sum up briefly, the 21 landowner who takes -- who goes beyond just 22 allowing individuals on the property but 23 recognizes, perhaps, that there's a danger and 6909 1 tries to restrict it, would that landowner be 2 covered, as well? 3 SENATOR COOK: I'm sorry, 4 Senator, would you state that again? 5 SENATOR PATERSON: Certainly, 6 Senator. 7 If the landowner who has gone 8 beyond the duty that this legislation allows 9 for, in other words, allowing individuals to 10 engage in recreational activity on their 11 property, but the landowner who takes responsi 12 bility to restrict that activity on their 13 property and someone disregards a "no trespass" 14 sign and goes on the property anyway and is 15 injured, are they covered by the legislation as 16 well? 17 SENATOR COOK: They certainly 18 are because it says "whether or not posted". 19 That's the existing law, Senator. 20 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, 21 Senator Cook. 22 Mr. President, if the Senator 23 would continue to yield? 6910 1 SENATOR COOK: Yes, sir. 2 SENATOR PATERSON: Senator Cook, 3 how, after making new law in the fashion that 4 you're proposing today, would we distinguish 5 between the landowner who is acknowledging a 6 duty to keep the premises safe and those that do 7 not? 8 In other words, whatever 9 expenditure a landowner would make to try to 10 make sure that the property is safe and that 11 there can be access and an inertia of movement 12 by individuals from the outside coming across 13 the property, whether they are invited or not 14 invited, what is the difference -- what is the 15 incentive to do that when we're passing a law 16 that's basically saying, "You can hike, you can 17 walk, you can fish, you can swim, you can do 18 just about anything on the property and if there 19 is any injury or damage --" you know, obviously, 20 if a person goes in the water and slips on the 21 rocks, there's a certain assumption of the risk 22 that they took; but if a person walks across a 23 foot bridge where the wood is atrophied and 6911 1 falls in the river, you know, I would maintain 2 that a perusal of the premises might indicate 3 that the landowner should have taken some 4 remedial action and that the hazard was known to 5 everyone except a stranger that happened to be 6 on the property. 7 SENATOR COOK: Well, Senator, 8 I'm not an attorney and I do recognize that what 9 you're saying is possibly true relative to the 10 foot bridge because ironically it seems that 11 even though somebody may be on your property and 12 have no good reason to be there and they are 13 injured, that possibly you're subject to 14 lawsuit, which, of course, is one of the very 15 things that we're talking about. 16 I think, though, in regard to 17 your question, if I understood it correctly, it 18 was if we're making it the same freedom from 19 liability, whether the land is posted or not 20 posted, the issue really in posting is that you, 21 by posting the land, have -- you assert a right 22 to potentially have the person arrested for 23 trespassing. 6912 1 Now, I don't know that anybody 2 ever made that stick, but the point is, if you 3 put a sign up saying, "No hunting, fishing or 4 trespassing," and somebody insists on coming on 5 your property, you at least can order them off 6 or have someone, in an extreme case, have them 7 removed. 8 Probably you also have that 9 ability even if you don't have posted signs up 10 because it is, after all, your property; but I 11 don't think this changes the situation as it 12 relates to posting. Posting is merely a 13 notice, in a sense, saying, "You're not welcome 14 here." 15 We're trying to get rid of those 16 posted signs. We are trying to get it so that 17 when folks come into the country and they want 18 to enjoy a hike through somebody's pasture or 19 over their land, that the landowner will not 20 live in fear that that person is going to fall 21 over a rock, break their leg and sue them. 22 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. 23 President, if Senator Cook would continue to 6913 1 yield. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: 3 Senator Cook, do you continue to yield? 4 SENATOR COOK: Yes, I will. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 6 Senator yields. 7 SENATOR PATERSON: Yes, Senator. 8 I think you've laid out very well the purpose 9 for the bill and you probably understand a lot 10 more than I do what the - 11 SENATOR COOK: Senator, let me 12 indicate one other thing that this bill is 13 really aimed at and that is to permit a 14 nonprofit corporation, such as a soil and water 15 conservation district, for example, to organize 16 a group of landowners to develop, for example, a 17 hiking trail across several lots, and so that 18 there may be, you know, a few miles of hiking 19 trail over private land, and that the -- it also 20 protects that organization from liability, since 21 they were the one who put up the posters and 22 said, "This is a walking trail," that they will 23 not be subject to lawsuit because -- simply 6914 1 because they're the ones who marked the trail. 2 SENATOR PATERSON: I under 3 stand. Thank you, Senator. 4 That actually brings me back to a 5 question I asked earlier that perhaps I'd like 6 to be a little more specific, if, Mr. President, 7 the Senator will continue to yield. 8 SENATOR COOK: Yes. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: 10 Senator yields. 11 SENATOR PATERSON: Senator, in 12 those types of situations where you have the 13 not-for-profit corporation and you have specific 14 authorization now because you're going to build 15 a hiking trail that's going to span through a 16 few lots, for those lots in the area that are 17 not authorizing it, they don't want a hiking 18 trail through their lot. Let me be sure that 19 there is no distinction in the liability where 20 the unauthorized lot would, in a sense, become 21 liable to a lawsuit, and where there is an 22 authorized allowance for the recreational 23 activity, your bill has really eliminated the 6915 1 possibility of redress in that area. 2 SENATOR COOK: No, Senator. 3 This bill really doesn't address that point at 4 all and, therefore, it doesn't change anything, 5 anything at all. 6 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you 7 very much, Senator Cook. 8 Mr. President, on the bill. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: 10 Senator Paterson, on the bill. 11 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. 12 President, the problem that we see with the 13 legislation, even though its intent is certainly 14 one that would probably make life a little bit 15 easier, not only for the individuals who are 16 engaging in recreational activities, but even 17 for the landowners themselves. The problem is 18 that we feel that it, in some -- to some degree, 19 impedes on pre-existing law in the sense that 20 tort liability is kind of a specific standard 21 and it relates to specific types of scenarios. 22 So, there are some where if a 23 person, you know, falls over a rock, something 6916 1 like that, there's kind of an assumption of the 2 risk that when you're climbing on rocks, you 3 might fall over one, and there's a test of a 4 reasonable standard as to whether or not the 5 landowner would be liable. 6 But in certain situations where 7 the landowner has not kept up the property to 8 such an extent, they have not, in a sense, 9 caused a hazard or some kind of an encumbrance 10 to the passerby, we feel there should still be 11 some protection under the law for individuals 12 who are met with the misfortune of suffering an 13 injury in those situations caused by those 14 obstacles. 15 And so what we're recommending is 16 that -- Senator Cook is really on the right 17 track, it's just in my opinion, the train has 18 gone too far. We're protecting all landowners 19 to such an extent that almost anything can be 20 deemed a recreational activity and that's where 21 we feel that the bill, in a sense, is going to 22 work against an individual who is harmed who has 23 a legitimate lawsuit for a legitimate purpose. 6917 1 SENATOR COOK: Mr. President. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: 3 Senator Cook. 4 SENATOR COOK: Mr. President, 5 the state of New York owns hundreds of 6 thousands, perhaps even millions of acres, I'm 7 not sure what it is, of public lands. 8 The state of New York assumes no 9 responsibility if anyone enters those lands and 10 is injured. And, yet, the same activity, if 11 someone actually enters on private land, can 12 subject the landowner to a lawsuit, and that's a 13 reason why people have increasingly been putting 14 up those posted signs which say,"You're not 15 welcome here," and, in effect, reenforce, if you 16 will, the very point that there is no liability 17 because if the owner did not invite you there, 18 the owner owes no obligation to you. 19 This bill goes one step further, 20 however, and says that in the lifetime of many 21 of us, we are used to a time when we used to 22 walk for miles across various parcels of private 23 land with no concern about an injury or suing 6918 1 anyone because it was taken for granted that if 2 you were injured while you were on that land, it 3 was your problem. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: 5 Excuse me, Senator. Let me apologize for the 6 interruption. 7 Senators, would you please show 8 some respect to your colleague and listen while 9 Senators are speaking, And those staff members 10 or non-Senators, please take your conversations 11 outside. 12 Senator Cook. 13 SENATOR COOK: What this bill is 14 attempting to do, then, is to, if you will, 15 revert back to the situation where if a person 16 wishes to cooperate with the extension service 17 or soil and water conservation district or 18 whoever, maybe a quasi-public entity that will, 19 in effect, set up a series of parcels of land 20 where people can utilize it for recreational 21 purposes, that you protect those landowners in 22 the same way that the state of New York is 23 protected if people are utilizing public land. 6919 1 It simply puts private land into 2 the same category, if you will, of liability as 3 would public land be placed. 4 So, it doesn't really expand or 5 contract, in my opinion, the present law, except 6 to the degree that we do say that, Okay, you 7 can't sue the landowner, but since the soil and 8 water conservation district put up a sign that 9 says that this is a hiking trail, that you can 10 sue them because their name is on it. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: 12 Senator Dollinger. 13 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Would 14 Senator Cook yield to just a couple questions? 15 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: 16 Senator Cook, would you yield to a question? 17 SENATOR COOK: Yes. 18 SENATOR DOLLINGER: First, just 19 two housekeeping questions. Do I understand 20 this is the "C" print of the bill that we did 21 last year? 22 SENATOR COOK: It's the "C" 23 print. 6920 1 SENATOR DOLLINGER: And this 2 doesn't include the provision that would allow 3 attorneys' fees to transfer, that has been 4 deleted from the bill, is that - 5 SENATOR COOK: We've taken that 6 out. 7 SENATOR DOLLINGER: A second 8 cleanup question: What does the term "speleo 9 logical" refer to? 10 SENATOR COOK: I believe that's 11 caves. 12 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Exploration 13 of caves? 14 SENATOR COOK: Exploration of 15 caves. I hadn't seen the term before. 16 One final question, through you, 17 Mr. President. 18 The example that's used in 19 opposition to this bill says what happens if 20 someone is walking across unposted land, which 21 they are trying to take advantage of this 22 section of the General Obligations Law, what 23 happens if an individual, while having 6921 1 permission to be on the land, walks across a 2 small foot bridge which is rotted out and they 3 fall through the foot bridge? Under this bill, 4 would that person have a right of action against 5 the landowner, assuming that the landowner knew 6 that the bridge had been there, hadn't been 7 repaired for the better part of a decade and 8 might be in disrepair; or would that individual 9 have no claim whatsoever? 10 SENATOR COOK: Senator, I 11 believe when you're talking about improvements 12 to property, you've created a different set of 13 tort possibilities than would exist if it were 14 not an improved piece of land. In other words, 15 if I say, "You may walk across my property," 16 that's one thing; but, as I understand it, as 17 soon as I put a foot bridge in place that I've 18 actually constructed, that becomes a liability 19 issue that's different from simply hiking across 20 open lands. 21 So, I don't think that -- I guess 22 my real answer to your question is this would 23 not change the law in regard to the foot bridge, 6922 1 whatever that law might be at the present time. 2 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Okay. And 3 again, through you, Mr. President, if I could 4 just have a clarification, what is there in the 5 bill that says that? 6 SENATOR COOK: Pardon? 7 SENATOR DOLLINGER: What is 8 there in the bill, the language of the bill, 9 that actually says that? I'm just trying to 10 make sure it - 11 SENATOR COOK: There is nothing 12 in the bill, Senator, and that's why I defer to 13 your expertise as an attorney. If you were to 14 be representing someone who is injured on a 15 piece of private property, referring to the 16 Appellate Division decision relative to section 17 99-103 of the General Obligations Law, you would 18 expect to meet that as a defense against what I 19 said about earlier, falling over a rock and 20 breaking your leg; but that would be different 21 than falling through a foot bridge and breaking 22 your leg because I'm not sure that was addressed 23 in that decision, the foot bridge having been 6923 1 something that was constructed on the property 2 as opposed to the rock that was put there by you 3 decide who. 4 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Just on the 5 bill briefly, Mr. President. 6 I appreciate Senator Cook's 7 differentiation between those two types of 8 liablity, one that flows from the naturally 9 occurring part of the land, the other that would 10 flow from the improved portion of the land. 11 I'm going to vote against this 12 bill because I'm not clear in my own mind 13 whether that differentiation is made here; and 14 although I have been involved in lawsuits 15 involving landowner liability, I'm not quite 16 sure that the differentiation that Senator Cook 17 described is actually present and currently a 18 part of our law. 19 So, because of that lack of 20 clarity on my part, I will be voting against 21 this bill. I understand the measure. I think 22 broadening and opening public lands has a 23 benefit. I'm concerned about cutting off 6924 1 people's access to redress in the event that 2 something happens on a piece of land while 3 they're walking there and the landowner has in 4 some way created an assurance and in some way 5 created a sense on the part of the person on the 6 land that this is somehow going to be safe and 7 it turns out not to be safe. 8 So, for that reason, Mr. 9 President, I'll be voting in the negative. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Read 11 the last section. 12 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This 13 act shall take effect in 30 days. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Call 15 the roll. 16 (The Secretary called the roll.) 17 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded 18 in the negative on Calendar Number 1060: 19 Senators Abate, Connor, Dollinger and Paterson. 20 Ayes 50, nays 4. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: The 22 bill is passed. 23 Senator Spano -- Senator 6925 1 Stafford. 2 SENATOR STAFFORD: Mr. 3 President, could we please call an immediate 4 meeting of the Finance Committee in Room 332, 5 please. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: There 7 will be an immediate meeting of the Finance 8 Committee in Room 332. 9 Senator Spano. 10 SENATOR SPANO: Can we return to 11 reports of standing committees? I believe there 12 is a report of the Rules Committee at the desk. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Yes, 14 there is, Senator. 15 Secretary will read. 16 THE SECRETARY: Senator Bruno, 17 from the Committee on Rules, reports the 18 following bills: 19 Senate Print 5590A, Budget Bill, 20 an act making appropriations for the support of 21 government (Education, Labor and Social Services 22 Budget); 23 5591A, Budget Bill, an act making 6926 1 appropriations for the support of government 2 (Public protection, health and mental hygiene 3 budget); 4 5592A, Budget Bill, an act making 5 appropriations for the support of government; 6 5593A, Budget Bill, an act making 7 appropriations for the support of government 8 (General government budget); 9 5595A, Budget Bill, an act making 10 appropriations for the support of government 11 (Legislature and Judiciary budget); 12 7714, by the Senate Committee on 13 Rules, an act to amend the Public Authorities 14 Law, in relation to the issuance of bonds; 15 7723, by the Senate Committee on 16 Rules, an act in relation to certain provisions 17 which impact upon the expenditure of certain 18 appropriations; 19 7724, by the Senate Committee on 20 Rules, an act in relation to certain provisions; 21 7725, by the Senate Committee on 22 Rules, an act in relation to certain provisions 23 which impact upon the expenditures of certain 6927 1 appropriations; 2 7733, by the Senate Committee on 3 Rules, an act in relation to certain provisions 4 which impact upon the expenditure of certain 5 appropriations; 6 Senate Print 2238A, by Senator 7 Padavan, an act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic 8 Law; 9 2278, by Senator Hoblock, an act 10 to amend the Labor Law, in relation to excluding 11 from an employer's experience rating charge, the 12 voluntary separation; 13 2586, by Senator Velella, an act 14 to amend Chapter 576 of the Laws of 1975; 15 2743A, by Senator Leibell, an act 16 to amend the Penal Law, in relation to 17 increasing the penalty for endangering the 18 welfare of a child; 19 2835C, by Senator DiCarlo, an act 20 to amend the Civil Service Law and the Civil 21 Practice Law and Rules, in relation to notice of 22 claim in Article 78; 23 3538A, by Senator Stafford, an 6928 1 act to amend the Soil and Water Conservation 2 Districts Law; 3 3891, by Senator Hoblock, an act 4 to amend the Labor Law, in relation to providing 5 for eligibility; 6 4160B, by Senator Marchi, an act 7 authorizing the city of New York to release its 8 interest in certain real property; 9 4672C, by Senator Tully, an act 10 to amend the Environmental Conservation Law, in 11 relation to the leasing of state-owned lands; 12 5749, by Senator Smith, an act 13 authorizing the city of New York to reconvey its 14 interest in certain real property. 15 5806, by Senator Marchi, an act 16 authorizing the city of New York to reconvey its 17 interest in certain real property; 18 5827, by Senator Maltese, an act 19 authorizing the city of New York to reconvey its 20 interest in certain real property; 21 5908, by Senator Present, an act 22 to amend the Penal Law, in relation to antique 23 slot machines; 6929 1 6058, by Senator Babbush, an act 2 authorizing the city of New York to reconvey its 3 interest in certain real property; 4 6185A, by Senator DeFrancisco, an 5 act to amend the Parks, Recreation and Historic 6 Preservation Law, in relation to the powers of 7 the commissioner; 8 6483, by Senator Spano, an act to 9 amend the Labor Law, in relation to the transfer 10 of employee accounts; 11 6540, by Senator Volker, an act 12 to amend the Executive Law, in relation to the 13 entry of arrest warrants; 14 6575, by Senator Spano, an act to 15 amend the Labor Law, the Tax Law and the 16 Administrative Code of the city of New York; 17 6611A, by Senator DiCarlo, an act 18 to amend the Executive Law, in relation to 19 making the Elderly Pharmaceutical Insurance 20 Coverage program permanent; 21 6618, by Senator Nozzolio, an act 22 to amend the Corrections Law, in relation to the 23 retaking of absconders; 6930 1 6648, by Senator Farley, an act 2 to amend the Retirement and Social Security Law, 3 in relation to clarifying eligibility 4 requirements; 5 6715, by Senator Wright, an act 6 authorizing the Commissioner of Parks, 7 Recreation and Historic Preservation to transfer 8 and convey certain state owned lands; 9 7091, by Senator Larkin, an act to amend 10 the General Municipal Law, in relation to 11 environmental facilities; 12 7158, by Senator Maltese, an act 13 authorizing the city of New York to reconvey its 14 interest in certain real property; 15 7194A, by Senator Seward, an act 16 to amend Chapter 366 of the Laws of 1994; 17 7242, by Senator Saland, an act 18 to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in 19 relation to authorizing a permit parking system; 20 7248, by Senator Saland, an act 21 to amend the Labor Law, in relation to 22 disqualification from unemployment compensation 23 benefits; 6931 1 7303A, by Senator Skelos, an act 2 to amend the General Municipal Law and the 3 General Obligations Law, in relation to the 4 scope of the cause; 5 7328A, by Senator Marcellino, an 6 act to amend the Environmental Conservation Law, 7 in relation to establishment and publication of 8 guidance memoranda; 9 7355A, by Senator Marcellino, an 10 act to amend the Environmental Conservation Law, 11 in relation to requirements under the federal 12 Clean Air Act; 13 7376B, by Senator Larkin, an act 14 to amend the General Municipal Law, in relation 15 to bell jar game regulation; 16 7423A, by Senator Volker, an act 17 relating to permitting nonbargaining units, 18 salaried employees; 19 7465, by Senator Marchi, an act 20 authorizing the city of New York to reconvey its 21 interests in certain real property; 22 7472A, by Senator Volker, an act 23 to amend the Town Law, in relation to absentee 6932 1 ballots; 2 7518, by Senator Spano, an act to 3 amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in relation 4 to establishing a residential parking system; 5 7535, by Senator Marchi, an act 6 to amend the Real Property Tax Law, in relation 7 to waivers of tax credits. 8 7623, by Senator Hoblock, an act 9 authorizing the city of Albany to lease a 10 portion of a city park to a non-for-profit 11 corporation; 12 7631, by Senator Hoblock, an act 13 to amend the Criminal Procedure Law, the Family 14 Court Act, and the Penal Law; 15 And 7721, by the Senate Committee 16 on Rules, an act to amend the Racing, Pari 17 Mutuel Wagering and Breeding Law. 18 All bills ordered directly for 19 third reading. 20 Senator Spano. 21 SENATOR SPANO: Mr. President, I 22 move we accept the report of the Rules 23 Committee. 6933 1 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: All 2 in favor of accepting the report of the Rules 3 Committee, signify by saying aye. 4 (Response of "Aye.") 5 Opposed, nay. 6 (There was no response.) 7 The report is accepted. 8 Senator Bruno. 9 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, 10 thank you. 11 Mr. President, we adopted a 12 resolution recognizing the New York City 13 firefighters. Many of them are here with us in 14 this chamber, and I was out of the chamber at 15 the time, doing some other things that are 16 preoccupying us during this lack-of-budget 17 session. 18 But, I wanted to come into the 19 chamber to just say a word to thank these fire 20 fighters that are here representing all the 21 others that can't be here. They protect 22 people, their lives, their properties, put their 23 own lives, their own health on the line. Many 6934 1 of them have lost their lives, literally, as 2 they do what they can do on behalf of the 3 public. 4 So, we in this chamber recognize 5 all the good things that you do for the people 6 of the City and, consequently, for the people of 7 this state; and we recognize that it takes 8 courage and it takes endurance and it takes 9 stamina, but most of all, it takes a heart that 10 goes out to people as you respond to over 90,000 11 fires in a year. 12 Now, that's hard for us to 13 comprehend; and when a firefighter goes in, they 14 don't know what to expect and no matter how much 15 you reherse and practice, when you're at a fire 16 and those of us that get near a fire to watch 17 the awesome power that is in a fire as it's 18 raging out of control, it takes a special kind 19 of person to be there on behalf of the people 20 that they protect. 21 So, I want to say thank you to 22 the firefighters that are here, thank all of 23 your colleagues that can't be here, and we 6935 1 salute you and thank you for all the good things 2 that you do for the people of this state. 3 My colleagues, I would give an 4 ovation and a standing ovation to our friends, 5 the New York City firefighters. 6 (Standing ovation.) 7 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: 9 Senator Bruno. 10 SENATOR BRUNO: I believe there 11 is a report from the Finance Committee at the 12 desk. Can we have the report read. I'd move 13 its adoption. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: There 15 is a report. The Secretary will read. 16 THE SECRETARY: Senator Stafford, 17 from the Committee on Finance, offers up the 18 following bills: 19 Senate Bill 7737, by the Senate 20 Committee on Rules, an act making appropriations 21 for the support of government; 22 And 7743, by the Senate Committee 23 on Rules, an act making an appropriation for the 6936 1 support of government. Both bills directly for 2 third reading. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: 4 Without objections, all bills are reported to 5 third reading. 6 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: 8 Senator Bruno. 9 SENATOR BRUNO: Can we at this 10 time take up Calendar Number 1351. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: That 12 is on Supplemental 1, Calendar 1351. 13 The Secretary will read. 14 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 15 1351, Senate Print 5590-A, Budget Bill, an act 16 making appropriations for the support of 17 government, Education, Labor and Social Services 18 Budget. 19 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: 21 Senator Bruno, an explanation has been asked 22 for. 23 Senator Bruno. 6937 1 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO: Excuse 3 me, Senator Bruno. Could we please have some 4 quiet in the chamber. Have the Sergeant-at-arms 5 please close the doors to cut down on the 6 sound. 7 Senator Bruno. 8 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, 9 approximately a year ago, a little shorter than 10 a year ago, we passed a budget in this chamber, 11 and that budget changed the direction for the 12 people of this state from the declining years of 13 the previous decade to moving this state 14 forward, where we went in one year, from 50th in 15 this country in job creation, leading the 16 country in job losses, to 6th in the country in 17 job creation, creating over 100,000 new jobs. 18 What did we do? We cut spending less than the 19 previous year, first time in 51 years. We cut 20 taxes. We cut government regulations. 21 This, Mr. President, is the first 22 of the Senate's budget package, and we will 23 present this afternoon a complete package of 6938 1 budget bills, and I emphasize that this will be 2 a completed budget. Why do we do this? Because 3 we now have a new record for a late budget. 4 We have been doing everything 5 that we can to move the process forward, and we 6 want to encourage others that are involved in 7 the process, the Assembly and the Executive, to 8 join with us in going forward in getting a 9 budget in place for the people of this state, 10 but this budget is not just a one-house budget. 11 This is a budget that we are willing to see 12 become the budget for this state. Why? Because 13 it carries forward all of the good things that 14 the Pataki administration, with we as partners 15 -- and I emphasize "we" -- in this chamber, 16 partnered with this governor in moving this 17 state forward from the losing ways of the past 18 to the winning ways that we now enjoy. 19 What does this budget do 20 generally? It cuts spending, again, second year 21 in 52 years over the previous year by about $357 22 million in the general fund, and we have 23 significant tax cuts to help stimulate and help 6939 1 move this economy forward. 2 Tax cuts first year are 90 3 million growing to about $1 billion in tax 4 relief for the people of this state over the 5 next four years, and these tax cuts start with 6 repealing what has been referred to infamously 7 as "the Cuomo tax", the Cuomo taxes on 8 properties, over a million, a surcharge of ten 9 percent. 10 Since that -- and I know that you 11 want to know this -- that since that tax went 12 into effect 12 years ago, we are the only state 13 in the United States that has this tax in 14 effect. You know why? Because when it went 15 into effect, the revenue from the sale of real 16 estate over a million to the people of this 17 state was about $800 million. 18 Last year, the revenue had 19 dropped to about $100 million. You don't have 20 to be a rocket scientist to know that if your 21 revenue is dropping from 800 million to 100 22 million over 11 years, you have done something 23 wrong, and we have done a lot wrong. We've got 6940 1 to fix it. 2 This budget takes the Cuomo tax 3 off the books. And what will the result be? An 4 independent study that was done shows -- and 5 those of you from the City ought to recognize 6 this -- $200 million in revenue to the City with 7 a repeal of this tax. The mayor is screaming 8 literally in anguish over a budget deficit. 9 This moves approximately $215 million to the 10 City directly. Why? Because about $7.7 billion 11 of property will be transferred that people have 12 been doing everything but transferring title to 13 avoid the tax. 7,000 new jobs created. So you 14 make your own judgments on how you relate to 15 that, but what I share with you is that we have 16 done a lot of damage to the people of this state 17 with that tax staying on the books. It's time 18 for that to go. 19 You know what the net impact is 20 according to this independent study? You're 21 going to ask me so I'm going to tell you. The 22 net impact to the state is something in the 23 neighborhood of $15 million, 25 to 15 million 6941 1 going down to 11-. It's of no consequence in a 2 $64 billion budget. When it drives 200 million 3 into the City, that is money that we at the 4 state won't have to put into the City, so it's a 5 net gain to the state of about 175 million as 6 relates to what we're doing. 7 We also phase out the gross 8 receipts tax on utilities which I don't have to 9 go into what the cost of utilities have been 10 doing to businesses in this state. They have 11 been leaving the state. They have been 12 inhibited in their growth and we have to start 13 phasing out the gross receipts tax. 14 We're reducing the estate taxes 15 through this budget. Why? People move to other 16 states to pass their estates because someone can 17 be in Florida when they pass away, their heirs 18 will inherit much more than they would if they 19 stayed in New York. So we have to conform to 20 the federal standards. We start moving in that 21 direction. 22 We put a petroleum business tax 23 on diesel and other fuels, and we have been 6942 1 gouging the public. We have been gouging 2 businesses. We have been putting them at a 3 disadvantage. People have been buying in other 4 states to avoid buying in New York. This puts 5 us on an equal footing. 6 There are eight or ten other 7 taxes that we affect in this budget: Sales 8 taxes, sales taxes on municipal parking, bus 9 rides, going to circuses, coin-operated car 10 washes, the hot dog tax so-called and vending 11 machines. This takes all of those taxes off the 12 books. Why? Because they're inhibitors to 13 business, and by getting them off the books will 14 help businesses, will create jobs. 15 It also addresses the high 16 property taxes in this state. We, through this 17 program, freeze property taxes. We offer a 18 program for school districts. Freeze property 19 taxes. Total tax relief fully implemented about 20 885 million, and you hear like I hear that the 21 biggest problem that people have in this state 22 are the high property taxes. Seniors can't stay 23 in their homes because they can't afford 6943 1 escalating taxes. We do something about that in 2 this budget. 3 We also -- recognizing that 4 education is a priority, priority for you, 5 priority for us, this restores about 385 million 6 in cuts that were made to school districts. 7 Why? Who asked me why? Why? Because if we 8 don't, property taxes are going to go up again 9 because there are mandates to school districts 10 and they will have to increase property taxes to 11 pay for the school aid. 12 It has $40 million in distress 13 city aid. There are cities that are on the 14 brink of bankruptcy, financial disasters. We 15 help those cities. It restores about 105 16 million to SUNY and CUNY, restorations that we 17 think are critically important. 18 Welfare in this state is 19 something that's talked about a lot. We reform 20 welfare in this budget. It saves the taxpayers 21 of this state about $88 million, but it isn't 22 the 88 million that's important for us. The 23 programs that help people give them incentive to 6944 1 get off welfare, that's what's important. What 2 we did last year took over 170,000 people off of 3 welfare in New York, 35- or 36,000 people into 4 Workfare and off welfare, based on what we did 5 last year. 6 We set through this budget a 7 60-day time limit on home relief benefits, 26 8 percent home relief grant reduction, and a five 9 percent grant reduction in the AFDC benefits. 10 Now, you might wonder if we're 11 cutting welfare income, how does that help? We 12 have incentives to get people off welfare with 13 the programs that started last year, and all of 14 us in this chamber know that if a person earns 15 what they bring to the family for themselves 16 increases their pride, makes them feel good 17 about themselves. I don't believe there are 18 many people that want to stay in a welfare state 19 where their children are learning the wrong 20 lessons. So we think that this offers the 21 property incentives and opportunities to get 22 people off welfare and into real jobs because we 23 stimulate the economy with this budget. We 6945 1 create jobs with this budget. We put people to 2 work with this budget. We continue the good 3 things that started last year that we were all 4 partners in, and it restores almost $9 million 5 to law enforcement. 6 It has reforms for the criminal 7 justice system, the sentencing reform having to 8 do with violent felons. Crime -- violent crime 9 is down in this state primarily with the work we 10 did with this Governor last year. About 11 two-thirds of all the violent felonies in this 12 state happen with repeat offenders. It stands 13 to reason if you let violent felons out of jail 14 and two-thirds of them end up back in jail after 15 they hurt somebody again, that if you keep them 16 in jail longer, let them serve their sentences, 17 those people while they're incarcerated can't be 18 hurting people on the streets. So the program 19 has been working. So we continue that, and we 20 also restore money in mental health which we 21 think is critical to keeping the programs that 22 are necessary going on behalf of the people of 23 this state. 6946 1 Again, I'm going to conclude my 2 remarks by reminding people in this chamber, 3 this is not a partisan act. What I have 4 reviewed with you is a complete and whole 5 budget, and we invite our colleagues to join in 6 this budget and stay focused on the bottom line. 7 This budget restores about 900 8 million -- 900-plus million to the Governor's 9 budget in sensitive places. Does the Governor 10 totally embrace this budget? No. Does the 11 Speaker of the Assembly totally embrace this 12 budget? No. But is this the kind of budget 13 that will do the best that can be done on behalf 14 of the people of this state? We think so, and 15 that's why we advance this for your 16 consideration, for your debate, and I would 17 encourage you to be objective, stay with the 18 program. Let's minimize the partisanship 19 because this is not a partisan issue. This is 20 an issue of putting something in place that we 21 will be behind that represents a budget for the 22 people of this state and we're long overdue in 23 passing a budget on behalf of the people of this 6947 1 state. 2 Thank you, Madam President. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 4 Connor. 5 SENATOR CONNOR: Thank you, Madam 6 President. 7 Madam President, I do believe 8 Senator Bruno is sincere when he says this is 9 the best possible budget for the people of the 10 state of New York, although I have this feeling 11 that in a week or two, he will stand up with 12 hopefully a different budget and say, "No, this 13 is the best budget for the people of the state 14 of New York." 15 Early in this budget process, 16 Madam President, the Senate Democrats put forth 17 a set of values and urged that any budget that 18 be adopted reflect those values. They're 19 fundamental New York values, Madam President. 20 They deal with providing for the future with our 21 children and their opportunity for education, 22 for higher education. They deal with today 23 economic security for our work force. They deal 6948 1 with things like training grants and retraining 2 grants for workers. 3 Now, I know Senator Bruno has 4 said we now have more people working than we did 5 a year ago but, Madam President, part-time work 6 with no benefits, two or three part-time jobs 7 with no benefits, unfortunately, has appeared to 8 be, to many people in the last year or two, to 9 be the wave of the future. 10 We put forth a value that we 11 ought to take funds and dedicate them to 12 corporations by way of tax credits for the 13 retraining of workers rather than layoffs. 14 In looking at the whole area of 15 taxes -- and we had a debate on this a couple 16 weeks ago where we put forth amendments -- while 17 we agreed with many of Senator Bruno's 18 proposals, we thought there were better taxes to 19 focus on, both for creating jobs and protecting 20 middle class homeowners. So we felt that 21 protecting the property tax was very, very 22 important. Indeed, if you look at the 23 Governor's proposal, the whole series of block 6949 1 grants would have had a devastating impact on 2 localities and counties throughout this state 3 and would have, in fact, continued the Pataki 4 pattern of shifting responsibility to localities 5 that has resulted in the kind of local property 6 tax increases that are documented to have 7 occurred in the last year and a half and, of 8 course, we urge responsibility for protecting 9 seniors, the disabled and protecting health care 10 for all New Yorkers and responsible government, 11 where in any program -- in any of government's 12 programs, we weed out fraud and abuse. We 13 eliminate partisan political patronage concerns, 14 whether it's geographic patronage or just having 15 wasteful entities as a place to bury partisan 16 appointees and, of course, we call for budget 17 reform and debt reform, and as we have this 18 debate today, I'm sure a number of my colleagues 19 will come forward and offer amendments to these 20 budget bills that will demonstrate adherence to 21 these values in a consistent way, in a way that 22 serves best the interest of all New Yorkers. 23 Now, Madam President, a year ago, 6950 1 we heard a song sung on the other side of the 2 aisle, everybody seemed to want to drink of the 3 Pataki cup in terms of budget. Today we have a 4 proposal to put forth -- you know, it's - 5 remember when Coke was countered by 7-up, I 6 guess it was, "the Un-Cola"? Now I think we 7 have 900 million up on Pataki. It's the 8 "un-Pataki" budget. 9 There's an admission here. 10 There's an admission on the part of the 11 Republicans in the New York State Senate that 12 the Pataki budget certainly as proposed in 13 December and amended in January was woefully 14 inadequate to meet the needs of New Yorkers and 15 to reflect the values that New Yorkers care 16 about, be it education, health care or safety in 17 the fight against crime, and the Governor upped 18 the ante $1 billion in March. Did this Senate 19 act by April 1st to do a one-house budget? No. 20 A dilemma -- a dilemma because even that budget, 21 $1 billion more than the Governor first 22 proposed, it seems the Senate Republicans, the 23 party who have cast aspersions for many years at 6951 1 others as wanting to spend more and more, felt 2 they needed more spending, and I don't know 3 whether it's the difference between an odd 4 numbered year or an even numbered year, or if 5 they've seen the light about the misguided 6 policies put forth by the Governor, the kind of 7 cuts that do transfer real costs to local 8 government that pressure middle class families 9 because they lose -- they lose things like an 10 opportunity for their children to have a higher 11 education in a public system that they can 12 afford and their property taxes go sky high and 13 jeopardize the very homes they live in. 14 Whatever it be, we hear a 15 different song now. We see the Senate 16 Republicans saying, in effect -- and that's the 17 real story. Isn't the real story here today 18 that the Senate Republicans want to spend $900 19 million more than the Governor put forth in 20 March? Who's the big spenders? I don't know. 21 Senator Bruno, in all candor, said the Governor 22 doesn't accept this budget. The Speaker doesn't 23 accept this budget. It's a one-house budget. 6952 1 Frankly, as I look through these 2 bills -- and there are a number of budget bills 3 here and they stack quite high -- I can find 4 something in every one of these bills, sometimes 5 more than one thing, that I like. I like some 6 of the things that Senator Bruno outlined, and 7 there's something good in every one of these 8 bills but, you know, there's some things in 9 these bills, Madam President, that I don't like, 10 some things that don't meet the needs of New 11 Yorkers because they don't reflect our 12 fundamental values about preserving jobs for the 13 middle class, about rewarding work, about 14 creating jobs, about providing a future for our 15 children. 16 Now, in the ordinary course, were 17 this an agreed-upon budget, I would view it 18 through a different pair of glasses. I would 19 focus on the half of the cup that's full, and we 20 do that every year in all candor. Oh, an 21 agreed-upon budget? It's the best we can do. 22 Look at all the good things in it. Look at the 23 half filled cup, but this is a one-house 6953 1 exercise, a one-house, not even partisan, not if 2 the Governor and the Majority in this house all 3 belong to the same party -- although looking 4 around this house, reading the papers in the 5 last few weeks, maybe there are two Republican 6 parties out there. I see a lot of charges 7 flying back and forth involving some of the 8 highest elected officials in this state and in 9 this country. Be that as it may, if they 10 repealed the Eleventh Commandment of the 11 Republican Party, this budget certainly 12 indicates there may be two Republican parties in 13 this very Capitol, but it's a one-house budget, 14 and I can't help looking at the half of the cup 15 that's empty, and when it's a one-house budget 16 and I look at all the things that aren't in this 17 budget or all the things that are in this budget 18 that I don't like, I say why not vote against 19 it? Why not vote against it? It's not a final 20 product. Why give a stamp of approval to a half 21 finished work that does leave much to be 22 desired? 23 Therefore, I intend to vote 6954 1 against these bills, but I intend to support 2 amendments that reflect the values that I have 3 articulated that my Senate Democratic colleagues 4 have put forth during this budget process, 5 because until we get away from the partisan 6 bickering that has made this budget a record 7 late budget -- indeed, the record has been 8 broken and here we are today in the last week of 9 session dealing with a one-house budget that's 10 going nowhere, that the Republican Governor 11 doesn't support, that the Democratic Speaker 12 doesn't support, here we are getting ready to go 13 home for the summer without a real budget, a 14 real budget. 15 So we have to put aside that kind 16 of partisan bickering, the kind of accounting 17 that says, Oh, we're spending a little less and 18 we're spending more. He wants to spend more. I 19 want to spend less. This year it's very 20 confusing. The Governor wants to spend less. 21 The Republicans in the Senate want to spend 22 more, far more than the Governor, their 23 governor, and they're even putting it out here 6955 1 for a vote on a one-house basis. 2 Unless we get away from that and 3 look at New Yorkers' needs, look at the kind of 4 values that New Yorkers always upheld, unless we 5 look to the future, unless we look to job 6 security for middle class working people and 7 unless we figure out how to provide jobs for 8 those who want to work and can't find work, we 9 have failed to live up to the kind of values we 10 ought to espouse. 11 Therefore, Madam President, I 12 would urge all of my colleagues to support the 13 amendments that will be put forth here and 14 should they fail -- should they fail because the 15 Senate wing of the Republican Party, the 16 "un-Pataki" wing, votes down these amendments, 17 then I would urge that we vote against this at 18 best half-finished product. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 20 Gold. 21 SENATOR GOLD: Yeah. Madam 22 President, would Senator Bruno yield to a 23 question or two? 6956 1 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 2 Bruno, would you yield to Senator Gold for a 3 question? 4 SENATOR BRUNO: Yes, Mr. 5 President -- Madam President. 6 SENATOR GOLD: Senator Bruno, you 7 indicated that you thought that the elimination 8 of the luxury sales tax -- which on a partisan 9 basis, of course, you like to call "the Cuomo 10 tax" -- would mean about $200 million for the 11 city of New York. 12 Senator, is there anything in 13 your proposal that has any kind of hold harmless 14 to the City on that? I mean, you're asking us 15 to vote for this and say that we're going to 16 give our Republican -- I'm sorry -- we're going 17 to give our mayor a $200 million hit to help him 18 fill a budget and you've also said that 19 eliminating this tax means a huge number of 20 jobs. Well, if we're wrong, Senator -- I know 21 we've done this with other taxes before where we 22 have been wrong -- wouldn't it be nice to at 23 least give him that cushion? You said it very 6957 1 confidently -- and you're a man who I know means 2 what he says. Is there anything in the bill 3 that gives the City that cushion if we turn out 4 to be wrong? 5 SENATOR BRUNO: No, there is no 6 guarantee, but we did the best that we could to 7 make sure that what we're talking about is 8 accurate. We used the Wharton School of Finance 9 -- or that's the institution that was used, and 10 they objectively had compiled the information 11 that I'm sharing with you. It stands to reason 12 to me and common sense would dictate that if 13 people are not transferring property because of 14 that tax that they would have to pay -- and we 15 all know that that's the case because you can 16 look at the records in the transfers of title - 17 that if you lift that inhibition, that there's 18 going to be activity and that activity will 19 create taxes for the City. That, to me, is 20 common sense. 21 SENATOR GOLD: Will the Senator 22 yield to another question? 23 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 6958 1 Bruno, will you yield? 2 SENATOR BRUNO: Yes, Madam 3 President. 4 SENATOR GOLD: Senator, of 5 course, everybody also knows that over the last 6 11 years, real estate values have not 7 skyrocketed the way they did in prior years and 8 maybe that's the reason why people haven't sold, 9 but on another issue, you said that your -- this 10 first budget bill restores -- I think that was 11 your word -- $385 million for education. By 12 restoring, you're actually saying that we are 13 going to spend, if we pass your budget, 385 14 million more dollars, more spending for 15 education than the Governor's proposal, is that 16 correct? 17 SENATOR BRUNO: Those are 18 approximate numbers, yes, Senator Gold. 19 SENATOR GOLD: And having said 20 that, Senator, I think you said that if we don't 21 do that, property taxes would go up. 22 SENATOR BRUNO: Well, that's the 23 history. When we deny school aid, municipali 6959 1 ties are locked in and they have one place to 2 raise their budgets and that's with property 3 taxes in their school districts. So that's 4 usually the consequence. 5 SENATOR GOLD: So if I understand 6 it, Senator Bruno, the budget as proposed by 7 Governor Pataki, if not addressed in this area, 8 would have unquestionably meant increases in 9 local property taxes, is that correct? 10 SENATOR BRUNO: Well, that is a 11 district-by-district judgment to be made, but 12 that we feel that it would have that kind of an 13 effect. 14 SENATOR GOLD: And, Senator, in 15 terms of the -- I think you said $106 million - 16 again -- restoration to CUNY and SUNY - 17 SENATOR BRUNO: Yes. 18 SENATOR GOLD: -- is it your 19 statement that if we did not make that 20 restoration and we passed the budget as proposed 21 by the Governor, it would be a disaster for 22 those two university systems? 23 SENATOR BRUNO: No. We don't 6960 1 think it would be a disaster. We think that it 2 might necessitate some adjustments and some of 3 them would be very difficult adjustments, and I 4 believe the original cuts were in the neighbor 5 hood of 270 million, give or take 10 million, 6 and we think that some cuts are warranted, but 7 we don't think it would be a disaster, but we 8 think that we're trying to transition the system 9 into where they ought to be. 10 SENATOR GOLD: Thank you. 11 Madam President, on the bill, and 12 just for the - 13 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: On the 14 bill. 15 SENATOR GOLD: My understanding, 16 we are now -- while Senator Bruno and Senator 17 Connor made general comments, I believe we're on 18 5590-A, is that correct? 19 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: That's 20 correct. 21 SENATOR GOLD: All right. Madam 22 President, I -- I think first of all that the 23 remarks of Senator Bruno are a complete 6961 1 vindication for everybody in this chamber and 2 everybody in the Assembly for not passing the 3 Governor's budget. So if we do nothing else, at 4 least let's congratulate ourselves that we saved 5 the people of the state from the disasters of 6 the budget. The Governor submitted a budget in 7 December. He amended it in January, and this 8 budget offered today, if nothing else, indicates 9 that if we had passed that budget in January, we 10 would have wreaked disaster upon the people of 11 this state. 12 The Governor, who is a good 13 person, apparently got some religion in March 14 and he added another billion dollars into this 15 budget. Today's offering by the Republican 16 Majority in this house is a vindication of 17 everyone in this house for not passing the new 18 budget of the Governor in March because the bill 19 offered by the Republicans today with its 20 additional -- almost $1 billion in additional 21 spending shows what a disaster upon the people 22 of this state the Governor's budget would have 23 been. 6962 1 Now, I am not suggesting at any 2 point that the Governor is evil -- he is not - 3 that the Governor is mean because he's not, but 4 let's call it the way it is. If the budget had 5 been passed and we walked downstairs and said, 6 "Governor, here it is", we would have caused 7 disaster throughout this state, and most of you 8 from upstate New York would have been faced with 9 huge outcries because of increases in local 10 property taxes as Senator Bruno acknowledges, 11 and in the city of New York and in some of the 12 other cities throughout the state, we would have 13 been faced with total disaster. 14 I shouldn't tell this to Senator 15 Bruno in public, but the way he uses logic and 16 language, you really are one of my idols. 17 Senator, you say that this is the second year in 18 a row that we have cut spending. The truth is 19 it's about the 22nd year in a row that the 20 Republican Majority in this house has urged a 21 budget that's greater in spending than the 22 Governor. Now, that's the reality. Whether 23 that governor was Carey, whether that governor 6963 1 was Cuomo or whether that governor is Pataki, 2 whatever the governor says, you spend more. 3 Now, Senator, I don't mind that 4 you do it. I mind that you do it and then some 5 of your colleagues, not as honorable and as open 6 as you are, Senator, run away from it. I know 7 one of my colleagues who has a big grin -- but I 8 won't mention our law professor by name -- gets 9 very excited when I say, "Senator, you're 10 spending more than the Governor" and he says, 11 "No, no, no. We've cut it by this. We've cut 12 it -- it's less than last" -- it's more than the 13 Governor. That's all. Let's put it where it's 14 at. 15 Last year, you were 1.6 billion 16 more than the Governor. Now this year it's only 17 1.2 or 900 million, but it's more, and I don't 18 know how you get around that in any practical 19 way. 20 This particular bill, just so we 21 understand it, does a lot of things, and as 22 Senator Connor pointed out, some of it is good. 23 I don't think that you can spend $400 million 6964 1 more than the Governor and not be something 2 good, but that's what this particular bill does 3 do, as I understand it, and while I am not happy 4 with what this bill, even in its amended state, 5 would do to CUNY and SUNY, the fact is that we 6 do give them, as the Senator pointed out, more 7 money. 8 I would hope -- and this is my 9 last comment on this -- I would just hope that 10 in addition to passing a one-house budget today, 11 that perhaps for the first time in a long, long 12 time, maybe the press will get it right and at 13 least report on what happens here, and what is 14 happening here is that the Majority is coming 15 out, the Majority is looking the public in the 16 face and saying, Okay. Let's forget the tax cut 17 thought. We have to put money into certain 18 places and, therefore, we are going to tell you 19 that we have to spend $900 million more. 20 Senator, I would respect that, 21 and if you want my cooperation, Senator Bruno, 22 in fixing the Governor's budget, I'll be glad to 23 do it. There are some areas where you have done 6965 1 a good job. Unfortunately, Senator Bruno, there 2 are some areas that you haven't dealt with very, 3 very well. Whether the luxury tax is the best 4 one to deal with or some other one is something 5 that ought to be discussed, but I am delighted 6 that once and for all -- once and for all, maybe 7 we can stop with some of the masquerading that 8 goes on around here and each one of you can 9 stand up when you vote for this budget and say, 10 Yes, the Governor is a good man; the Governor is 11 an honorable man, but he doesn't know how to 12 spend as well as I do because you certainly are 13 bigger spenders than the Governor of this state. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Read the 15 last section. 16 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 17 act shall take effect immediately. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 19 Montgomery, why do you rise? 20 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Madam 21 President, I have an amendment at the desk to 22 Calendar 1351, Senate Bill 5590. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: The 6966 1 amendment is at the desk. 2 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: I would like 3 to waive its reading. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Waive the 5 reading. Would you like to speak on the 6 amendment? 7 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes, I would 8 like to speak on the amendment. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 10 Montgomery, on the amendment. 11 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Thank you. 12 I hear the illustrious leader of 13 the Senate talking about all of the aspects of 14 this bill that he thinks are an improvement in 15 the fiscal state of our state and while I can 16 certainly agree on some of the areas, there are 17 some glaring omissions that I would just like to 18 raise in this amendment, and part of what I'm 19 going to raise deals with the one thing that I 20 think we all agree in this room that is pivotal 21 to opportunity and to the future economy and the 22 future development of the potential of people in 23 this state, and that is higher education. 6967 1 I -- Madam President, my -- my 2 amendment just simply enhances what is being 3 proposed here in some very important ways. For 4 instance, I note that the CSTEP in this bill has 5 been eliminated. I would like to see that 6 important program which introduces young people 7 to science at an early age, STEP, CSTEP, I would 8 like to see those funded at the level at least 9 that they were last year. I'm proposing that 10 CSTEP be funded at the level of three and a half 11 million. 12 The other important area that is 13 very, very small -- it's minuscule when you look 14 at this total budget, yet it is extremely 15 important in developing teachers who are able to 16 go in and work effectively with young people in 17 their classrooms no matter where they are and 18 where they come from and what their background, 19 and that's the Teacher Opportunity Corps. I 20 would like to see that funded. That has been 21 eliminated. I think that is a mistake. 22 Let's fund TAP to at least 90 23 percent of the tuition. That would cost 45 6968 1 million. However, that's, again, a minuscule 2 amount of money for an extremely important 3 program that provides opportunity for people who 4 otherwise would not be able to attend a - 5 higher ed' institutions. 6 We have already lost some 20,000 7 young people who are no longer able to afford to 8 access higher education. That is shameful, and 9 let's not continue that -- that mistake. 10 So, Madam President, my -- my 11 amendment would restore funding so that we could 12 continue to at least fund TAP to -- up to 90 13 percent of the costs of tuition. 14 In addition, my amendment 15 addresses the children and family block grant. 16 That needs to be at least restored up to '94-95 17 levels. The cost is $10 million, but we're 18 saving lives. This is not -- this is not a 19 program that -- where -- that people are enter 20 tained. We are not paying for entertainment of 21 people. We're paying to save lives of young 22 people, young children and their families. 23 We talk about removing people 6969 1 from the welfare rolls, and I am probably, out 2 of everybody in here, despite what you may think 3 -- you think, I probably would like to see 4 people removed from welfare more than anybody 5 else in here because it's demeaning and it's 6 disgusting and it takes away your basic sense of 7 personhood and esteem. It's an awful way to 8 have to live to be essentially on the dole, and 9 it's embarrassing. So we should certainly be 10 supporting that. How do you do it? You have to 11 provide day care, child care. It is a pivotal 12 part and you have to provide jobs for people and 13 opportunity. 14 So, Madam President, my amendment 15 simply says, let's live up to what we talk about 16 we want. We say that we want to get people off 17 of welfare. Fine. Let's make it possible for 18 them to access higher education. We say we want 19 people to be able to go to work. Fine. Let's 20 -- let's present a budget that has those oppor 21 tunities, especially by way of jobs, new job 22 opportunities, and we say that we want women to 23 go to work. We don't want them to sit home. We 6970 1 don't want them to be mothers that just sit home 2 and take care of their children. We really want 3 them to go to work. Fine. I agree with that, 4 as long as we have day care for them, for their 5 children so the children can be safe while 6 parents work and/or while they are able to 7 access higher education. 8 So, Madam President, I think that 9 my amendment makes so much sense. This is 10 probably a historical moment in this house. 11 We're going to vote for it because you want the 12 same things that I do. I know that Senator 13 Bruno wants that. He talks about it all the 14 time how he doesn't want people begging and he 15 doesn't want people on welfare and he doesn't 16 want people to be on the dole. 17 So, Senator Bruno, live up to 18 your words. Let's do the right thing for once, 19 make sure we have day care, add the $10 million 20 that I propose or the $18 million that I 21 propose. Restore $10 million to the children 22 and family block grant, and let's raise the 23 tuition so that people can, in fact -- are able 6971 1 to access higher education. 2 Thank you, Madam President. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Thank 4 you, Senator Montgomery. 5 Senator Padavan. 6 SENATOR PADAVAN: Would Senator 7 Montgomery yield to a question? 8 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 9 Montgomery yields to Senator Padavan. 10 SENATOR PADAVAN: First off, I 11 heard your initiatives and the things that you 12 spoke to, and I just have one simple question. 13 Reflecting on the dialogue we listened to 14 earlier between the chairman, the Minority 15 member of Finance and the Majority Leader -- can 16 you give us an idea roughly what the total 17 increase would be beyond the budget bill before 18 us by virtue of all these amendments? 19 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: You want to 20 know what my budget bill would be? I believe my 21 budget would cost somewhere around 51 million - 22 51 million, very small amount. I'm not asking 23 for a lot. 6972 1 SENATOR PADAVAN: 51 million? 2 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: This is not 3 a big restoration, Senator. 51 million. 4 SENATOR PADAVAN: 51 million. 5 That would be the addition beyond that which is 6 currently before us. 7 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: This is just 8 -- this would bring it up to how we funded 9 these programs last year. 10 SENATOR PADAVAN: Thank you very 11 much. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: The 13 question is on the amendment. 14 Senator Leichter. 15 SENATOR LEICHTER: Madam 16 President, yes. I just wanted to elaborate a 17 little bit on Senator Montgomery's answer to 18 Senator Padavan's question. Senator, you take 19 it as a given that we accept all of your 20 spending initiatives. We would make a lot of 21 changes if we had a budget that really served 22 the interests of the people of the state of New 23 York. So some of the - 6973 1 SENATOR PADAVAN: Would you 2 yield, Senator? 3 SENATOR LEICHTER: Sure. 4 SENATOR PADAVAN: You did not 5 hear me correctly. I said what was the net - 6 now, I didn't hear any amendments, at least in 7 Senator Montgomery's presentation, that deleted 8 anything in this budget. Now, if there are some 9 to come, I will be very attentive. This was in 10 addition. It was not a deletion of any other 11 part of the budget. 12 Now, if you're saying that you're 13 going to propose removing certain items from the 14 budget that have dollar signs associated with 15 them, I will be very attentive to what you have 16 to say. 17 I implied no such conclusion. I 18 simply added -- asked what was the net result of 19 this amendment. 20 SENATOR LEICHTER: Madam 21 President. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 23 Leichter. 6974 1 SENATOR LEICHTER: I'm happy to 2 respond to my good friend, but the very premise 3 of your question was that taking your budget as 4 a baseline, it would add so much. We don't take 5 your budget as a baseline. I don't think that 6 when you have an amendment to the budget that 7 deals with one specific area that you're 8 required to take a one-house budget bill and 9 make adjustments in it and point out to you how 10 it works out. 11 So the fact of the matter is that 12 this is not a $51 million addition to what your 13 budget is because we happen to disagree with the 14 budget. We can do it by amendments. Some of us 15 are going to do it by voting against your 16 amendment showing in that sense how we feel that 17 that budget, in many respects, has misplaced 18 priorities. 19 SENATOR PADAVAN: Madam 20 President. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 22 Leichter. 23 SENATOR PADAVAN: Senator, I 6975 1 think in the last sentence you just made, you 2 clarified the issue. I think it's an obligation 3 we all have, that if we're going to say we're 4 spending too much -- and certainly that was the 5 clear implication and the comments of Senator 6 Gold and Senator Connor -- I have no quarrel 7 with some of the initiatives outlined by Senator 8 Montgomery, but I think we have an obligation if 9 we're going to say this budget is unsatisfactory 10 because it doesn't do this but it should not do 11 that, to not give us half the story. If you 12 want to add 51 million, fine. Show us within 13 the parameters that you already stated here 14 where that will come from in some other portion 15 of the budget. Are you going to reduce aid to 16 education 51 million? Are you going to reduce 17 mental health 51 million, or whatever the number 18 turns out to be when we hear all the 19 amendments. I think that's an obligation we 20 have. 21 Now, you say you're going to 22 demonstrate that by voting against the budget. 23 Well, fine. That's your prerogative. No 6976 1 quarrel with that either, but don't start off 2 the debate by lecturing us that this budget is 3 more than the Governor presented to us when you 4 and your amendments are going to do even more 5 so. 6 SENATOR LEICHTER: Senator - 7 Senator Padavan. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 9 Padavan. 10 SENATOR LEICHTER: Just to answer 11 you, I think that Senator Connor and Senator 12 Gold -- and I was in the Conference Committee 13 and didn't hear everything they said, but I 14 heard enough and I know the viewpoints -- I 15 think they wanted everybody to understand what 16 you were doing. They felt that it is wrong for 17 the Senate Republicans to hide under a smoke 18 screen that "we are cutting spending" when, in 19 fact, you're not. That doesn't mean -- and I 20 heard Senator Gold say it -- that he doesn't 21 agree with some of your initiatives, but let's 22 be honest. He wanted you to be honest as a 23 Majority, not you individually, Senator, because 6977 1 you are, but as a Majority to be honest and to 2 tell the people, We are increasing spending. 3 That doesn't mean -- that doesn't mean that here 4 and there that we don't agree with you, here and 5 there we disagree with you. I was just 6 concerned, Senator, that you were getting the 7 wrong impression on Senator Montgomery's 8 amendment and that you were thinking that we 9 were accepting your budget. 10 SENATOR PADAVAN: I don't think 11 there's - 12 SENATOR LEICHTER: Your budget 13 doesn't seem to be accepted by your own 14 governor, so why should we accept it? 15 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 16 Padavan to respond to Senator Leichter. 17 SENATOR PADAVAN: Senator, you 18 read the papers just the way I do. The Majority 19 has been stating time and time again on, I might 20 add, some occasions very similar to the 21 Assembly, that we wish to add to the Governor's 22 budget based on estimates of revenue and other 23 considerations. There's never been any secret 6978 1 about that. That's been going on for weeks, if 2 not months. Your suggestion that we are not 3 being honest -- well, you just haven't been 4 paying attention. That's been stated time and 5 time again. 6 The only comment made here today, 7 if I heard the Majority Leader correctly -- and 8 I did -- was that this budget is less than last 9 year by 357 million. Nowhere, at no time has 10 anybody said that this budget -- these budget 11 bills are not greater than that proposed by the 12 Governor. We have been perfectly honest in that 13 regard. 14 However, I think your rhetoric 15 was somewhat oblique when you bring up the point 16 that we are spending more than the Governor and 17 then you go on to present amendments that do 18 even more so. I think, you know, if we want to 19 be honest, I think we have that obligation but 20 let's not play games while we're doing it. 21 SENATOR GOLD: Madam President. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 23 Gold. 6979 1 SENATOR GOLD: Would Senator 2 Padavan yield? 3 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 4 Padavan, will you yield to Senator Gold? 5 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: The 7 Senator yields. 8 SENATOR GOLD: First of all, 9 Senator, I want to clarify the record. I didn't 10 say we were spending too much. I think Senator 11 Leichter hit it right on the head, and I'm glad 12 you're finally acknowledging it, just for the 13 clarity of the record of who's doing what but, 14 Senator, I've heard this spending less than last 15 year $357 million. 16 Senator, the fact of the matter 17 is, is it not, that last year you and your 18 Majority increased the Governor's budget by 1.6 19 billion and this year your agreement with the 20 Assembly was only 1.2 billion. So it's not that 21 you're spending less money than last year. What 22 you're doing is maybe adding to the Governor's 23 budget a little less than last year, but you're 6980 1 certainly, as you did last year and the year 2 before and the year before, spending more money 3 every year than the governors have asked for. 4 SENATOR PADAVAN: The Governor's 5 budget request has been cut -- are you going to 6 listen to the phone -- is something that we have 7 all been made aware of since the middle of 8 December, and this Majority, and I might add the 9 Majority in the Assembly, has labored with that 10 budget in a variety of ways. You participated 11 in public hearings chaired by Senator Stafford 12 and others over an extended period of time where 13 we've listened to the people of this state. 14 We've listened to representatives from our city, 15 from the mayor, from the speaker of the City 16 Council and many, many others have come here for 17 months now pointing out areas where they feel 18 adjustments in the Governor's budget were 19 appropriate and desirable. We have heard the 20 people, and Senator Bruno presents to you a 21 budget that reflects what the people have said. 22 Now, you can categorize that any 23 way you wish. We have not hid from the simple 6981 1 fact that this budget exceeds the Governor's 2 proposal, and you -- I don't even know why you 3 feel it necessary to bring that up. It's a 4 known fact. 5 SENATOR GOLD: Madam President. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 7 Padavan, will you yield to Senator Gold? 8 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: The 10 Senator yields. 11 SENATOR GOLD: Senator, I'll tell 12 you why I bring it up, and one of my colleagues 13 -- one of my dear friends was concerned last 14 week because somebody was making reference to a 15 memo and whether the bill or the memo -- and 16 from my point of view, I'm concerned about what 17 we say to the public. Forget whether it's a 18 bill or a memo. What we say to the public. 19 Senator Bruno's press release 20 today in his fourth or fifth paragraph doesn't 21 say, And we are proud once again to spend more 22 money than suggested by the Governor because we 23 held hearings and we're concerned about the 6982 1 needs of the people. It says, quote, "The 2 Senate budget spends 357 million less than the 3 general fund than last year", and that's where 4 you're focusing people. 5 I want people to focus on the 6 truth. The truth is that you last year spent 7 1.6 billion more than the Governor wanted and so 8 this year you're a little less, but at least 9 let's let them know what's going on and then 10 we'll be able to argue from there about it, and 11 just so we have it clear, according to the press 12 reports and according to the shaking of hands 13 that I heard about, the Majority in this house 14 agreed with the Majority in the other house to 15 spend 1.2 billion. So that if you take the 16 amendment of Senator Montgomery, we're still way 17 within what you on the other side agreed we 18 could spend, way within it, and if we do some 19 things which some of us believe must be done for 20 Medicaid and put in another 140 million in that 21 to take care of people who really need it, we're 22 still within the bounds because the fact is that 23 if the Governor went along with you and the 6983 1 Majority in the other house, we would have 2 before us an additional $300 million in spending 3 than this bill puts forth. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 5 Waldon. 6 SENATOR WALDON: Thank you very 7 much, Madam President. 8 Would Senator Montgomery yield to 9 a question or two? 10 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 11 Montgomery, will you yield to Senator Waldon? 12 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: The 14 Senator yields. 15 SENATOR WALDON: Senator 16 Montgomery, I was very intrigued by your 17 presentation regarding your amendment. One, it 18 was eloquently stated. Two, you went point by 19 point for us telling us the needs as you saw 20 them regarding certain issues contained in the 21 proposal that we are considering, and I was 22 wondering, is this something that just dropped 23 out of the air to you, or did your constituents 6984 1 actually call you, or did your research motivate 2 you to put this amendment together, or who did 3 you hear which caused you to submit this for our 4 consideration as an amendment? Would you please 5 edify us? 6 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Well, Madam 7 President - 8 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 9 Montgomery. 10 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: -- in answer 11 to Senator Waldon, Senator Waldon - 12 SENATOR WALDON: I can't hear, 13 Madam President. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: A little 15 quiet in the chamber, please. 16 Thank you. 17 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: -- I have 18 for some years been very much involved in the 19 whole issue of what are the things that we do in 20 the state of New York that really, in fact, work 21 to support families moving from welfare to 22 independence; and one of the things that we have 23 found based on studies that have been done 6985 1 funded by state education, done by City 2 University Graduate Center, looking at what 3 happens to people who are able to go through 4 college, receive a degree at different levels, 5 come out; where does that put them in 6 relationship to the welfare system? That study 7 has been replicated around the nation, and the 8 answer is simple, that if a person -- if it's a 9 young person or if it's a parent who goes back 10 to school, if that person is able to go through 11 college successfully, if they receive a two-year 12 degree, they do very well. If they receive a 13 four-year degree, they do even better. They are 14 95 to 99 percent likely never to have to require 15 the use of publicly funded services. 16 So that this is an investment. 17 Higher education in the state of New York is an 18 investment, and it is an investment in reducing, 19 in fact, the cost to the state of people who 20 need services on an -- on a limitless basis. 21 So what my proposal does, Senator 22 Waldon, is speak to what we know works in the 23 state because we've done it and we've seen how 6986 1 it works. I've also had hundreds and hundreds 2 of letters from young people who are in school, 3 many people who've said they've had to drop out 4 of school because they can no longer afford to 5 go to college. This is very heartbreaking, some 6 people who are in their last semester in 7 college. So this has really been a very, very 8 -- a very, very disappointing problem that we 9 have created based on last year's cuts. 10 So what I'm trying to do is at 11 least bring us to restore what we were able to 12 do at least last year so that we don't continue 13 to lose young people from the system. 14 Day care is important. On a 15 daily basis, I get phone calls from some parent 16 needing day care. "I'm eligible. I'm within 17 the income eligibility but there is no child 18 care for me. I want to go to school. I don't 19 have child care. Where can I get it?" These 20 are -- these are very troublesome times, and 21 what I'm saying is that the state cannot afford 22 to just back away from people. This is an 23 investment that we make and, Madam President, to 6987 1 Senator Waldon, it just didn't come off the top 2 of my head. I'm not just begging for some more 3 money so that people can enjoy themselves. I'm 4 asking this -- this house to look at my 5 amendment as a statement of investment in our 6 future. It is the future of the state that is 7 at stake, not just the individual young person 8 who's dropped out of school. For every little 9 person that we lose out of school, for every 10 parent who doesn't have child care who can't go 11 to work, for every person who can't go to 12 college because TAP isn't there, the state 13 loses. It is our loss. So let's not -- let's 14 not be foolish about this. 15 Maybe we cannot afford the taxes 16 that Senator Bruno has outlined that he wants to 17 cut. Yes, I want to cut taxes because I want 18 businesses to be able to flourish in this 19 state. I'm not anti-business, but there is a 20 point where you have to say, We have to 21 establish some priorities and investment to any 22 business person is a priority. Investment in 23 your business' growth is a priority. That has 6988 1 to be a priority. Investment in the people in 2 our state has to be a priority for the state. 3 So, Senator Waldon, it didn't 4 just come off the top of my head. This is a 5 sincere request of my colleagues to make some 6 sense today with this budget by adopting this 7 amendment. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 9 Waldon. 10 SENATOR WALDON: Madam President, 11 would the gentle lady from Kings County yield to 12 just one more question? 13 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 14 Montgomery, would you yield? 15 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: The 17 Senator yields. 18 SENATOR WALDON: Senator, I'm 19 touched by what you said. I thought you were 20 really on point. Your sensitivity to people who 21 are least able to take care of themselves is 22 legend in this house. 23 What I think I heard you say sub 6989 1 rosa, underneath all of your words, was that 2 government should be in the business of people, 3 and impliedly in those statements, I believe you 4 said -- and I wish you to correct me if I was in 5 error -- that our highest priority should be the 6 people of the state of New York, ensuring that 7 they could have the very best and highest 8 quality of life and that your amendment would go 9 a long way towards ensuring that mandate. Is 10 that what I heard, Senator? 11 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Absolutely. 12 Absolutely, Madam President. That is exactly 13 what I would like to do. 14 SENATOR WALDON: Madam President, 15 my colleague, I thank you very much. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 17 Oppenheimer, on the amendment. 18 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: I would 19 like to ask a question, if I may, of the 20 sponsor. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 22 Montgomery, do you yield to Senator 23 Oppenheimer? 6990 1 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: The 3 Senator yields. 4 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: I would 5 like you to answer the question, how would we 6 proceed with moving low income women off -- of 7 families off of welfare if we did not have this 8 low income child care subsidy; because these 9 families very likely have small children and 10 since we cannot leave them out on the street, we 11 have to find some low income subsidies so that 12 the child of the welfare family will have a 13 place to go while the mother either takes job 14 training or education. Is there an alternative 15 to not moving ahead with low income child care 16 subsidy? Is there any choice? 17 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 18 Montgomery. 19 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: There is no 20 alternative that I'm aware of to provide for the 21 children of parents who are young children, in 22 particular, and children in general. We have - 23 we serve about five percent of the need for - 6991 1 for day care in this state, quality day care 2 services. This doesn't begin to even address 3 the real need, but it at least provides for the 4 localities resources where they can begin to 5 provide more, hopefully, day care which begins 6 to meet the needs of these particular families. 7 Let me just say that what has 8 happened in New York City, in particular, is 9 that we have, in fact, lost day care for working 10 families. The day care that we have now targets 11 those parents that we want to get off of welfare 12 but at the same time, we are throwing out the 13 children of parents who are marginal, though 14 they're working. So it's very likely that we're 15 going to create a situation where they're going 16 to come back onto welfare and then once again 17 they will be eligible for whatever small amount 18 of day care services that we have. 19 So this -- we cannot -- we cannot 20 expect our welfare reform movement to be 21 successful ever if we are not willing to provide 22 child care services which allow people to go to 23 work. That is what happened in World War II 6992 1 when we needed women working. That's what 2 happened in New York City. That's when we came 3 into the welfare -- the day care business. It 4 was set up so that women could go to work. 5 That's when the government needed them to go to 6 work because the men were gone to war. 7 So I say if we're at war with 8 this -- with welfare reform and we want to 9 really -- we want to get rid of it, we want to 10 make it so that people are not bound to be on 11 welfare, then we have to understand what will 12 make that possible and child care is important, 13 and I don't know any other way of doing it 14 without child care services. 15 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: And - 16 would you yield for another question? 17 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 18 Montgomery continues to yield. 19 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Thank you, 20 Ms. President. 21 Would you say that in most other 22 countries in the industrialized world, that this 23 understanding of providing assistance to 6993 1 families that are working but low income, 2 working their at least 40 hours a week, probably 3 more, but still do not have the money necessary 4 to provide for the children to go to child care 5 because it's costly? Would you say that this 6 country would -- and this state would rightly - 7 would be moving in the correct direction to try 8 to remediate what is a major problem now and 9 also if you would comment on the need for the 10 quality child care that these low income 11 families need. 12 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Let me just 13 say, Madam President, that some of the other 14 countries that we are aware of place their 15 children as a priority. So even though some of 16 them are not as well placed as the U.S. but - 17 they make sure that there is child care 18 available for at least 75 or more percent of 19 their children. France is one of them that has 20 for years, for decades, been a leader in the 21 world in terms of the way that it provides for 22 its young children. Britain is another place 23 where there are modeled -- there's a model 6994 1 approach to young children, that young children 2 are important and they provide for them. China 3 even provides for children to have -- to be 4 cared for at the workplace. They've done that 5 for -- for many years. Israel is another place 6 where children are -- are cared for, and these 7 are model nations where the child is viewed as 8 an asset and, therefore, it is a requirement 9 that we invest so that our assets grow and are 10 productive and our economy expands and our 11 literacy rate is addressed, and so on. 12 So there are many, many examples 13 around the world. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 15 DiCarlo, why do you rise? 16 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: And so we 17 are very far behind in this country, in fact, 18 and let me just say that New York State has been 19 in the past a leader at least in the nation. 20 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator, 22 would you excuse the interruption? Senator 23 DiCarlo has risen. 6995 1 Senator, why do you rise? 2 SENATOR DiCARLO: Thank you, 3 Madam President. 4 Would Senator Montgomery yield 5 for a question? 6 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator, 7 would you yield for a question? 8 SENATOR SKELOS: If I could 9 interrupt for one minute, if we could. Just for 10 the order of -- maintaining order in the house, 11 if we could direct -- rather than having a 12 conversation between two members, if we could 13 direct the question and the answer through the 14 Chair, I think it would make the conversation a 15 lot more productive. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator, 17 would you allow an interruption? Senator 18 DiCarlo has risen. 19 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes, Madam 20 President, I will. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Thank 22 you, Senator Montgomery. 23 Senator DiCarlo, why do you 6996 1 rise? 2 SENATOR DiCARLO: Thank you, 3 Madam President. 4 Senator Montgomery, I don't know 5 whether I was listening attentively enough, but 6 did you just a few moments ago hold the People's 7 Republic of China up as some example of child 8 care? 9 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes, I did. 10 Yes, I did. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 12 DiCarlo. 13 SENATOR DiCARLO: Senator 14 Montgomery, isn't it -- it's my understanding 15 that in the People's Republic of China, don't 16 they have a problem with the government 17 sanctioning and allowing the murder of female 18 children and it's widespread throughout the 19 People's Republic of China? That's the nation 20 you're holding up as saying they are superior to 21 us in terms of child care; is that correct? 22 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 23 Montgomery. 6997 1 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Madam 2 President, the China that I am referring to is 3 where they have developed a system whereby the 4 children are allowed to -- the child care is 5 attached to the workplace. So parents come to 6 the workplace, bring their children, breast feed 7 their children, if necessary, while they're at 8 work, have lunch with the children so there is a 9 -- there is an involvement with their children 10 at all times during the day while they are at 11 work. 12 I am not prepared to address the 13 issue that Senator -- Senator DiCarlo raises. 14 While I am extremely concerned about the whole 15 notion of limiting children by killing them as 16 they're born as has been reported that may be 17 happening in China, there is, in fact, Madam 18 President, a history in China related to this 19 kind of child care, and that's simply the model 20 that I was talking about. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Thank 22 you, Senator. 23 Senator DiCarlo. 6998 1 SENATOR DiCARLO: Senator, am I 2 to understand that you continue to believe that 3 the People's Republic of China does a better job 4 with children and caring for its children, 5 whether it be the workplace or not the 6 workplace, than the United States of America; 7 that's what you're really telling us? 8 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 9 Montgomery. 10 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Madam 11 President, I'm simply saying that the model of 12 having child care available for people who were 13 working -- working people at the work site was a 14 model that China developed many, many decades 15 ago prior to the time that we in this country 16 were looking at the work site as an appropriate 17 place to provide child care. That is all that I 18 am saying. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Thank 20 you, Senator Montgomery. 21 If you want to proceed with 22 Senator Oppenheimer, if you would direct your 23 questions through the Chair, Senator 6999 1 Oppenheimer, so that Senator Montgomery can 2 yield in the traditional fashion. 3 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: I guess my 4 -- my -- my question was we have been 5 proceeding in this state fairly well with middle 6 income child care at the work sites at least in 7 my area, but I was questioning, was there any 8 alternative to placing this $18 million back 9 into low income child care because I see no 10 other way of helping the people we want to keep 11 employed and we want to get employed, and that's 12 where we started this polemic. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 14 Oppenheimer's question, would you repeat just 15 the question, please? 16 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: The 17 question was, is there any other way to keep 18 people -- families working and to get people 19 into the work force? 20 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 21 Montgomery. 22 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: And I think 23 you answered that already. 7000 1 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: The answer 2 is no. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: The 4 answer is no. The question is on the 5 amendment. Those in favor say aye. 6 SENATOR PATERSON: Party vote in 7 the affirmative. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Opposed? 9 In the affirmative. Call the roll. 10 (The Secretary called the roll.) 11 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 19, nays 37. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Record 13 the party vote. The amendment is defeated. 14 The Secretary will read the last 15 section. 16 THE SECRETARY: This act shall 17 take effect immediately. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Call the 19 roll. 20 (The Secretary called the roll.) 21 THE SECRETARY: Ayes -- those 22 recorded in the negative on Calendar Number 1351 23 are Senators Abate, Connor, Gold, Hoffmann, 7001 1 Kruger, Lachman, Leichter, Markowitz, Mendez, 2 Montgomery, Onorato, Paterson, Smith, Stachowski 3 and Waldon. Ayes 41, nays 15. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: The bill 5 is passed. 6 Senator Skelos. 7 SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President, 8 at this time, could you call up Calendar Number 9 1401 that was previously reported from the Rules 10 Committee. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Secretary 12 shall read. 13 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 14 1401, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate 15 Print 7737, an act making appropriations for the 16 support of government. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Calendar 18 Number 1401, Senate Bill Number 7737. 19 SENATOR SKELOS: Is there a 20 message of necessity at the desk? 21 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Yes, 22 there is a message of necessity and message of 23 appropriation at the desk. 7002 1 SENATOR SKELOS: Move to accept. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: All those 3 in favor of accepting the messages, say aye. 4 (Response of "Aye.") 5 Opposed. 6 (There was no response.) 7 The messages are accepted. 8 Secretary will read the last 9 section. 10 THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This 11 act shall take effect immediately. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Call the 13 roll. 14 (The Secretary called the roll.) 15 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 16 the negative on Calendar Number 1401 are 17 Senators DiCarlo, Libous and Wright. Ayes 53, 18 nays 3. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: The bill 20 is passed. 21 SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President, 22 if you would recognize Senator Nanula, please. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 7003 1 Nanula. 2 SENATOR NANULA: Thank you, Madam 3 President. I would like to request unanimous 4 consent to be recorded in the negative on 5 Calendar Number 1351. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Unanimous 7 consent, without objection, on Calendar 1351, 8 Senator Nanula. 9 SENATOR NANULA: Thank you. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 11 Skelos. 12 SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President, 13 at this time, if you could call up - 14 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 15 Nozzolio, why do you rise? 16 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Madam 17 President, I would like to be recorded in the 18 negative on Calendar 1401. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Without 20 objection, Calendar 1401, Senator Nozzolio in 21 the negative. 22 Senator Skelos. 23 Senator Maziarz. 7004 1 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Thank you, 2 Madam President. I would like to ask unanimous 3 consent to be recorded in the negative on 4 Calendar Number 1401, please. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Unanimous 6 consent on 1401 for Senator Maziarz. 7 Senator Skelos. 8 SENATOR SKELOS: If you could 9 call up Calendar Number 1402 which was reported 10 from the Rules Committee. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Secretary 12 shall read. 13 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 14 1402, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate 15 Print 7743, an act making appropriations for the 16 support of government. 17 SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President, 18 is there a message of appropriation and 19 necessity at the desk? 20 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: There are 21 messages of appropriation and necessity at the 22 desk. 23 SENATOR SKELOS: Move to accept 7005 1 the messages. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: All those 3 in favor of accepting the messages, aye. 4 (Response of "Aye.") 5 Opposed. 6 (There was no response.) 7 The messages are accepted. 8 Secretary will read the last 9 section. 10 THE SECRETARY: Section 52. This 11 act shall take effect immediately. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Call the 13 roll. 14 (The Secretary called the roll.) 15 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 55, nays 1, 16 Senator Hoffmann recorded in the negative. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: The bill 18 is passed. 19 Senator Skelos. 20 SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President, 21 if we could return to Supplemental Calendar 22 Number 1 and take up Calendar Number 1352. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Secretary 7006 1 shall read Calendar 1352. 2 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 3 1352, Budget Bill, Senate Print 5591A, an act 4 making appropriations for the support of 5 government on public protection, health and 6 mental hygiene. 7 SENATOR GOLD: Explanation. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: 9 Explanation has been asked for. 10 Senator Nanula, why did you 11 rise? 12 SENATOR NANULA: I wanted express 13 unanimous consent to be recorded in the 14 negative. I'll wait until after. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: We'll 16 wait until later. Thank you. 17 Senator Stafford, an explanation 18 has been requested. 19 SENATOR STAFFORD: Thank you, Mr. 20 President. 21 I would point out that this year 22 -- I would point out that the State Operations 23 Budget, I think, is much better drafted this 7007 1 year. I think it's much clearer, and I think 2 those who have been involved in this, especially 3 the staff people, are indeed to be commended. 4 This bill, S.5591, we have 5 entitled the, "Public Protection, Health and 6 Mental Hygiene" bill. 7 SENATOR GOLD: Madam President. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 9 Gold. 10 SENATOR GOLD: Would the Senator 11 yield to a question? 12 SENATOR STAFFORD: Yes. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 14 Stafford yields. 15 SENATOR GOLD: Senator, my 16 understanding is that this bill adds another 17 $350 million to the Governor's budget, and that 18 one very small item in there is 2.5 million for 19 -- it says, "partial restoration" of Queensboro 20 -- Kingsboro, rather, Psychiatric Center. Am I 21 correct on that? 22 SENATOR STAFFORD: Yes. 23 SENATOR GOLD: Well, Senator, 7008 1 what my concern is, is that there was talk 2 earlier this year of closing Kingsboro 3 Psychiatric Center, and there was much talk 4 about it at the budget hearings conducted by you 5 and I and Assemblyman Farrell and Assemblyman 6 Faso. What I'm concerned about is the words 7 "partial restoration." How much money would be 8 needed, Senator, to keep Kingsboro Psychiatric 9 Center operating as it is operating today in its 10 full capacity? 11 SENATOR STAFFORD: $7 million. 12 SENATOR GOLD: Senator, if you 13 yield to one more question? 14 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator, 15 will you yield to one more question? 16 Thank you. 17 SENATOR GOLD: Senator, this is 18 my concern. Those people who are affected by 19 Kingsboro Psychiatric Center and who want it so 20 desperately to remain open are very, very 21 suspicious of a partial restoration of $2.5 22 million, which is maybe a little more than a 23 third of the money because what we anticipate - 7009 1 and this is what I would like you to comment 2 on -- is that the downsizing, which was the word 3 used in the committee meeting, is only one step 4 towards the closing of the facility. 5 In other words, if you have about 6 one-third the budget and you are going to have 7 to fire employees, if you are going to have to 8 cut services, you are going to have to cut out 9 rooms that are being used, then next year we 10 have the argument presented to us, How can you 11 keep this big building open when you got so many 12 vacant rooms and we don't have the employees, 13 and that is one step away, as I say, from the 14 closing? 15 So isn't it a fact, Senator, that 16 this 2.5 million is just one, perhaps, year from 17 avoiding the inevitable which is this great 18 desire to close this facility? 19 SENATOR STAFFORD: Mr. President, 20 I understand Senator Gold's question and I would 21 point this out. This phenomena concerning our 22 facilities in this field started way before this 23 administration. Up in our area in northern New 7010 1 York, we have exactly the same situation. We 2 have a facility that at one time -- don't hold 3 me to this, but I think it was up around 3,000 4 -- 2,000, excuse me. Two thousand is a lot of 5 people for our area to get together at one time, 6 and it now has, I am told, less than 300. 7 That's a very serious situation for those in the 8 community. There is no question about it. 9 I relate to that, because I have 10 friends. I have people that I know well, and I 11 was going to say relatives -- and I think it's 12 no doubt accurate -- who are affected. 13 Now, I think this. I think that 14 those who are very, very concerned about 15 Kingsboro -- and I say this with all the concern 16 and sensitivity that I can bring together here, 17 I think they are very fortunate that this 18 funding is here, and I think that we just move 19 on from there. I assure you there are many 20 other facilities that have the same feeling 21 because -- and, again, I don't mean to get into 22 this in too much detail, but I have always 23 remembered this. I had a friend that I went to 7011 1 school with, and all through school for 12 years 2 his mother was in the facility that I'm talking 3 about in northern New York, and treatment 4 changed, and medicine changed, and the mother 5 has been home now 20 years, and what I'm saying 6 is there has been many good things that have 7 happened here, but, again, we've had some very 8 serious problems in communities where these 9 facilities are. There is no question about it. 10 SENATOR GOLD: Madam President, 11 will the gentleman yield to a question? 12 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator, 13 will you yield? 14 The Senator yields. 15 SENATOR GOLD: Senator Stafford, 16 your ability not to answer questions is 17 legendary, and we understand that, but I really 18 believe that your side of the aisle either is 19 ashamed or they're proud of what they do, and I 20 know you're proud, so let's just deal with the 21 question. 22 There's this terrible expression, 23 "self-fulling prophecy," and it seems to me 7012 1 that if we, in fact, fund Kingsboro Psychiatric 2 Center at only 2.5 million we are going to have 3 a self-fulling prophecy because we will cut 4 staff. You cut staff and even though there are 5 patients who should be assigned to that facility 6 they can't be assigned. So they will be 7 assigned to Creedmoor. They will be assigned to 8 Staten Island, and then as it works its way 9 down, somebody next year says, "Why do we have 10 to have this facility open? After all, look how 11 many vacancies there are." 12 That's what I want you to 13 address, Senator. There are people in Kings 14 County, and there are people who find it 15 convenient to have their family there. There is 16 a need for that facility; and downsizing, as we 17 hear, to the extent of elimination of almost 18 two-thirds of its budget is really the death 19 knell; and isn't it a fact that this is the 20 death knell? 21 Is it the fact that your party 22 wants to close the facility and by cutting down 23 by two-thirds this year is laying the foundation 7013 1 for its closure next year? 2 SENATOR STAFFORD: Well, you 3 mentioned -- Mr. President. Senator Gold 4 mentioned to me that we were very proud. I 5 think he was being rather light, so I will 6 answer lightly in the beginning here. 7 You said "self-fulling 8 prophecy." I thought that meant if you keep 9 saying it that it will happen. But what you are 10 saying is that it isn't exactly that you are 11 just saying it. 12 Now, as far as the money 13 available for Kingsboro, you know this -- this 14 great state is a great locomotive, and it has 15 many, many engines. We like to keep these 16 engines going, and if we continually just draw 17 resources from these engines, continually draw 18 it, the first thing you know the locomotive 19 isn't going to run, and then we're not going to 20 have a state for anything, for social services, 21 for infrastructure, for the protection, police 22 powers, education. It's priorities. 23 Again, that's what a budget is 7014 1 all about. It's raising the issues and 2 balancing the equities, and this is what has to 3 be done and you have to decide. Will the money 4 be spent here? Will it be spent there? Where 5 can it best be spent? We won't spend quite as 6 much probably as we want to here. But, as I 7 say, if a facility is remaining open and is 8 being funded, in this day and age, I wouldn't 9 complain. I would be encouraged. 10 SENATOR GOLD: Madam President. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 12 Gold. 13 SENATOR GOLD: Will the gentleman 14 yield to a question? 15 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator, 16 will you yield? 17 SENATOR STAFFORD: Yes. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 19 yields. 20 SENATOR GOLD: Thank you, 21 Senator. Let's try it again. I understand 22 about all of the engines, Senator, but isn't it 23 a fact that what this appropriation is doing is 7015 1 informing this community that it is the 2 intention of your party if you have your 3 budgetary druthers, together with the Governor, 4 who was going to cut it out altogether, to 5 terminate the facility in Brooklyn, and that 6 this year the so-called downsizing will take the 7 guts out of the program, and next year the next 8 step will be to look at it and say, "We now have 9 a mostly empty facility; let's close it," and if 10 we do that, Senator, just understand, it means 11 crowds of people from Brooklyn coming through 12 Senator Padavan's district, coming to Creedmoor, 13 having to travel two, three hours by mass 14 transit to see their relatives. It means huge 15 gaps in support because where the facility is 16 now there are people in there who get support 17 from their family who live in the community, and 18 that kind of transportation is very hard 19 particularly if you have people of limited 20 means, people who work for a living. They can 21 not make that trip without losing their job. 22 Isn't it a fact that by this 23 funding, we are telling the people at Kingsboro, 7016 1 "Watch out, because next year there is no 2 program"? Isn't that a fact? 3 SENATOR STAFFORD: Well, Senator 4 -- or Madam President. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 6 Stafford. 7 SENATOR STAFFORD: Now, I 8 explained last year. You know, sending a 9 message, you're telling the people -- I 10 mentioned to you last year, you know, one man's 11 ceiling is another man's floor. I mean it's how 12 people interpret things. 13 Please let me emphasize that 14 there was no funding for Kingsboro. The funding 15 has been restored to save the facility. Next 16 year is next year. We can't what -- we can't 17 tell what will happen next year. As they say in 18 legal circles, tempus fugit. 19 SENATOR GOLD: Madam President. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 21 Gold. 22 SENATOR GOLD: Yes, will the 23 gentleman yield to a question? 7017 1 SENATOR STAFFORD: Yes. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 3 Stafford, would you yield? 4 He yields. 5 SENATOR GOLD: As I was saying, 6 Senator, right now there is a facility that 7 operates, and it's called Kingsboro Psychiatric 8 Center; and if the Governor's budget were to 9 have its way, this facility would be closed 10 down. It would be emptied out, and people would 11 be sent to Creedmoor or other places traveling 12 through the community. 13 There was an outcry over this, 14 and the point was made at budget hearings that 15 this would be a terrible inequity, particularly 16 since the facility is operating and servicing 17 its community. 18 Isn't it a fact, Senator, by this 19 so-called downsizing, by putting in budget 20 requests which may take care of one-third of the 21 institution, that this is part of a plan to 22 create a self-fulling prophecy? So then, next 23 year we come out and say, "Well, you don't have 7018 1 the same outcry as last year because, look, 2 two-thirds of the place is empty; two-thirds of 3 the place doesn't work. We don't have the same 4 staffing levels, and we can't take the crowds of 5 people." 6 So that now, next year, if you 7 try to close it down, you hope that you will 8 have squashed some of the opposition because you 9 would have sent some of those families already 10 to other facilities; or, in assigning new people 11 to a facility, you will now assign them other 12 places because you don't have the staff at 13 Kingsboro because we haven't funded it. 14 So, Senator, I'm willing to stick 15 it out as long as you are. Isn't it a fact that 16 this particular downsizing is only to create the 17 opportunity next year to terminate the use of 18 the facility? 19 SENATOR STAFFORD: Senator - 20 Madam President. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 22 Stafford. 23 SENATOR STAFFORD: I would only 7019 1 -- I would only attempt to answer the Senator 2 -- distinguished Senator from Queens this way. 3 The entire situation in these 4 facilities has been a very difficult situation. 5 All you have to do is come up to northern New 6 York, and there's a facility that borders my 7 district. The Senator is sitting on my right 8 who represents the area, and I live in the -- is 9 the "catchment" area the right word? 10 Right. I live in that area where 11 that facility provides a very, very fine 12 service. As I mentioned to you, at one time, 13 there were 2,000 people in that facility. 14 That's bigger than our cities up our way. 15 Now, this day and age, that 16 facility now has less than 300 people. Now, 17 interestingly enough, I've had people in the 18 mental health field come in and sit there and be 19 rather direct with me and point to me and say, 20 "You can't keep these facilities open. This is 21 ridiculous what you're doing." 22 Now, fortunately -- as I 23 mentioned before, there was not funding for 7020 1 Kingsboro -- the Senate has been able to restore 2 and save the facility. Next year is next year. 3 We can't tell what will happen next year. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 5 Gold. 6 SENATOR GOLD: Will the gentleman 7 yield to a question? 8 SENATOR STAFFORD: Yes. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator, 10 will you yield to one more question? 11 SENATOR GOLD: Senator Stafford, 12 can you tell me how many people are in the 13 Kingsboro facility now? 14 SENATOR STAFFORD: No. 15 SENATOR GOLD: Can you tell me 16 how many employees they have? 17 SENATOR STAFFORD: No. Wait a 18 minute. Wait a minute. I will, though. A 19 thousand employees and 400 patients. 20 SENATOR GOLD: Now, Senator, can 21 you tell me the result of this downsizing? If 22 we are going to now appropriate $2.5 million to 23 this facility out of the 7 million it needs, can 7021 1 you tell me what that means in terms of how many 2 employee slots they would lose and, therefore, 3 how many patients they would be able to take 4 care of? 5 SENATOR STAFFORD: Well, I think 6 this. I think that I have pointed out that 7 there is a very serious situation here, and I 8 don't think it takes a -- well, it might. I 9 don't know whether it would or not. But I don't 10 think it's very difficult to understand, as I 11 have said, that this is a very, very difficult 12 situation and that at the present time Kingsboro 13 is being considered, that it is being saved at 14 this time. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 16 Gold. 17 SENATOR GOLD: If the Senator 18 will yield? But, Senator - 19 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator, 20 will you yield? 21 SENATOR GOLD: I'm just trying to 22 find out. Right now, I'm told there's a 23 thousand employees. I'm told there's about 400 7022 1 patients. 2 And what I'm trying to find out, 3 Senator, is if we cut some $4500 out of that 4 budget and if we only allow them the 2.5 5 million, how many employees will that leave to 6 remain and how many patients can they take care 7 of? 8 SENATOR STAFFORD: Well, I think 9 the answer is that this appropriation will take 10 care of the facility, and the number of patients 11 they can take care of is what the facility will 12 handle. They had 3,000 patients at one time. 13 SENATOR GOLD: Madam President. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 15 Gold. 16 SENATOR GOLD: Will the Senator 17 yield to another question? 18 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator, 19 will you yield for another question? 20 SENATOR STAFFORD: Yes. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 22 yields. 23 SENATOR GOLD: Senator, I know 7023 1 that there's about $15.5 million added. It 2 says, "to undo the OASAS block grant program 3 which had been bundled," and now this does some 4 unbundling. Can you explain to me exactly what 5 that means? 6 SENATOR STAFFORD: "Unbundling," 7 that usually means separating, and that's what's 8 being done. 9 SENATOR GOLD: Now, Senator, in 10 doing the separations, I understand that one 11 thing that may be an advantage from it is that 12 some of the community-based programs will now be 13 able to get their funding in the normal way. Is 14 that correct? 15 SENATOR STAFFORD: Yes. 16 SENATOR GOLD: Well, Senator, if 17 that is the case -- and the aim is something 18 which I might very well support. My 19 understanding is it requires about $45 million 20 statewide to take care of these programs. How 21 do we make up the other $30 million? 22 SENATOR STAFFORD: It is not 45 23 million that it will take. It will take 42 7024 1 million. 2 SENATOR GOLD: Fine. How do we 3 make it up? 4 SENATOR STAFFORD: We're just 5 putting 15 of the 42 back. 6 SENATOR GOLD: Senator, I 7 understand that, so it's the same question be it 8 42 or 45. If the idea of unbundling is to get 9 the community projects back online so that they 10 can make their normal applications and provide 11 the services, we are still something like $27 12 million short, Senator. How do those community 13 programs get funded? 14 SENATOR STAFFORD: Well, we will 15 just have to consider as we progress and have to 16 meet those challenges as we go down the road. 17 This is the whole story of our budget. 18 You know, I can remember -- I can 19 remember when really programs like this, 20 communities were told they were going to take a 21 program, and they'd say, "Well, we don't really 22 need it," and they'd say, "No, you're going to 23 have a program. Things have changed. 7025 1 And there is a situation here 2 where funding is a problem. There is no 3 question about it. If this state is going to be 4 competitive, if we're going to have a state 5 where we have 100,000 more jobs this year than 6 we had last year -- which we do have -- rather 7 than being almost last in job creation, and if 8 we're going to stop having a situation -- and I 9 don't mean to embarrass the lady on my right. 10 But just completely, completely not connected 11 with what we're debating here today, we were 12 talking about a mutual friend who worked for a 13 company, and one time there was an electronic 14 company in Western New York and there was a 15 company that was connected with them working on 16 airplanes, and there was another company that - 17 engineering - 18 SENATOR GOLD: Senator, are they 19 the ones putting up the 27 million? 20 SENATOR STAFFORD: -- and they 21 were doing research, and now they are all gone. 22 They left. They left in the late '70s, and that 23 happened year after year after year, and that is 7026 1 why we're having to look at funding to make some 2 very, very hard choices and people are going to 3 have to work smarter, harder and friendlier. 4 SENATOR GOLD: Madam President. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 6 Gold. 7 SENATOR GOLD: I wanted to 8 continue, but can I yield for one question to 9 Senator Onorato, please? 10 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 11 Onorato. 12 SENATOR ONORATO: Madam 13 President, will Senator Stafford yield to a 14 question? 15 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 16 Stafford will yield to a question. 17 SENATOR ONORATO: I'm getting a 18 little mixed up with the questioning that's 19 going on here. I'm a little concerned about the 20 fact -- are you aware that Kings County is the 21 largest county in the State of New York with 22 almost 3 million people? 23 SENATOR STAFFORD: Yes, and if 7027 1 Kings County was by itself, it would be the 2 eighth largest city in the nation. 3 SENATOR ONORATO: Now, can you 4 explain to me how a county with almost 3 million 5 people in it can operate with a budget of $2.5 6 million? Will that not contribute, again, to 7 the increasing homeless population that we have 8 in the city of New York, putting this type of 9 person back onto the street without having a 10 facility to take care of them? 11 And can any other facility in the 12 state -- have they also received this type of a 13 downsizing, or are we picking on downstate New 14 York's mental hospitals for cutbacks to again 15 increase the problems that we are already 16 overwhelmed with? 17 SENATOR STAFFORD: Senator. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 19 Stafford. 20 SENATOR STAFFORD: Madam 21 President. 22 Senator, you asked that question 23 with gusto. 7028 1 SENATOR ONORATO: That's right. 2 SENATOR STAFFORD: I will answer 3 it with gusto. I hope you were listening when I 4 explained we have a hospital in Upstate New York 5 that used to have 2,000 people. It now has - 6 patients. It now has less than 300, and there's 7 a real, real problem on exactly how you handle 8 this. Kingsboro used to have 3,000 patients and 9 1,000 employees. It now has 1,000 employees and 10 430 inpatients. 11 Now, we can ask all sorts of 12 questions, and we can be just as boisterous as 13 we want to, but we got to look at this and see 14 exactly what we're going to do and make some 15 hard choices here and decide where we're going 16 to spend our money and how the treatment is 17 going to be provided, and it's happening all 18 over the state, not just upstate, not just the 19 metropolitan area, but all over the state of New 20 York. 21 SENATOR GOLD: Madam President. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 23 Gold, Senator Montgomery - 7029 1 SENATOR GOLD: I have one last 2 question of the Senator. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: One last 4 question. 5 SENATOR GOLD: Senator, you are 6 from Plattsburgh, New York; correct? 7 SENATOR STAFFORD: Yes. 8 SENATOR GOLD: Yes. Thank you. 9 No further questions. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Thank 11 you, Senator Gold. 12 SENATOR GOLD: Madam President. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: One more 14 question. 15 SENATOR GOLD: Yes. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: On the 17 question, Senator Gold. 18 SENATOR GOLD: I think the point 19 that I just made is really a very easy one; and 20 that is, that my distinguished colleague who is 21 so much younger than I am has no problem in the 22 world answering questions. You guys are 23 fooled. When he wants to answer it, he can 7030 1 answer it. He can take a question with a lot of 2 words, "Senator, is it a fact that you come from 3 Plattsburgh?" and answer in one word, "Yes." 4 It's easy. He knows how to do it. 5 The fact is that he doesn't want 6 to answer the other questions because they won't 7 deal with an embarrassment, and I don't blame 8 him. He is a gentleman. Senator, we're all 9 ready to make hard choices. But when we make 10 the hard choice, what in the heck is wrong with 11 looking people in the eye and saying, "Yes, 12 that's my choice. It's a hard choice. We're 13 closing Kingsboro, but we're going to do it a 14 year from now because it may be a little 15 easier. We may cut it down, make it so it can't 16 breathe and then tell you it's dying so we'll 17 close it." 18 At least you'd say, "Well, look 19 at that man. That is my friend Ron Stafford. 20 By God, hard choices. He stands up like a man 21 and he'll tell it to you." 22 Senator, when it comes to the 23 local drug programs, many of us are very 7031 1 concerned about it. We're concerned about it 2 because we feel that on a day-to-day basis they 3 do good work. Well, the Governor's program, I 4 think, would have hurt them terribly. You throw 5 a couple of bones in there and maybe it will do 6 a little better. But, Senator, they are going 7 to be short $27 million, which is a lot of money 8 to these programs. 9 And if you are doing that, 10 Senator, because you are making a hard choice 11 then stand up and say, "Manny, look, it's a hard 12 choice. You're right, and I will take the knock 13 that there is 27 million missing, but I will get 14 the credit, Senator Gold, because I'm adding in 15 15 million and we're trying to do the right 16 thing." 17 The biggest problem we always 18 have with the Majority Party in this house - 19 and I know Senator Bruno always says we 20 shouldn't be partisan, and, of course, he never 21 is. But the biggest problem we have is just 22 pulling teeth to get you to admit what you are 23 doing, and that's what I don't understand. 7032 1 There are principles we all run 2 on. There are principles we all say we stand 3 for, and if that's what is behind the budget and 4 if that's what you believe in, then say it and 5 vote for it and walk out of here, and 6 everybody's blood pressure will be down nice and 7 low because everybody is doing what they say is 8 in the best interests of the people. 9 The mystery is you don't do 10 that. You don't. The discussion that went on 11 earlier today between our distinguished 12 colleague Senator Padavan and our distinguished 13 colleague Senator Leichter is amazing. It's 14 amazing. On the one hand, you are spending 15 money which some of us agree should be spent 16 and, obviously, you agree it should be spent 17 because you are the ones spending it, and yet 18 you seem to wish that all of these lights were 19 turned out so you could do it in the dark, 20 because you are going to run home and tell 21 people that for the second year in a row you 22 spent less money, whatever. 23 Now, that isn't true. What's 7033 1 true is you are spending it. What's true is 2 that you are closing Kingsboro, unfortunately, 3 within a year. What's true is that you are 4 going along with a process which may very well 5 damage local community drug programs; and if 6 that's a hard choice and you've got to do it, 7 then you propose it. We will either agree or 8 not agree, but let's at least answer the 9 questions with the same pride, Senator Stafford, 10 as you say, "Yes, I'm from Plattsburgh." 11 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 12 Gold. 13 Senator Montgomery. 14 Senator Gold, have you 15 completed? Are you finished? 16 SENATOR GOLD: Senator. Senator 17 Stafford, with the same sense of humor that you 18 have I remember somebody who asked the judge - 19 while he was questioning a witness on the stand, 20 the judge was making faces at the jury and 21 nodding his head one way or the other; and, 22 finally, the lawyer couldn't stand it any more. 23 He said, "Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, I 7034 1 want to assure you that when the judge nods his 2 head, there's nothing in it." 3 Now, what he meant was a little 4 something different; and, Senator, it's okay. 5 If you nodded your head, I still accept it. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Thank 7 you, Senator Gold. Senator Montgomery is next. 8 Senator Montgomery is next. 9 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes, Madam 10 President. I wonder if Senator Stafford would 11 clarify something for me? 12 Senator Stafford, you said that 13 one man's ceiling is another man's floor, and I 14 was just wondering do you mean that you are 15 walking on my grave? That's sort of a feeling 16 that I got. My ceiling is your floor. 17 SENATOR STAFFORD: No, Madam 18 President. First, as we talk here it's always 19 good to keep your sense of humor, but I take 20 very seriously this issue for you and for 21 Senator Gold and everyone, just like I do with 22 the problems we're having upstate. 23 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Thank you. 7035 1 Thank you, Senator. 2 SENATOR STAFFORD: That just goes 3 to show that it's how we interpret things. 4 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: That's 5 right. 6 SENATOR STAFFORD: Senator Gold 7 said what he heard in court. I was in Vermont 8 in Federal Court the other day, and they were 9 questioning this Vermonter, and they said to 10 him, "Sir, have you lived all your life here in 11 Vermont?" He said, "Not yet." So he actually 12 -- he knew more than some of us. But the point 13 is, it's how we interpret it. We can't exactly 14 know what's going to happen, Senator. I would 15 say this. Having facilities in my own area, and 16 I do -- just like you do -- and take it very 17 seriously just like you do. If there is funding 18 to keep it going, then that's encouraging. 19 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Thank you. 20 Madam President, just if I can ask - 21 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 22 Montgomery. 23 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Senator 7036 1 Stafford, I believe Kings County is the largest 2 county in the state. Is your proposal based on 3 an assessment of the need in the county of Kings 4 for a psychiatric facility? Have you come to 5 the conclusion based on your needs assessment 6 and analysis of Kings County and the people in 7 Kings County that we don't need a facility in 8 the largest county in the state? 9 SENATOR STAFFORD: I mentioned I 10 understand being the largest county. Also I 11 mentioned earlier if Brooklyn was by itself, not 12 part of the great city of New York, it would be 13 the eighth largest city in the nation. 14 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Exactly. 15 SENATOR STAFFORD: Now, I also 16 would point out - 17 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Our borough 18 president says it would be the fifth. So I take 19 his word - 20 SENATOR STAFFORD: I think the 21 figures have been revised, because I looked it 22 up just before I came here because I thought 23 that might come up. But I could be wrong. I 7037 1 could be wrong. I might have gotten some 2 misinformation, but as I pointed earlier - 3 again, not making light of this, but I mention 4 it. I mention it, and I say this again because 5 it drives the point home about people not being 6 in the facility. But my friend from first grade 7 to high school -- getting out of high school, 8 his mother was in a facility. Different 9 treatment, different medicine, she came home 10 when we were in college and she's been home for 11 a long time. She's alive. She's very elderly 12 now, and she was very normal. 13 My point is, there she was in the 14 facility, came home, and lived as the husband - 15 excuse me, as the wife and, of course, most of 16 her children by then had left home -- or they 17 all had. My point is she wasn't at the facility 18 any more that was making it possible for them to 19 have 2,000 people. Again, it is serious. 20 A thousand employees anywhere in 21 this state is important and, yes, the treatment 22 is important; but when you have 430 patients 23 where you used to have 3,000, it's a tough, 7038 1 tough issue and - 2 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 3 Montgomery. 4 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: If the 5 Senator would continue to yield. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator, 7 will you continue to yield? 8 Senator continues to yield. 9 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Madam 10 President, I would like for Senator Stafford to 11 give me what your proposal does. Have you not 12 proposed that we also eliminate five community 13 based mental health programs, and will you tell 14 me whether or not you have fully restored the 15 community reinvestment funding which will allow 16 us to develop some community facilities? 17 What do you do about the 18 community reinvestment funding and what do you 19 do about the five other facilities related to 20 Kings County that are also slated to be closed? 21 SENATOR STAFFORD: Very fair 22 question? 23 Once again, the community 7039 1 reinvestment, many of us have been involved in 2 the community reinvestment program. As a matter 3 of fact, there are colleagues on both sides of 4 the aisle that have had a great deal to do, 5 yourself included. There was no funding and we 6 now have provided funding for one half, 2.5 7 million -- here's a gentleman who is been 8 working on it. 9 And I would only say once again 10 -- once again, it's the availability of funds, 11 and these decisions are difficult. Where do you 12 place the funding? I hesitate to say this but 13 yet providing funding is better than not 14 providing it, and 12.5 million is better than 15 zero. So we're addressing the situation under 16 difficult circumstances and, again, not having 17 the funding that we would need to do more. 18 Now, with the five programs you 19 mentioned, we understand that the five programs 20 will remain online, but there may be a change as 21 far as one of the hospitals is concerned, 22 Kingsboro Hospital. 23 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Madam 7040 1 President, I hear Senator Stafford saying that 2 the funding for the five community-based mental 3 health centers that are connected to Kingsboro 4 Psychiatric Center are going to be funded at 5 their full level as '94-95. 6 SENATOR STAFFORD: Once again, 7 you are getting right to the point and you 8 certainly should. Whether they will be fully 9 funded, I certainly wouldn't stand here and give 10 you any misinformation. We'll just have to see 11 what funds are available as we proceed 12 throughout the fiscal year. 13 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Thank you. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 15 Montgomery. 16 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Madam 17 President. Senator Stafford, again, I just want 18 to be clear about the answers that I'm receiving 19 here. 20 I understand him to say that the 21 Community Reinvestment Act is funded at about 50 22 percent of what our commitment was in that 23 program as of last year's memorandum of 7041 1 understanding, which is about 12 million for the 2 entire state. Is that what I hear? 3 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: You are 4 asking Senator Stafford? 5 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: I'm asking 6 if that is the answer that Senator Stafford has 7 given? 8 SENATOR STAFFORD: Right. Yes. 9 SENATOR GOLD: Now, Senator 10 Stafford, with the Community Reinvestment Act 11 cut in half, a reduced funding for the five 12 community-based centers, the funding that you 13 propose is about one-third of what would be 14 required to fully operate Kingsboro Psychiatric 15 Center. Have you made an assessment as to the 16 impact of all of these cuts on our ability in 17 the borough of Brooklyn to provide mental health 18 services to seriously mentally ill people? 19 SENATOR STAFFORD: Once again - 20 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: In the 21 borough of Brooklyn? 22 SENATOR STAFFORD: In the borough 23 of Kings. 7042 1 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: If we were 2 able to provide services within the borough of 3 Brooklyn? 4 SENATOR STAFFORD: In the borough 5 of Kings. 6 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: The borough 7 of Brooklyn in the County of Kings. 8 SENATOR STAFFORD: The borough of 9 Brooklyn in the county of Kings. 10 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes, sir. 11 SENATOR STAFFORD: Right. I 12 think we're going to have a situation where 13 we're going to be relying on professionals that 14 are going to have to make, again, hard choices, 15 and I say this -- we've said it about all of us 16 who are in government and frankly -- frankly, 17 this has happened in the private sector also. 18 People are going to have to work harder. They 19 are going to have to work smarter and they are 20 going to have to work friendlier, all of us, and 21 I think we're going to have to do our best to 22 provide as much as we can as far as services are 23 concerned. I think this is very serious, but I 7043 1 would only - 2 But I would point out once again 3 that it would be -- again, it would be just 4 ridiculous. For instance, it would be good if 5 we could have a teacher for every student. We 6 can't. We can't afford it. We have done a lot 7 in this state that we couldn't afford, and we've 8 had many programs that we couldn't afford. 9 Now, we are doing our best to 10 make sure that these programs remain online, and 11 we will have to rely on the professionals to 12 provide the services. 13 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Thank you. 14 Madam President, just briefly. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 16 Montgomery briefly. 17 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: I want to 18 make a couple of comments if I may to Senator 19 Stafford. I certainly understand that the 20 genesis of this proposal to close that 21 significant facility in the borough of Brooklyn 22 comes from the Governor. So I'm not confused, 23 Senator Stafford. 7044 1 I know you put back a little bit, 2 not enough, but it didn't come from you. You 3 didn't suggest it in the first place, so I want 4 you to know that I understand that. 5 The second thing that I want to 6 say to you is that we're talking about equal 7 access to services, so we want equal access to 8 mental health services in the borough of 9 Brooklyn just like you have in Watertown and in 10 your district and in the districts throughout 11 the state. 12 And the third thing that I want 13 to say is that your budget proposal is based on 14 certainly not enough information, no 15 intelligence, no analysis of the impact this 16 will have on, one, the ability to deliver 17 services in the borough, how many, what is the 18 need right now, whether or not we're even able 19 to serve the need that we have now and not to 20 mention the fact that we're looking at an area 21 of Brooklyn that under optimal circumstances 22 might be considered a medical center. We have 23 the SUNY Downstate Medical School and Hospital, 7045 1 Kingsboro Hospital, Kings County Hospital and 2 the Kingsboro Psychiatric Center, all within a 3 six blocks radius of each other. Extremely 4 important area, and we need to be talking about 5 ways in which we can bring that whole center 6 into the next century in terms of delivering 7 health care from mental health services to 8 services to the elderly, services to health care 9 in general. 10 So rather than just saying, 11 "We're going to decide arbitrarily to cut 12 two-thirds of the budget of this major 13 institution without any planning, without any 14 analysis, and be damned what happens to the 15 borough of Brooklyn, we don't really care if you 16 can deliver those services because they can just 17 transport themselves to hither and yon, 18 wherever, and that's just fine with us because 19 we have to save a dollar" -- and that is really 20 the problem I have with this proposal. 21 It is not based on sound 22 analysis, and we should not be making decisions 23 of this magnitude to have that kind of impact on 7046 1 the largest county in the state without more 2 information. 3 So I would have to oppose this 4 because it says to me that we don't care about 5 people, and we can not afford to take that 6 position and have that attitude, and we're not 7 AT&T. We're the state of New York and we're 8 bound by a Constitution that says we must have 9 some level of safety net for people in this 10 state. 11 And so that's my comment on this, 12 and I will vote later on it. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Thank 14 you, Senator Montgomery. 15 Senator Stafford. 16 SENATOR STAFFORD: I would just 17 very briefly want to point out and I do this 18 with all of the camaraderie that I can muster 19 here. You know, I have lived in upstate. We 20 have this problem in Poughkeepsie. We have this 21 problem in Binghamton. We have this problem in 22 Ogdensburg. I could go on and on. 23 How do I know that I can name 7047 1 them off like that. In upstate, if it was ever 2 said that you were going to Ogdensburg, if you 3 were going to Binghamton, if you were going to 4 Poughkeepsie, do you know what it meant? It 5 meant something very, very sad, but we all knew 6 where those facilities are and we all knew what 7 it meant. 8 All of those facilities are 9 having the same problem. What is the one on 10 Long Island? What is the one on Long Island? 11 The same in that, in other areas of the state. 12 Now, what I'm attempting to say 13 here, just exactly the problem that you are 14 bringing out and bringing out very well is the 15 same in every one of the facilities that I just 16 mentioned. It's very difficult but, again, 17 treatment has changed, medicine has changed, and 18 community residence treatment, and we are having 19 to make difficulty decisions in all the areas of 20 the state, not just in the county of Kings and 21 the borough of Brooklyn. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 23 Abate. 7048 1 SENATOR ABATE: Madam President. 2 Would Senator Stafford yield to a question? 3 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 4 Stafford, will you yield for a question? 5 SENATOR STAFFORD: Yes. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Yes. 7 SENATOR ABATE: Senator Stafford, 8 you talked about the goals of your budget 9 proposal were to be -- to use your words - 10 "smarter," "more intelligent," "more friendly"? 11 SENATOR STAFFORD: I never use 12 intelligent. 13 SENATOR ABATE: No, never 14 intelligent? 15 SENATOR STAFFORD: I don't use 16 that word. 17 SENATOR ABATE: Would smart be a 18 good - 19 SENATOR STAFFORD: Yes. 20 SENATOR ABATE: That we should do 21 things that are smarter. To that end, I would 22 like to ask a couple of questions to see if, in 23 fact, this proposal is really smarter. 7049 1 How many psychiatric beds are 2 there throughout the state, beds, residential 3 beds for the mentally ill? 4 SENATOR STAFFORD: People that 5 are in the beds or beds available if you wanted 6 to fill every bed. 7 SENATOR ABATE: Operating beds. 8 Operating beds. 9 SENATOR STAFFORD: Seven or eight 10 thousand statewide. 11 SENATOR ABATE: Seven or eight 12 thousand statewide. How many of those seven or 13 eight thousand statewide are in New York City? 14 SENATOR STAFFORD: About a 15 third. 16 I have counsel on both sides 17 here, both of them experts. 18 SENATOR ABATE: Where are the 19 third located in New York City? 20 SENATOR STAFFORD: In the five 21 psychiatric centers. In the five psychiatric 22 centers in the City. 23 SENATOR ABATE: That's broader 7050 1 than New York City, though. That's dealing with 2 Long Island and other places. That's not just 3 New York City. 4 SENATOR STAFFORD: Kingsboro has 5 its own psychiatric center. That's five. How 6 many boroughs do you have? 7 SENATOR ABATE: Five boroughs. 8 SENATOR STAFFORD: How many would 9 that be if you had one in each borough? 10 SENATOR ABATE: You would have 11 five psychiatric. 12 SENATOR STAFFORD: Right. So you 13 got it. 14 SENATOR ABATE: What is the total 15 population of those five psychiatric centers? I 16 want to arrive at the fact that it's one-third. 17 SENATOR STAFFORD: 2500, 500 a 18 piece average. 19 SENATOR ABATE: 2500. And to 20 follow up with what Senator Montgomery had 21 raised, there is a huge population of people 22 throughout New York City. 23 SENATOR STAFFORD: Throughout the 7051 1 whole state, as a matter of fact. 2 SENATOR ABATE: And throughout 3 the whole state. 4 SENATOR STAFFORD: In fact, 5 there's only eight million in New York City; 6 there's 18 -- there's 10 million outside of New 7 York City. 8 SENATOR ABATE: Would the Senator 9 continue to yield? 10 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator, 11 will you continue to yield? 12 SENATOR STAFFORD: Yes. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 14 yields. 15 SENATOR ABATE: My understanding, 16 that more than one-third of the severely 17 mentally impaired residents of New York State 18 lie in New York City, that in fact there aren't 19 enough right now, psychiatric beds, and there 20 are clearly not enough community-based mental 21 health organizations to support those 22 individuals now in New York City. 23 SENATOR STAFFORD: Madam 7052 1 President. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Yes, 3 Senator Stafford. 4 SENATOR STAFFORD: I would point 5 out in answering -- once again, I do this 6 realizing that you also take this very 7 seriously. It's how we understand it. It's how 8 we're treating people. You got people in the 9 field that don't think people should be going to 10 these hospitals. 11 SENATOR ABATE: But, Senator, 12 would you yield to a question? 13 SENATOR STAFFORD: Yes. 14 SENATOR ABATE: The issue and my 15 understanding is 60 percent of the severely 16 mentally ill lie in New York City, 60 percent, 17 and you are saying to me that one-third of all 18 the psychiatric beds lie in New York City, so 19 there's some deficiency, and I don't even know 20 what the analysis is for Brooklyn. What I'm 21 suggesting, if someone is in need of mental 22 health support that may either be in a couple 23 places they can get it, either through in 7053 1 residence psychiatric help, hospitalization, in 2 the community or in the home. Is there any 3 other place that's really acceptable? 4 SENATOR STAFFORD: What about 5 Article 28 hospitals? 6 SENATOR ABATE: Article 28. But 7 that's hospitalization. Beyond that. And so my 8 question, Senator - 9 SENATOR STAFFORD: Going to one 10 of these facilities is hospitalization. 11 SENATOR ABATE: Right. But then, 12 Senator, there's such a need - 13 SENATOR STAFFORD: Outpatient 14 services, also. 15 SENATOR ABATE: That's what I 16 meant in the community, those community supports 17 or the hospitalization. 18 So my concern is, there is a 19 tremendous need within New York City, far 20 greater than the current existence of beds and 21 community-based programs. My question is, if we 22 are cutting -- and your proposal not only cuts 23 further psychiatric beds in New York City and 7054 1 reduces community reinvestment -- where do these 2 individuals end up? 3 SENATOR STAFFORD: Senator, your 4 point is well taken and that is being asked in 5 every area of the state. And believe you me, I 6 understand the New York City is the greatest 7 city in the world, but an ill person there is no 8 different than an ill person in any other part 9 of this state, and we have the same problems 10 that you are talking about in all of the areas 11 of state. There is a ferocious debate going on 12 in the field. They can't agree when they come 13 in to see me, the care givers and the 14 professionals. 15 SENATOR ABATE: Senator, I agree 16 that there is a need, and I would like to see 17 more money throughout the state through the 18 Community Reinvestment Act restored because 19 there is a need not just in New York City but 20 throughout the state to support people in their 21 homes and in their communities? 22 SENATOR STAFFORD: I won't argue 23 that, and that's why we took it from zero to 7055 1 12.5 million. 2 SENATOR ABATE: And we agree, but 3 my concern - 4 SENATOR STAFFORD: Excuse me. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator. 6 SENATOR STAFFORD: Pardon me. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: If you 8 would direct your question through the chair to 9 the Senator. 10 SENATOR ABATE: But are you 11 aware, Senator, that there are -- 60 percent of 12 the severely diagnosed mentally ill are in New 13 York City, but there is nowhere near -- I mean, 14 traditionally, New York City has been under 15 served in terms of mental health facilities and 16 supports. 17 So by cutting, further, these 18 programs, aren't we really handicapping New York 19 City that much further to a further extent than 20 anywhere else in New York State? 21 SENATOR STAFFORD: Will the 22 Senator yield to me asking a question in my 23 answering? 7056 1 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator, 2 will you yield? 3 SENATOR ABATE: Yes. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: The 5 Senator yields. 6 SENATOR STAFFORD: I'm a layman 7 compared to this gentleman on my right and a 8 layman compared to the people who work in this 9 field. But are you sharing with me that when we 10 have a psychiatric hospital in each borough of 11 New York City and that would be Richmond - 12 that's Staten Island, right -- and then Kings 13 which is the borough of Brooklyn, Queens, Bronx. 14 SENATOR ABATE: I would love to 15 answer that question. 16 SENATOR STAFFORD: No, wait a 17 minute. 18 SENATOR ABATE: Not yet? Okay. 19 SENATOR STAFFORD: Manhattan. 20 Where are the Yankees? 21 (Response of "Bronx.") 22 And the Bronx. Right, the 23 Bronx. Now, are you sharing with me here this 7057 1 evening at 6:32 and a half, June 10, if there is 2 a facility in each one of those boroughs 3 compared to other parts of this state, New York 4 City is underserved? 5 SENATOR ABATE: I would love to 6 respond to that, Senator. That's a question? 7 Okay. Yes, and I do appreciate 8 the question. 9 Yes, and let me tell you from 10 what perspective I speak. I remember at Rikers 11 Island doing some statistics on the 120,000 12 people that walked in and out those doors. 13 Would believe that 25 percent of the people that 14 were admitted to Rikers Island were in need of 15 mental health services? 16 And there's another statistic. 17 The people with mental health needs - 18 SENATOR STAFFORD: Can I ask one 19 more question? 20 SENATOR ABATE: -- these are 21 people in jail that we spend $60,000 a year - 22 SENATOR STAFFORD: Would you 23 yield for a question? 7058 1 SENATOR ABATE: -- because 2 there's no community programs. 3 SENATOR STAFFORD: Will the 4 Senator yield for a question? 5 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 6 Abate, will you yield for a question? 7 SENATOR ABATE: Can I first 8 respond to the question? 9 SENATOR STAFFORD: By all means. 10 Excuse me. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Thank 12 you. 13 SENATOR ABATE: It was such a 14 good question I'm going to try to respond to it 15 appropriately. So of the 100,000-some people 16 that came through Rikers Island -- I'm sure you 17 know what Rikers Island is. It's the jail 18 system. One of the parts of the jail system in 19 New York City. It's near the airport, LaGuardia 20 Airport. 21 Anyway, it's a very large 22 correction facility. And so we're talking about 23 25 percent of the people that pass through 7059 1 Rikers Island are in need of mental health 2 treatment, and some of them suffer from very 3 chronic mental illnesses. 4 The judges -- and because there 5 is a great deal of concern. What do you do with 6 people who are incarcerated long periods of 7 time, being charged with misdemeanors? Going 8 back to the judges and also faced with the 9 statistics that the people were serving 6.5 10 times longer than someone else without a mental 11 health history because -- do you understand 12 why? Because the judges said there was nothing 13 they could do with them. There were no hospital 14 beds. There were no community-based programs. 15 So the only thing the judges would say if they 16 had a mental health problem let them stay in 17 Rikers Island because we had no other solution. 18 So my suggestion is, is that 19 smart, Senator Stafford? Is that cost 20 effective? Instead of putting money in 21 community-based programs and limited psychiatric 22 hospital units, we're willing to spend $60,000 a 23 year to house someone at Rikers Island because 7060 1 there is no other option in the community to 2 deal with these individuals. 3 So it seems to me -- we use this 4 phrase over and over again. Isn't this penny 5 wise and pound foolish? 6 How can we not afford -- this is 7 my question if the Senator could yield to one 8 last question. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Yes, 10 Senator yields to one last question. 11 SENATOR ABATE: How can we not 12 afford in human terms and in dollar terms not to 13 keep the facilities and the community-based 14 programs available in the City of New York? 15 Because we're either going to pay for it in the 16 front end, which is a lot fewer dollars than in 17 the back end when we're talking $60,000 per 18 person per year. That buys a lot of treatment. 19 SENATOR STAFFORD: I would answer 20 the distinguished Senator from Manhattan this 21 way by making - 22 SENATOR ABATE: Not from Brooklyn 23 but from Manhattan. 7061 1 SENATOR STAFFORD: I said 2 Manhattan. 3 SENATOR ABATE: You're right. 4 Absolutely right, and I'm not from Plattsburgh. 5 SENATOR STAFFORD: Pardon me? 6 SENATOR ABATE: I'm not from 7 Plattsburgh. 8 SENATOR STAFFORD: Well, that's 9 unfortunate. Now, I had a friend of mine who 10 was in Corrections, and he was in Correction 52 11 years. He retired when he was about -- he 12 started before he was 21, but he was a warden 13 for 22 years, and he said this was a hard 14 figure, seventy -- and that is your field, and 15 this is how you can debate this. You know, 16 medicine isn't an exact science. I found that 17 out. You know, when you have doctors working 18 and things work out, and you have doctors right 19 in front of you argue, and you start realizing 20 that, you know, it's -- it isn't exact. This 21 field isn't exact. He said 75 percent of the 22 people that are incarcerated didn't -- he said 23 this now -- didn't needs bars; they needed 7062 1 mental health - 2 SENATOR ABATE: Amen. 3 SENATOR STAFFORD: -- services. 4 That was a fellow who was considered one of the 5 hard wardens of the state. 6 Now, to answer your question. 7 It's a very good question, because I, of course, 8 am familiar with correction facilities myself, 9 and I know that there are people professionally 10 in the field that feel very strongly the need 11 for these services that you are referring to in 12 these facilities. Once again -- and, you know, 13 it's very difficult to stand here and to -- not 14 difficult, but it's unfortunate that we have to 15 stand and say, you know, we can only do what we 16 can afford and we can only provide the services 17 that we can afford and they are hard decisions 18 that have to be made, where we provide the 19 services, and you are very well versed in the 20 field, and the professionals can debate this and 21 not agree. 22 SENATOR ABATE: Thank you, 23 Senator. 7063 1 Just a moment on the bill. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: On the 3 bill, Senator Abate. 4 SENATOR ABATE: Where we depart 5 -- and I think sincerely, Senator Stafford, you 6 are absolutely committed. You understand the 7 concerns of communities throughout the state and 8 the need to supply critical services for people 9 who suffer from mental illness. 10 But where we depart and why I can 11 not support the Senate budget proposal is that 12 we can not afford today to take money away from 13 community reinvestment and to close needed 14 psychiatric beds. 15 The pennies we save today, we 16 will spend threefold, maybe fourfold, tomorrow; 17 and where will we spend those dollars? 18 The mentally ill who can not stay 19 in homes because their families can not take 20 care of them will end up on the street. They 21 will end up, in the best possible circumstances, 22 in homeless shelters and that will cost enormous 23 amount of dollars to municipalities throughout 7064 1 this state. 2 It will affect -- if more 3 mentally ill are on the street, it will affect 4 the quality of life of neighborhoods throughout 5 the state. 6 And then the worst scenario that 7 there will be some mentally ill persons who do 8 not receive the care and support they need will 9 end up in jail systems throughout the state at 10 an enormous cost to the localities. 11 So for the couple dollars that we 12 need to invest in today, we will save not only 13 neighborhoods, we will save lives. We will 14 reduce the havoc that will be created throughout 15 communities in this state. 16 So I, like you -- it's not just a 17 New York City issue. The issue of investing in 18 mental illness is a statewide issue. We can not 19 turn our backs. It's one of the critical goals 20 of government, and we have to find that first 21 dollar. If we don't, all of us will suffer in 22 the long run. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 7065 1 Dollinger. 2 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Madam 3 President, there is an amendment at the desk. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Amendment 5 at the desk. 6 SENATOR DOLLINGER: I'd waive its 7 reading and ask to be heard on the amendment. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Waive its 9 reading. Would you like to explain the 10 amendment? 11 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Yes. This 12 amendment has four parts to it and gives the 13 Majority an opportunity to follow through on 14 what I heard were its promises today. 15 Senator Bruno talked about the 16 effect of this budget on mental health and said 17 that this budget improved the status of mental 18 health in this state. 19 Senator Padavan said that this 20 budget as presented by the Majority was a 21 reflection of what you had heard from the 22 people. 23 Well, let me tell you what we 7066 1 have heard from the people because this 2 amendment addresses the difference between hard 3 choices and no choice at all. This amendment 4 would do the following. 5 It will put $4 million into the 6 South Beach program in Staten Island, which will 7 continue the commitment to South Beach and also 8 allow the clinics that are open throughout the 9 city of New York to remain open -- $4 million. 10 It will commit $4.3 million to 11 the Kingsboro Psychiatric Center. In addition 12 to the 2.5 million that's been restored by the 13 majority, this will fully fund the operation of 14 Kingsboro. It will save the jobs of the 15 employees there, but, more importantly, it will 16 continue financing Kingsboro so they can 17 continue to serve the approximately 400 or so 18 inpatients that they currently have and continue 19 their outpatient program, as well. 20 Three, this will fully commit us 21 to the Community Reinvestment Act. The Majority 22 has proposed that we restore 12.5 million. That 23 is not enough. That is what the people of this 7067 1 state have told us. It's not enough money to 2 make community reinvestment a reality in this 3 state. 4 I can remember one of the best 5 speeches I heard, one of the most effective 6 polemics I heard on this floor, came from 7 Senator Spano two and a half years ago when the 8 Hudson Valley Psychiatric Center was at issue, 9 and he made an impassioned case for community 10 reinvestment to keep the dollars in the 11 communities. 12 Well, if you pass this budget 13 without this amendment, you are not going to 14 keep those savings in the communities. You will 15 make community reinvestment a mere farce. Make 16 it a reality. Put the 22.5 million back to 17 work. Make community reinvestment fulfill the 18 promise that this body made two and a half years 19 ago when we committed ourselves to community 20 reinvestment. Keep that commitment. 21 ADAP is the third piece. This 22 program will provide $10 million more for the 23 prescription drug portion of the ADAP program. 7068 1 This will allow people who do not qualify for 2 Medicaid to get $10 million to help them in 3 obtaining prescription drugs to deal with the 4 opportunistic infections that often plague 5 people with HIV. This is a step to make the 6 formula work, to give those who are fighting for 7 their lives the opportunity for help so that 8 they don't have to impoverish themselves to get 9 the prescription drugs they need. It's $10 10 million. 11 The last piece is very simple. 12 If there is a flaw in this budget as it is 13 proposed by the Governor and as it's proposed by 14 the Majority, it's that it transfers 15 responsibilities from the state to the counties 16 and doesn't give them the money to fulfill that 17 promise. 18 What am I talking about? Local 19 public health, primary care clinics, 20 immunizations, the TB program. You have 21 proposed putting 3 million of the 10 million 22 that was cut by the Governor. Let's put 90 23 percent of it back. Give $6 million more to 7069 1 local public health. Increase the total 2 appropriation to 9 million, and we will be able 3 to fulfill our responsibilities as a state for 4 the people of this state for simple issues of 5 public health, immunizing our children and 6 providing primary care. 7 NYSAC favors this. The city of 8 New York favors this restoration, because they 9 know if you don't do it communities are going to 10 have to raise local property taxes. All we're 11 doing is passing another one of the things we're 12 famous for, the things this Majority is famous 13 for, another form of unfunded mandates to our 14 local communities. 15 I'll also address the issue that 16 Senator Padavan brought out. How do you pay for 17 it? It's very simple. The total cost is about 18 $50 million. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: 20 Background noise, please. Please keep the 21 background noise down. 22 Senator. 23 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Thank you, 7070 1 Madam President. 2 How do you do it? We can find 3 the $50 million. We have been revising the 4 revenue projections since the dawn of this 5 year. We can find $50 million more. Come up 6 with a tax amnesty program that works. New 7 Jersey has found it successful. It will be 8 successful here. It will generate additional 9 revenue that can easily pay this 50 million. 10 Simply readdress the revenue estimates in this 11 budget. We can find the 50 million. 12 But the critical piece that you 13 should all recognize is that this may be a hard 14 choice for us, but look at the people who will 15 be affected by this amendment. They have no 16 choice at all. What may be a hard choice for us 17 is no choice for them. 18 Give the people who need 19 immunizations a choice. Give the people who 20 need primary care a choice. Give the people who 21 are afflicted with HIV who need prescription 22 drugs, give them a choice. Give community 23 investment to the people who need those 7071 1 resources, mental health people in our cities 2 and our communities. Give them a choice. Give 3 the people at Kingsboro and the people who 4 depend on South Beach a choice, as well. 5 If you listen to the people, you 6 have no alternative but to give the people of 7 this state this choice. At $50 million, we can 8 find the money, and it's well worth it. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: The 10 question is on the amendment. 11 Senator Abate. 12 SENATOR ABATE: Yes. On the 13 amendment. I support the amendment, and I just 14 would like to address one part of the amendment 15 which is the ADAP program, which is the AIDS 16 Drug Assistance Program. 17 On December 31, 1995, our 18 government failed 10,000 people, and these are 19 10,000 people who were enrolled in ADAP; and 20 because ADAP up to that point and up to this 21 point is a federally-funded program that serves 22 people with AIDS who want to work and are not 23 Medicaid eligible -- they are taxpayers, but 7072 1 they do not make enough money to buy the 2 prescription drugs, the psychotropic drugs, the 3 vitamin supplements and mineral supplements 4 necessary to keep them alive. So what happened 5 at the end of last year? 6 Because the program was so 7 successful, there was no money left. So 70 8 percent of the vitamins and minerals and drugs 9 available to the 10,000 people who want to work 10 and want to be taxpayers and don't want to be 11 become Medicaid eligible were told, "Seventy 12 percent of these drugs are no longer available 13 to you." 14 Now, we can turn our backs and 15 say this is a federal program, even though, year 16 after year, through Ryan White dollars more 17 money comes into the program, even this year, a 18 whole cadre of us went to Washington with 19 Commissioner DeBuono and asked for more money to 20 come to this state. And I believe seven or 21 eight million dollars more is coming to this 22 State to support this program, but it's not 23 enough. There is a gap of 25 million. 7073 1 So what this amendment would do 2 would be, for the first time the state would 3 recognize this is such a critical program and 4 we're going to devote tax -- state tax levy 5 dollars to support this program, and that's what 6 the $10 million would be all about. Up to this 7 point, the state has only spent $400,000 in 8 administrative costs. 9 So if we think it's worthy of 10 people who are disabled, people with AIDS, and 11 they want to work, they want to have dignity, 12 but we also want to make sure they have 13 available to them new drugs that are approved by 14 the FDA like the new proteose inhibitor -- this 15 is a drug that actually may save someone's 16 life. It may mean the difference between life 17 and death. If we give the money to ADAP through 18 this amendment, we are saying to 10,000 people 19 with AIDS who also want to work, who do not want 20 to become Medicaid eligible, we respect them. 21 We care about their health care needs, and we 22 will assure these drugs remain available. 23 This to me is a bipartisan 7074 1 issue. It's not a partisan issue. It's about 2 health. It's about prolonging people's life, 3 and I hope everyone in this chamber will support 4 this amendment. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 6 Abate. 7 Senator Markowitz. 8 SENATOR MARKOWITZ: Thank you 9 very much. 10 On the amendment. I really want 11 to congratulate my colleague for offering the 12 amendment, recognizing, of course, the chances 13 of passage like most of the things that we offer 14 which make perfect common sense will go nowhere, 15 into that circular file. 16 But, Senator Stafford, I had the 17 opportunity because of your generosity to visit 18 beautiful Plattsburgh on more than one 19 occasion. Very quiet, very picturesque 20 community. Really a part of small town New York 21 State. 22 Certainly, many of us that live 23 in and represent neighborhoods, communities, 7075 1 somewhat larger and are faced with some of the 2 urban challenges look to Plattsburgh as in some 3 ways an ideal of people that seem to have found 4 for themselves a very quiet, relaxing way of 5 life; and Plattsburgh, at least on the occasions 6 that I have been there, certainly seems to have 7 significantly less problems than communities 8 that are as large as the county of Kings. 9 Having said that, Kingsboro 10 Psychiatric is the only institution that we have 11 in a borough of 2.3 million. I can't accept, 12 nor will I ever accept, that we can't do -- we 13 can do. We can do. Your position and your 14 colleagues' probably is, "Well, we just don't 15 have the funds." We can have the funds. 16 We have to decide. What type of 17 society do we want? What is the proper role of 18 government in New York and across the nation? 19 And that's pretty much the arguments that are 20 occurring today in Washington and here in New 21 York State. 22 I believe that we have a 23 responsibility to provide; and once we make that 7076 1 decision, then we know how to go about getting 2 the funds, obtaining the funds, to provide those 3 services. I certainly don't ever want a member 4 of your family or a member of yours, Senator, 5 next to you ever to be in a position to have 6 relatives in Brooklyn that have to be turned 7 away because we don't have the funds to provide 8 for those greatest in need. 9 I don't accept it, Senator 10 Stafford, and I only hope that my colleagues in 11 the Republican Party recognize that you have an 12 obligation way beyond party affiliation, way 13 beyond a governor, this governor or any 14 governors that have come before him and that 15 will surely come after him; and that is, that we 16 have an obligation, Senator Stafford, to come up 17 with the necessary funding, make the provision 18 and provide it and get it done and provide the 19 services in this state and not cut back, 20 certainly, on those most vulnerable in our 21 society. 22 So I support Senator Dollinger on 23 a tremendous amendment; and as I look to Senator 7077 1 Marchi and some of his wonderful colleagues, I 2 know, Senator Marchi, that since you are 3 impacted like we are in our county that you are 4 going to do the right thing and support Senator 5 Dollinger's amendment, and I thank you. 6 SENATOR STAFFORD: Madam 7 President. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 9 Stafford. 10 SENATOR STAFFORD: I told 11 everyone we weren't going to talk on the 12 amendments, but Senator Markowitz has the 13 ability to get people on their feet. 14 Now, he says it's calm in 15 Plattsburgh, and he said it's just very placid. 16 Well, it was a beautiful summer evening, and a 17 local business was having a dinner, so I 18 announced Senator Markowitz, and he gave them 19 the same speech that he just gave; and if you 20 ever saw a riot in the place, you should have 21 been there. But I got to say he didn't back 22 down. They didn't either, by the way. So there 23 was one time in Plattsburgh when things weren't 7078 1 very calm. 2 Now, let me talk just exactly the 3 way you were talking, Senator. We have to make 4 some tough, solid decisions, and we just can't 5 continue to spend, spend, spend on any field, 6 whether it's education, social services, mental 7 health, any field. We've got to look and decide 8 where the funds are going to go. We don't have 9 them any more. If we kept spending, the way we 10 spent the last 20 years, the state was going to 11 go down the drain. No one would get services. 12 There would be no education, no social services, 13 no infrastructure, no state. 14 I vote no. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 16 Leichter. 17 SENATOR LEICHTER: Madam 18 President, Senator Stafford had the ability to 19 get me on my feet on this. But, you know, the 20 one thing that has not been discussed and said 21 -- and I will try to make it brief. But I 22 think that the whole debate so far and I think 23 all of us realize -- you know, this is a 7079 1 charade. It's an exercise in futility; 2 nevertheless, I think it does give expressions 3 to interests, concerns, policies, that 4 particular legislators have and certainly that 5 the two sides of the aisles have. 6 But all of what has not been 7 discussed is the deficit and why we have a 8 deficit. Senator Stafford says we can't keep on 9 spending this way and so on. The fact is that 10 over the last few years, we have reduced state 11 spending, and the fact also is that some of the 12 spending that did occur was driven by the 13 Majority in this house. 14 But the point is the reason that 15 we have a deficit is because you enacted a 16 three-year phased-in income tax that you didn't 17 have the money for. You promised that this was 18 going to generate so many jobs and it was going 19 to increase economic activity. 20 Well, it hasn't done that, and we 21 knew it wouldn't do it because it was more of 22 that same supply-side nonsense that we saw in 23 the Ronald Reagan years that didn't work, that 7080 1 this state tried in 1987 with Cuomo legislative 2 four-year phased-in tax cuts that didn't work. 3 In fact, the job growth last year in New York 4 State was slower than in the last year of the 5 Cuomo administration. 6 So we've got a deficit; and, 7 furthermore, that deficit is driven by this tax 8 cut which was a tax cut that essentially 9 benefited affluent people. Forty percent of the 10 tax cut goes to affluent people. Doesn't go to 11 people in Essex County or Clinton County because 12 there are very few people that could really 13 benefit from that tax cut, but they're paying 14 the price for it. 15 They are paying it in higher real 16 estate taxes. We're paying it down in New York 17 City in higher transportation costs, and you're 18 asking the most vulnerable, fragile part of our 19 population, those people who need mental 20 services to pay for it, because they will not be 21 able to get those services. 22 So you are breaking your 23 promises. You are breaking the promise that 7081 1 this Legislature made, that George Pataki made 2 as a Senator when he voted for the Community 3 Reinvestment Act. That was a promise that I 4 think was a solemn sacred promise that we would 5 take care of those people in need, and we're 6 breaking that promise, and we're doing it to 7 give tax cuts to people who certainly don't need 8 it to the extent that the mentally ill need 9 these services. 10 So I'm going to very happily 11 support this amendment because it says that we 12 keep our word, and we made a commitment to the 13 mentally ill population and we ought to keep 14 it. 15 SENATOR STAFFORD: Madam 16 President. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Senator 18 Stafford. 19 SENATOR STAFFORD: I would only 20 point out to my distinguished colleague -- who I 21 would say summers in our area but he does more 22 than that; he also winters in our area, in 23 Wadhams; that's a suburb of Elizabethtown -- and 7082 1 I would emphasize this point. Governor Pataki 2 and with the legislation we passed last year, we 3 had $440 million surplus this year. We're using 4 that for the restoration that we're talking 5 about. We have 100,000 more jobs than we had 6 last year. 7 Between 1989 and 1992, Madam 8 President, we lost 500,000 jobs in this state. 9 I would suggest that it's not a failure but 10 Governor Pataki and with the tax cuts last year 11 we're on the right track. 12 Once again, we can debate. We 13 can have differences of opinion. I think we all 14 have concerns of those who we're considering 15 this evening, the programs, the services that 16 are provided to these individuals, but once 17 again, it's what this state can realistically - 18 realistically provide, and I have mentioned this 19 a number of times. 20 It doesn't make any difference 21 what the program is. If we have a social 22 program in this state but we spent year before 23 last $10 million -- we have 18 million people - 7083 1 California that year has 31 million people, and 2 they spent $7 billion -- excuse me, billion. 3 The next state that has 18 million people, 4 Texas, they spent $2 billion on the program. 5 Now, once again, I know that 6 there is certain apples and oranges and, you 7 know, it's not an exact comparison, but it tells 8 us something. It tells us that we were in real 9 trouble in all the areas of our budget, and we 10 have to make some very difficult choices. 11 And, once again, Madam President 12 -- excuse me. I would emphasize that we're 13 here this evening talking about restoration. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: The 15 question is on the amendment. 16 SENATOR PATERSON: Party vote in 17 the affirmative. 18 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Party vote 19 in the negative. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Call the 21 roll. 22 (The Secretary called the roll.) 23 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 19, nays 37, 7084 1 party vote. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Record 3 the party vote. The amendment is defeated. 4 Read the last section. 5 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 6 act shall take effect immediately. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Call the 8 roll. 9 (The Secretary called the roll.) 10 SENATOR GOLD: Madam President. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: Why do 12 you rise, Senator Gold? 13 SENATOR GOLD: I was getting 14 tired. I would like to explain my vote. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: To 16 explain your vote. 17 SENATOR GOLD: Madam President, I 18 am very, very appreciative of remarks such as 19 are made by Senator Stafford when he says that, 20 you know, we do what we can do. But the thought 21 that comes to my mind are two -- thoughts are 22 two. 23 Number one, there is the child 7085 1 who falls into a well. The television cameras 2 are there; and when the television cameras are 3 there, we will spend a million, two, four, it 4 doesn't matter what, to save that one beautiful 5 life, and we pray that we can save that life. 6 But without the television cameras being there 7 and without the drama when we do a budget, we 8 can't seem to personalize the items and the 9 need. 10 And the second thought that comes 11 to my mind is an attitude which is very 12 prevalent in a society, and I'm not criticizing 13 any society but it's the truth and we know it 14 happens, and that's the attitude of very decent, 15 loving, kind, good people who want to write out 16 a check for charity A or charity B, charity C, 17 and then who get offended if they are approached 18 in the street by a homeless person. They are 19 offended if they see somebody sleeping in the 20 street or - 21 I know we had a bill one year 22 that wanted to bring down the force of 23 government if somebody urinated behind a tree. 7086 1 These people take the attitude, and these are 2 good people, "Why do I have to see it?" 3 ACTING PRESIDENT RATH: 4 Background noise, please. 5 Thank you, Senator. 6 SENATOR GOLD: Why do I have to 7 see it if I gave to charity? The charities are 8 supposed to be dealing with this. Why do I have 9 to look it in the eye? 10 And, Senator Stafford, I guess 11 that really draws the distinction between some 12 of us. There are some people who have spoken 13 today who say that society has an obligation and 14 you got to meet that obligation, and there are 15 some people, well-meaning people, who say this 16 is as much of the obligation society can meet 17 and people have to live with it. 18 Senator, I understand how 19 difficult it is for the Majority in this house 20 to say to Governor Pataki, "Your proposal for 21 this state is insufficient. It is a disaster 22 and, in this particular bill, we must add $350 23 million." I know that's hard for you. 7087 1 On the other hand, Senator, it's 2 very hard for people on this side of the aisle 3 to look at a place like Brooklyn, New York - 4 many of us still haven't gotten over the loss of 5 the Dodgers -- and say that they are not 6 entitled to their own psychiatric center and 7 that that is a real need. It's not a luxury. 8 I vote no. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 10 Gold will be recorded in the negative. 11 Announce the results. 12 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 13 the negative on Calendar Number 1352 are 14 Senators Abate, Connor, Dollinger, Gold, 15 Hoffmann, Kruger, Leichter, Markowitz, Mendez, 16 Montgomery, Nanula, Onorato, Paterson, 17 Stachowski and Waldon. Ayes 41, nays 15. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 19 is passed. 20 Senator Marcellino. 21 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Will you 22 recognize Senator Nanula, please. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 7088 1 Nanula. 2 SENATOR NANULA: Thank you, Mr. 3 President. I'd like to request unanimous 4 consent to be recorded in the negative on 5 Calendar Number 1401. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 7 objection, hearing no objection, Senator Nanula 8 will be recorded in the negative on Calendar 9 Number 1401. 10 Senator Hoffmann, why do you 11 rise? 12 SENATOR HOFFMANN: I rise for a 13 point of clarification on Calendar Number 1401 14 and 1402. I believe several of my colleagues 15 and I may have been inadvertently recorded 16 incorrectly, and we would just like to make sure 17 for the record. Calendar Number 1401, do you 18 show negative votes recorded for Senators 19 Oppenheimer, Senator Dollinger, Senator Nanula 20 and myself? And Calendar 1402, I believe those 21 same names should all be recorded in the 22 affirmative. 23 SENATOR GOLD: Point of order, 7089 1 Mr. President. 2 SENATOR HOFFMANN: One second. 3 SENATOR GOLD: Point of order, 4 Mr. President. 5 SENATOR HOFFMANN: That's where 6 we had the confusion. One second, Mr. 7 President. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 9 Hoffmann, after reviewing the roll calls, were 10 you inquiring of the chair or the Senate 11 Minority Counsel, Senator Hoffmann? 12 SENATOR GOLD: Point of order, 13 Mr. President. 14 SENATOR HOFFMANN: Mr. President, 15 would you read back those negatives for Counsel? 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 17 Hoffmann, the desk, after reviewing the roll 18 call at the desk, you were voted in the 19 affirmative on Calendar Number 1401 and in the 20 negative on Calendar Number 1402. 21 You know, as an experienced 22 member of this Senate body, that you have the 23 ability to change those votes as long as we're 7090 1 in session if you'd like to, so the Chair would 2 certainly entertain an application at this time 3 if you had one, to shift your vote. 4 SENATOR HOFFMANN: Thank you very 5 much, Mr. President. 6 Due to the confusion in the way 7 the numbers were called at the time without 8 having the advantage of a fresh calendar in 9 front of us - 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: I 11 apologize for that, Senator Hoffmann. I was not 12 here, so I - 13 SENATOR HOFFMANN: I believe I 14 was in error at the time I was recording my own 15 vote and I believe several of my colleagues were 16 similarly in error. I would request unanimous 17 consent to be recorded in the negative on 18 Calendar Number 1401. I would like to be 19 recorded in the affirmative on Calendar Number 20 1402. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 22 objection. Senator Marcellino, any objection? 23 SENATOR MARCELLINO: As long as 7091 1 we understand that the confusion was not gener 2 ated from this side of the aisle. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 4 objection, Senator Hoffmann will be recorded in 5 the negative on Calendar Number 1401, and 6 Senator Hoffmann will be recorded in the 7 affirmative on Calendar Number 1402. 8 SENATOR HOFFMANN: I greatly 9 appreciate that courtesy, Mr. President. 10 Senator Alesi, why do you rise? 11 SENATOR ALESI: Thank you, Mr. 12 President. For entirely dissimilar reasons, I 13 ask for unanimous consent to cast my vote in the 14 negative on 1401. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 16 objection, hearing no objection, Senator Alesi 17 will be recorded in the negative on Calendar 18 Number 1401. 19 Senator Marcellino, why do you 20 rise? 21 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Can we take 22 up Calendar Number 1353. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Just 7092 1 before that, could we -- Senator Dollinger, why 2 do you rise? 3 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr. 4 President, I would ask also by unanimous consent 5 to be recorded in the negative on Calendar 6 Number 1401. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 8 objection. 9 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Thank you, 10 Mr. President. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Hearing 12 no objection, Senator Dollinger will be recorded 13 in the negative on Calendar Number 1401. 14 Secretary will read the title of 15 Calendar Number 1353. 16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 17 1353, Senate Print 5592-A, Budget Bill, an act 18 making appropriations for the support of 19 government (Transportation, Economic Development 20 and Environmental Conservation budget). 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Any 22 Senator wishing to speak on Calendar Number 23 1353? 7093 1 SENATOR LEICHTER: Oh, Mr. 2 President. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 4 Leichter, you wish to speak on Calendar Number 5 1353? 6 SENATOR LEICHTER: I have an 7 amendment at the desk on Calendar 1353, but if 8 Senator Gold wishes to address the bill. 9 SENATOR GOLD: No, no, just want 10 to make sure you had the right amendment. 11 SENATOR LEICHTER: Yeah. Then 12 would you be so kind, Mr. President, to call up 13 my amendment at this time? 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 15 Leichter, are you asking that the amendment be 16 offered up at this time? 17 SENATOR LEICHTER: Yes, please. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Amendment 19 is offered up. Do you waive the reading of it? 20 Reading of it is waived. You are now afforded 21 the opportunity to explain the amendment. 22 Senator Leichter. 23 SENATOR LEICHTER: Thank you, Mr. 7094 1 President. My colleagues, this is an amendment 2 that addresses the environmental section of this 3 budget bill and provides essentially for the 4 restoration of $4 million to the Department of 5 Economic Conservation, so as to avoid cuts that 6 were contained in the Executive Budget and that, 7 unfortunately, are carried over into the budget 8 of the Senate Majority, cuts that significantly 9 impair the ability of the Department to preserve 10 the air and the water and the environment for 11 all New Yorkers. 12 Senator Stafford in our debate on 13 the previous bill, and you said we were spending 14 too much, we have to cut. I think the people of 15 New York State certainly want us to have a lean 16 government, but I think one thing is clear, that 17 this haphazard cutting, and particularly cutting 18 the environmental protection is one that I think 19 New Yorkers did not vote for, do not support, do 20 not want and, when we talk about restorations, I 21 think one of the restorations that is absolutely 22 necessary is to give DEC the personnel, the 23 power, the tools to protect our environment. 7095 1 So my bill, or my amendment, is 2 very simple, not a big amount of money, but I 3 think, as you go throughout New York State and 4 you see problems, whether it's with Great Kills 5 in Staten Island or in a county where I'm 6 extremely fortunate to have a -- a vacation 7 home, Essex County, there is terrific concern 8 about landfills. There's terrific concern about 9 the pollution of streams and lakes, oceans. 10 There's terrific concern about the air that 11 people breathe and people want DEC to have the 12 necessary and the needed enforcement personnel. 13 So, Mr. President, I move the 14 amendment. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Is there 16 any other Senator wishing to speak on the 17 amendment? Hearing none, the question is on the 18 amendment. All those in favor signify - 19 Secretary will call the roll. 20 SENATOR PATERSON: Party vote in 21 the affirmative. 22 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Party vote in 23 the negative. 7096 1 (The Secretary called the 2 roll. ). 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Record 4 the party line votes. 5 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 19, nays 37. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 7 amendment is lost. 8 Secretary will read the last 9 section. 10 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 11 act shall take effect immediately. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 13 roll. 14 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 15 THE SECRETARY: Record the 16 negatives. Announce the results when 17 tabulated. 18 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 19 the negative on Calendar Number 1353 are 20 Senators Abate, Connor, Dollinger, Kruger, 21 Lachman, Leichter, Markowitz, Mendez, 22 Montgomery, Nanula, Onorato, Smith, Stachowski 23 and Waldon. Ayes 42, nays 14. Also Senator 7097 1 Oppenheimer. 2 SENATOR GOLD: You got Paterson 3 no? 4 THE SECRETARY: We withdraw 5 Senator Oppenheimer as a negative and record 6 Senator Paterson in the negative. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 8 is passed. 9 Now, Senator Smith, why do you 10 rise? 11 SENATOR SMITH: Mr. President, I 12 request unanimous consent to be recorded in the 13 negative on Calendar Number 1352. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 15 objection. 16 SENATOR SMITH: Thank you. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Hearing 18 no objection, Senator Smith will be recorded in 19 the negative on Calendar Number 1352. 20 Senator Oppenheimer. 21 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: I request 22 unanimous support to be in the negative on 23 Calendar 1401. 7098 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 2 objection, hearing no objection, Senator 3 Oppenheimer will be recorded in the negative on 4 Calendar Number 1401. 5 Senator Marcellino. 6 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 7 President, can we take up Calendar Number 1355. 8 1355. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 10 will read the title to Calendar Number 1355. 11 1355. 12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 13 1355, Budget Bill, Senate Print 5595-A, an act 14 making an appropriation for the support of 15 government on Legislature and Judiciary Budget. 16 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 18 Leichter. 19 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President, 20 I believe I have an amendment at the desk. Let 21 me see if I find it. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Would you 23 like to offer the amendment up at this time, 7099 1 Senator Leichter, waive its reading and ask for 2 an opportunity to explain it? Senator Leichter? 3 Senator Leichter? 4 SENATOR LEICHTER: Yes. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Are you 6 asking to offer the amendment up at this time, 7 waive the reading and ask an opportunity to 8 explain it? 9 SENATOR LEICHTER: You've guessed 10 my mind, Mr. President. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Thank 12 you. The reading of the amendment is waived. 13 It is offered up, and you are afforded the 14 opportunity to explain it. 15 SENATOR LEICHTER: O.K. Mr. 16 President, some people have accused me of living 17 solely to be able to debate the legislative 18 budget. It is not true, and I must say that I 19 was hoping before my time here expires, which it 20 will I guess some time, that I would see a 21 legislative budget that I would get up and that 22 I would praise and I would say, We have finally 23 recognized our accountability and responsibility 7100 1 to the people of New York. We have an honest 2 legislative budget, and I was really certain 3 last year that 1996 would be that year, that all 4 of us would look and, my God, those of us who've 5 been here for some time would say, Hey, it's a 6 new budget. They really have come up with an 7 honest budget. 8 Now, did I base this on some 9 false hope? Did I have an illusion? No. I 10 relied on Joe Bruno. I relied on the Majority 11 Leader, because last year -- and I'm going to 12 read you from the debate that we had last year. 13 Last year, we had a budget that was in the 14 precisely same form as the budget that we have 15 now. Now it's in precisely the same form as 16 every legislative budget that I've seen. There 17 may be some changes in the numbers, but essen 18 tially what we have in the legislative budget 19 are large raw categories, no itemization. It's 20 a non-budget. It's an exercise in obfuscation 21 and over the years I debated against the legis 22 lative budget. I used to be the only one voting 23 against it. Then Senator Howard Nolan joined 7101 1 me. Now, most of the members of the Minority 2 over the years, Senator Pataki has voted against 3 the legislative budget, but last year I had this 4 debate with Senator Bruno, and I read, and I 5 asked him: "Just so that I'm" -- these are all 6 quotes. "Just so that I'm clear, Senator Bruno, 7 as I understand it, that itemization and that 8 information, that openness that you have 9 committed yourself to, will also be reflected in 10 the legislative budget so that we will see in 11 the legislative budget a degree of itemization 12 that we require from the executive." 13 Senator Bruno answers, quote: "We 14 will provide you, Senator, as much itemization 15 as there is in the Executive Budget. Does that 16 satisfy your requirement that it be as the 17 Executive Budget? Very clear, very direct." 18 However, one year later just another promise of 19 reform, promise of openness, promise of fairness 20 that unfortunately has not been kept. 21 Then I went on, and I -- so that 22 there has been no question, I want to be, if you 23 will, somewhat persistent on this, but I then, 7102 1 in the debate with Senator Bruno, I said and I'm 2 quoting: "But just so that we're clear as to 3 what we mean by an itemized budget, will you 4 agree with me, Senator Bruno, that this budget 5 bill that is before us is not an itemized 6 budget?" 7 Senator Bruno answered: "Well, 8 Senator, I wish I could answer you differently 9 but the agencies of this state report in about 10 the same fashion that we're reporting in this 11 legislative budget." Then he goes on and he 12 says, "but I, with the Governor and the Speaker, 13 are going to try to get more detailed with the 14 agencies, and we are -- and we have direct 15 control over our budget so we are going to have 16 fuller, better disclosure." Then Senator Bruno 17 goes on and he says, when I asked him whether 18 there's going to be back-up material so that we 19 have for the legislative budget what is provided 20 to us for the Executive Budget, he said, and I'm 21 quoting him: "I'm doing some research on this at 22 this very second, Senator Leichter, and my 23 research shows me that we will be very specific 7103 1 and the public expenditure review that we have 2 already indicated that we will support and 3 implement will contain, we believe to your 4 satisfaction, parts of what you are now 5 recommending and discussing." 6 Then he goes on and he says, "I 7 think you will be very happy, very satisfied as 8 will my colleagues here, to see every cent that 9 we spend itemized, so that everyone's salary is 10 itemized, all the expenditures for travel, for 11 office expense, for your district office 12 itemized, and I don't know how much more fully 13 we can disclose than that and, if you have any 14 suggestions, we're going to welcome it and we 15 will be very anxious to see what your amendment 16 contains." 17 Last year, I proposed an 18 amendment very similar to the amendment I'm 19 going to do now. I didn't think that I would 20 have to propose it this year, because as I've 21 just shown you, Senator Bruno was very clear, 22 very precise in stating that we would have an 23 itemized budget. 7104 1 Now, I know this has become, you 2 know, something of a joke. Here goes Leichter 3 again about the itemized budget, but the fact is 4 that it's really a test of how serious we take 5 our responsibility, and it's really a test of 6 whether we consider that this body -- and it's 7 also the Assembly, by the way, so it's the 8 Legislature as such, and I blame the Majority in 9 the Assembly to the same extent that I blame the 10 Majority in this house, but it's how honest 11 we're going to be with the public. 12 Are we going to tell them how we 13 spend our money, show to them that degree of 14 itemization that Senator Bruno committed himself 15 to, or are we going to say, you know, We're the 16 Legislature, we're different? We're above the 17 law. We're not accountable. We're not 18 responsible. We can do what we want to do and, 19 unfortunately, Senator Bruno has answered that 20 question by saying: "All right, I may have made 21 some promises last year, but who's going to hold 22 me to it? Who's going to hold the Legislature 23 to it?" 7105 1 I guess one of the reasons he can 2 get away with it is because the media seems to 3 pay very little attention to this issue and it 4 really goes to the heart of how we function and 5 it -- it really tests our integrity as a 6 legislative body. 7 So, Mr. President, my amendment, 8 as the amendment did last year, and as I'm doing 9 today, sets forth -- it's an itemized budget. 10 It sets forth salaries for the members, it 11 provides what the Majority Leader has, and it 12 gives you, when you look at it, you know what 13 the Legislature is spending its money on. 14 By the way, it's no different 15 than the Congress does. Congress has an extreme 16 -- extremely precise itemization. It's no 17 different than many of our sister states do, and 18 it is an honest budget. By the way, it happens 19 to be less than the budget that -- the 20 legislative budget that is proposed and that is 21 now before us, and I think when you itemize, 22 then you can see what sort of expenditures are 23 really necessary and you can get rid of some of 7106 1 the fat, some of the waste, some of the 2 political patronage that exists and is hidden in 3 the budget. 4 So I just want to say, you know, 5 that those of you like Senator Stafford and 6 you've talked about, you know, we can't continue 7 the spending and so on, well, here's a chance to 8 put your vote where your mouth is, where your 9 commitment is, and it's also your chance to vote 10 for honest government, responsible, accountable 11 and to -- so that if Senator Bruno, for whatever 12 reason, has not carried out the promise that he 13 made on this floor last year, we have the power 14 to do it. Accept this amendment and we will 15 have an itemized budget. 16 Mr. President, I move the bill. 17 I move the amendment. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 19 Dollinger, on the amendment. 20 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Just briefly, 21 Mr. President. I've supported Senator Leichter 22 in the past. This comes down to a very simple 23 issue for me. I've heard lectures on the floor 7107 1 of this Senate from lots of people who say we 2 ought to run government like a business. We 3 ought to run it like the private sector. 4 Name me one -- one small 5 corporation, private business, in this state 6 that doesn't itemize its annual expenditures. 7 When you can name one, I will vote against this 8 amendment. Every business does it this way 9 except government, it seems to me, follow that 10 vaunted private sector model that I'm always 11 talked to and people always tell me you run the 12 state government like a business. 13 We don't run our house like a 14 private business. We do it with this decades 15 old, perhaps centuries old budgeting method. 16 Senator Leichter, who probably is not one of 17 what I would call the free market people in this 18 Senate, but nonetheless, he's saying we ought to 19 run our business like every other business in 20 the state. 21 Here's your chance. Vote yes on 22 the amendment. 23 SENATOR VOLKER: Mr. President. 7108 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 2 Volker, on the amendment. 3 SENATOR VOLKER: Senator, very 4 quickly. 5 Senator Dollinger, have you ever 6 really looked at some of the corporate 7 accountings and some of the corporate dossiers 8 prior to these meetings? I think you ought to 9 take a look at them. If you think they're any 10 more detailed than the legislative budget, I've 11 got some news for you. I know a lot of 12 businesses, and I've seen some of the major 13 corporations when they send out some of their 14 prospectuses, because most of the prospectuses 15 they send out that are detailed, are not for 16 public viewing on a lot of occasions, and I 17 think we both know why. 18 Senator Leichter, all I can say 19 to you is, Who says we're not going to get any 20 more detailed budget? 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Is there 22 any other Senator wishing to speak on the 23 amendment? 7109 1 Senator Gold on the amendment. 2 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President, I 3 heard the last question that was asked by 4 Senator Volker, and he said to Senator Leichter 5 "And by the way, who said we're not going to 6 get a more detailed budget?" 7 Senator, I guess you're saying 8 it, and your side is saying it. Senator Bruno 9 earlier today said that the budget that he's 10 offering today in all its pieces is the complete 11 budget. Now, if you're telling me that Senator 12 Bruno has another budget bill to explain this 13 budget bill, I would like to know that. I would 14 feel comforted by it. 15 I think, Senator Leichter, the 16 issue this year is different than in other 17 years. In other years, you said to us that you 18 believe that the Legislature owed it to the 19 people to itemize and tell them how we're 20 spending their money. This year I heard 21 something completely different. 22 What I heard you say, Senator 23 Leichter, is that that's not the fight any 7110 1 more. What you said, you said that Senator 2 Bruno conceded to that fight. So the issue 3 before us today is even more significant in that 4 you're telling us, Senator Leichter, that there 5 is the credibility of a legislative leader 6 involved in this vote and that disturbs me, 7 Senator Leichter, because I have argued with 8 Senator Bruno man to man, person to person, many 9 times, and he and I disagree on issues and where 10 they come out, and that's O.K., and I shake his 11 hand and he shakes mine, I hope and we smile at 12 each other and that's fine. 13 This vote is one, I believe, of 14 integrity, and I've always thought Senator Bruno 15 was a person of integrity and I'm hoping, 16 Senator, that before we vote, he will come 17 busting through that door and say, "Franz, I'm 18 sorry, you're right, I said it and we'll change 19 it," and I'm hoping that before we vote he's 20 going to come busting through that door and say, 21 "Please, please, for those of you on my side of 22 the aisle, let's go for this because I said I'd 23 do it, and maybe I shouldn't have said I would 7111 1 do it, but I said it, and as sure as I have a 2 horse that I rode over the week end and got on 3 television with, I'm going to keep my word 4 because people who ride horses keep their 5 word." 6 So, Senator Leichter, I look at 7 the issue as unquestionably being different this 8 year, and I'm certainly going to support your 9 amendment. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Any other 11 Senator wishing to speak on the amendment? 12 Hearing none - 13 SENATOR GOLD: Can we open the 14 door, so Senator Bruno can be on the way in? 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Hearing 16 none, the question is on the amendment. All 17 those in favor signify by saying aye. 18 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Party vote 19 in the negative. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 21 Paterson, did you want to request a party vote? 22 SENATOR PATERSON: No, I did 23 not. I just want to do it over. 7112 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: All those 2 in favor of the amendment signify by saying 3 aye. 4 (Response of "Aye.") 5 Opposed nay. 6 (Response of "Nay.") 7 The amendment is defeated. 8 Anybody wishing to speak on the 9 bill? 10 Senator Dollinger, on the bill. 11 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Just briefly, 12 on the bill. 13 I'll give every person one reason 14 to vote against this bill. This bill cuts by 15 $27 million dollars in the judiciary department 16 including $14 million worth of funding for 17 vacant positions, and those vacant positions in 18 this state, the best we can estimate, 80 of them 19 are vacant positions in Family Courts throughout 20 this state. 21 I've heard a discussion 22 throughout this session and prior sessions that 23 the Family Courts of this state need help, that 7113 1 they need people to work and that they need 2 people to process our criminal justice system 3 for those in Family Court so that we create an 4 effective deterrent for our young people. 5 It seems to me that, if we don't 6 fund those 80 positions, we're in essence saying 7 we'll let the Family Courts continue to function 8 as they've functioned to this point. We'll let 9 delay be the order of business in our juvenile 10 courts. We'll allow too many kids to slip 11 through the cracks, and we don't dispense the 12 kind of justice we all believe should exist in 13 Family Court in an efficient and cost-effective 14 way. 15 If you believe in the Family 16 Court, and I've heard so many people during the 17 course of this session say how important our 18 Family Courts is -- are. Here's your chance, 19 put your money where your mouth is. Don't cut 20 those positions in Family Courts throughout this 21 state. Of all the places where we need to spend 22 money, we need to put our money into our 23 juvenile justice system. By cutting those 80 7114 1 positions throughout this state, we're taking 2 Family Court backwards instead of forwards. 3 Vote against this bill. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Any other 5 Senator wishing to speak on the bill? Hearing 6 none, the Secretary will read the last section. 7 THE SECRETARY: Section 35. This 8 act shall take effect immediately. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 10 roll. 11 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce 13 the results when tabulated. 14 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 15 the negative on Calendar Number 1355 are 16 Senators Abate, Dollinger, Hoffmann, Lachman, 17 Leichter, Montgomery, Oppenheimer, Paterson and 18 Smith. Excuse me, Senator Lachman recorded in 19 the negative. Ayes 48. Lachman affirmative. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: In the 21 affirmative. 22 SENATOR LACHMAN: Affirmative. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 7115 1 Paterson, why do you rise? 2 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President, 3 I'd like to be recorded in the affirmative. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 5 Paterson in the affirmative on this bill also. 6 Senator Smith, how are you 7 voting? 8 SENATOR SMITH: In the affirm 9 ative. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 11 Smith in the affirmative. Senator Montgomery. 12 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: In the 13 affirmative. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: In the 15 affirmative. 16 The Chair would make just the 17 observation that certainly we have a lot of 18 budget bills that we're taking up. There are a 19 lot of amendments, but it's very difficult for 20 the people up here at the desk and you're really 21 trying them intensely. You run in and out, run 22 in and out, up and down and around we go. 23 You're not voting from your seats. It's very 7116 1 difficult, very time-consuming and certainly 2 we're all busy people, and so I would certainly 3 ask the people -- ask all people on both sides 4 of the aisle, all people on both sides of the 5 aisle, and if you're going to register a vote, 6 and you want to take part in the debate, please 7 be in your seats. Please make it easy for the 8 people up here who are trying very hard to 9 record your votes. 10 Announce the negatives. 11 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 12 the negative on Calendar Number 1355 are 13 Senators Abate, Dollinger, Hoffmann, Leichter 14 and Oppenheimer. Ayes 51, nays 5. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 16 is passed. 17 Senator Marcellino. 18 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 19 President, we concur with your previous remarks 20 and we urge our members to do just what you 21 suggest. 22 Can we now take up Calendar 23 Number 1356, please. 7117 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 2 will read the title of Calendar Number 1356, 3 Calendar Number 1356. 4 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 5 1356, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate 6 Print Number 7714, an act to amend the Public 7 Authorities Law. 8 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 10 Gold. 11 SENATOR GOLD: Yes, Mr. 12 President. This bill, Calendar Number 1356, 13 which is basically an omnibus Article 7 bill, 14 and which I think different from prior years, 15 lumps many, many areas together. I have an 16 amendment at the desk. I would offer that 17 amendment, waive its reading and ask the 18 opportunity to explain it before adoption. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is 20 an amendment at the desk, Senator Gold. The 21 reading of the amendment is waived and you are 22 now afforded the opportunity to explain it. 23 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President, as 7118 1 I said, this bill, contrary to its predecessors, 2 has many different facets to it, and for that 3 reason, there are a number of areas which 4 require being addressed, and rather than offer 5 separate amendments as the Majority has chosen 6 to lump them together, I have an amendment which 7 deals with eight areas, and I think it will make 8 it easier because it gives the Majority the 9 opportunity to cast one affirmative vote instead 10 of having to cast eight affirmative votes. 11 The first part of the amendment 12 deals with the Tuition Assistance Program which 13 under the Majority bill has restored some of the 14 money. Under my amendment, we would restore it 15 all the way to current levels so that we would 16 continue for Senator Farley's benefit the 17 current law. 18 The second part of the amendment 19 deals with the transfer language which is 20 contained in the bill which takes some powers 21 from SED and changes it to HESC and basically 22 what my amendment does is to undo that language 23 and leave the powers exactly where they are. 7119 1 The third part of the bill deals 2 with local public health. The language would, 3 in effect, add $6 million. The language that 4 you have now would deny reimbursement in the 5 formula and make cuts to local public health 6 departments in the area of vaccines, TB 7 detection, primary care services and things of a 8 very significant nature. 9 If my amendment is not passed, 10 either those services will be denied or the 11 locality will have to increase property taxes to 12 raise the money for the services. 13 The fourth part of my amendment 14 deals in the area of revenue sharing and this 15 would add $52 million for the '97-98 budget and 16 basically help cities in that amount and again 17 give property tax relief. It would also help 18 some towns and villages to the extent of 5 19 million, and you say, Well, Senator, that's 20 '97-98. The importance of this is it gives 21 some planning room to those municipalities. 22 The fifth part is a language for 23 relocation of workers. This is rather 7120 1 significant because, as we all know, the 2 Governor has suggested decimating the Albany 3 area, just to give you one, and there are people 4 in Albany and in the surrounding area who are 5 going to lose their jobs. There is going to be 6 an overwhelming economic effect on the Albany 7 area, and my amendment would say that before you 8 can do that and decimate an area and move a 9 hundred state workers or private sector 10 employees, that there must be an analysis and 11 approval by the Comptroller, the Attorney 12 General and by the Legislature. 13 The sixth part deals with 14 distressed cities and, while there is some 15 reference in your bills to some of our cities, 16 my amendment would help Buffalo to the tune of a 17 million six; it would help Rochester to the tune 18 of 850,000, and it would help Utica to the 19 extent of 300,000, putting them where they 20 belong and helping them, along with other 21 areas. 22 The seventh part of my amendment 23 would restore powers to the hazardous abatement 7121 1 -- hazard abatement board and basically what it 2 does is restore those powers that are being 3 taken away and require annual reports to the 4 Legislature. 5 The eighth part of the amendment 6 and a part which everyone in this chamber should 7 want to be a part of, deals with Medicaid and 8 this cost factor is $138.5 million and basically 9 would put the reimbursement level, restoration 10 level rather, back to where the Majority in this 11 house and the Majority in the other house agreed 12 it should be. 13 Now, I can't speak for everyone 14 in this house, but I know everybody has their 15 pet charities, their pet peeves, their pet this 16 and their pet that, and I was very, very proud 17 of Senator Libous, for example, last week when 18 we had some physically disadvantaged people here 19 and we talked about what was unfortunately 20 called Disabilities Awareness Week, and when you 21 see these people you understand the need, and I 22 think that that is to our credit to pay 23 attention to them. 7122 1 The Medicaid program is not 2 charity. The Medicaid program is not a gift of 3 excess money to undeserving people to curry 4 favor. The Medicaid program is, by definition, 5 as we all know, a major life line. The Medicaid 6 program is an essential life line to millions of 7 people. 8 The restoration that you as a 9 Majority were ready to agree to and the Majority 10 in the Assembly were ready to agree to is a 11 restoration level which is not a luxury. It is 12 not a restoration level where Senator Stafford 13 or anybody else or I can glibly say, we do what 14 we can afford to do and no more. This is an 15 area where we are not speaking luxury. 16 So I would urge everyone in this 17 chamber to adopt these amendments to the Article 18 7 bill. They do not, in any one of the eight 19 instances, create luxury. There is not one of 20 these eight instances where we are not, by 21 definition, doing the right thing for people who 22 look to us for that help and who need that help 23 from us and if indeed the Senate today is 7123 1 offering to the people of this state a complete 2 budget, I urge upon you that these eight items 3 must be included if that budget is to be fair 4 for all of our people. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Any other 6 Senator wishing to speak on the amendment? 7 Hearing none - 8 SENATOR NANULA: On the 9 amendment. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 11 Nanula, on the amendment. 12 SENATOR NANULA: Thank you, Mr. 13 President. 14 I'd like to speak specifically in 15 regards to the aid to distressed cities portion 16 of the amendment and, for the record, I wish 17 this -- this aspect of the amendment actually 18 had gone a little bit further. I represent a 19 good portion of the city of Buffalo and pretty 20 much the entire city of Niagara Falls. In past 21 budgets, Governor Pataki and former Governor 22 Cuomo had allocated dollars to the city of 23 Niagara Falls relative to our tragic Love Canal 7124 1 debacle there and the settlement between the 2 state and Occidental Chemical. That money has 3 not been put into the budget this year that I'm 4 aware of, or at least the budget that's been 5 presented today and, in addition to that, there 6 is no aid for the city of Niagara Falls. 7 That's a disappointment. I am 8 encouraged, though, that there is a restoration 9 of some dollars here in this amendment to the 10 city of Buffalo, and I want to take a second to 11 remind everybody about the current status of 12 many of our upstate cities, from Yonkers to the 13 city of Niagara Falls and just about every city 14 in between. 15 Our upstate economies are 16 reeling. We're losing and we've lost a 17 substantial amount of our commercial tax base. 18 Our populations are aging and growing poorer. 19 Our neighborhoods are becoming distressed. Our 20 residential tax base, which in many of these 21 cities is our only remaining significant source 22 of tax revenue, is for a variety of reasons 23 becoming destabilized and to many local 7125 1 governments' credit, including our new mayor in 2 the city of Niagara Falls working with the 3 County Legislature in Niagara County, our mayor 4 of the city of Buffalo working with our County 5 Executive and their respective legislative 6 bodies, there are substantive processes, 7 substantive programs being put into motion to 8 stabilize this crisis situation in our urban 9 centers. 10 And, by the way, and this has 11 become -- this has been a real problem for us in 12 western New York. Many of our suburban counter 13 parts feel the strength of our cities, the 14 stability of our cities as urban centers really 15 isn't all that important given their suburban 16 status. Let the cities decay. Let the cities' 17 economic status dwindle. 18 Our upstate cities are the hubs 19 of our upstate metropolitan communities and, if 20 you look at the leading economic indicators from 21 western New York all the way down to this com 22 munity here in Albany and Troy and Schenectady, 23 they're reeling. They are reeling. We need to 7126 1 put together a responsible program at the 2 legislative level. The Governor has not been 3 proactive in regards to coming up with programs 4 to address the root causes of what's killing our 5 upstate cities. 6 Again, I give credit to our local 7 elected officials in areas that I represent for 8 trying to be proactive in regards to real 9 consolidation measures, but during this process 10 while we as a legislative body are deliberating 11 over changing the state and how to responsibly 12 reform New York, we need these dollars to keep 13 these cities afloat. 14 The world I come from, the 15 private sector I often make the analogy if 16 you're in Chapter 11 you can't focus on 17 expanding into new markets. You can't focus on 18 adding product lines. We're not going to be 19 able to focus on the root causes of these urban 20 situations and revitalizing our cities, 21 revitalizing our neighborhoods, revitalizing and 22 bringing back businesses to our cities which, in 23 turn, will stabilize our upstate metropolitan 7127 1 economies unless we can keep our upstate urban 2 environments, our cities, solvent. 3 The mayor of the city of Buffalo 4 who is a former Senator, served in this body, 5 has been imploring us historically since he took 6 office, to help in this short-term way. I'm 7 encouraging this body to support this amendment 8 in its entirety. This is a short-term solution 9 to keeping a situation away from insolvency, 10 keeping cities like Buffalo away from bankruptcy 11 so that we can work together to create the long 12 term solutions to bring back these urban centers 13 and, hopefully, with that bring back the 14 metropolitan communities of upstate New York. 15 I urge my fellow colleagues here 16 to support this amendment. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Question 18 is on the amendment. All those in favor signify 19 by saying aye. 20 (Response of "Aye.") 21 Opposed nay. 22 (Response of "Nay." ) 23 SENATOR PATERSON: Party vote in 7128 1 the negative. 2 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Party vote 3 in the negative. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 5 will call the roll. 6 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Record 8 the party line votes and announce the results. 9 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 19, nays 37. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 11 amendment is lost. 12 Secretary will read the last 13 section. 14 Senator Oppenheimer, you wish to 15 speak on the bill? 16 (Senator Oppenheimer nods head.) 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Chair 18 recognizes Senator Oppenheimer on Calendar 19 Number 1356. 20 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: In reading 21 the bill, there appears to be, and I guess I'm 22 addressing this to -- to Senator Rules -- Rules. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 7129 1 Stafford, do you yield to a question from 2 Senator Oppenheimer? Senator yields. 3 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Thank you, 4 Senator. 5 Does this bill include budget 6 votes for small city school - 7 SENATOR STAFFORD: Excuse me, Mr. 8 President. I'm sure it's me, but I can't hear. 9 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Does this 10 bill - 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 12 Oppenheimer. Senator Oppenheimer. I think 13 Senator Stafford was remarking that it's a 14 little noisy, and there were conversations going 15 on in the chamber that would best be taken out 16 of the chamber. So could we please quiet down, 17 members take their seats, staff take their 18 seats. If you have to have a conversation, take 19 it out of the chamber. 20 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Senator 21 Stafford, my question is, does this bill have in 22 it the budget vote for small city school 23 districts? It doesn't. I'm reading something 7130 1 incorrectly then. That was the question. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 3 will read the last section. 4 THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This 5 act shall take effect July 1st. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 7 roll. 8 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce 10 the results when tabulated. 11 Senator Abate, do you want to 12 explain your vote? 13 SENATOR ABATE: Yes. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 15 Abate, to explain her vote, I'm sorry. 16 SENATOR ABATE: Yes. The last 17 section was read so quickly, I would like to 18 have spoken on the bill, but - 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: You have 20 two minutes to explain your vote. 21 SENATOR ABATE: I have two 22 minutes. 23 But let me in a very fast 7131 1 fashion, I thought that Senator Bruno and 2 Assembly member Speaker Silver were brilliant a 3 couple of weeks ago when they recognized how 4 complex criminal justice issues are and they 5 made a decision that we should not be developing 6 criminal justice policy in a budget context in 7 Article 7 bills because there is, and I believe 8 a consensus that we have to do everything 9 possible for public protection, to make our 10 streets safer, that there's not a member in 11 either house of the Legislature that does not 12 support strong and vigorous law enforcement, 13 that don't want laws on the books that support 14 crime victims, and also that we need money for 15 treatment and prevention. 16 But the issues at hand are so 17 complex because what combination of treatment/ 18 prevention do we need as opposed to law 19 enforcement and prosecution? What, in fact, 20 when we do legislate new proposals, will make 21 our streets safer? What will be the impact of 22 the laws we pass on correction? Do we need to 23 build more prisons? What will the impact be on 7132 1 the courts? What will the impact be on parole 2 and probation, on the D.A.'s offices? I can go 3 on and on, the issues are so complex. 4 I cannot support this legislation 5 because, again, we're doing what we did last 6 year. We passed the most dramatic changes in 7 criminal justice overnight. What do we do? We 8 eliminated parole. We reduced good time from 9 one-third to one-seventh. We elongated 10 sentences. I think it was a decade, 20 years, 11 before we did anything as dramatic as last 12 year. But we were told it was a wash. We 13 didn't need to build more prisons, that the 14 D.A.s would go along with it, et cetera. 15 So I think we do a disservice to 16 people throughout the state. We believe in 17 public safety. We're for victims. We're for 18 justice, and I, if I had more than two minutes, 19 which I know I do not, I could have a lengthy 20 debate on all the issues that have been raised, 21 why we need to discuss these issues around 22 criminal justice much further. 23 So again, I shouldn't, as a State 7133 1 Senator, be doing a report called Dollars and 2 Cells, analyzing the impact of the laws last 3 year. Let's do it as a body. Let's be 4 methodical and scrutinize and make sure we do 5 the best thing we can for the people of the 6 state. Let's not do criminal justice policy in 7 the middle of the budget. Let's get all these 8 criminal justice issues out of the budget and 9 let's produce effective crime-fighting policy. 10 For this bill, I must oppose the 11 bill, and I thank the President for his 12 generosity in giving me another minute or so. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 14 Abate will be recorded in the negative. 15 Announce the results. 16 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 17 the negative on Calendar Number 1356 are 18 Senators Abate, Connor, Hoffmann, Kruger, 19 Lachman, Mendez, Montgomery, Nanula, Paterson, 20 Smith and Stachowski. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 22 Markowitz, why do you rise? 23 SENATOR MARKOWITZ: Negative. 7134 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 2 Markowitz, I know you've been here a long time, 3 as Senator Gold has and Senator Leichter. I 4 might remind you of Rule IX, section 1, of the 5 rules of this house, which says and I quote: "No 6 vote of a Senator shall be recorded on a bill on 7 a controversial calendar unless the Senator 8 shall vote from his or her seat." 9 So I just bring that to your 10 attention once again to reiterate the fact that 11 it's extremely difficult for people up here, the 12 Secretary and the members who are trying to 13 assist him, to record votes when people come in 14 and snap their fingers. We don't know whether 15 you're trying to signal something to a member of 16 yours or whether you're actually trying to vote, 17 so if you are going to vote, the Chair would 18 request that you vote from your seat. 19 SENATOR MARKOWITZ: I appreciate 20 your very kind comments. However, my negative 21 vote was acknowledged prior to my second 22 negative vote at this moment, and that is the 23 reason why I was standing over there because it 7135 1 was acknowledged and then it was not read off by 2 the clerk. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 4 Markowitz, how do you vote? 5 SENATOR MARKOWITZ: No. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 7 Markowitz voting in the negative. Senator Gold 8 will be recorded in the negative. 9 SENATOR GOLD: Be recorded in the 10 negative. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 12 Paterson. 13 SENATOR PATERSON: No, Mr. 14 President, I just wanted to -- to compliment the 15 personnel in recording the vote and to 16 understand, when Senator Marcellino spoke with 17 me, we were trying to address that problem; so 18 I'm sure you'll get calm and relaxed. You sound 19 tense, Mr. President. I just wanted to assure 20 you that we understand. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 22 Paterson, my stomach is sending me signals that 23 I'm not used to. 7136 1 Senator Leichter, how do you 2 vote? 3 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President, 4 I think you're absolutely correct, and I was one 5 of those guilty of snapping my fingers madly. 6 I'm not sure that the clerk got my vote. I'm 7 now at my chair and vote in the negative, 8 please. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 10 Leichter will be recorded in the negative. 11 Senator Montgomery, did you wish 12 to be recorded in the negative also. 13 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 15 Waldon. 16 SENATOR WALDON: Senator Waldon 17 from his chair, in the negative. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: In the 19 negative. Please announce the results when 20 tabulated. 21 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 22 the negative on Calendar Number 1356: Senators 23 Abate, Connor, Gold, Hoffmann, Kruger, Lachman, 7137 1 Leichter, Markowitz, Mendez, Montgomery, Nanula, 2 Paterson, Smith, Stachowski and Waldon. Ayes 3 41, nays 15. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 5 is passed. 6 Senator Marcellino. 7 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 8 President, can we take up Calendar Number 1357. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 10 will read the title of Calendar Number 1357. 11 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 12 1357, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate 13 Print 7723, an act in relation to certain 14 provisions. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 16 will read the last section. 17 THE SECRETARY: Section 13 - 18 SENATOR CONNOR: Explanation. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 20 Stafford, an explanation of Calendar Number 1357 21 has been requested by Senator Connor. 22 SENATOR STAFFORD: Mr. President, 23 we now pull things together here. This bill 7138 1 enacts technical provisions necessary to 2 implement the amended appropriation bill and 3 comply with the provisions of the New York State 4 Constitution regarding the content of 5 appropriation bills and the ability of the 6 Legislature to alter such appropriation. 7 As one who has served here with a 8 number of individuals who have served here for a 9 number of years, we all recollect when the 10 Legislature passed the budget that at times it 11 had language so that we could clarify what our 12 intent was and we could, in that way, do our 13 job, do it accurately and do it well. 14 The courts, in their wisdom, said 15 that -- well, let -- scratch the last 16 statement. A decision was made that, when it 17 came to an appropriation bill -- what case was 18 this called? -- the Bankers decision, but the 19 court said that we could not add words to the 20 appropriations bill. Nonetheless, Mr. 21 President, we now pass this law which refers to 22 the budget, and we now do indirectly what we did 23 directly previously. 7139 1 When we did it previously, it was 2 clear; it was very sensible. Now, we must do it 3 indirectly through legislation but we do it in 4 one bill. So what we are doing here is simply 5 making it crystal clear what our intention is 6 when we pass the appropriation measure. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Any other 8 Senator wishing to speak on the bill? 9 Secretary will read the last 10 section. 11 THE SECRETARY: Section 13. This 12 act shall take effect immediately. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 14 roll. 15 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 16 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 17 the negative on Calendar Number 1357 are 18 Senators Abate, Connor, Dollinger, Gold, 19 Hoffmann, Kruger, Lachman, Leichter, Markowitz, 20 Mendez, Montgomery, Nanula, Onorato, Paterson, 21 Smith, Stachowski and Waldon. Ayes 39, nays 17, 22 also Senator Oppenheimer. Ayes 38, nays 19. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 7140 1 is passed. 2 Senator Marcellino. 3 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 4 President, can we take up Calendar Number 1358, 5 please. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 7 will read the title of Calendar Number 1358. 8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 9 1358, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate 10 Print Number 7724, an act in relation to certain 11 provisions which impact upon the expenditure of 12 certain appropriations. 13 SENATOR GOLD: Explanation. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 15 Stafford, an explanation of 1358 has been asked 16 for by Senator Connor. 17 SENATOR STAFFORD: Mr. President, 18 what I would suggest here is what I just said 19 for the general government budget bill we are 20 incorporating now in the Transportation, 21 Economic Development and the Environmental 22 Conservation budgets. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 7141 1 Stachowski. 2 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Mr. 3 President, I believe I have an amendment up at 4 the desk. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is 6 an amendment here, Senator Stachowski. 7 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Could we 8 waive the reading, and I'd like to move the 9 amendment and explain it. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 11 reading of the amendment is waived. You're now 12 offered an opportunity to explain the amendment, 13 Senator Stachowski. 14 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: In the 15 amendment, what it does is, first of all, it 16 removes the UDC block grant authority and makes 17 the expenditure of such funds subject to a 18 chapter to be enacted by the Legislature. In 19 the second piece of this amendment, what it does 20 is it keeps intact the Governor's JOBS NOW 21 program, but instead of -- instead, it limits 22 its application to corporations with employees 23 of 300 or more and instead sets forth the 7142 1 criteria that I want to highlight, basically a 2 six-point criteria. 3 Those points are, first, it would 4 offer corporate tax incentives for retraining 5 rather than down-sizing. Companies would have 6 to match the incentives and could get a tax 7 credit of up to $500 per employee that they did 8 not let go. 9 Secondly, it would recruit failed 10 job creation tax credits, loans or grants in the 11 companies that give public money and then do not 12 create the jobs they have promised. That money 13 would come back to the state. 14 Third, it would provide training 15 vouchers for laid-off employees. Workers caught 16 in economic layoffs would be eligible for up to 17 $5,000 in approved retraining programs. 18 Fourth, it would expand New 19 York's unique Child Health Plus insurance plan 20 to cover children from 15 to 18 who are living 21 in near poor and working poor families. 22 Fifth, it would require better 23 notice of major layoffs and plant shutdowns, 7143 1 extend state law to cover plant closings 2 involving at least 50 workers in layoffs 3 affecting 20 percent of the work force or 150 4 individuals, and it would require a 60-day 5 notice and, lastly, would increase the minimum 6 wage from 4.25 to 5.05. The minimum wage has 7 not risen since 1991, and a study in New Jersey 8 shows that when they raised their minimum wage, 9 it had no significant job loss. 10 I think it's important to note 11 that when we talk about the retraining piece, 12 somebody might say, as I know Senator Padavan 13 asked earlier, Senator Montgomery, like how 14 would this cost more money? Are you adding to 15 the budget? 16 Well, in this particular case 17 we're not. We're using the same $30 million. 18 We're just changing the JOBS NOW, what programs 19 we do. With that, Mr. President, I move the 20 amendment. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 22 question is on the amendment. All those in 23 favor, signify by saying aye. 7144 1 SENATOR PATERSON: Party vote in 2 the affirmative. 3 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Party vote in 4 the negative. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 6 will call the roll. 7 (The Secretary called the roll.) 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Record 9 the party line votes and announce the results. 10 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 19, nays 37. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 12 amendment has failed. 13 Secretary will read the last 14 section. 15 THE SECRETARY: Section 51. This 16 act shall take effect immediately. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 18 roll. 19 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce 21 the results when tabulated. 22 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 23 the negative on Calendar Number 1358: Senators 7145 1 Abate, Connor, Gold, Hoffmann, Kruger, Lachman, 2 Leichter, Mendez, Montgomery, Nanula, Paterson, 3 Smith and Waldon. Ayes 43, nays 13. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 5 is passed. 6 Senator Marcellino. 7 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 8 President, can we take up Calendar Number 1359. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 10 will read the title of Calendar Number 1359. 11 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 12 1359, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate 13 Print 7725, an act in relation to certain 14 provisions which impact upon the expenditure of 15 certain appropriations. 16 SENATOR GOLD: Explanation. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 18 Stafford, an explanation of Calendar Number 1359 19 has been requested. 20 SENATOR STAFFORD: Mr. President, 21 once again I would incorporate the explanation 22 that I gave for the general government budget 23 bill and then referred that it was the same for 7146 1 the Transportation, Economic Development, 2 Environmental Conservation bill. It is now for 3 the Education, Labor and Social Services budget 4 bill. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 6 Paterson. 7 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President, 8 if Senator Stafford would yield for a question. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 10 Stafford, do you yield? Senator yields. 11 SENATOR PATERSON: Was it 12 Education, Labor or Social Services that this 13 explanation would suffice for? 14 SENATOR STAFFORD: For all 15 three. 16 SENATOR PATERSON: All three, 17 plus the two previous pieces of legislation. 18 SENATOR STAFFORD: Yes. 19 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President, 20 if the Senator would yield for a question. 21 SENATOR STAFFORD: Yes. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 23 continues to yield. 7147 1 SENATOR PATERSON: This would 2 inevitably create a savings to the public of 3 what in -- applied to this particular bill? 4 SENATOR STAFFORD: Well, of 5 course, we're now going back to the 6 appropriation bill. That would have the 7 savings. This legislation is just a language 8 bill which makes a clear, concise and really 9 tells a complete story on what we intend when we 10 pass the appropriation. Because of the Bankers 11 decision, they said we couldn't put any wording 12 in the appropriation bill. Now we have to do 13 indirectly what we used to do directly. 14 SENATOR PATERSON: I understand. 15 Mr. President, if Senator Stafford would yield 16 for another question. 17 SENATOR STAFFORD: Yes. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 19 yields. 20 SENATOR PATERSON: Then, in the 21 actual appropriations bill, if it would be 22 germane to this subject and regarded that way, 23 proportionally speaking, and I guess I'm 7148 1 interested in the education area specifically, 2 what the savings would be. 3 SENATOR STAFFORD: We restored 4 385 million in that portion of the budget. 5 SENATOR PATERSON: 385 million. 6 Thank you very much. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 8 Paterson, on the bill? 9 SENATOR PATERSON: That answers 10 my question. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 12 will read the last section. 13 THE SECRETARY: Section 62. This 14 act shall take effect immediately. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 16 roll. 17 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce 19 the results when tabulated. 20 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 21 the negative on Calendar Number 1359: Senators 22 Abate, Connor, Gold, Hoffmann, Kruger, Leichter, 23 Markowitz, Mendez, Nanula, Onorato, Paterson, 7149 1 Smith, Stachowski and Waldon. Also Senator 2 Lachman. Ayes 41, nays 15. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 4 is passed. 5 Senator Marcellino. 6 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 7 President, can we take up Calendar Number 1360, 8 six-zero. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 10 will read the title of Calendar Number 1360. 11 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 12 1360, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate 13 Print 7733, an act in relation to certain 14 provisions which impact upon the expenditure of 15 certain appropriations. 16 SENATOR GOLD: Explanation. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 18 Stafford, an explanation of Calendar Number 1360 19 has been requested by Senator Gold. 20 SENATOR STAFFORD: Mr. President, 21 as I have mentioned, this legislation provides 22 language which explains, points out, makes clear 23 what exactly it is our intent when we pass the 7150 1 appropriation, how that appropriation should be 2 interpreted. This bill is for the public 3 protection, health and mental hygiene portion of 4 the budget. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Any other 6 Senator wishing to speak on the bill? Hearing 7 none, the Secretary will read the last section. 8 THE SECRETARY: Section 80. This 9 act shall take effect immediately. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 11 roll. 12 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce 14 the results when tabulated. 15 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 16 the negative on Calendar Number 1360: Senators 17 Abate, Connor, Gold, Hoffmann, Kruger, Lachman, 18 Leichter, Markowitz, Mendez, Montgomery, Nanula, 19 Onorato, Paterson, Smith and Waldon. Ayes 41, 20 nays 15. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 22 is passed. 23 Senator Montgomery, why do you 7151 1 rise? 2 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Mr. 3 President, apparently you did not see my hand. 4 It was raised. I would like to be recorded in 5 the negative on Calendar 1359. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 1359, 7 Senator? Without objection, hearing no 8 objection, Senator Montgomery will be recorded 9 in the negative on Calendar Number 1359, Senator 10 Stachowski. 11 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Mr. 12 President, apparently with all the people moving 13 back and forth, my vote wasn't recorded in the 14 negative on 1358. I'd like to be reported in 15 the negative on 1358. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 17 objection, hearing no -- without objection, 18 hearing no objection, Senator Stachowski will be 19 recorded in the negative on Calendar Number 20 1358. 21 Senator Onorato. 22 SENATOR ONORATO: Mr. President, 23 I'd like unanimous consent to be recorded in the 7152 1 negative on Calendar Number 1358. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: You have 3 a job now as Senator Gold's counsel? 4 SENATOR ONORATO: Yes, I am. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: You have 6 a seat there. 7 Without objection, Senator 8 Onorato will be recorded in the negative on 9 Calendar 1358. 10 Senator Marcellino. 11 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 12 President, can we take up Calendar Number 1400. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 14 will read the title of Calendar Number 1400. 15 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 16 1400, an act to amend the Racing, Pari-Mutuel 17 Wagering and Breeding Law, in relation to 18 extending provisions relating to in-home 19 simulcasting. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 21 will read the last section. 22 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 23 act shall take effect immediately. 7153 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 2 roll. 3 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 4 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 56. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 6 is passed. 7 Senator Marcellino. 8 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 9 President, can we take up Calendar Number 1354, 10 please. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 12 will read the title to Calendar Number 1354. 13 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 14 1354, Senate Print 5593-A, Budget Bill, an act 15 making appropriations for the support of 16 government on general government budget. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair 18 recognizes Senator Hoblock. 19 SENATOR HOBLOCK: Mr. President, 20 we want to offer the following amendment to 21 Calendar Number 1354, Senate Bill 5593-A. I ask 22 the reading of the amendment be waived, and I'll 23 give a brief explanation. 7154 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 2 Hoblock, the reading of the amendment is waived 3 and you're afforded an opportunity to explain 4 the amendment at this time. 5 SENATOR HOBLOCK: Mr. President, 6 this amendment simply addresses state Tax and 7 Finance and it has to do with their contracting 8 or amendment for contracting in connection with 9 the income tax processing function. This 10 amendment provides that no monies will be 11 utilized directly or indirectly for any contract 12 or amendment to contract if, in fact, it has to 13 do with relocation of that process. 14 The amendment further goes on to 15 describe that monies can be used directly or 16 indirectly for tax processing contracts for Tax 17 and Finance if, in fact, it has to do with 18 expansion or enhancement of existing facilities, 19 and I move the amendment. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Question 21 is on the amendment. 22 Senator Paterson, why do you 23 rise? 7155 1 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President, 2 on the amendment. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 4 Paterson, on the amendment. 5 SENATOR PATERSON: I'm very happy 6 that Senator Hoblock has offered the amendment. 7 It will certainly help to hopefully save jobs. 8 Curious that Senator Hoblock did not vote for 9 the measure that would have saved jobs, the 10 amendment offered earlier here by Senator 11 Stachowski, and the issue is what we've got to 12 stop is the geographic patronage that exists in 13 this state, the moving of jobs in large numbers 14 and what is really the gentrification of the 15 economy in small areas, and what we're going to 16 have to have is consistency on that particular 17 issue, and so the amendment on its face is quite 18 meritorious, and we support it. 19 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 21 Gold, on the amendment. 22 SENATOR GOLD: Yeah, Mr. 23 President. 7156 1 I understand the problem that 2 Senator Hoblock is trying to address. I know 3 that there are areas of Queens County where we 4 are being threatened with losses of jobs and we 5 take it very seriously. I know that also 6 earlier today the mayor of this great city was 7 in the chamber and around, and he's very 8 concerned about this region. 9 Senator Hoblock, I've spoken to 10 Senator Paterson, and we're ready to give you a 11 party vote. I think that's 19 votes today and 12 if some of the members on your side will show 13 some respect for you the way we're going to give 14 you respect today, you may be able to do this 15 one. So why don't you talk it up on your side, 16 Senator? 17 I know it's a very important 18 matter for you. I hope that Senator Bruno and 19 your colleagues don't slap you in the face today 20 when you've shown so much concern for your 21 constituents, but we're going to help you, 22 Senator. We'll give you our side. Let's see a 23 rally on your side. 7157 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 2 Hoblock, on the amendment. 3 SENATOR HOBLOCK: Senator Gold, 4 thank you very much for that offer, and I 5 appreciate your support. Perhaps we can utilize 6 that in some other things that we may tend to 7 agree on, because so far in my brief tenure 8 there's been very little that we've agreed on, 9 but I appreciate that offer. 10 Senator Gold, I represent this 11 Senate District. I got separately elected. I 12 will fight for the constituents and voters in my 13 district, and I respect that of every other 14 legislator in doing the same. This is not a 15 business of trading favors. Perhaps with your 16 tenure you've been used to that. I am not, and 17 I support my -- my constituents, and that's why 18 I offered this amendment. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 20 Dollinger? Senator Gold. 21 SENATOR GOLD: Yeah, Mr. 22 President. 23 I'm interested to hear Senator 7158 1 Hoblock talk about trading favors, and I'm 2 reminded of some of the negotiations that we've 3 had, Senator, where there were Democratic bills 4 that were needed for localities and we held up 5 some bills on that side because members here 6 were fighting for their localities and I guess, 7 Senator, I wouldn't sit in judgment of anybody. 8 That's the Lord's work, not mine, but everybody 9 does what they have to do for their district, 10 but it will be interesting, Senator, if this 11 session ended and the only Republican bill to be 12 offered on this floor that was rejected would be 13 yours. I'd feel bad about that. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 15 Dollinger. 16 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Senator 17 Hoblock yield to a question? 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 19 Hoblock, do you yield? 20 SENATOR HOBLOCK: Yes. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 22 yields. 23 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Senator, has 7159 1 there been a similar amendment offered in any or 2 all of the interim pay bills that we've been 3 passing since April 1st? 4 SENATOR HOBLOCK: Not familiar. 5 SENATOR DOLLINGER: So there's 6 been no restriction -- again through you, Mr. 7 President -- so there's been no restriction on 8 the ability of the executive to transfer these 9 jobs or spend funds for these jobs since April 10 1st. 11 SENATOR HOBLOCK: This amendment 12 is different from that. 13 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr. 14 President, I missed the end of the answer. I 15 apologize. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 17 Hoblock, would you repeat the answer? 18 SENATOR HOBLOCK: I said this 19 amendment is different from what you may be 20 referring to, and I'm not sure what you're 21 referring to. 22 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Again through 23 you, Mr. President. 7160 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 2 Hoblock, do you continue to yield? 3 SENATOR HOBLOCK: Sure. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 5 yields. 6 SENATOR DOLLINGER: My question 7 is, at least as best as I've followed this 8 controversy, the Governor has been making this 9 movement to transfer jobs out of Albany to some 10 other location during the course of time since 11 April 1st when the budget -- last budget cycle 12 ended. I guess my question is, I'm trying to 13 find out what's the status of the Governor's 14 attempt to move these jobs? 15 SENATOR HOBLOCK: I apologize, 16 Senator Dollinger. My understanding is that 17 yes, the proposal has been made and perhaps the 18 administration is making its plans, but there's 19 no funds yet appropriated to implement it. 20 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Again through 21 you, Mr. President, just so - 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 23 Hoblock, you continue to yield? 7161 1 SENATOR HOBLOCK: Sure. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 3 continues to yield. 4 SENATOR DOLLINGER: There are no 5 funds. What does the Governor use to fund his 6 exploration of this potential shift in the jobs; 7 what funds does he use? 8 SENATOR HOBLOCK: I'm not sure. 9 It might have been the general funds out of the 10 Office of General Services. I'm not sure. 11 SENATOR DOLLINGER: O.K. Just 12 through you, Mr. President, I agree with Senator 13 Gold, I think this was a good amendment when 14 Senator Stachowski proposed it. I continue to 15 believe it's a good amendment. I share Senator 16 Paterson's view that this kind of geographic 17 patronage is not what this state should be all 18 about. I hope this sends a message to the 19 second floor that this institution, this part of 20 the Legislature, will not tolerate it. 21 My suggestion is that I guess 22 both houses of the Legislature could have sent 23 this message a long time ago if Senator 7162 1 Stachowski's amendment had become law. Al 2 though perhaps it's a little bit late, I still 3 think it's better late than never, and I'm going 4 to vote in favor. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 6 Paterson. 7 SENATOR PATERSON: Yes, Mr. 8 President. Actually, upon -- upon further 9 perusal, we've gone through a lot of bills 10 today. It was actually Calendar Number 1356 and 11 it was Senator Gold's amendment that, from my 12 reading -- had them both here -- seemed to 13 actually do the same thing, and so -- but I just 14 wanted to mention his name one more time. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 16 question is on the amendment to Calendar Number 17 1354. Secretary will call the roll. 18 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Party vote 19 in the negative. 20 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce 22 the party line vote with exceptions. 23 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 20, nays 36, 7163 1 party vote with exception. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 3 amendment is defeated. 4 Secretary will read the last 5 section. 6 THE SECRETARY: This act shall 7 take effect immediately. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the 9 roll. 10 (The Secretary called the roll. ) 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce 12 the results when tabulated. 13 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 14 the negative on Calendar Number 1354 are 15 Senators Abate, Connor, Dollinger, Gold, 16 Hoblock, Kruger, Lachman, Leichter, Markowitz, 17 Mendez, Montgomery, Nanula, Onorato, Paterson, 18 Smith, Stachowski and Waldon. Ayes 39, nays 19 17. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill 21 is passed. 22 Senator Dollinger, why do you 23 rise? 7164 1 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr. 2 President, I'd ask unanimous consent to be 3 recorded in the negative on Calendars Number 4 1358, 1359 and 1360. I was not in the room at 5 the time, although I'm usually in my desk. I 6 was not here at that time, and I'd ask unanimous 7 consent to be recorded in the negative. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 9 objection, hearing no objection, Senator 10 Dollinger will be recorded in the negative on 11 Calendars Number 1358, 1359 and 1360. 12 Senator Marcellino. 13 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 14 President, is there any housekeeping at the 15 desk? 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Yes, we 17 have several items up here, Senator Marcellino. 18 SENATOR MARCELLINO: May we do 19 the housekeeping. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: We'll 21 return to motions and resolutions. 22 Chair would recognize Senator 23 Maziarz. 7165 1 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Thank you, Mr. 2 President. 3 I wish to call up Print Number 4 7010 recalled from the Assembly which is now at 5 the desk. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 7 will read. 8 THE SECRETARY: By Senator Kuhl, 9 Senate Print 7010, an act to amend the General 10 City Law. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 12 Maziarz. 13 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Mr. President, 14 I now move to reconsider the vote by which this 15 bill was passed. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary 17 will call the roll on reconsideration. 18 (The Secretary called the roll on 19 reconsideration. ) 20 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 56. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 22 Maziarz. 23 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Mr. President, 7166 1 I now offer the following amendments. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 3 Amendments are received and adopted. 4 Senator Maziarz. 5 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Mr. President, 6 on page number 31, I offer the following 7 amendments to Calendar Number 1062, Assembly 8 Print Number -- I'm sorry, Senate Print Number 9 6561, and ask that said bill retain its place on 10 Third Reading Calendar. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 12 Amendments are received and adopted. 13 Senator Maziarz. 14 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Thank you, Mr. 15 President. 16 On behalf of Senator Nozzolio, on 17 page number 8, I offer the following amendments 18 to Calendar Number 401, Senate Print Number 19 6175, and ask that said bill retain its place on 20 Third Reading Calendar. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 22 Amendments to Calendar 401 are received and 23 adopted. Bill will retain its place on the 7167 1 Third Reading Calendar. 2 Senator Maziarz. 3 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Mr. President, 4 on behalf of Senator Cook, on page number 29, I 5 offer the following amendments to Calendar 6 Number 1020, Senate Print Number 7353, and ask 7 that said bill retain its place on Third Reading 8 Calendar. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 10 Amendments are received and adopted. 11 Senator Marcellino. 12 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 13 President. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: I'm 15 sorry. Senator Maziarz. 16 SENATOR MAZIARZ: One more. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Got one 18 more. 19 SENATOR MAZIARZ: On behalf of 20 Senator Lack, on page number 31, I offer the 21 following amendments to Calendar Number 1067, 22 Senate Print Number 7484-A, and ask that said 23 bill retain its place on Third Reading Calendar. 7168 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 2 Amendments to Calendar 1067 are received and 3 adopted. The bill will retain its place on the 4 Third Reading Calendar. 5 Senator Marcellino. 6 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 7 President, for the benefit of the members, 8 session for the rest of the week has been moved 9 to 10:00 a.m. 10 There being no further business, 11 I move we adjourn until Tuesday, June 11th at 12 10:00 a.m. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 14 objection, the Senate stands adjourned until 15 tomorrow, Tuesday, June 11th, at 10:00 a.m. 16 Note the time change, 10:00 a.m. 17 (Whereupon at 8:35 p.m., the 18 Senate adjourned.) 19 20 21 22 23