Wednesday, March 11, 1998

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 ALBANY, NEW YORK 9 March 11, 1998 10 11:07 a.m. 11 12 13 REGULAR SESSION 14 15 16 17 SENATOR JOHN R. KUHL, JR., Acting President 18 STEVEN M. BOGGESS, Secretary 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 1 P R O C E E D I N G S 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 3 Senate will come to order. Ask the members to 4 find their places, the staff to find their 5 places. I'd ask everybody in the chamber to 6 rise and join with me in saying the Pledge of 7 Allegiance to the Flag. 8 (The assemblage repeated the 9 Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.) 10 In the absence of clergy, may 11 we bow our heads in a moment of silence. 12 (A moment of silence was 13 observed.) 14 The reading of the Journal. 15 THE SECRETARY: In Senate, 16 Tuesday, March 10th. The Senate met pursuant 17 to adjournment. The Journal of Monday, May 18 9th, was read and approved. On motion, the 19 Senate adjourned. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Hearing 21 no objection, the Journal stands approved as 22 read. 23 Presentation of petitions. 24 Messages from the Assembly. 25 Messages from the Governor. 1 Reports of standing committees. 2 Reports of select committees. 3 Communications and reports from 4 state officers. 5 Motions and resolutions. 6 The Chair recognizes Senator 7 Marcellino. 8 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Thank you, 9 Mr. President. 10 On behalf of Senator Libous, 11 please place a sponsor's star on Calendar 12 Number 332. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 14 Calendar Number 332 is starred at the request 15 of the sponsor. 16 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr. 17 President, on page -- on behalf of Senator 18 Rath, on page number 16 (22), I offer the 19 following amendments to Calendar Number 367, 20 Senate Print Number 4412, and I ask that said 21 bill retain its place on the Third Reading 22 Calendar. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 24 amendments are received and adopted. The bill 25 will retain its place on the Third Reading 1 Calendar. 2 Senator Padavan. 3 SENATOR PADAVAN: Mr. 4 President, would you place a sponsor's star on 5 Calendar Number 97, my bill, Print Number 6 3069. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 8 Calendar Number 97 will be starred at the 9 request of the sponsor. 10 Senator Marchi. 11 SENATOR MARCHI: Mr. President, 12 there is a special resolution that is at the 13 desk. I ask that it be read, along with the 14 title. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 16 Secretary will read the privileged resolution 17 by Senator Marchi. 18 THE SECRETARY: By Senator 19 Marchi, Legislative Resolution 2867, 20 memorializing Governor George E. Pataki to 21 proclaim February 3rd of each year as "Four 22 Chaplains Day" in New York State. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 24 Marchi, do you wish to speak on the bill -- on 25 the resolution? 1 SENATOR MARCHI: Anything we 2 say in this case would be inadequate and most 3 of you -- or all of you are familiar with the 4 fact that the four chaplains, Catholic, Jewish 5 and Protestant joined hands and gave up their 6 place of security when the ship that they were 7 on was being attacked. So they gave up their 8 place of security, four of the mariners who 9 were on the ship. 10 So it struck a very responsive 11 chord across this nation, those of you who 12 were alert and living at that time and it's 13 going to be offered by the American Legion on 14 this weekend. So that's why I moved its 15 adoption at this time. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 17 question is on the privileged resolution 18 offered by Senator Marchi. All those in favor 19 signify by saying aye. 20 (Response of "Aye".) 21 Opposed, nay. 22 (There was no response.) 23 The resolution is adopted. 24 Senator Bruno. 25 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, 1 can I ask for a meeting of the Elections 2 Committee immediately in Room 332. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There 4 will be an immediate meeting of the Elections 5 Committee, an immediate meeting of the 6 Elections Committee in the Majority Conference 7 Room, Room 332. 8 Senator Bruno, we have one 9 substitution at the desk we would like to take 10 now, if that's okay. 11 SENATOR BRUNO: Okay. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 13 Secretary will read the substitution. 14 THE SECRETARY: On page 21, 15 Senator Velella moves to discharge from the 16 Committee on Cities, Assembly Bill Number 17 3169-A and substitute it for the identical 18 Third Reading Calendar 356. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 20 substitution is ordered. 21 Senator Bruno, that brings us 22 to the calendar. 23 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, 24 can we at this time take up the non 25 controversial calendar. 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 2 Secretary will read the non-controversial 3 calendar. 4 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 5 180, by member of the Assembly Harenberg, 6 Assembly Print 3920-A, an act to amend the 7 Education Law, in relation to the provision of 8 physical therapy. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 10 Secretary will read the last section. 11 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. 12 This act shall take effect immediately. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call 14 the roll. 15 (The Secretary called the 16 roll.) 17 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 37. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 19 bill is passed. 20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 21 182, by the Assembly Committee on Rules, 22 Assembly Print 8546-A, an act in relation to 23 persons who may practice a profession within 24 the state without a license. 25 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 1 Secretary will read the last section. 2 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. 3 This act shall take effect immediately. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call 5 the roll. 6 (The Secretary called the 7 roll.) 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 9 Balboni, why do you rise? 10 SENATOR BALBONI: Mr. 11 President, I would ask -- request to be - 12 unanimous consent to be -- to abstain from 13 voting on this particular measure. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 15 objection, hearing no objection, Senator 16 Balboni will be marked as abstaining from the 17 vote. 18 The Secretary will record the 19 negatives and announce the results. 20 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 36. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 22 bill is passed. 23 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 24 234, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 5525, an 25 act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law and 1 others, in relation to the collection of 2 financial obligations. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 4 Secretary will read the last section. 5 THE SECRETARY: Section 9. 6 This act shall take effect on the first day of 7 November. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call 9 the roll. 10 (The Secretary called the 11 roll.) 12 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 37. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 14 bill is passed. 15 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 16 263, by Senator Padavan, Senate Print 6084, an 17 act to amend the New York City Charter. 18 SENATOR GOLD: Lay it aside, 19 please. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 21 bill aside. 22 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 23 298, by Senator Johnson, Senate Print 243, an 24 act to amend the Education Law, in relation to 25 requiring that the State University graduation 1 ceremonies include the Pledge of Allegiance 2 and National Anthem. 3 SENATOR GOLD: Lay it aside. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay it 5 aside. 6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7 303, by Senator Maziarz, Senate Print 2558, an 8 act to amend the Correction Law, in relation 9 to co-payment of fees for medical services. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 11 Secretary will read the last section. 12 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. 13 This act shall take effect immediately. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call 15 the roll. 16 (The Secretary called the 17 roll.) 18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 37. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 20 bill is passed. 21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 22 304, by Senator Nozzolio - 23 SENATOR BRUNO: Lay it aside 24 for the day. 25 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 1 bill aside for the day. 2 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 3 305, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 3408-A - 4 SENATOR GOLD: Lay it aside. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 6 bill aside. 7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 8 306, by Senator Nozzolio, Senate Print - 9 SENATOR BRUNO: Lay it aside 10 for the day. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 12 bill aside for the day. 13 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 14 322, by Senator Stafford, Senate Print 3766, 15 an act to amend the Executive Law, in relation 16 to permitting the Secretary of State to 17 receive records. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 19 Secretary will read the last section. 20 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. 21 This act shall take effect immediately. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call 23 the roll. 24 (The Secretary called the 25 roll.) 1 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 37. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 3 bill is passed. 4 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 5 324, by Senator Marcellino, Senate Print 6 4129-A, an act authorizing the Commissioner of 7 General Services to transfer and convey 8 certain state lands. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 10 Secretary will read the last section. 11 THE SECRETARY: Section 6. 12 This act shall take effect immediately. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call 14 the roll. 15 (The Secretary called the 16 roll.) 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 18 Wright, why do you rise? 19 SENATOR WRIGHT: Mr. President, 20 I request unanimous consent to be recorded as 21 abstaining from this vote. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 23 objection, hearing no objection, Senator 24 Wright will be denoted as abstaining on the 25 vote. 1 The Secretary will record the 2 negatives and announce the results. 3 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 38. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 5 bill is passed. 6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7 333, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 1488, an 8 act to amend the Public Health Law, in 9 relation to public notification of health 10 hazards. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 12 Secretary will read the last section. 13 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. 14 This act shall take effect on the 180th day. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call 16 the roll. 17 (The Secretary called the 18 roll.) 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Record 20 the negatives and announce the results. 21 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 39, nays 22 1, Senator Cook recorded in the negative. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 24 bill is passed. 25 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 1 340, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 4174, an 2 act to amend the Business Corporation Law, in 3 relation to requiring any foreign corporation. 4 SENATOR GOLD: Lay it aside. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 6 bill aside. 7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 8 344, by Senator Alesi, Senate Print 4266, an 9 act to amend the General Business Law, in 10 relation to false price comparisons. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 12 Secretary will read the last section. 13 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. 14 This act shall take effect on the 30th day. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call 16 the roll. 17 (The Secretary called the 18 roll.) 19 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 21 bill is passed. 22 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 23 377, by Senator Marcellino, Senate Print 2848, 24 an act to amend the General Municipal Law, in 25 relation to establishing the town of 1 Huntington. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There 3 is a home rule message at the desk. 4 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it 5 aside. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the 7 bill aside. 8 Senator Bruno, that completes 9 the reading of the non-controversial calendar. 10 SENATOR BRUNO: Thank you, Mr. 11 President. 12 Can we at this time return to 13 motions and resolutions. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: We'll 15 return to the order of motions and 16 resolutions. 17 SENATOR BRUNO: And I believe 18 that there is a privileged resolution at the 19 desk by Senator Goodman. I would ask that the 20 title be read and move for its immediate 21 adoption. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 23 Secretary will read the title to the 24 privileged resolution at the desk by Senator 25 Goodman. 1 THE SECRETARY: By Senator 2 Goodman, Legislative Resolution 2868, mourning 3 the death of Eric M. Breindel, outstanding 4 journalist and distinguished citizen. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 6 Chair recognizes Senator Goodman on the 7 resolution. 8 SENATOR GOODMAN: Mr. 9 President, I have asked that we waive the 10 reading of the full resolution, but I would 11 like to say a few special words on behalf of 12 the resolution, if I may. 13 Mr. President, last Saturday 14 the state of New York and the world - 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 16 Goodman, excuse me just a minute. There's an 17 awful lot of noise in the chamber. I know 18 it's very difficult for members to hear. I 19 would ask the staff to take their places, 20 members to take their chairs. If you need to 21 have a conversation, let's take it out of the 22 chamber. 23 SENATOR GOODMAN: Mr. 24 President. 25 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Thank 1 you for the indulgence, Senator Goodman. 2 SENATOR GOODMAN: Mr. 3 President, last Saturday the City, state and 4 nation lost a brilliant journalist and a great 5 humanitarian. His name is Eric Breindel and 6 for many years he was the editorial chairman 7 of the New York Post and a man who gained 8 universal respect for the forthrightness of 9 his views, the brilliant lucidity of his 10 editorials and the extreme integrity with 11 which he addressed his work as both a 12 journalist and one in pursuit of justice for 13 the press multitudes. 14 Eric Breindel came from a 15 unique background. Both of his parents were 16 victims of the Holocaust and throughout his 17 life he was especially devoted to both his 18 father and mother and at the funeral which was 19 held in New York on Monday morning, there was 20 an extraordinary outpouring of respect and 21 affection for this unique man. 22 Those who were in attendance at 23 the funeral ranged from the high and mighty to 24 the common people of the state. Governor 25 Pataki was there, Senator D'Amato and Senator 1 Moynihan were there, Mayor Giuliani, Henry 2 Kissinger, a wide range of notable 3 celebrities, as well as those who had watched 4 for years with admiration the work of this 5 unique individual. 6 I knew Eric Breindel personally 7 and counted him as a close friend. We 8 attended one another's social gatherings and 9 he was always genial and exceptionally 10 forthcoming in his generous understanding of 11 human nature. 12 Mr. President, I would like to 13 just comment on one or two of his special 14 qualities as we consider this resolution. 15 Eric Breindel was the senior vice-president of 16 the News Corporation. He had a legion of 17 friends, colleagues, and world leaders 18 remembered him warmly for his honesty, razor 19 sharp intellect, remarkable leadership and 20 uncomplaining determination. 21 Many years ago he was diagnosed 22 with cancer and had painful episodes with 23 which he always -- which he always handled 24 with extraordinary bravery. He also was not 25 afraid ever at any point in his journalistic 1 career to take on tough campaigns on from time 2 to time very unpopular causes. 3 The resolution which we have 4 sponsored today describes him as a champion of 5 the state of Israel and it takes note of the 6 fact that Breindel was known for his vigorous 7 conservative viewpoint and his unique ability 8 to influence political debate in the City and 9 around the world in his finely crafted 10 literate and clear-sighted columns. 11 Mr. President, Eric Breindel 12 brought to his columns a remarkable series of 13 insights, but one of the things for which I 14 always had greatest respect for him was the 15 fact that he had a great sense of 16 communication with people, even those who 17 disagreed strongly with his own very strongly 18 held views. 19 Eric Breindel was a congenial 20 man and a collegial man. He welcomed the 21 chance for debate. He was zestful in his 22 propounding of his own point of view but was a 23 careful listener to those who disagreed and 24 were diametrically opposed to him. 25 I thought one of the unique 1 statements made at his funeral was that of a 2 young woman who had been a friend of his and 3 regarded him as a surrogate father. She 4 happened to be the granddaughter of Katherine 5 Graham, the editor of the Washington Post and 6 she said that she disagreed with virtually 7 every one of his editorial positions and loved 8 him as a father because of his kindness to her 9 and the fact that he would always have a 10 special ability to communicate with young 11 people. She commented that one evening while 12 leaving a party he accidentally knocked the 13 front porch off a house in which the party had 14 been held and his comment was he thought the 15 house looked better that way. 16 He was a man with a keen sense 17 of humor, a great sense of the importance of 18 sticking up for those who were in trouble in 19 life and an enormous dedication to the state 20 of Israel and to the importance of having it 21 provide a shelter and a place for those 22 oppressed always to go in the future and never 23 to permit the Holocaust to be repeated. 24 He viewed with great derision 25 those who sought to revise history, to suggest 1 that the Holocaust never existed and he was an 2 ardent champion of the rights of the Israelis 3 to have a homeland free from the constant 4 threat and the overhang of and the possibility 5 of extinction. 6 And so, Mr. President, as we 7 salute him in his premature death at the age 8 of 42, we realize that a very important notion 9 in life is not -- it is not necessarily the 10 length of time that we are here on earth, but 11 the quality of the hours we spend and the 12 contribution we make during the time that we 13 are active in our pursuit of what we believe 14 in. 15 It is with those notions that I 16 ask the house to unanimously adopt this 17 resolution and ask that it be opened to 18 sponsorship by any members who wish to join in 19 its resolution. 20 Thank you very much, Mr. 21 President. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 23 Chair recognizes Senator Maltese, on the 24 resolution. 25 SENATOR MALTESE: Mr. 1 President, I can add very little to what 2 Senator Goodman has indicated, except I did 3 want to note that Eric was always accessible, 4 always available despite, as Senator Goodman 5 has so aptly described, his academic acumen, 6 his intellectual achievements. He always was 7 ready for advice on a national basis to both 8 conservatives and liberals alike across the 9 nation. He was of invaluable assistance to 10 the Conservative Party, to the conservative 11 movement. He was -- he combined all the 12 intellectual qualities with being, as they 13 say, a regular guy. He is a person that will 14 be sorely missed by this nation and a very 15 severe loss at such a young age as 42. 16 I am proud to join in Senator 17 Goodman's resolution. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 19 Chair recognizes Senator Marchi on the 20 resolution. 21 SENATOR MARCHI: Mr. President, 22 I believe Senator Goodman has stated the 23 circumstances and facts that sustain the 24 purpose of this resolution. 25 I can attest personally that 1 two presidents, at least and perhaps others, 2 but President Nixon and President Reagan both 3 shared with me when we were engaged in casual 4 conversation their unbounded estimate and 5 respect that they had at that time of Mr. 6 Breindel and it's -- I think having known him 7 and having heard even casual comments, they 8 were all excellent in their assessment of this 9 exceptional individual. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Is 11 there any other Senator wishing to speak on 12 the resolution? 13 (There was no response.) 14 Senator Goodman has opened the 15 resolution for co-sponsorship. Are there 16 members who would like to be listed as 17 co-sponsors? Seeing a multitude -- Senator 18 Bruno, should we put everybody on as a co 19 sponsor, excepting those people who do not 20 wish to be on the resolution as a co-sponsor? 21 SENATOR BRUNO: Yes. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: If they 23 would so indicate to the desk, then we'll 24 direct that all members be added as 25 co-sponsors. 1 The question is on the 2 resolution offered by Senator Goodman. All 3 those in favor signify by saying aye. 4 (Response of "Aye".) 5 Opposed, nay. 6 (There was no response.) 7 The resolution is adopted. 8 Senator Bruno. 9 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, 10 can we at this time take up the controversial 11 calendar. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 13 Secretary will read the controversial 14 calendar. 15 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 16 263, by Senator Padavan, Senate Print 6084, an 17 act to amend the New York City Charter. 18 SENATOR GOLD: Explanation. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 20 Padavan, an explanation of Calendar Number 263 21 has been requested by Senator Gold. 22 SENATOR PADAVAN: Thank you, 23 Mr. President. 24 This legislation corrects a 25 bill drafting error in Chapter 569 of a law - 1 a bill we passed which became law last year. 2 The intent of that chapter was to allow nail 3 and mail service of Environmental Control 4 Board violations, the property owners of one-, 5 two- and three-family buildings. It was 6 important in terms of strengthening New York 7 City's ability to deal precisely with a very 8 pervasive problem of illegal occupancies and 9 illegal conversions. 10 Unfortunately due to a drafting 11 error that placed language in Subparagraph A 12 (i) instead of Paragraph A (ii) of Section 13 1404, Chapter 569 unintentionally permits nail 14 and mail service on all residential and 15 commercial property and restricts the use of 16 personal service which was previously allowed 17 for all residential and commercial buildings. 18 Expansion of the nail and mail 19 service, while restricting personal service 20 was never the intention of the city of New 21 York or the state Legislature. 22 This amendment reinstates, by 23 the way, in addition to the other error, the 24 ability of the fire department and the 25 department of buildings to personally serve 1 notice of ECB violations on residential and 2 commercial buildings and restricts nail and 3 mail service to one, two and three residential 4 buildings. 5 Also, some language that 6 inadvertently was deleted relating to 7 additional mailings of notice of violations is 8 rectified with this amendment. 9 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 11 Gold. 12 SENATOR GOLD: Will the 13 gentleman yield to a question? 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 15 Padavan, do you yield? The Senator yields. 16 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes. 17 SENATOR GOLD: Senator, I 18 certainly am not suggesting that we should by 19 inadvertence eliminate situations of personal 20 service and if it was merely what you're 21 saying, I could start to understand the bill, 22 but I'm looking at the bill. I'm looking at 23 the City's memo and if you could help me, I 24 would be very grateful. 25 On page 2 of your bill, it says 1 "provided, however, that the department of 2 buildings and the fire department may not 3 utilize the procedures set forth in this item 4 to serve a notice of violation relating to 5 commercial premises or residential premises 6 with illegal occupancy of four or more 7 dwellings." 8 So if we left the law alone and 9 did not put this phrase in, I understand they 10 could use the nail and mail on commercial 11 properties also. 12 SENATOR PADAVAN: Correct. 13 SENATOR GOLD: But where is it 14 in the bill where it talks about restricting 15 the personal service? I don't see any of that 16 in the bill. 17 SENATOR PADAVAN: It was not - 18 what do you mean "restricting"? The original 19 - 20 SENATOR GOLD: In other words 21 - 22 SENATOR PADAVAN: Our bill 23 passed. It passed last year. Inadvertently 24 it left that out. 25 SENATOR GOLD: Well, I don't 1 see that. That's what I'm trying to tell 2 you. 3 SENATOR PADAVAN: It's there. 4 SENATOR GOLD: Well, Senator, 5 if you'll let me ask the question. 6 SENATOR PADAVAN: Sure. I 7 thought I answered it. 8 SENATOR GOLD: There are two 9 concerns I have with the piece of 10 legislation. Number one, assuming that 11 personal service remained available -- and I 12 think it should remain available -- I don't 13 know why we would want to restrict the fire 14 department and the buildings department from 15 using this additional method of making service 16 in commercial situations. Maybe you could 17 explain to me how we are hurting the city of 18 New York rather than helping the city of New 19 York by allowing them that extra method, the 20 nail and mail method, if it deals with 21 commercial violations. 22 SENATOR PADAVAN: All right. I 23 understand your question, Senator. I'll try 24 and answer it. 25 First, the problems that the 1 City historically has experienced is not with 2 commercial establishments because the owners 3 of commercial buildings and the managing 4 agents of commercial buildings are readily 5 available. So the need to nail a violation to 6 the front door of a commercial building has 7 never been necessary. There's been no 8 difficulty whatsoever historically as far as 9 the city of New York is able to relate to us 10 and frankly in terms of my own personal 11 experience in doing that. 12 The problem has been with the 13 illegal conversion of one-, two- and three 14 family residential buildings where either we 15 have an absentee owner or access is refused to 16 a building inspector, and so that precipitated 17 the bill we passed last year. 18 So to answer your question 19 directly, it is simply a question of need and 20 in the City's judgment and one with which I 21 concur, the need is with the ones, twos and 22 threes and not with the commercial buildings. 23 SENATOR GOLD: Will the Senator 24 yield to a question? 25 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 1 Padavan, do you continue to yield? 2 SENATOR GOLD: As I understand 3 it, Senator, the fact that the City has this 4 authority isn't hurting the City. You're 5 saying that they want to eliminate it even 6 though they have it because they don't need 7 it, isn't that correct? 8 SENATOR PADAVAN: Would you say 9 that again, please? 10 SENATOR GOLD: Surely. 11 Senator, if I understand your comments, the 12 law last year gave the City the authority to 13 nail and mail in not only the ones, twos and 14 threes which you talk about but in all other 15 situations, residential and commercial, and 16 what I believe you just said is even though 17 they've got that authority, they want to give 18 up that authority because they say they don't 19 need it. Is that it? 20 SENATOR PADAVAN: They don't. 21 They never had -- they never did need it. 22 SENATOR GOLD: And if this bill 23 did not pass, they would have the authority 24 and if they don't want to use it, they don't 25 have to use it, isn't that correct? 1 SENATOR PADAVAN: No, they 2 don't, I guess. In fact, you're right. It 3 just an encumbrance that's unnecessary. 4 SENATOR GOLD: Well, when you 5 say it's an encumbrance, Senator, you're 6 adding more language in here so you're making 7 a bigger law than it was without your 8 language, so it's not encumbrance. 9 The one part that I didn't 10 understand which, in my opinion, would justify 11 your bill, it says that in doing what we did 12 last year, we apparently restricted the use of 13 personal service. Now, that's in the City's 14 memo. It says that the -- unintentionally 15 permits nail and mail and restricts the use of 16 personal service. 17 I don't see anywhere in your 18 bill where we are unrestricting personal 19 service, and I would just like you to point 20 that out to me if you can. The City's memo 21 said that was one of the problems with the 22 amendment last year and, therefore, we're 23 doing the Padavan bill. I don't see in here 24 where we are unrestricting that and maybe I'm 25 just missing that, but if you could show that 1 to me. 2 SENATOR PADAVAN: As far as I 3 know, Senator, the language in the bill that 4 you have, the amendment before us today - 5 SENATOR GOLD: I'm sorry? 6 SENATOR PADAVAN: The amendment 7 we have before us today restores something 8 that we inadvertently left out last year. 9 SENATOR GOLD: But that's what 10 I'm asking you, Senator. Where is it 11 restored? It's a short bill. If you want to 12 lay it aside a day, that's okay. 13 SENATOR PADAVAN: I don't need 14 to lay it aside. 15 SENATOR GOLD: I understand 16 that but, Senator, the City's memo says they 17 had inadvertently have made a restriction on 18 personal service. If they've done that, that 19 concerns me, and I will certainly want to give 20 them unfettered ability to make personal 21 service, but if you take a look at the 22 language that you're adding to this bill and 23 there is some language taken out on page 1, 24 but I just want to understand where -- and 25 there's some two words taken out on page 2 - 1 I would just like to understand where in this 2 bill it cures that particular problem that's 3 set forth in the City's memo. 4 SENATOR PADAVAN: Well, 5 Senator, if you read the bracketed parts on 6 lines 21 to 24, you see where it says that the 7 department of buildings and fire department 8 may not utilize the procedures set forth in 9 this item to serve a notice of violation? 10 SENATOR GOLD: All right. So 11 that's -- so on line 20 -- that's all right. 12 I think you gave me my answer. 13 SENATOR PADAVAN: I think so. 14 SENATOR GOLD: On lines 20 to 15 24, if we did not eliminate that language, 16 they would not be able to - 17 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yeah. See 18 the word "not"? 19 SENATOR GOLD: That's what I'm 20 -- let me just ask the question. 21 SENATOR PADAVAN: No. I'm 22 saying -- I'm pointing out to you, the answer 23 to your question, we're taking that out 24 because it said "may not utilize" and that 25 corrects the problem that you referred to. 1 SENATOR GOLD: All right. And 2 where it says "may not utilize", that's the 3 personal service procedure? 4 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes. 5 SENATOR GOLD: All right. 6 Thank you for your help. 7 SENATOR PADAVAN: You're 8 welcome. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Any 10 other Senator wishing to speak on the bill? 11 (There was no response.) 12 Hearing none, the Secretary 13 will read the last section. 14 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. 15 This act shall take effect immediately. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call 17 the roll. 18 (The Secretary called the 19 roll.) 20 SENATOR WALDON: Mr. President. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 22 Waldon, to explain your vote. 23 SENATOR WALDON: No. When 24 we're finished with this, I wanted to - 25 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: We're 1 on a roll call. 2 SENATOR WALDON: Sorry about 3 that. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 5 Announce the results. 6 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 51, nays 7 1, Senator Sampson recorded in the negative. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 9 bill is passed. 10 Senator Waldon, did you wish 11 to - 12 SENATOR WALDON: Yes, Mr. 13 President. I would like the record to reflect 14 unanimous consent to be recorded in the 15 negative on 303. I was out of the chamber on 16 other business. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 18 objection, Senator Waldon will be recorded in 19 the negative on Calendar Number 303. 20 The Secretary will continue to 21 call the controversial calendar, but before 22 that, Senator Bruno. 23 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, 24 can I ask for an immediate meeting of the 25 Children and Families Committee in Room 332. 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There 2 will be an immediate meeting of the Children 3 and Families Committee in the Majority 4 Conference Room, Room 332. Immediate meeting 5 of the Children and Families Committee in the 6 Majority Conference Room, Room 332. 7 The Secretary will read. 8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 9 298, by Senator Johnson, Senate Print 243, an 10 act to amend the Education Law, in relation to 11 requiring that the State University graduation 12 ceremonies include the Pledge of Allegiance 13 and National Anthem. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 15 Secretary will read the last section. 16 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. 17 This act shall take effect on the 120th day. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call 19 the roll. 20 (The Secretary called the 21 roll.) 22 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 52. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 24 bill is passed. 25 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 1 305, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 3408-A, 2 an act to amend the Executive Law and the 3 Penal Law, in relation to payment of a fee by 4 persons sentenced to probation. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 6 Secretary will read the last section. 7 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. 8 This act shall take effect on the first day of 9 November. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call 11 the roll. 12 (The Secretary called the 13 roll.) 14 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 52. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 16 bill is passed. 17 Senator Gold. 18 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President, 19 may I have unanimous consent to be voted in 20 the negative on Calendar 298. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 22 objection, hearing no objection, Senator Gold 23 will be recorded in the negative on Calendar 24 Number 298. 25 The Secretary will continue to 1 read. 2 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. 3 President, with unanimous consent, might I 4 offer to move to reconsider Calendar 298 which 5 just passed this chamber seconds ago which 6 Senator Leichter had asked me to lay aside. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 8 motion is to reconsider the vote by which 9 Calendar Number 298 passed the house. 10 The Secretary will call the 11 roll on reconsideration. 12 (The Secretary called the roll 13 on reconsideration.) 14 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 52. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 16 bill is before the house. 17 SENATOR PATERSON: May we have 18 an explanation on that bill. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 20 Johnson, an explanation of Calendar Number 298 21 has been requested by Senator Paterson. 22 SENATOR JOHNSON: Mr. 23 President, this bill requires the Education 24 Department to promulgate regulations 25 concerning the recitation of the Pledge of 1 Allegiance and performance of the National 2 Anthem at all graduation ceremonies of the 3 State University institutions. 4 Thank you. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 6 Paterson, explanation satisfactory? 7 SENATOR PATERSON: It's 8 satisfactory to me, Mr. President. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 10 Secretary will read the last section. 11 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. 12 This act shall take effect on the 120th day. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call 14 the roll. 15 (The Secretary called the 16 roll.) 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Record 18 the negatives. 19 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. 20 President, just - 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 22 Announce the results. 23 Senator Leichter. 24 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. 25 President, if I may explain my vote, please. 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 2 Leichter, to explain his vote. 3 SENATOR LEICHTER: Yeah. I 4 don't think anybody who's voting against the 5 bill has any problems with playing the 6 National Anthem or reciting the Pledge of 7 Allegiance at graduation ceremonies or at any 8 other occasion. In fact, we honor the 9 National Anthem and the Pledge of Allegiance 10 as much as anybody else. We just don't 11 believe it is the role and function of the 12 Legislature to interfere with the functions of 13 the State University to the extent of telling 14 them how to do their graduation. Next we'll 15 see a bill will tell them how to set up the 16 chairs or what robes they should wear, what 17 speeches they ought to make. This is rank 18 interference. 19 As we've suggested in the past, 20 if Senator Johnson wants to do something for 21 the State University -- it needs a lot of 22 help, Senator Johnson, no question about it - 23 I would like to see you work to try to get 24 more funding for the State University, more 25 TAP, deal with the problems of deteriorated 1 campuses but not tell them how to conduct 2 their graduation. 3 I vote in the negative. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 5 Leichter will be recorded in the negative. 6 Announce the results. 7 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded 8 in the negative on Calendar Number 298 are 9 Senators Gold, Leichter, Markowitz, Seabrook, 10 Smith and Waldon. Ayes 47, nays 6. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 12 bill is passed. 13 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 14 340, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 4174, an 15 act to amend the Business Corporation Law, in 16 relation to requiring any foreign corporation 17 providing gambling. 18 SENATOR GOLD: Hold on a 19 second. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 21 Gold, did you have a question of the sponsor? 22 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President, 23 my question was about Calendar Number 305, 24 which I understand that's passed? 25 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: That 1 did pass, but let me continue on this bill and 2 if you have any further questions, I'll be 3 happy - 4 SENATOR GOLD: I want to recall 5 305, so can we hold - 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: It's 7 out of the house, Senator. 8 SENATOR GOLD: It's out of the 9 house. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Your 11 motion would be inappropriate at the time 12 because we're already on another bill. 13 SENATOR GOLD: I know, but 14 you're telling me - 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: It's 16 out of the house. It left five minutes ago. 17 SENATOR GOLD: But it's out of 18 the house? 19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: It's 20 out of the house. 21 The Secretary will read the 22 last section on Calendar Number 340. 23 SENATOR LEICHTER: No. If 24 Senator Larkin would yield, please. 25 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 1 Larkin, do you yield to a question from 2 Senator Leichter? 3 SENATOR LARKIN: Yes, Mr. 4 President. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 6 Senator yields. 7 SENATOR LEICHTER: Senator, I 8 took a quick look -- I took a quick look at 9 your bill, Senator, and I just question the 10 constitutionality of what we're doing. Isn't 11 this an area that's preempted by the commerce 12 clause? Are you saying that if a company, a 13 corporation in Nevada, wishes over the 14 Internet to set up a gambling operation or 15 operation that would allow people in New York 16 City or New York State to gamble, that we can 17 force that corporation to incorporate in New 18 York? 19 SENATOR LARKIN: Two things, 20 Senator. Senator Kyl from Arizona, with 21 sponsors on both sides of the aisle in both 22 the House and Senate in Washington, have their 23 own bill to address this. 24 Our bill is very specific. We 25 have, with the attorney generals across the 1 state and our own Attorney General Vacco, who 2 is chairing the attorney generals' cause on 3 this, what we're trying to do is to just get a 4 handle on it because we're getting 5 correspondence every day, Senator, of people 6 who are getting invites to participate in 7 this. 8 Recently there was a -- sent to 9 us some information on this Internet gambling 10 and, lo and behold, going through the numbers 11 that we were told to call, we found out in 12 support of an off-shore in Antigua, the phone 13 call was in Billy Stachowski's area in 14 Buffalo, New York. 15 SENATOR LEICHTER: If Senator 16 Larkin will continue to yield. 17 SENATOR LARKIN: One other 18 thing I would like to point out. If you'll 19 read the memo, what we're saying is that we're 20 asking them to file it. Technically there's 21 no gambling. It's illegal to gamble in New 22 York State. So the Secretary of State 23 technically cannot accept and validate their 24 application. 25 What we're trying to do is to 1 try to build a base so we can be supportive of 2 our people who maybe are being bilked out of 3 dollars with off-shore companies that they 4 don't know. We're trying to build a 5 database. 6 SENATOR LEICHTER: Senator, if 7 you would be so good as to continue to yield. 8 I don't question the fact that there's a 9 problem. I don't question the intent of our 10 trying to deal with it, but you haven't 11 addressed what is -- my difficulty with this 12 bill is that I believe that the state of New 13 York cannot force a company that's in 14 interstate commerce and that's not located in 15 New York State to incorporate in New York 16 State, and I just wondered whether you had 17 done any research on that issue. 18 SENATOR LARKIN: Well, we 19 haven't changed the bill from last year, 20 Senator Leichter. We're not -- we're not 21 forcing them. They can stay incorporated 22 wherever they're at. What we're trying to do 23 is to get a handle on this issue which is 24 growing by leaps and bounds. Every bit of 25 information we're told that this is an 1 industry, by next year will be worth $20 2 billion and we're not saying that you must 3 incorporate in New York State. We're very 4 clear. 5 Go ahead. 6 SENATOR LEICHTER: Excuse me, 7 Mr. President. If Senator Larkin would 8 continue to yield. 9 That's exactly what you're 10 saying. You're saying it shall, therefore, be 11 required. You use the word "required". You 12 require that corporation to obtain 13 authorization to do business in this state, 14 and I don't think that constitutionally we can 15 do that. 16 SENATOR LARKIN: Two things: 17 Gambling is illegal in the state of New York, 18 so we didn't change the Constitution. The 19 Secretary of State cannot officially receive 20 your application and get it. What we're 21 saying, he can accept it and he will reject it 22 because there is no gambling and then we will 23 have our database of who you are and where you 24 are. 25 SENATOR LEICHTER: If you would 1 continue to yield. I think we're talking at 2 cross-purposes but then that's not unusual in 3 this chamber. I don't mean between you and 4 me. 5 SENATOR LARKIN: I'm not 6 mean-spirited on this one. You've got to 7 admit that. 8 SENATOR LEICHTER: Senator, 9 it's just that you're not addressing the issue 10 that I'm raising. First of all, you're saying 11 that we're not requiring them to do this, but 12 the language in the bill says they shall be 13 required. 14 Secondly, you say that there's 15 no authorization for the Secretary of State to 16 submit a charter of a corporation that says 17 "our business is gambling" because gambling 18 is illegal in the state. Are you saying that 19 the purpose of your bill is to provide that 20 the Secretary of State may accept the charter 21 of a corporation that wishes to engage in 22 gambling if the gambling is being conducted 23 over the Internet? 24 SENATOR LARKIN: We're saying 25 solely that the Secretary of State, they can 1 file with him, it says. We're asking him to 2 file with the Secretary of State. The 3 Secretary of State does not have any authority 4 to turn around then and certify them as an 5 Internet operator in the state of New York. 6 SENATOR LEICHTER: Okay. But 7 my question still is, Senator, the very first 8 question I asked, do you have any authority? 9 Have you looked into the constitutional issue 10 and question that this corporation not being 11 located in New York State and being engaged in 12 interstate commerce, whether we have the 13 authority and the legal right under the U.S. 14 Constitution to require that corporation to 15 incorporate in New York State? And your bill 16 says that they must and while I can't say that 17 I am particularly knowledgeable of the 18 commerce clause, not having really looked at 19 it much since my days in law school which was 20 many years ago, but it still seems to me, as I 21 recollect, that the commerce clause gives that 22 authority to Congress, and I don't believe 23 that the state of New York can make a 24 corporation that's not physically located in 25 the state, that's merely transacting business 1 through the Internet to say you must 2 incorporate in the state of New York. I don't 3 want you to do something that's fruitless. I 4 don't want us here as a body to pass 5 legislation, people are going to look at it 6 and say this is laughable. These guys never 7 read the U.S. Constitution. They don't know 8 about the commerce clause. 9 Now, I may be wrong and maybe 10 you've looked into that issue. I hope it's 11 not on the reliance of the Attorney General of 12 this state, but I would trust your research 13 into it, but if you haven't done that 14 research, I raise the question whether this 15 bill is within the purview and authority of 16 the state of New York to enact. 17 SENATOR LARKIN: The only 18 response I have, Franz, is that under the 19 Constitution, gambling is a state's issue. 20 The proposals put forth by Senator Kyl and 21 other members in the House addresses part of 22 the problem that I think you're talking about, 23 but right now we believe having researched 24 this matter, talked to the people at the fed's 25 and talked all around, we believe we're doing 1 the right thing for the people of the state of 2 New York and so far have that authority 3 because gambling is the state's rights. It's 4 our right to regulate gambling and what we're 5 trying to do is get a handle on an issue that 6 is growing by leaps and bounds. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 8 Leichter, are you asking Senator Larkin to 9 continue to yield? 10 SENATOR LEICHTER: Yes. 11 Senator, I understand what you're saying, but 12 I seriously question whether we have the 13 authority to do this. 14 I yield to Senator Marchi. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 16 Marchi. 17 SENATOR MARCHI: You're stating 18 something that is at least partially 19 established, but I was wondering whether there 20 was more to it in terms of police powers given 21 the nature of the Senator's sponsorship? I 22 believe that there is -- it's not that clear 23 where you're weighing police powers by the 24 state but - 25 SENATOR LEICHTER: Senator, I 1 still think the police power of the state of 2 New York is significantly limited to the 3 extent that we're dealing with matters in an 4 interstate commerce that have been either 5 exempted -- I don't mean exempted -- have been 6 taken over by the federal government or are 7 reserved to the federal government by the - 8 by the Constitution. 9 I just don't know what we're 10 accomplishing here. I think what we're 11 dealing with is a very serious problem that we 12 have in this state and frankly throughout the 13 nation and throughout the world, that you now 14 have means of communication. How do you 15 control the Internet? How do you control a 16 company, they could be in Macao, they could be 17 in Hong Kong and they're conducting gambling 18 over the Internet? How does New York State 19 which tries to protect its citizens from 20 gambling, how do we control that? 21 The answer is probably that we 22 can't. Let Senator Larkin try, but I think on 23 this one he's being a Don Quixote and tilting 24 at windmills. 25 SENATOR MARCHI: Senator, just 1 one more question. Suppose I wanted to do 2 something like this and I'm not doing too well 3 within the state and so you go to another 4 jurisdiction, would that confer -- well, it's 5 debatable just what it would confer, but under 6 this bill, the application, at least we would 7 know about it. 8 SENATOR LEICHTER: Well, maybe 9 the key issue is -- if I could just ask 10 Senator Larkin to yield again for a moment. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 12 Larkin, do you yield to another question from 13 Senator Leichter? 14 SENATOR LARKIN: Yes. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 16 Senator yields. 17 SENATOR LEICHTER: Senator, 18 what happens, I'm a company in Hong Kong and 19 I'm conducting this gambling operation through 20 the Internet and somebody comes to me in Hong 21 Kong and says, Hey, you didn't register in New 22 York under the Larkin Law. I say, The Larkin 23 Law? Yeah. Everybody knows the Larkin Law. 24 You got to register in New York State to 25 conduct gambling and I say, The hell with it. 1 Let Larkin come and tell me to my face I got 2 to register. What does New York State do? 3 SENATOR LARKIN: Well, Senator 4 Leichter, I would like to refer this back to 5 something last year when we had in this 6 chamber what's called Megan's Law and you and 7 a few others had objected to it and it went to 8 the courts, the highest courts and the court 9 said that New York State was right. I think 10 that this is a matter -- I believe that that's 11 why 12 we should let this out. We're not forcing 13 anybody. We're not changing the commerce 14 law. We checked with people in Washington and 15 the attorney generals, 50 of them, bipartisan 16 believe that this is the right approach to 17 address the issue. We don't have a handle on 18 something that is growing by leaps and bounds 19 and, Senator, what I would think we should be 20 doing, we should be passing this and then if 21 somebody wants to take it to the courts, let 22 them. I think that we're doing what's right 23 for the people of the state of New York. 24 Thank you. 25 SENATOR LEICHTER: Senator, 1 just one more question on this. I appreciate 2 your -- the point that you very subtly made: 3 Leichter, you were wrong on Megan's Law. Why 4 should we listen to you? 5 SENATOR LARKIN: I didn't mean 6 it disrespectfully. 7 SENATOR LEICHTER: It's 8 perfectly fair. 9 SENATOR LARKIN: You voted for 10 this bill back in 1997. 11 SENATOR LEICHTER: Perfectly 12 proper, and I will acknowledge after a 13 momentary victory at the District Court level, 14 every court since then has said I was wrong on 15 that issue, but I'm raising the practical 16 problem now. Your law has passed. You've got 17 this company in Hong Kong doing business over 18 the Internet. They thumb their nose at the 19 Larkin Law. What do you do? What does New 20 York State do? You've got this company. 21 They've refused to register and they're still 22 sending their material under the Internet 23 gambling. What do you do? 24 SENATOR LARKIN: Go back to the 25 basic principle -- purpose of what we're 1 trying to do to this bill. We're trying to 2 build a database. We're trying to work with 3 Congress to get them to enact some federal 4 legislation, and I think we're in the right 5 direction, Franz. 6 SENATOR LEICHTER: Thank you. 7 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 9 Gold, I have several people before you. 10 Senator Dollinger. 11 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Thank you, 12 Mr. President. 13 I rise just to offer another 14 insight on Senator Larkin's bill which I 15 supported last year and I'm going to support 16 again. 17 This bill steps us down the 18 road to extending long-arm jurisdiction over 19 these companies. What it requires is the 20 company be authorized to do business in New 21 York. 22 I agree with Senator Leichter, 23 that is, what are we going to do with the 24 company in Hong Kong that's running an 25 international gambling operation through the 1 Internet? 2 The answer is, I don't believe 3 under this bill that we can go to Hong Kong 4 and shut them down and enforce them, but what 5 I think we ought to do -- this is a bill that 6 begins the step down the road to redefining 7 the minimum contacts under our long-arm 8 statute so that if someone is victimized by 9 fraud, they can sue in the New York courts and 10 get jurisdiction. 11 What we'll have to do, and I 12 think the part of the longer road to really 13 achieve long-arm jurisdiction is to go back, 14 look at the long-arm statute under the CPLR 15 and redefine the concept of minimum contacts 16 under International Shoe. That doctrine is 17 flexible enough in my judgment to accommodate 18 the new transmission capabilities that are 19 present that allow Internet gambling and my 20 hope is at some point we'll look at the 21 long-arm statute and say let's extend it 22 further so that if you're an Internet 23 operating company and the transaction, the 24 sale transaction, the deposit of the money, 25 the advancing of the money occurs in New York 1 State, New York State then has jurisdiction, 2 as far as I'm concerned, any place on the 3 planet to bring that person to the New York 4 courts, sue them there, recover a judgment and 5 then go and enforce it in Hong Kong, 6 Pennsylvania or in the Bahamas. 7 Senator Larkin's bill doesn't 8 accomplish all that yet. I hope this is the 9 first step to walk down that road. I agree 10 with Senator Leichter that it's a good idea 11 perhaps to require them to obtain authority to 12 do business in this state but there's no way 13 to enforce it against the Hong Kong 14 corporation unless we go to the next step. 15 I'll vote for it now, and I 16 hope we get to the next step in the near 17 future. 18 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. 19 President. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 21 Leichter, why do you rise? 22 SENATOR LEICHTER: If Senator 23 Dollinger would yield. Senator Dollinger, 24 isn't it a fact that long-arm jurisdiction 25 does not -- or doing business to sustain 1 long-arm jurisdiction doesn't depend on 2 whether this bill is passed or not? A court 3 could very -- let me finish the question. A 4 court could very well determine that by 5 conducting a gambling operation through the 6 Internet, you're doing business in New York 7 State. Doing business doesn't require -- and 8 as you pointed out, while the state of New 9 York could say gambling over the Internet is 10 deemed to be doing business in the state of 11 New York, that would require an amendment of 12 the CPLR which this bill doesn't do. 13 So I question whether this bill 14 in any way advances the test under the 15 standard of doing business. 16 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Through 17 you, Mr. President. This does not 18 specifically deal with the long-arm 19 jurisdiction issue. What this is, as I see 20 it, is a first step to move down the road to 21 addressing the long-arm jurisdiction issue, 22 and I agree with you that the courts can 23 interpret it currently to give New York State 24 jurisdiction over Internet gambling companies 25 wherever they are in the planet, but it would 1 be preferable if this Legislature gave 2 guidance to the courts, expanded the scope of 3 the long-arm statute by -- and legislative 4 action, gave guidance to the courts as to what 5 we intended and have the issue of whether 6 we've gone too far challenged by some company 7 from the Bahamas when we get jurisdiction, get 8 a judgment and seek to enforce it some place 9 else. That's the way the system should work. 10 Again, I'm going to vote in 11 favor of this bill. I'm not convinced it's 12 the total solution, but I think it steps us 13 down the road a little bit, and I hope next 14 year we'll look at the long-arm statute, 15 expand the scope of jurisdiction so people who 16 are victimized by these Internet gambling 17 frauds will have a right of action here in New 18 York, can sue here in New York, give their 19 business to New York lawyers and then go 20 enforce their judgments some place else. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 22 Chair recognizes Senator Gold. 23 SENATOR GOLD: Thank you, Mr. 24 President. 25 I would like Senator Larkin to 1 yield, but before that I would just like to 2 point out my admiration for Senator Leichter 3 who can smile about being wrong in a situation 4 which is more than the Senator and our other 5 colleagues do every time we're right for 6 something that is unconstituional. We never 7 hear about that one. 8 I also have been looking around 9 the room for Alice. I haven't seen her. I 10 know we've entered Wonderland with this bill. 11 Senator Larkin, if you would 12 yield to a question. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 14 Larkin, do you yield? 15 SENATOR LARKIN: Yes, Mr. 16 President. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 18 Senator yields. 19 SENATOR GOLD: Senator, there 20 is a principle of law in the state of New York 21 where we all happen to be standing which says 22 that the law never requires a useless act. 23 That's absolutely the law in this state. 24 You, by this law, are asking 25 someone to file a document requesting 1 something that the law doesn't allow to be 2 given. Now, isn't that, in effect, passing a 3 law mandating a useless act? 4 SENATOR LARKIN: I think, 5 Senator, if you take a step back and look at 6 -- I would appreciate that. You have a 7 better view this way -- I would appreciate it 8 if you would think of what we're trying to do, 9 what has been discussed on the Internet, what 10 everybody else has been saying. There must be 11 a way to get a handle on the issue. 12 We've talked to people in 13 Washington. We've talked to people at other 14 states. We talked to what is known as the 15 "nickel states" that have the gambling that 16 have experienced greater problems with this 17 than New York has. Other states are doing the 18 same type of legislation and they're waiting 19 on the federal government and what the states 20 are trying to do is to get a handle on how - 21 the impact on New York. We are not telling 22 them that gambling is the state's rights. We 23 are not forcing them. We're letting them 24 submit an application to the Secretary of 25 State. 1 SENATOR GOLD: Which will be 2 denied. 3 SENATOR LARKIN: That's right, 4 but the Secretary of State at that time will 5 have that data so if we need something and we 6 will hope that the federal government, with 7 their Kyl bill, will come up with what we have 8 been recommending to them to support us in New 9 York State, then we will have some direct 10 guidance. In the meantime, we think we should 11 move forward and try to control it, period. 12 SENATOR GOLD: Will the 13 gentleman yield to another question? 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 15 Larkin, do you continue to yield? The Senator 16 continues to yield. 17 SENATOR LARKIN: Yes, Mr. 18 President. 19 SENATOR GOLD: Senator, I 20 appreciate your interest in gambling and 21 trying to control it or hold it down. I think 22 one of the most disgusting things is child 23 pornography. Why don't you put in a bill that 24 says that if you want to go on the Internet 25 from Alaska -- from the Orient with child 1 pornography, you have to apply to the 2 Secretary of State in New York for corporate 3 authorization? Why don't you tell people if 4 they want to commit interstate bank fraud that 5 they've got to file with the Secretary of 6 State and then you can say, Well, we're not 7 going to give the child pornographer a license 8 but now we're going to start getting a 9 database because all these child pornographers 10 reading the Larkin Law are going to start to 11 send in their applications. We won't give 12 them a license, but we'll know who they are. 13 Senator, this is fairyland. I 14 mean it really is. What are we talking about 15 here? If -- by the way, Senator -- on the 16 bill, Mr. President. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 18 Gold, on the bill. 19 SENATOR GOLD: Senator, I heard 20 about a week or so ago, I believe that the 21 U.S. Attorney for the Southern District of New 22 York has indicted some of these off-shore 23 people for gambling on the Internet, what 24 you're talking about. 25 People have raised the issue in 1 that lawsuit as to whether or not the federal 2 government has a right to go after these 3 people who are in some ways beyond our 4 jurisdiction but, Senator, the fact of the 5 matter is that you, in your legislative 6 background, have done some very good things. 7 Many of us have done good things. We do what 8 we can do and we should be smart enough to 9 understand what we can't do and leave it 10 alone. 11 The concept of telling someone 12 that they must file an application for 13 something that we have no authority to grant 14 because then we're going to have the names and 15 addresses of everybody who filed the 16 application is ludicrous. It makes no sense. 17 It's below our dignity. People will read this 18 and say we have lost our marbles, and I think 19 you ought to withdraw the bill. 20 If there was any jurisdiction 21 to control this, I would love to see it 22 controlled. I think that gambling should be 23 controlled. I'm not arguing that it's not a 24 state function to control it. I am arguing 25 that in spite of our right to control it, that 1 we ought to have some personal pride in this 2 chamber as to what we put on a piece of paper 3 and, Senator Larkin, no one has better 4 motivation than you. No one is more sincere 5 than you, but we can't do it, can't do it, and 6 if you're home over the weekend and you're out 7 to dinner with friends or whatever, your 8 closest friends, you tell them that you put in 9 a bill that requires people to apply for a 10 license in New York that they can't get and 11 you're collecting a database and in the 12 privacy of having a drink or dinner with your 13 friends, you get their reaction, because 14 they're going to think we're all nuts. 15 I admire your attempt. I 16 admire your sensitivity to the issue, but this 17 bill does nothing except, I think most 18 respectfully, make us look a little not so 19 brilliant. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Is 21 there any other Senator wishing to speak on 22 the bill? 23 (There was no response.) 24 Hearing none, the Secretary 25 will read the last section. 1 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. 2 This act shall take effect on the 90th day. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call 4 the roll. 5 (The Secretary called the 6 roll.) 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Record 8 the negatives and announce the results. 9 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded 10 in the negative on Calendar Number 340 are 11 Senators Connor, Gold, Leichter, Paterson, 12 Rosado and Waldon. Ayes 47, nays 6. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 14 bill is passed. 15 Senator Waldon, why do you 16 rise? 17 SENATOR WALDON: Mr. President, 18 I was engaged in other Senate business when 19 the house considered Calendar 305. I'm 20 advised through listening to your statements 21 earlier that it's out of the house, but I 22 would like the record to reflect that had I 23 been here and had I had the opportunity, that 24 I would have voted in the negative. 25 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Would 1 you like unanimous consent to be recorded in 2 the negative? 3 SENATOR WALDON: I'll be as 4 smooth as you if I keep working at it, right? 5 Yes, Mr. President. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 7 objection, hearing no objection, Senator 8 Waldon will be recorded in the negative on 9 Calendar Number 305. 10 The Secretary will continue to 11 read the controversial calendar. 12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 13 377, by Senator Marcellino, Senate Print 2848, 14 an act to amend the General Municipal Law, in 15 relation to establishing the town of 16 Huntington Industrial Development Agency. 17 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 19 Marcellino, an explanation of Calendar Number 20 377, Senate Print 2848, has been requested by 21 Senator Paterson. 22 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Yes, Mr. 23 President. This bill amends the General 24 Municipal Law by adding a new section, that 25 would be Section 907 (d) to establish the town 1 of Huntington Industrial Development Agency in 2 the county of Suffolk. 3 It has been introduced at the 4 request and passed, by the way, by this house 5 at the request of the town of Huntington Town 6 Board, last year when the town board was under 7 Republican control and this year again when 8 the town board is under Democrat control. 9 It's an effort by the town to provide more 10 effective economic planning. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 12 Paterson. 13 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation 14 satisfactory, excellent. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There 16 is a home rule message at the desk. The 17 Secretary will read the last section. 18 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. 19 This act shall take effect immediately. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call 21 the roll. 22 (The Secretary called the 23 roll.) 24 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Record 25 the negatives. Announce the results. 1 Senator Paterson, to explain 2 your vote? 3 SENATOR PATERSON: No, Mr. 4 President. I wanted to speak to you after the 5 vote. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Okay. 7 We'll conclude the roll call after the 8 negatives are recorded. 9 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded 10 in the negative on Calendar Number 377 are 11 Senators Leichter and Stachowski. Ayes 51, 12 nays 2. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The 14 bill is passed. 15 Senator Paterson, why do you 16 rise? 17 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. 18 President, with unanimous consent, I would 19 like to be recorded in the negative on 20 Calendar Number 305 which escaped this chamber 21 in a way that must have been faster than the 22 speed of light. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 24 objection, we will quickly record Senator 25 Paterson in the negative. 1 Senator Gold, why do you rise? 2 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President, I 3 would like unanimous consent to be recorded in 4 the negative on Calendar Number 305 which got 5 out of this chamber almost as well as you 6 putt. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 8 objection, record Senator Gold in the negative 9 on Calendar Number 305. 10 Senator Holland. 11 SENATOR HOLLAND: May we return 12 to reports of standing committees. I 13 understand the Children and Families Committee 14 report is available at the desk. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: We'll 16 return to the order of reports of standing 17 committees. 18 I'll ask the Secretary to 19 read. 20 THE SECRETARY: Senator Saland, 21 from the Committee on Children and Families, 22 reports: 23 Senate Print 2379, by Senator 24 Saland, an act to amend the Criminal Procedure 25 Law and others; 1 5149, by Senator Skelos, an act 2 to amend the Domestic Relations Law; and 3 5196, by Senator Saland, an act 4 to amend the Social Services Law. 5 All bills ordered direct to 6 third reading. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: All 8 bills are ordered directly to third reading. 9 Senator Holland. 10 SENATOR HOLLAND: Mr. 11 President, could you recognize Senator 12 Paterson. I understand he has an 13 announcement. Is that true? 14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator 15 Paterson. 16 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. 17 President, immediately after session, the 18 Senate Minority will have a Democratic 19 Conference in the conference room, Room 314 in 20 the Capitol. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 22 Immediately after session -- immediately after 23 session, there will be a Minority - 24 SENATOR ONORATO: For the 25 purpose of a search for Calendar 305. 1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Pardon 2 -- excuse me just a minute, Senator Onorato. 3 Without objection, we're going to search for 4 305, right -- no. There is a meeting of the 5 Minority in the Minority Conference Room 6 immediately after session, Room 314, and 7 without objection, Senator Onorato will be 8 recorded in the negative on Calendar Number 9 305. Okay. You don't want to be recorded in 10 the negative on Calendar Number 305? 11 SENATOR ONORATO: No. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: All 13 right. Senator Holland, could we return to 14 motions and resolutions. 15 The Chair recognizes Senator 16 Rath. 17 SENATOR RATH: Mr. President, I 18 move that the following bill be discharged 19 from committee and be recommitted with 20 instructions to strike the enacting clause. 21 It's item 3203-B, Senator Rath's bill. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 23 objection, the bill will be recommitted. 24 Senator Holland. 25 SENATOR HOLLAND: No further 1 housekeeping? 2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There's 3 none. 4 SENATOR HOLLAND: There being 5 no further business, I move we adjourn until 6 Monday, March 16th, at 3:00 p.m., intervening 7 days being legislative days. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without 9 objection, the Senate stands adjourned until 10 Monday, March 16th, 3:00 p.m., intervening 11 days to be legislative days. 12 (Whereupon, at 12:08 p.m., the 13 Senate adjourned.) 14 15 16 17 18 19 20