Monday, March 5, 2007

1 NEW YORK STATE SENATE 2 3 4 THE STENOGRAPHIC RECORD 5 6 7 8 9 ALBANY, NEW YORK 10 March 5, 2007 11 3:20 p.m. 12 13 14 REGULAR SESSION 15 16 17 18 LT. GOVERNOR DAVID A. PATERSON, President 19 STEVEN M. BOGGESS, Secretary 20 21 22 23 24 25

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(518) 371-8910 1 P R O C E E D I N G S 2 THE PRESIDENT: The Senate will 3 come to order. 4 I would ask all assembled to please 5 rise and recite with me the Pledge of 6 Allegiance. 7 (Whereupon, the assemblage recited 8 the Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.) 9 THE PRESIDENT: In the absence of 10 clergy, and the absence of any spiritual 11 guidance from any of the members of the Senate 12 who have been invited to come up here and 13 offer a prayer or thought, we will entertain a 14 moment of silence. 15 (Whereupon, the assemblage 16 respected a moment of silence.) 17 THE PRESIDENT: The reading of 18 the Journal. 19 THE SECRETARY: In Senate, 20 Sunday, March 4, the Senate met pursuant to 21 adjournment. The Journal of Saturday, 22 March 3, was read and approved. On motion, 23 Senate adjourned. 24 THE PRESIDENT: Without 25 objection, the Journal stands approved.

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(518) 371-8910 1 Presentation of petitions. 2 Messages from the Assembly. 3 Messages from the Governor. 4 Reports of standing committees. 5 Reports of select committees. 6 Communications and reports from 7 state officers. 8 Motions and resolutions. 9 The chair recognizes Senator 10 Skelos. 11 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, 12 there will be an immediate meeting of the 13 Rules Committee in the Majority Conference 14 Room. 15 And under the order of motions and 16 resolutions, there's a resolution at the desk, 17 339, by Senator Nozzolio, which was previously 18 adopted on February 6th. If we could have it 19 read in its entirety and then recognize 20 Senator Nozzolio. 21 THE PRESIDENT: There will be an 22 immediate meeting of the Rules Committee in 23 the Majority Conference Room, Room 332. 24 The Secretary will read the 25 resolution.

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(518) 371-8910 1 THE SECRETARY: By Senator 2 Nozzolio, Legislative Resolution Number 339, 3 congratulating the Geneva High School Football 4 Team and Coach David Whitcomb upon the 5 occasion of capturing the 2006 New York State 6 Class B Championship. 7 "WHEREAS, Excellence and success in 8 competitive sports can be achieved only 9 through strenuous practice, team play, and 10 team spirit, nurtured by dedicated coaching 11 and strategic planning; and 12 "WHEREAS, Athletic competition 13 enhances the moral and physical development of 14 the young people of this state, preparing them 15 for the future by instilling in them the value 16 of teamwork, encouraging a standard of healthy 17 living, imparting a desire for success, and 18 developing a sense of fair play and 19 competition; and 20 "WHEREAS, The 2006 New York State 21 Class B champions, the Geneva High School 22 Panthers Football Team, defeated Albany 23 Academy 33-7 at the Carrier Dome in Syracuse, 24 New York, to finish the season with an 11-2 25 record; and.

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(518) 371-8910 1 WHEREAS, The Panthers were led this 2 season by 2006 New York State Class B Player 3 of the Year Brian Fowler, who rushed for 2,042 4 yards and scored 36 touchdowns. In addition, 5 Torrell Northrup was named to the New York 6 State Class B First Team and John Warner and 7 Kelvin Cruz were named to the Second Team; and 8 "WHEREAS, The athletic talent 9 displayed by this team is due in great part to 10 the efforts of Coach David Whitcomb and his 11 team of outstanding assistant coaches, skilled 12 and inspirational tutors, respected for their 13 ability to develop potential into excellence; 14 and 15 "WHEREAS, The team's overall record 16 is outstanding, and the team members were 17 loyally and enthusiastically supported by 18 family, fans, friends and the community at 19 large; and 20 "WHEREAS, The hallmarks of the 21 Geneva High School Football team, from the 22 opening game of the season to participation in 23 the championship game at the Carrier Dome, 24 were a brotherhood of athletic ability, of 25 good sportsmanship, of honor and of

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(518) 371-8910 1 scholarship, demonstrating that these team 2 players are second to none; and 3 "WHEREAS, Athletically and 4 academically, the team members have proven 5 themselves to be an unbeatable combination of 6 talents, reflecting favorably on Geneva High 7 School; and 8 "WHEREAS, Coach David Whitcomb and 9 his dedicated staff have done a superb job in 10 guiding, molding and inspiring the team 11 members toward their goals; and 12 "WHEREAS, Sports competition 13 instills the values of teamwork, pride and 14 accomplishment, and Coach David Whitcomb and 15 the outstanding athletes on the Geneva High 16 School Football Team have clearly made a 17 contribution to the spirit of excellence which 18 is a tradition of their school; now, 19 therefore, be it 20 "RESOLVED, That this Legislative 21 Body pause in its deliberations to 22 congratulate the Geneva High School Football 23 Team, its members -- Tom Price, Jeff 24 Springmeier, Jimmy Warner, Junior Collins, 25 Tyler Travis, Bobby Martin, Tremaine Green,

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(518) 371-8910 1 Ronnie Collins, David Deraddo, Matt Schutz, 2 Brian Fowler, Matt Augustine, Shamar Bridges, 3 Carrington Johnson, Jeremiah Allen, Tyler 4 Knight, Robert Sapp, Cheagan Wilson, Derrious 5 Thomas, Andy Torruella, Andrew Graves, Ben 6 Chilbert, Matt Hegel, Mike Raplee, Dom Carter, 7 John Warner, John Cosentino, Antaun Wright, 8 Tyler Sollenne, Kelvin Cruz, Joe Passalacqua, 9 Kyle Olschewske, Carlos Patino, Nick Morlang, 10 Torrell Northrup, Harrison Hardy, Willie 11 Smallwood, Kevin Cook, Shane Beer, Tim 12 Blancke -- Assistant Coaches Mike Pane, Steve 13 Marchitell, Brad Roach, Jasper Collins, Pat 14 Martin, Bob Greco, Mike Cooper, Marc Tapscott, 15 Matt Nolin, Nate Schnekenburger and Justin P, 16 and Coach David Whitcomb on their outstanding 17 season and overall team record; and be it 18 further 19 "RESOLVED, That copies of this 20 resolution, suitably engrossed, be transmitted 21 to the Geneva High School Football Team and to 22 Coach David Whitcomb." 23 THE PRESIDENT: This resolution 24 was passed earlier in the session. We are 25 pleased to have the football team located in

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(518) 371-8910 1 the gallery with its coach, David Whitcomb. 2 And on the resolution that we have 3 adopted, the chair recognizes Senator 4 Nozzolio. 5 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Thank you, 6 Mr. President. And thank you very much for 7 having the resolution read in its entirety. 8 And I ask my colleagues to join 9 with me in welcoming a group of fine young 10 New Yorkers here to the State Capitol; fitting 11 that the state champions be recognized for 12 their contributions here, where we make the 13 laws, in our State Capitol. 14 The journey for this team was a 15 long one. It was one that was marked with the 16 highest success. But before the Geneva 17 Panthers became successful, they faced 18 adversaries very strong a year before. This 19 was the second opportunity I believe in its 20 history that Geneva, the Geneva Panthers had 21 an opportunity to win the New York State 22 football championship. And they won it. 23 But the first time, they were met 24 with some very strong opposition from a team 25 in Amsterdam represented here by the great

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(518) 371-8910 1 Senator Hugh Farley. That defeat -- out of 2 the seeds of that defeat were born the fruits 3 of victory a year later. 4 And I want to congratulate Coach 5 David Whitcomb and his excellent staff for 6 molding together a fine group of athletes who 7 are much more than athletes, they're truly 8 gentlemen, gentlemen who are great 9 representatives of their school and their 10 community. 11 We oftentimes hear about the 12 foibles of young people and, when young people 13 go astray, read about their defeats and their 14 passages in a negative sense. This team is 15 all positive. They care about each other. 16 That's why they are as successful and became 17 state champions, in beating, I daresay, a team 18 again from this region, revenge on the eastern 19 part of the state in the victory this last 20 year, a resounding 33 to 7 victory over Albany 21 Academy. 22 Today the team is accompanied by 23 some fine adults who have helped mold the 24 spirit, cooperation, and are great educators. 25 I mentioned him once and I daresay he deserves

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(518) 371-8910 1 mention again, and that's Coach Dave Whitcomb, 2 head coach. He's also here today with Mike 3 Pane, Brad Roach, Pat Martin, Jasper Collins 4 and Marc Tapscott, all assistant coaches. 5 Mike Cooper, another assistant coach, could 6 not be with us. 7 Also listening just outside the 8 chamber, because he is confined to a 9 wheelchair -- but that young man, assistant 10 coach, team leader, team spiritual leader 11 Bobby Greco, has also made the trip. 12 Two fine people from the Board of 13 Education. First, the superintendent of 14 schools, Bob Young, as well as Tom Scherer, a 15 member of the school board, are also here 16 today to be part of this recognition. 17 Mr. President, I appreciate very 18 much the pause in the proceedings today to 19 welcome these state champions here to Albany, 20 to congratulate them on their significant 21 victory, a victory even sweeter because it 22 came after a year of disappointment at the 23 final championship game. But they came back, 24 and that's the measure of a true champion. 25 Thank you, Mr. President. I

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(518) 371-8910 1 appreciate this house's indulgence. 2 THE PRESIDENT: Thank you, 3 Senator Nozzolio. 4 Senator Farley. 5 SENATOR FARLEY: Thank you, 6 Mr. President. 7 I rise to congratulate this school 8 of champions. You know, they were involved in 9 one of the most exciting, fierce football 10 games at the Carrier Dome last year where 11 Amsterdam, one of my schools, survived to be 12 champions. 13 But the school, what a tradition 14 you have. It's kind of interesting, you are 15 getting your revenge, because my daughter 16 graduated from the Albany Academy. She didn't 17 play football. 18 But you certainly had a very big 19 win this year, and I congratulate you for 20 that. The record that you're already 21 maintaining as two years in the state finals 22 is really something. You're all champions. 23 I'm very proud of you. Congratulations. 24 And, Senator Nozzolio, you really 25 got even in a hurry.

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(518) 371-8910 1 THE PRESIDENT: Senator Breslin. 2 SENATOR BRESLIN: Thank you, 3 Mr. President. 4 I rise to commend the Geneva 5 Football Team. In the finals, they beat 6 Albany Academy, a team from my district. Of 7 course Albany Academy at the time was besieged 8 with injuries and -- 9 (Laughter.) 10 SENATOR BRESLIN: Seriously. And 11 academic failures as well. 12 (Laughter.) 13 SENATOR BRESLIN: No. 14 Seriously, I commend the Geneva 15 team because they won it without any doubt 16 being left to who was the best team. 17 So to the Geneva Football Team and 18 its coaches and administrators, from the 19 representative of Albany Academy, I 20 congratulate you. 21 Thank you, Mr. President. 22 THE PRESIDENT: Thank you, 23 Senator Breslin. 24 This resolution was already passed 25 earlier in our session.

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(518) 371-8910 1 And so therefore, to Coach Whitcomb 2 and all of his assistant coaches, to 3 Superintendent Bob Young of Geneva and all of 4 your staff and the people in the educational 5 system who helped all of these young men, and 6 to the players themselves, who were victors by 7 a score of 33 to 7 over Albany Academy at this 8 year's 2006 Class B finals at the Carrier Dome 9 in Syracuse, we in the Senate want to extend 10 to you our congratulations. 11 And we know that Senator Breslin 12 will take all of the inspirational messages 13 that Senator Nozzolio just brought back so 14 that another school may reign supreme next 15 year. But for right now, you are the 16 champions, and congratulations. 17 (Applause.) 18 THE PRESIDENT: Senator Wright. 19 SENATOR WRIGHT: Thank you, 20 Mr. President. 21 Would you please recognize Senator 22 Farley, who has an amendment. 23 THE PRESIDENT: The chair 24 recognizes Senator Farley. 25 SENATOR FARLEY: Thank you very

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(518) 371-8910 1 much. It's nice to be recognized. 2 On page 11 I offer the following 3 amendments to Calendar Number 18, Senate Print 4 42, and I ask that Senator Maziarz's bill 5 retain its place on the Third Reading 6 Calendar. 7 THE PRESIDENT: This amendment is 8 received and adopted and will retain its place 9 on the Third Reading Calendar. 10 Senator Wright. 11 SENATOR WRIGHT: Mr. President, 12 can we take up the noncontroversial reading of 13 the calendar, please. 14 THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary 15 will read the noncontroversial calendar. 16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 17 39, by Senator Maziarz, Senate Print 521A, an 18 act to amend the Judiciary Law, in relation to 19 the compensation of interpreters. 20 THE PRESIDENT: Last section. 21 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 22 act shall take effect immediately. 23 THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll. 24 (The Secretary called the roll.) 25 THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 57.

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(518) 371-8910 1 THE PRESIDENT: The bill is 2 passed. 3 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 4 94, by Senator Saland, Senate Print -- 5 SENATOR WRIGHT: Lay that aside 6 for the day, please. 7 THE PRESIDENT: The bill is laid 8 aside for the day. 9 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 10 125, by Senator Nozzolio, Senate Print 329, an 11 act to amend the Real Property Tax Law, in 12 relation to exemption. 13 THE PRESIDENT: Last section. 14 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 15 act shall take effect immediately. 16 THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll. 17 (The Secretary called the roll.) 18 THE PRESIDENT: Results. 19 THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 56. Nays, 20 1. Senator Duane recorded in the negative. 21 THE PRESIDENT: The bill is 22 passed. 23 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 24 144, by Senator Marcellino, Senate Print 699, 25 an act to amend the Environmental Conservation

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(518) 371-8910 1 Law, in relation to special permits. 2 THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary 3 will read the last section, please. 4 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This 5 act shall take effect immediately. 6 THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll. 7 (The Secretary called the roll.) 8 THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 57. 9 THE PRESIDENT: The bill is 10 passed. 11 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 12 148, by Senator Marcellino, Senate Print 618, 13 an act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to 14 criminally negligent homicide. 15 THE PRESIDENT: Last section. 16 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This 17 act shall take effect on the first of 18 November. 19 THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll. 20 (The Secretary called the roll.) 21 THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 57. 22 THE PRESIDENT: The bill is 23 passed. 24 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 25 149, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 638, an

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(518) 371-8910 1 act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law and 2 the Family Court Act, in relation to evidence 3 of identification. 4 THE PRESIDENT: Last section. 5 THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This 6 act shall take effect on the first of 7 November. 8 THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll. 9 (The Secretary called the roll.) 10 THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 57. 11 THE PRESIDENT: The bill is 12 passed. 13 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 14 150, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 754, an 15 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to 16 unlawful sale of tobacco products to a child. 17 THE PRESIDENT: Read the last 18 section. 19 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 20 act shall take effect immediately. 21 THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll. 22 (The Secretary called the roll.) 23 THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 57. 24 THE PRESIDENT: The bill is 25 passed.

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(518) 371-8910 1 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 2 162, by Senator Little, Senate Print 1117, an 3 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to 4 increasing the penalties for hazing. 5 THE PRESIDENT: Read the last 6 section. 7 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This 8 act shall take effect on the first of 9 November. 10 THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll. 11 (The Secretary called the roll.) 12 THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 57. 13 THE PRESIDENT: The bill is 14 passed. 15 That completes the noncontroversial 16 reading of the calendar, Senator Wright. 17 SENATOR WRIGHT: Thank you, 18 Mr. President. 19 May we please return to reports of 20 standing committees. I believe there's a 21 report of the Rules Committee at the desk. 22 THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary 23 will read. 24 THE SECRETARY: Senator Bruno, 25 from the Committee on Rules, reports the

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(518) 371-8910 1 following bills: 2 Senate Print 3318, by Senator 3 Volker, an act to amend the Mental Hygiene Law 4 and others; 5 And Senate Print 3322, by Senator 6 Bruno, an act to amend the Workers' 7 Compensation Law and others. 8 Both bills ordered direct to third 9 reading. 10 THE PRESIDENT: Senator Wright. 11 SENATOR WRIGHT: Move to accept 12 the report of the Rules Committee. 13 THE PRESIDENT: All in favor. 14 (Response of "Aye.") 15 THE PRESIDENT: Those opposed. 16 (No response.) 17 THE PRESIDENT: The Rules report 18 is accepted. 19 Senator Wright. 20 SENATOR WRIGHT: May we please 21 take up Calendar Number 251, which was just 22 reported from the Rules Committee. 23 THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary 24 will read. 25 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number

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(518) 371-8910 1 251, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 3318, an 2 act to amend the Mental Hygiene Law and 3 others, in relation to the treatment, 4 supervision and civil commitment of sex 5 offenders. 6 THE PRESIDENT: Last section. 7 SENATOR DUANE: Lay it aside, 8 please. 9 THE PRESIDENT: Lay it aside. 10 Senator Wright. 11 SENATOR WRIGHT: Mr. President. 12 Can we take up the controversial reading of 13 the calendar, please. 14 THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary 15 will conduct the controversial reading of the 16 calendar. And we will ring the bells for the 17 members. 18 The Secretary will read. 19 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 20 251, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 3318, an 21 act to amend the Mental Hygiene Law and 22 others, in relation to the treatment, 23 supervision, and civil commitment of sex 24 offenders. 25 SENATOR DUANE: Explanation,

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(518) 371-8910 1 please. 2 THE PRESIDENT: Senator Volker, 3 an explanation has been requested by Senator 4 Duane. 5 SENATOR VOLKER: Yeah. Just as a 6 point of reference, I have here the initial 7 bill -- we found it in the archives -- that I 8 put in June 30, 1994. It is four pages. And 9 this bill is 44 pages. So actually, we have 10 come a long way. 11 And we've had hearings on the 12 bills. One year I passed it four times, 13 different bills, Governor's bills and -- and I 14 only point that out because we only put the 15 bill in when the Hendricks v. Kansas decision 16 was decided in '94. 17 I read an interesting article 18 yesterday by the New York Times that as I read 19 the first three paragraphs I said, Well, what 20 this means is that they're going to 21 editorialize against the bill. It was 22 obvious, because I've heard the story that 23 they had from the critics in Kansas. 24 I was on a national group one time, 25 and I listened to the people in Kansas

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(518) 371-8910 1 complain. Interestingly enough, there was 2 people from Texas and various places, and when 3 I listened to their explanations, I said, "The 4 biggest problem you seem to have is you don't 5 really want to do civil confinement." "Oh, 6 yes, we do, but we can't pay for it." I said, 7 "Well, how do you do civil confinement unless 8 you're going to pay for it?" And they said, 9 "That's our problem." 10 So I said, "What are you going to 11 do?" I asked these people from all across the 12 country, I said, "Well, what's your solution?" 13 "We'll let them out, and we'll watch them." I 14 said, "Well, that's a big problem." 15 By the way, Hendricks, who -- I 16 don't want to say anything except that my 17 suspicion is that the reason that Hendricks is 18 still civilly confined since 1994 is maybe 19 that's a good place for him. That's all I can 20 say. 21 If you know anything about some of 22 these people, they're pretty bad people, many 23 of them. And by "bad," I mean they're sick 24 people. I've listened to mental health people 25 tell me stories. And I say to them: "Well,

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(518) 371-8910 1 what would you propose we do?" And many of 2 them say, "We don't know. We don't want them 3 mixed in with regular mental health people." 4 And I say to them, but how do we in 5 conscience let people -- for instance, just in 6 the last two weeks, a seven-time rapist was 7 about to be let out. He had raped seven 8 different women. 9 Now, if you know anything about the 10 rape cases -- and years ago when I did a big 11 investigation, we figured at least four for 12 every one that you know about. We had good 13 reason to come up with that number, because we 14 charged the guy with 29 counts and we -- 15 amazing the number of people who came forward 16 afterward and said, you know, "I don't want to 17 tell my husband," this and that. It was 18 amazing, the numbers. 19 I only say that because there's one 20 thing you have to realize about this issue. 21 In many ways the reason that those of us that 22 are in criminal justice -- and Frank Padavan 23 and I are the last members in the Senate of 24 the original Mental Health Committee. We've 25 been on since, what, '74, Frank? I think so.

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(518) 371-8910 1 Both of us have been on Mental Health all that 2 time. And of course we've been involved in 3 criminal justice, and I have most of my life. 4 This is a very difficult bill, I'm 5 not kidding you, because it crosses the line 6 between mental health and criminal. The 7 reason it's such a tough concept is because 8 neither side really likes this kind of thing. 9 And I tell that you very honestly. By "sides" 10 I mean neither the criminal side nor the civil 11 side. 12 But the people that are involved 13 here, many of them child sex offenders, 14 ordinary sex offenders of women and sometimes 15 men, they're different. I think everyone does 16 agree with that. Glenn Goord used to tell me, 17 who was the head prison system, they were the 18 biggest single problem in his prison system 19 other than murderers of pregnant women. 20 Because there's a caste system in 21 prison. If you kill a pregnant women, you're 22 a target by other inmates wherever you go. 23 Once they find out about it, that's a complete 24 no-no. We are amazed because we live outside 25 the whole prison situation.

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(518) 371-8910 1 I've been in most of the major 2 prisons in this state. I've met some real 3 characters. I've met people that did not want 4 to get out. We offered to let them out with, 5 what do you call it, medical parole. The one 6 guy cried and carried on, I've been here -- he 7 was there fifty years for two murders. He 8 said, "I have nothing to go back to." And, 9 you know, it's a tragic case. 10 But you know, there's another 11 factor. And that's what this bill, which is 12 the Sex Offender Management and Treatment Act, 13 it deals with people who eventually, and 14 through a very intricate process -- and by the 15 way, I've heard people say, "Well, how soon 16 are these people going to be in there?" Well, 17 it's going to take a little time. I mean, 18 this is not something that's going to happen 19 overnight. 20 The Budget Bureau, that I'm not so 21 sure is a great judge of some of this stuff, 22 they claim that it will take a couple of 23 years. But they feel that of 400 people who 24 will eventually reach trial in the next couple 25 of years, a hundred would be civilly confined,

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(518) 371-8910 1 250 could go to strict and intensive 2 supervision, and 50 would be released. 3 The reason that they figure that -- 4 it does make some sense. Because remember, 5 the chances of someone being put before a jury 6 is fairly slim. And the reason is you have to 7 be a pretty clear and convincing case before 8 it's going to happen. You've already gone 9 through all this stuff, you've got 10 psychiatrists, you've got the case management 11 people, you've got the case review team, 12 you've got the Attorney General and then the 13 judge reviews it. 14 And then it goes to the judge, and 15 what happens is that a jury doesn't say 16 whether the person should go and be confined 17 or not, it says that the predator is found to 18 be dangerous and that he is mentally abnormal. 19 That is, he's got a major -- he or she has got 20 a major problem. And then the judge formally 21 decides whether that person should be civilly 22 confined or put out on strict and intensive 23 supervision. 24 One thing I want to point out in 25 the bill is -- and this is a big bill, it's 44

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(518) 371-8910 1 pages -- there is a provision in here, and I 2 only mention -- on page 15 and 16 that I 3 believe has never been put in any civil 4 confinement bill. One of the issues that came 5 up in our conference committee is, what does 6 strict and intensive supervision mean? 7 Because that was a major issue with the 8 Assembly, and this house was asking that 9 question. What does it mean? They said, 10 well, it's going to be a lot of people. 11 Well, in this bill, on pages 15 and 12 16, you will see the criteria for what "strict 13 and intensive supervision" means. And it is 14 the most complete, I think -- obviously, there 15 will be some changes, but it is the most 16 complete and mandates a number of parole 17 officers. In fact, the estimate is -- because 18 I asked for this. I said, "Well, what exactly 19 are we talking about here?" 20 And the civil commitment people, 21 the Governor and the Attorney General and the 22 people involved in this Legislature, feel that 23 on an annual basis about 1500 people are 24 annually released from DOCS. The number that 25 would be screened would probably be about 400.

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(518) 371-8910 1 And that was the numbers I gave you before. 2 Now, it is estimated that the need 3 will be -- and I'm not kidding anybody here, 4 and I've said this. And that's what the New 5 York Times, they said. Whenever you're 6 opposed to something the big thing is, well, 7 this is way too expensive. Is it way too 8 expensive to keep people from being assaulted 9 in the streets and so forth? I don't know. 10 This would take over a thousand new 11 full-time employees. At least 60 of them 12 initially would be parole officers. Now, one 13 of the things we said, I said to Governor 14 Pataki and now Governor Spitzer, we have to 15 know that we are going to put the people out 16 there to do the kind of job that needs to be 17 done. To their credit, both Governors have 18 said yes, we will do it. And this is what 19 they're talking about doing. 20 The ratio, by the way, for sexually 21 violent predators out on the street would be 22 10 to 1 for parole officers. Now, if you 23 think of that, if you know anything about the 24 ratios, they're a heck of a lot bigger than 25 that now. They're as much as 40 to 50, in

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(518) 371-8910 1 some places as much as 70 to 1 or bigger. I 2 know in Buffalo they're 45 to 1. In New York 3 City I understand they're bigger than that. 4 I'm not exactly sure. 5 What that means is, how many parole 6 officers per parolees? Now, we know that 7 that's been a problem. So they are ready to 8 provide people for this. 9 The bill creates the new crime of 10 sexually motivated felony, where 11 potentially -- we've had a lot of discussion 12 about this. As an example, you have somebody 13 that was involved in a rape and maybe even a 14 murder or, more likely, arson or something of 15 that nature, he pleads to the arson, let's 16 say, and the rape is dropped for whatever 17 reason. That person could potentially be 18 indicated later -- because of the sexual 19 motivation of how the arson happened, could be 20 checked before he's let out. 21 By the way, it's hard to -- there's 22 been cases on this. Very difficult to prove, 23 by the way. You'd have to bring in all the 24 evidence surrounding the initial case and so 25 forth. The only reason I use that is because

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(518) 371-8910 1 it is possible. 2 Let's see. Persons currently on 3 parole could potentially be subject to civil 4 confinement proceeding. That would be tough 5 to do. I was a little surprised the Assembly 6 accepted this, because initially they wanted 7 no part of it. But the Governor, to his 8 credit, I think, felt that that provision 9 should be in here in case you get somebody who 10 is out on parole. 11 Normally, the way that would be 12 done is that a person literally commits a 13 crime while on parole, is not yet convicted, 14 but still could be checked if the crime is a 15 sexually motivated crime. So that 16 occasionally happens. If the previous crime 17 was sexually motivated and if the present 18 crime is, that that person could be checked 19 for civil confinement. 20 There's a whole series of 21 provisions in here relating to how the 22 proceeding comes forth. All kinds of 23 protections of all sorts. I was asked 24 questions in the committee about the parole 25 officers. The only thing a parole officer

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(518) 371-8910 1 would have to do is refer it to someone. His 2 power is he could put a person, for violation 3 of parole, in jail for five days. Which is 4 what you can now for a violation of parole at 5 any time. 6 After that, the rest of the process 7 takes over and you decide whether the person 8 should be civilly confined or not and go 9 through the case management committee and the 10 case review team and all that other stuff. 11 Has to be checked by psychiatrists and a whole 12 series of things. 13 This bill, in my opinion -- and 14 I've been, as I say, around criminal justice 15 for quite a few years -- represents what I 16 consider -- it's hard to call it reform. It 17 is reform. It's change of epic proportions. 18 This will be the class bill for the whole 19 country, there's no question in my mind. No 20 one has done a bill like this. 21 That is, people have done bills 22 like this, but they have never gone to the 23 extent that we have to protect the 24 individuals, to deal with the issue of sexual 25 depravity, and to actually put the money up,

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(518) 371-8910 1 which is substantial, to put the people in a 2 confined situation and then give them a 3 treatment that as far as we know no one else 4 in the country has done. 5 By the way, also involved in this 6 bill is a provision that says that people who 7 are sexually motivated criminals will have 8 additional treatment in prison. That is, when 9 they're in there initially, before they ever 10 get to civil confinement and all the rest of 11 this, they're going to be treated in prison. 12 There's a reason why that's 13 significant, is because by putting these 14 people in to deal with them, it won't detract 15 from the mental health for the other inmates. 16 Right now a lot of the mental health people 17 are trying to deal with the sexual predator 18 people in prison. And an enormous amount of 19 time is taken away from other inmates who 20 merely -- and I say merely -- have mental 21 health problems. 22 What this bill will do is provide 23 additional people to help out with that 24 situation and actually will deal with some of 25 these. The Assembly wanted that in the bill,

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(518) 371-8910 1 and I think it was a very good idea. There's 2 going to be a number of additional people 3 helping out with mental health in the prisons 4 to specifically deal with sexual motivation, 5 which would relieve some of the people now to 6 deal with other problems, mental health 7 problems, in the prison. Finally, there will 8 be new parole officers in the prison, also in 9 addition to being outside. 10 So this is a bill that will cost a 11 lot of money, no question. The bill will come 12 into effect 30 days after the bill is signed 13 by the Governor. And as I say, I think it is 14 the most comprehensive approach to dealing 15 with sexual predators that this nation has 16 ever seen. 17 We have always been a leader here 18 in New York in criminal justice. Very little 19 attention by the media to the fact that one of 20 the main ways we brought down our prison 21 system was the best shock incarceration 22 program in the country and probably in the 23 world. Which is now, because we don't have 24 many people to let out anymore since about 25 75 percent of the people in our prison system

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(518) 371-8910 1 are now violent people, where years ago it was 2 the reverse, 75 nonviolent, 25 -- that's all 3 changed. There's an enormous amount of very 4 violent predators. 5 And that's why we have to be 6 careful with this. That's another issue in 7 the prison system. These people are extremely 8 disruptive in the prison system itself. It's 9 no secret. They will always tell you that, 10 that -- I have inmates when I walk through the 11 prisons they say: "Hey, Volker, you've got 12 something to do with this stuff, get these 13 crazies out of here." A murderer tells me 14 they want to get the crazies out of here 15 because they're dangerous to the system. 16 Literally, that's happened to me as 17 I'm walking through the prison system. 18 Especially at Attica, where unfortunately too 19 many of them know me. But at any rate, it's 20 amazing the knowledge the inmates have of 21 what's going on there. 22 So I say to you I personally think 23 that this is a bill that will make New York 24 way ahead of the rest of the country in an 25 effort to deal with an epidemic of sexual

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(518) 371-8910 1 predators in our streets. People have said to 2 me, What about this? What about that? I say 3 if we get this under control, a lot of the 4 problems that we have in some of the 5 neighborhoods we believe will begin to remedy 6 themselves. 7 And there's a lot more to be done. 8 Senator Skelos has some more notification work 9 that he's been doing in relation to Megan's 10 Law, and we'll be able to track these people 11 more easily. But if you get the worst of the 12 worst out of the system, you will then be in a 13 much better situation to deal with this issue. 14 THE PRESIDENT: Senator Bruno. 15 SENATOR BRUNO: Thank you very 16 much, Mr. President, Senator Volker, 17 colleagues. 18 Senator Volker, thanks for your 19 diligence and your efforts over the last I 20 don't know how many years -- 18, 20 years -- 21 that you have been involved in this issue. 22 But to our colleagues here, what 23 we're doing here this afternoon is one of the 24 most important things that we can do on behalf 25 of our mutual constituency. And what we're

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(518) 371-8910 1 doing today would not have happened and taken 2 place without the direct intervention of 3 Governor Spitzer. He made a commitment that 4 he was going to help get this done. 5 Now, I say that his direct 6 leadership helped us get this bill on the 7 floor of the Senate on its way to becoming 8 law. And for many of you that partner and 9 relate very, very closely, I'd like to have 10 you bear that in mind. 11 Because I am reading, as you are, 12 some of the editorials that really advocate on 13 behalf of the perpetrator, the predator, the 14 convicts, and be careful that you don't tamper 15 with their civil liberties. And I didn't hear 16 of all of what Senator Volker had to say, but 17 I know he's pretty comprehensive in his 18 explanations and his diligence. 19 But think about this. When those 20 that advocate "be careful, be lenient," half 21 to two-thirds of these violent, violent 22 predators go out and do it again. And it has 23 been determined by professionals they are not 24 able, most of them, to help themselves. They 25 know they can't help themselves. And so many

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(518) 371-8910 1 of them want a barrier, some rehab protection 2 to keep them from recommitting. They are 3 disruptive. They need to be segregated after 4 they serve whatever sentence they're given. 5 But I'm asking you to focus. This 6 is something we've been debating, we've been 7 deliberating ever since I've been leader here 8 and as a Senator before. And we're now here. 9 And it's time for people to make a commitment. 10 And the commitment is that we protect your 11 constituency, our constituencies, from the 12 predator, that person that will violently 13 attack, rape, murder, maim. 14 And I'm reminded of case after case 15 that we read about, people that come in who 16 are truly scarred. Even though they go on 17 with their lives, they're scarred for life. 18 So I am appealing here that we join together 19 to think about the victims, the innocent 20 potential victims. 21 And for those that would rather 22 coddle that person that has been convicted -- 23 that's what we're talking about, violent, 24 violent criminals -- think about your 25 constituents with children, with the

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(518) 371-8910 1 vulnerability that's there. And heaven forbid 2 and God forbid that one of these people are 3 out on the streets and they do it all over 4 again, as they have done. 5 And anyone that had talked to the 6 father of that little 9-year-old in Florida 7 and listened to his story about the repeat 8 offender who killed his 9-year-old daughter, 9 which you all read about, buried her 10 half-alive, you would never, ever err on the 11 side of the criminal and the perpetrator. You 12 would err on the side of protecting a 13 9-year-old, 12-year-old or any person that's 14 out there that truly deserves the protection 15 that we as legislators need to give them with 16 a result such as we want to get today. 17 Thank you. Thank you, Madam 18 President. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 20 you, Senator Bruno. 21 Senator Smith. 22 SENATOR SMITH: Thank you very 23 much, Madam President. 24 And let me also congratulate the 25 Governor, who, as Senator Bruno said, had the

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(518) 371-8910 1 fortitude and took the time to bring both 2 houses together. Obviously Senator Volker has 3 put a great amount of time into this 4 particular bill, as well as Senator Klein and 5 Senator Tom Duane. 6 We have moved very rapidly over the 7 last 50 or so days on a number of issues in 8 this particular house and with the Governor as 9 well. And that goes back for not only 10 workers' comp but ethics reform. And now we 11 are doing a very important bill today, civil 12 confinement. 13 I can't speak for everyone in this 14 room, but I can only tell you if you ever had 15 the unfortunate privilege, if you will, to 16 have to talk to a family member or talk to a 17 parent who had come to your office because of 18 an incident that happened with their child, 19 their daughter or even their son, we would not 20 be debating this or even discussing it right 21 now, we just would have passed it short of 22 what the process requires. 23 Anyone here who has a child or a 24 son or a daughter needs to clearly understand 25 what it means to protect that person. And

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(518) 371-8910 1 whether you are a surrogate parent or a parent 2 or a godparent, the bottom line is your 3 ultimate responsibility is to protect your 4 family and the children that are in your 5 family and those that are associated with them 6 as well. 7 This particular bill, granted, 8 there was some debate about treatment. And 9 yes, there was an agreement to provide some 10 treatment. We also understand the importance 11 of providing what we would call humane 12 responses to individuals, and we don't want to 13 just blanketly indicate that their lives are 14 completely out of order and cannot be 15 resuscitated, if you will. 16 However, this particular bill goes 17 to the safety of individuals in our 18 communities. And if you ask anyone, there are 19 basic things that all of us agree upon. One, 20 we want to be able to educate our family. 21 Two, we want to be able to live in a 22 neighborhood where you can raise your family. 23 Three, you want to be able to know that your 24 family is going to be safe, whether you are at 25 home with them or when you leave.

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(518) 371-8910 1 All of us leave our homes. All of 2 us leave our neighbors. The last thing you 3 want is that phone call to come in to say that 4 this particular individual who was living two 5 doors away or four doors away -- and many of 6 us have seen the statistics, many of us have 7 seen the reports. And I would daresay if you 8 read it, many of you know that someone of this 9 background lives in close proximity to your 10 home. 11 And that is a challenge that we 12 face and a challenge that we face as a 13 society. But how you can mitigate some of 14 that challenge is by virtue of having this 15 particular law in place. 16 I again want to congratulate my 17 partner Senator Bruno, who has not only had 18 the fortitude to fight for this over the years 19 that he was here but also knows, according to 20 Assemblyman Tedisco, this particular bill was 21 introduced in '93, I think he says. Almost 14 22 years ago. And here we are now, 14 years 23 later, just passing that bill. 24 I think it says a couple of things. 25 One, to the public, as I always say, that

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(518) 371-8910 1 their message was delivered, their message was 2 received, and today we are taking action. 3 But more importantly, I think it 4 says to our family that we recognize that 5 while we may not always be there for them 6 because of what this job requires, that we are 7 doing things not only to protect the other 8 individuals that live in this state but 9 protect them as well. And that's a very 10 important thing, not only to myself but I'm 11 sure to each and every one of you. 12 So this is a day where, while we 13 may not be happy about the fact of what we're 14 doing because of what it says about 15 individuals within our society, you need to be 16 pleased about the fact that you are making a 17 hard decision and a tough decision. But when 18 you are in leadership, that's what it 19 requires. And that's what the people that are 20 sitting in this room are, leaders of this 21 state. And today they're showing that to the 22 rest of the people of the state. 23 Thank you. 24 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 25 you, Senator Smith.

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(518) 371-8910 1 Senator Padavan. 2 SENATOR PADAVAN: Thank you, 3 Madam President. 4 First let me congratulate Senator 5 Volker and the Majority Leader and all those 6 who made this possible to bring us to this 7 point we are today. 8 I'd like to put this legislation in 9 a particular context that might in part 10 respond to these editorials that have been 11 written in opposition to it, or some of the 12 questions individuals might have relative to 13 its efficacy. 14 Several decades ago the state and 15 the City of New York in particular dealt with 16 very thorny issue: individuals out on the 17 street, many high-profile cases -- the Bumpers 18 case, the Harris case -- individuals who were 19 mentally ill who had caused a great deal of 20 problems for themselves and their community, 21 violent and otherwise, and who were being 22 removed from the street, brought to an 23 acute-care hospital, treated, given 24 medication, they were fine, and then the civil 25 libertarians would say, You must be back, you

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(518) 371-8910 1 must release them back onto the street. 2 Well, this cycle never produced any 3 desired result until we came up with civil 4 confinement for those who are mentally 5 disabled, who either are unable, unwilling or 6 incapable of taking those medications and 7 being treated in the fashion that would 8 prevent them from continuing to be a danger to 9 themselves or others. And so for many years 10 now we have had the benefit of civil 11 confinement for the mentally disabled, the 12 mentally ill. 13 Now, pedophilia is a defined mental 14 illness. Unfortunately, there is no 15 medication. There is no Prozac, there is no 16 Valium, there is nothing you could give 17 someone who has this illness which will enable 18 them to function in society without reverting 19 to their base instincts. They have to be 20 treated in some fashion best known, of course, 21 to clinicians and those who deal with this 22 particular mental disability. 23 And so what we are doing here is 24 taking a mentally ill individual and putting 25 that individual in a structure where that

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(518) 371-8910 1 illness will be treated, until such time as 2 those who are in a position to make that 3 judgment will decide that they're cured. 4 It makes abundant sense. Long 5 overdue, as several have already said. And so 6 it's certainly a great day and a landmark day 7 that we've finally reached this point in time 8 where this law will become part of the laws of 9 the State of New York and, as all our laws 10 previously in prior decades were, emulated 11 throughout the nation. State after state 12 began to do the same thing, which I think 13 benefits our entire society. 14 Thank you, Madam President. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 16 you, Senator Padavan. 17 Senator Diaz. Oh, I'm sorry, 18 Senator Diaz left the room. 19 Senator Wright. 20 SENATOR WRIGHT: Thank you, Madam 21 President. 22 I too want to join in commending 23 the sponsor for his efforts and the Governor 24 for bringing this together. 25 More importantly, I want to point

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(518) 371-8910 1 out that for each of the years I've been in 2 the Senate, I voted in favor of this bill. 3 And it is my intention to do so again this 4 afternoon. 5 But I would also point out that 6 there is a headline in the local newspaper 7 today pointing out that "Sex Offender Bill 8 Brings New Worries." And it spoke to the 9 situation in the city of Ogdensburg, which I 10 happen to represent. 11 And there are several concerns, 12 even as we have reached agreement, even as 13 this bill has expanded from four pages to 44 14 pages, that remain concerns for the citizens 15 of the host communities, those concerns being 16 two issues. 17 Number one, the issue of discharge 18 planning, what happens to the patients at the 19 end of their civil confinement. The host 20 community is looking for an assurance that 21 those individuals return to their community of 22 origin, that they return to their families, 23 that they return to their neighborhoods and 24 not remain in the neighborhoods of the 25 community of confinement.

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(518) 371-8910 1 I think that's only a reasonable 2 expectation, that they too enjoy the same 3 level of safety, having met their obligation 4 to serve the citizens of this state. 5 The second issue is relative to 6 security staffing levels. I fully recognize, 7 as does everyone, the focus of this 8 confinement is treatment. Yet at the same 9 time these individuals are not psychiatric 10 patients being committed to a psychiatric 11 facility, they are violent predators who have 12 completed their tenure on felony counts in a 13 criminal institution in one of our 14 correctional facilities. And as a result, I 15 believe that warrants the highest level of 16 training and security that we can provide 17 relative to the manpower involved in that 18 task. 19 I would hope that the new 20 administration will work with us and with our 21 community on those two issues, just as they 22 have worked with Senator Bruno bringing this 23 bill to the floor so that we can all vote to 24 protect the children and the citizens of this 25 state.

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(518) 371-8910 1 I will be voting aye, Madam 2 President. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 4 you, Senator Wright. 5 Senator Diaz. 6 SENATOR DIAZ: Thank you, Madam 7 President. On the bill. 8 Today we are dealing with this 9 piece of legislation, and I'm looking in the 10 legislative history of the bill. And I see 11 that for ten years a similar bill has passed 12 the Senate. In 1998, a bill, 7659, passed the 13 Senate, 59 to 1; Senator Leichter voted 14 against. In 1999, Senate Bill 5093 passed the 15 Senate 56 to 1, Senator Duane. 2000, Senate 16 Bill Number 5093 again passed the Senate. 17 Again, Senator Duane voted against. 2001, 18 Senate Bill 5385 passed the Senate 56 to 0. 19 2003, Senate Bill 5556 passed the Senate 59 to 20 2, Senator Duane and Montgomery. 2004, Senate 21 Bill 5556 passed the Senate 59 to 2, Senator 22 Duane and Montgomery. 2005, Senate Bill 3273 23 passed the Senate 58 to 2, Senator Duane and 24 Montgomery. 2006, Senate Bill 6325 passed the 25 Senate, Duane and Montgomery. 2006 again,

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(518) 371-8910 1 Senate Bill 7001 passed the Senate in 2 extraordinary session. In 2007, Senate Bill 3 650 passed the Senate 56 to 3, Duane, 4 Montgomery, and Perkins. 5 I'm saying this because this is a 6 bill that has passed the Senate, but today 7 we're facing one bill with different -- some 8 kind of different things that was included. 9 And this morning in the committee, Mental 10 Health Committee, which I am the ranking 11 minority member, I asked some questions. And 12 I would like -- you know, I still have some 13 concerns. 14 And I'm saying that because the 15 part of town that I represent, in the part of 16 town that I represent, things happen. Weird 17 things happen. Things that don't happen in 18 other parts of other towns. But in the part 19 of the town that I represent, in school, for 20 example, in school Hispanic children or 21 minority children are placed in something 22 called special education because a teacher or 23 a counselor thinks that they are mental -- 24 that they are dysfunctioning, that something's 25 is wrong with their mental.

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(518) 371-8910 1 And because sometimes we in the 2 Hispanic community we speak with our hands, we 3 have a high tone of voice, people think that 4 we are mentally retarded or mentally ill. And 5 there are so many children placed, so many 6 children placed in special education, their 7 life completely ruined because somebody 8 decided that that child has something wrong 9 with him or with her. 10 In this bill there are some things 11 that I still have some concern for. For 12 example, in this bill it says that once the 13 person comes out of jail and goes into a 14 parole office and has to report to the parole, 15 the parole office will -- the person will go 16 into an intensive -- what's the word, 17 intensive supervision. And during that time, 18 at any time the parole officer could decide 19 that that person has become dangerous and 20 could be sent back to a mental institution for 21 the rest of his -- maybe of his life. 22 So what I'm saying is, suppose that 23 that person, that parolee are not engraced 24 [sic] with the parole officer and that parole 25 officer decides that for whatever reason he

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(518) 371-8910 1 becomes dangerous to the society and has to be 2 placed in an institution? 3 And there is another question that 4 I have. It says that an individual, in 5 conjunction with an Article 10 proceeding, and 6 to testify at such proceeding and to provide 7 that such examiner receives compensation and 8 reimbursement for expenses. And also it says 9 that two, two doctors are allowed to testify 10 in the proceeding. 11 So what I'm saying is in the part 12 of town -- in my part of town, black and 13 Hispanic, especially Hispanic residents, even 14 the blacks in my community, we are subject to 15 different treatment, we are subject to 16 different conditions, we are subject to 17 different measures. 18 So suppose that a person that just 19 was accused by a woman of sexual -- because 20 there have been cases where a person has 21 sexual relations with a woman because they 22 used to go together and suddenly that woman 23 doesn't like that man anymore or that man 24 doesn't like that woman anymore, and then, you 25 know, he gets to be accused of sexual -- of

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(518) 371-8910 1 rape or whatever, and that person is placed 2 into one of these institutions for life or for 3 as long as someone decided that that person is 4 okay. 5 So, you know, I'm voting for this 6 bill, I am voting for the bill, but I have 7 some concerns on the bill. I have some 8 concerns. And I am afraid that members of the 9 minority community will be put to different 10 measurement. 11 And I hope that Senator Volker and 12 the people that are instituting, are 13 responsible for this bill takes into 14 consideration that we have to be sure, we have 15 to be specific, sure, definitely certain that 16 this bill doesn't fall into the wrong hands. 17 Because this bill could be used to put our 18 people in more jeopardy than what they are 19 already. 20 So those are my concerns, Madam 21 President. It's different in my part of town. 22 It's different. We are placed in two 23 different categories of definition because we 24 don't speak good English, they don't like us, 25 they don't like our mustache, they don't like

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(518) 371-8910 1 my papasso [ph] -- you know what papasso? 2 Papasso means the way I stroke my hair. 3 You know, so because they don't 4 like some -- you know, and then a parole 5 officer will have a tool here, a parole 6 officer will have a different tool here that 7 could be very dangerous to our people and our 8 community. 9 You might say, oh, no, no, we have 10 to protect the community, I am here to protect 11 the community. For what I'm here? To protect 12 the community, not the perpetrator. 13 I'm just saying this bill gives the 14 parole officer and other people such a power 15 to do whatever they want with our community 16 that I'm afraid that it might be used against 17 black and Hispanic, another tool to be used 18 against black and Hispanic. 19 Thank you, Madam Chair. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 21 you, Senator Diaz. 22 Senator Libous. 23 SENATOR LIBOUS: Thank you, Madam 24 President. 25 Twelve years this house has passed

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(518) 371-8910 1 legislation on civil confinement but did not 2 have a partner or companion in the other 3 house. Twelve years we've tried to protect 4 the children of our communities throughout 5 New York State but did not have a partner or 6 companion in the other house. 7 We were called back here in special 8 session by the Governor in December for the 9 purposes of coming to a compromise on civil 10 confinement, and we came back and the Senate 11 did what it did for the last 12 years -- it 12 passed a tough civil confinement bill -- and 13 the Assembly left town. 14 Early in January I had to go to a 15 local grade school and read to a class. It 16 was a fourth-grade class. And after I got 17 done, a parent came up to me and scolded me, 18 said: "Senator, why can't you folks in Albany 19 get your act together on protecting us from 20 sexual predators, protecting our children from 21 sexual predators? Why is it that you can't 22 get legislation together? What's the 23 problem?" 24 And I politely said to this woman 25 that, well, we didn't have a partner, that the

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(518) 371-8910 1 Senate passed it for 12 years, and we did it 2 again in December, but we did not have a 3 partner and the Assembly went home and did 4 nothing. 5 So today is a great day, Madam 6 President. Today is a great day because we 7 have legislation that once and for all will 8 protect our children. 9 And, you know, I wonder, looking at 10 these children that I read to that day, 11 wondering how many children we lost because we 12 couldn't come together or that the Assembly 13 decided to do nothing or just leave town, as 14 they did in December. How many children did 15 we lose in this state to sexual predators, 16 violent ones who should not have been put back 17 out on the street but should have been civilly 18 confined? 19 So today is a great day because we 20 are protecting our children, we are protecting 21 families. We are building families throughout 22 this state, and we are protecting them, as my 23 other colleague said, from the most violent of 24 individuals, sexual predators. 25 And as Senator Padavan said

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(518) 371-8910 1 earlier, there is no cure. I spent 12 years 2 as the chairman of the Mental Health and 3 Developmental Disabilities Committee. I've 4 spoken to experts in the field. And each time 5 they've shared with me that there is no cure. 6 There is treatment, and we can hope to stop 7 individuals from maybe the number of attacks, 8 but there is no cure. 9 So today is a great day. And I 10 want to applaud Senator Volker and certainly 11 his efforts and his hard work. Dale, thank 12 you for all the children of New York State, 13 and to Senator Bruno. 14 But I want to say thank you to the 15 Governor. Because, Governor, if you're 16 listening, I don't know what magic you have, 17 but you have brought the Assembly to the table 18 again to join us here in the Senate. And I 19 thank you for that, and so do the children of 20 this state. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 22 you, Senator Libous. 23 Senator Klein. 24 SENATOR KLEIN: Thank you, Madam 25 President.

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(518) 371-8910 1 I too want to thank Senator Volker 2 for his leadership on this issue for such a 3 long time. 4 And I agree with Senator Bruno, who 5 said our Governor, Governor Spitzer, provided, 6 I think, the leadership necessarily to finally 7 pass this legislation. 8 Last year I did an investigation 9 where I looked at over 50 zip codes which make 10 up the City of New York and Westchester 11 County. And what I found was, on average, 12 there's six Level 3 sexual predators living in 13 each of those zip codes, near our schools, 14 near daycare centers, near playgrounds. 15 And when I released it, it was on 16 some of the local TV shows, it was in 17 newspapers. And Governor Spitzer, then 18 Attorney General Spitzer, saw one of the 19 newsclips. He came over to me in an event up 20 here in Albany, and he said to me: "Now, let 21 me ask you a question. You seem to be very 22 actively involved in the whole issue of civil 23 confinement. Why is it that we haven't passed 24 a bill yet? Why hasn't anything happened?" 25 And very similar to the case of

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(518) 371-8910 1 Senator Libous talking to an outraged parent 2 in his district, I looked at him and I said, 3 "I can't really tell you the answer. I mean, 4 the Assembly finally passed a bill, the Senate 5 has been passing a bill for years." 6 Differences between the two bills 7 weren't all that different, but I guess we 8 needed a leader like Eliot Spitzer who goes 9 after an issue, talks about an issue, and 10 really takes the issue to the public. Because 11 when you talk to people in our respective 12 communities, they can't understand why a piece 13 of legislation like this just doesn't pass, it 14 just doesn't happen. 15 I also wanted to relay a hearing 16 that I held in the Bronxville community of my 17 district. And I know some of the stats were 18 already mentioned, and I know Senator Volker 19 knows them well. But when we're dealing with 20 a dangerous sexual predator, we're dealing 21 with someone who's like no other criminal. 22 First of all, they're four times 23 more likely to commit the same or similar 24 crime. It's the only type of criminal that 25 has a greater propensity to commit these

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(518) 371-8910 1 crimes as they get older and older. 2 I mean, if you rob banks for a 3 living, if you rob cars, you slow down with 4 age. These people actually have a greater 5 propensity to commit these crimes as they get 6 older and older. 7 I guess more on a very personal, 8 local level, I think many of you here heard of 9 the horrible case which took place in White 10 Plains in Westchester County, the murder of 11 Connie Russo. Connie Russo was a woman who 12 worked in a law firm for 15 years in downtown 13 White Plains, parked her car in the parking 14 lot of the Galleria Mall, which she did every 15 day for 15 years. One day she went into the 16 parking lot and was killed by Phillip Grant. 17 Unfortunately, Phillip Grant has 18 the dubious distinction, I believe, of being 19 the poster boy for civil confinement in New 20 York State. Phillip Grant was someone who 21 committed a horrible rape in the Bronx, served 22 25 years in prison, 23 years for rape. They 23 tacked on another two years because he tried 24 to kill someone with an ax while he was in 25 prison.

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(518) 371-8910 1 This is a man that was denied 2 parole nine times. Nine times. You know, the 3 Parole Board knew that this is not someone who 4 should once again rejoin society. Yet he was 5 released after serving a sentence, a very long 6 sentence under our rape laws in New York 7 State, and registered as he was required to do 8 under Megan's Law. As a matter of fact, he 9 reregistered as he was supposed to do every 10 90 days. 11 Yet he went into the Galleria Mall, 12 stole a knife, and killed the first person who 13 walked in the parking lot that day. And 14 that's Connie Russo. 15 Connie Russo's family, Jonathan and 16 Michael, have become very dear friends during 17 this whole process. They're two very brave 18 young men. They started a petition drive. 19 They testified at my hearing, they testified 20 at an Assembly hearing. They really didn't 21 want their mother's life to mean nothing. 22 They don't want her death to be in vain. They 23 want to pass a civil confinement law so this 24 doesn't happen to others. 25 Because I think the Phillip Grant

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(518) 371-8910 1 case not only illustrates the need for civil 2 confinement, but it also illustrates how what 3 we're doing now in our present laws just 4 aren't working. 5 I was a big supporter of Megan's 6 Law when I was an Assemblymember. I was one 7 of the original cosponsors of Senator Skelos's 8 bill. It was Dan Feldman's bill in the 9 Assembly. But I can tell you right now, 10 Megan's Law is no longer working. It's only a 11 Band-Aid approach. What we're doing is giving 12 people a false sense of hope that we're 13 releasing these dangerous sexual predators 14 onto the streets of our community and that the 15 local law enforcement is somehow going to let 16 the community know. 17 I'm not saying local law 18 enforcement doesn't do their job. But in a 19 place like New York City, they just don't have 20 the time to keep track of every Level 3 sexual 21 predator in their precinct. They don't have 22 the time to notify principals of schools or 23 our communities. And also, the law is not 24 mandatory, so they don't have to notify the 25 community.

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(518) 371-8910 1 We also see now, every day when we 2 open up a newspaper, laws throughout our state 3 attempting to be passed by localities, 4 villages, cities to ban sexual predators from 5 living anywhere in their communities near 6 schools, near daycare centers, in some cases 7 banning them from living in the city and 8 locality at all. 9 That's another Band-Aid approach. 10 That's not going to work. The City of Yonkers 11 attempted to pass one of these bills. I 12 believe they were successful. So what are we 13 going to do, have all the sexual predators 14 move from Yonkers to Mount Vernon or from 15 Yonkers to the Bronx? You know, that's not 16 the way we're supposed to do legislation in 17 this state. 18 So I think really the only answer 19 is a civil confinement law. I think we have a 20 duty to those we represent, a duty to 21 families, a duty to children, to make sure 22 that before someone is released on the streets 23 of our state that they're safe to do so. 24 So I vote in favor of this 25 legislation, Madam President.

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(518) 371-8910 1 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 2 you, Senator Klein. 3 Senator Nozzolio. 4 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Thank you, 5 Madam President. On the bill. 6 Madam President and my colleagues, 7 as chairman of this house's Crime Victims, 8 Crime and Corrections Committee, what we have 9 heard time and time again over these last 10 dozen years from countless witnesses in many, 11 many hearings in every corner of the state -- 12 including Maureen Kanka, the mother of Megan 13 Kanka, for whom Megan's Law is named -- time 14 and time again what we had heard was that once 15 a sex predator, always a sex predator. 16 And time and time again what we 17 heard from the victims of these crimes was 18 that these crimes certainly are the most 19 horrific, but they also carry scars that last 20 a lifetime. The emotional scars of those who 21 have been victimized by sex predators do not 22 heal. They do not go away. They are not 23 erased by time. They are there for the life 24 of the victim. That could be said of any 25 crime, but no crime scars as deeply as sex

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(518) 371-8910 1 predating. 2 That's why Senator Volker needs to 3 be thanked for his dogged persistence, year 4 after year, in promoting this legislation as a 5 way to prevent victims from happening in the 6 first place. Thank you, Senator. Thank you 7 for your leadership on this issue. Thank you 8 for your continued hard work. 9 My colleagues spoke eloquently on 10 this issue. You all know how important it is. 11 We cannot allow victims to be victimized 12 further. We cannot stand back while there are 13 laws that do not prevent victims from 14 occurring. That's why this law is so 15 important. This protection will help ensure 16 those objectives. 17 And for that, Madam President, I 18 fully support this measure and am honored to 19 be a cosponsor and am pleased this house will 20 be passing it in a very short period of time. 21 Thank you. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 23 you, Senator Nozzolio. 24 Senator Montgomery. 25 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Thank you,

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(518) 371-8910 1 Madam President. 2 I have some concerns on the bill. 3 I would like to speak on the bill. I have 4 some concerns about this legislation, but I 5 would like to preface my comments on the bill 6 with this. 7 This is page 3 of the New York 8 Post. I'm going to show it to everybody in 9 here, those of you who can stand to look at 10 this. This is page 3 of the New York Post. 11 And it's an article on something or other, 12 Tony Soprano and something something. And my 13 son and your children and all of the children 14 and the sex predators in the state have full 15 and complete access to this. This is the news 16 that is printed -- that is unfit to print, but 17 it's printed and it's available. 18 And that's not all. I turn on my 19 television at prime time and I see in the back 20 of a red van a couple making love, having sex, 21 as part of a sitcom. 22 So that's where we are with sex in 23 our city and in our nation. It is available 24 to everyone. I don't know how any person who 25 is a little bit sick -- even the well people

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(518) 371-8910 1 must have a difficult time when we see this 2 and we watch those kinds of programs where sex 3 is the topic of the story. 4 Now, Madam President, I do have 5 some problems with this legislation. And I 6 just want to start with the fact that we're 7 going to be spending a lot of money. This is 8 going to be very costly, in both capital to 9 retrofit the facilities -- apparently we're 10 going to need a lot of them -- and we're also 11 going to be spending mental health dollars. 12 The Governor has funding for 335 new OMH 13 employees for the purpose of managing these 14 sex offenders. So it's not going to be easy. 15 Now, I've heard a lot of people 16 say, oh, we're protecting the children. And I 17 agree. I applaud my colleagues who want to 18 put away pedophiles and any other violent sex 19 offenders. I think we should put them away. 20 However, the legislation does not 21 speak specifically to pedophiles. So I hope 22 everybody understands that. This is not a 23 pedophile bill. And in fact, there are a 24 number of areas that I'm not sure we intend to 25 be in here for purposes of this kind of

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(518) 371-8910 1 commitment, civil commitment, possibly for 2 life. 3 I.e., one sex offense that falls 4 under this legislation is a prostitution 5 offense as defined in Section 230.06. Now, 6 someone explained to me that that were the 7 johns. I'm not sure, something to do with 8 prostitution. That, it seems to me, goes 9 beyond what we actually intend. Although, you 10 know, I don't -- I'm not saying that I'm for 11 the pimps or the johns. But I'm just 12 wondering if we intended for this to cover 13 that. 14 It also includes burglary. I'm not 15 sure if this was intended. Arson, robbery and 16 et cetera. So there's a lot. 17 It expands the definition of sex 18 offense. And the way that it includes them, 19 it says if they are sexually motivated. How 20 that gets defined, when it gets defined, is a 21 question. But anything that you do as long as 22 it can be proven by the psychiatrists who are 23 going to be examining these sex predators that 24 whatever they did, whatever the charge under 25 the original charge under the original arrest,

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(518) 371-8910 1 whatever that was, if -- after the point when 2 they are being examined, if it's found to be 3 sexually motivated, then they fall under this 4 category. 5 So I think there are some very 6 serious issues. I associate myself with the 7 comments that Senator Diaz made. Obviously 8 any of these kinds of bills fall very, very 9 heavily on people in my district, especially 10 young people, especially young men of color. 11 So I always am very, very suspicious and 12 concerned about this legislation with such a 13 broad sweep of everything that we can think of 14 to possibly put into such a bill. 15 And I want to just point out that 16 there are some concerns about us rushing to 17 judgment. There was an editorial in the Times 18 Union that talks about the fact that -- how we 19 rush to judgment. 20 And I can't imagine -- all of the 21 testimony that I'm hearing today, I can just 22 imagine that I'm sitting here, I'm listening 23 and I'm wondering, although I don't think 24 anyone in this room was present and part of 25 that discussion, I can imagine that exact same

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(518) 371-8910 1 hallelujahs going on, people praising the 2 bill, the Rockefeller drug laws. Because we 3 were going to get all the drugs off the 4 street, we were going to clean up our 5 communities, we were going to do all of these 6 things. 7 And what did we end up doing? 8 Tripling the number of people in prison that 9 were incarcerated in those 30 years. And not 10 only did we triple, but who went in? People, 11 young men especially, of color. Black and 12 brown men. That's who I see when I go into 13 prison these days. 14 So I just am very cautious about 15 this. And I think we could take a lot more 16 time and think more carefully and not sweep in 17 everybody under this law. 18 Madam President, I have so many 19 questions I think I will continue to oppose 20 this legislation. Thank you. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 22 you, Senator. 23 Senator Marcellino. 24 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Thank you, 25 Madam President.

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(518) 371-8910 1 One of the prime responsibilities 2 of government is to protect those citizens 3 within its boundaries. To that end, I too 4 would like to stand up and add my voice to 5 those commending Senator Volker, Senator 6 Bruno, the Governor, and everyone else who had 7 a role in making this bill come to fruition. 8 I think it's an important piece of 9 legislation. 10 It may be a difficult vote for 11 some, and I can understand some of the 12 arguments presented. However, I too, like 13 probably many of you, have had the occasion to 14 speak to victims or family members of victims 15 of what some have described as sexual 16 predators. These are horrendous stories. 17 These are horrific stories. The victims never 18 get over it. They simply never get over it. 19 No matter what you do, no matter all the 20 counseling they go through, no matter all the 21 time that -- you know, the old saying "time 22 heals all wounds"? Well, it doesn't heal this 23 one. It's there, and it stays there. It only 24 gets worse. It festers. 25 To those individuals who by their

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(518) 371-8910 1 actions have demonstrated that they cannot 2 function in society without causing harm to 3 others, I think government has an obligation 4 to see that they are off the streets. 5 If they cannot be treated, if they 6 cannot be helped -- which we should try, which 7 when they're in confinement for one of their 8 crimes we should try to offer them and give 9 them and provide to them whatever medical or 10 mental treatment we can provide them with to 11 try to take this pattern of behavior out of 12 their system, if you will -- when that is 13 demonstrated that it cannot be done, then 14 society, as I said earlier, has no other 15 alternative but to take them off the streets. 16 This bill doesn't give anybody a 17 blanket commitment. It's reviewable. They 18 have access to the courts periodically. Their 19 case is looked at periodically. So that there 20 is always the appeal to whatever authority is 21 available to them. But I think we have, as I 22 said, no choice but to act here. 23 I agree with Senator Klein. 24 Megan's Law has problems. The issues of 25 government tracking these individuals is very

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(518) 371-8910 1 difficult, very expensive, time-consuming and 2 consuming of personnel. And these days people 3 just don't want to pay what has to be paid to 4 do that. We in government have no choice but 5 to make that decision for them and say, Look, 6 this is something you've got to do. If you 7 want these people off the streets and you want 8 them taken care of and you want them 9 monitored, then you have to pay the price. We 10 must put the money into the system so that we 11 can track these people and provide local 12 governments with the efforts and with the 13 wherewithal to do the job. 14 I'm almost a little bit nervous 15 about grouping them with the mentally ill, 16 because I don't think that's the case here. 17 I'm no expert, but most mental illnesses are 18 treatable in one form or another, in one 19 manner or another. This situation doesn't 20 seem -- this type of criminality does not seem 21 to be treatable, does not seem to respond to 22 almost any form of treatment that is out there 23 now that we know of now. 24 So until we find something that 25 works to protect society as a whole from these

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(518) 371-8910 1 individuals, as I've said earlier, that have 2 demonstrated by their actions that they are 3 incapable of functioning in society, then I 4 intend to vote aye on this legislation. And I 5 urge us all to do the same. 6 Thank you. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 8 you, Senator. 9 Senator Morahan. 10 SENATOR MORAHAN: Thank you, 11 Madam President. 12 First, I would like to also 13 congratulate Senator Volker to deal with all 14 the frustrations that you have had over the 15 years in trying to get to where we are today. 16 I want to congratulate our new 17 Governor and commend the former Governor for 18 trying to implement this policy, if you will, 19 outside of legislative action, which the 20 courts ruled it was our responsibility to come 21 to the table and get this done. 22 And I congratulate the Speaker in 23 the Assembly for coming to the table as well, 24 and all his members who support this 25 particular bill. And I think it will be

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(518) 371-8910 1 supported overwhelmingly in both houses. 2 It's important to realize, however, 3 that this is a first step. It's important to 4 realize, as Carl -- Senator Marcellino pointed 5 out, there's going to be money involved in 6 this bill. There's going to be money for 7 treatment, there's going to be an obligation 8 to build facilities. 9 Because there will not be, as long 10 as I'm chairman of the Mental Health Committee 11 in this house, any commingling of the criminal 12 sex offenders with our regular New York 13 population who suffers with mental diseases. 14 We cannot allow that. We cannot allow them to 15 become victims. 16 We'll also have to deal, as we go 17 through the coming months, with the staffing 18 of these facilities between the Corrections 19 Department and the Office of Mental Health. 20 And we can expect that that will be something 21 that will be difficult as we move forward. 22 So today we take the first step in 23 assuring the people of the State of New York 24 that their safety, the safety of their 25 teenagers and their children and our women and

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(518) 371-8910 1 our men, in some cases, are protected. That 2 we offer them the safety that society ought 3 to -- excuse me. Am I being signaled to here? 4 Okay, thank you. I am? Okay. 5 (Laughter.) 6 SENATOR MORAHAN: Really, now 7 that we've assured their safety, we have to be 8 mindful of our other obligations to make sure 9 the implementation of this legislation is done 10 in a meaningful way, one where we deal with 11 treatment of those sex offenders while they're 12 in doing their time in our Department of 13 Corrections, that we start to address the 14 issues of the SHU, special housing units 15 within our prison system, that we start to 16 address separation of patients from criminals. 17 Because what we're speaking of here 18 today is not a vast, vast number. We're 19 speaking about those violent sex offenders 20 that are deemed by a professional board to be 21 high-risk repeaters putting our people in 22 jeopardy. 23 So I commend, again, Senator Bruno, 24 Senator Volker, all of those who worked so 25 hard, even those on the other side of the

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(518) 371-8910 1 aisle that worked on the joint conference over 2 the last couple of years, to bring this day 3 here to the Senate. Again we vote for this 4 bill, but today we have the hope that it will 5 become law with the agreement of the Assembly 6 and the approval of our new Governor. 7 Thank you very much, Madam 8 President. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 10 you, Senator Morahan. 11 Senator Griffo. 12 SENATOR GRIFFO: Thank you, Madam 13 President. 14 It's imperative that we do 15 everything we can to protect society from 16 these unconscionable acts by these dangerous 17 people that prey upon our innocents. So this 18 legislation is not only important but 19 necessary. 20 And I also want to commend the 21 Governor and the leaders for their efforts and 22 specifically to thank Senator Volker for his 23 persistence and his leadership throughout this 24 period to recognize how this problem had to be 25 dealt with.

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(518) 371-8910 1 Because many communities, as you've 2 heard today, across the state are already 3 beginning to take action. So it's very 4 appropriate that this state take the lead to 5 develop a policy such as civil confinement so 6 that we can show the communities across this 7 state that we're serious about tackling this 8 issue. 9 But I also want to echo what 10 Senator Wright indicated earlier, that as we 11 begin to place these individuals in facilities 12 that we're mindful of a number of things, 13 particularly the level of security. Because 14 its important to know that these individuals 15 are coming from correctional facilities. 16 And they will be interacting with 17 staff, and it is important that we ensure -- 18 and I hope the executive branch will look at 19 this very carefully -- that the appropriate 20 level of staffing and the appropriate 21 individuals are assigned for security purposes 22 to ensure that there's no problem. Because 23 while we're protecting our community, we owe 24 it to the people who work for this state to 25 protect them also.

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(518) 371-8910 1 So I'm very hopeful that the 2 Executive will approach this not only looking 3 at money but looking at what is necessary to 4 have the utmost and the highest level of 5 security in these facilities. 6 Beyond that, the Department of 7 Correctional Services has a model and a 8 policy, when individuals are released, that 9 they are returned to their point of origin. 10 As Senator Wright said, this is something that 11 we need to look at and should be incorporated. 12 Because many host communities where these 13 facilities are located need and require that 14 we have action that will not just dump these 15 individuals, upon completion of their 16 treatment, into these host communities. So I 17 think this is something that needs to be 18 looked at administratively or legislatively. 19 And also, we should be in continued 20 communication with these host communities to 21 ensure that we are not burdening them with any 22 additional expense or concerns that they may 23 have. So we should interact and communicate, 24 because they are playing a role in helping all 25 of us deal with a very important problem.

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(518) 371-8910 1 So I believe this is significant, 2 and I support it. 3 Thank you, Madam President. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 5 you, Senator Griffo. 6 Senator Farley. 7 SENATOR FARLEY: Thank you, Madam 8 President. 9 I'm going to be brief because I 10 understand there's 11 more speakers. And 11 consequently, I think we ought to get this 12 over with. 13 And Senator Dale "Relentless" 14 Volker, I'm proud of you. He's like a dog on 15 your pants leg; he won't let go until he gets 16 that issue solved. 17 You know, we're criticized for 18 doing one-house bills around here. This is an 19 example of a one-house bill that has become 20 law. And I support and congratulate my 21 colleagues on the other side of the aisle, 22 because you've also supported this 23 overwhelmingly. 24 It is an important piece of 25 legislation. If this is a hot-button issue

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(518) 371-8910 1 for all parents, it's really the issue that 2 they say "Why can't you get it done?" And I 3 try to say we do it in the Senate, but that 4 doesn't mean anything to the general public. 5 It's going to happen. It's going 6 to happen because of the people that put it 7 together, our new Governor and Senator Bruno 8 and so forth. And all the people that worked 9 so hard on this, I congratulate them, because 10 this is an issue has must be resolved. 11 And I support the bill. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 13 you, Senator. 14 Senator Liz Krueger. 15 SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you, 16 Madam President. 17 I'm also -- I have dilemmas with 18 this bill, I will tell you that. Twelve years 19 is what I heard people say, that we spent 20 12 years working only a version of the bill 21 here in the Senate. But it's not the version 22 we're passing today. 23 And so while people are thanking 24 everyone, I will thank Governor Spitzer for 25 getting us to a point where we've got a bill

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(518) 371-8910 1 that most of us can be at least comfortable 2 enough to vote for. 3 I also thank the Assembly for 4 frankly holding out and saying, with all due 5 respect, the bill that the Senate was pushing 6 for all these years wasn't the right bill 7 because it didn't provide for enough due 8 process and protection to ensure that we 9 didn't end up in a situation where we were 10 exploiting our mental health system to lock 11 people away forever without fair review and 12 due process. 13 But I'm also mindful of my 14 colleague Senator Diaz's point earlier today 15 when he spoke, that we do have a system of 16 racial injustice that we have seen in our 17 court system over and over again. And for the 18 same reasons that we have documented that the 19 death penalty has been applied unfairly and 20 with racial prejudice throughout this country, 21 that I have concerns that we have to make sure 22 that, as this bill becomes law and regulations 23 are written, that we make sure and that we are 24 doubly careful in due process to prevent any 25 risk of racial prejudice impacting who this

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(518) 371-8910 1 law applies to over time. 2 But I also will tell you that I met 3 with experts in this field, psychiatrists who 4 work in the field of sexually violent 5 criminals, who reminded me -- and I want to 6 say it, because these words get thrown around 7 on this floor too quickly -- that not all 8 rapists are mentally ill. They would argue 9 only a small percentage of people who are 10 sexual predators are in fact mentally ill and 11 therefore potentially treatable. 12 They would argue, and they did to 13 me, that many of these people should simply go 14 to jail for life without parole and not be 15 costing us enormous amounts of money in the 16 mental health system which will then be taken 17 away from other people who could be treated. 18 That some of these people are literally 19 sociopathic, dangerous people that we should 20 make sure are not in a situation where they 21 may be doing harm to other mentally ill people 22 in a mental health system. 23 They also highlight that we are 24 defining in this law something called mental 25 abnormality. And we are saying, through the

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(518) 371-8910 1 definition we're using here, that people who 2 are defined as mentally abnormal can be 3 civilly committed. But psychiatrists will 4 tell you they don't have that definition, not 5 till we put it into law today. 6 So I'm very concerned that as we in 7 fact, I believe, pass this law in both houses 8 and get it signed by the Governor, that it is 9 critical for us to have a better understanding 10 and to work with both the mental health 11 community, the community of experts in 12 healthcare, in prison structure, and in due 13 process through the court system to make sure 14 when we're defining people under a law, such a 15 definition actually exists, makes sense, and 16 can be applied. 17 Because I do believe that a vast 18 improvement in this bill over the previous 19 bills that came through this house for the 20 last 12 years, is, I suspect, many fewer 21 people will end up in civil confinement than 22 under the previous versions. 23 I think there will be greater 24 protections for our communities because we're 25 increasing the length of time we can put you

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(518) 371-8910 1 in prison for for sexually violent crimes. 2 Because, again, Senator Bruno, I believe, 3 talked about let's not coddle people. I have 4 absolutely no interest in coddling sexual 5 predators. And again, in fact, for the vast 6 majority of them who are not defined or 7 definable as mentally ill or mentally 8 abnormal, I am perfectly happy to see them go 9 into our prison system for extended periods of 10 time. 11 But I also think that we have to be 12 very, very careful, when implementing this 13 law, to recognize we're going into territory 14 that, as we see from other states' research, 15 isn't necessarily the outcomes they expected. 16 I think the lesson for us here in 17 New York is not to make the mistakes other 18 states have been making, to continue to ask 19 the questions and evaluate how we go forward 20 once this law is implemented, and to make sure 21 we've got our definitions clear so that people 22 who in fact can be helped with treatment are 23 offered that treatment. 24 That people who can't be, because 25 if it's the wrong definition of what their

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(518) 371-8910 1 problem is, are not using up hundreds of 2 millions of dollars of our resources that will 3 then likely come out of other mental health 4 care services; and to remember that 5 99.9 percent of people with mental illness are 6 not violent predators and that it's very 7 important that we're not lumping everyone 8 together. 9 And also to recognize that this 10 issue affects everyone and everyone's 11 community. So to try to simply state that 12 somebody from one part of the state or one 13 party has a different position on wanting to 14 protect the people in their community than 15 someone from a different part of the state or 16 from a different party is truly something we 17 need to steer away from, because of course 18 these kinds of crimes can affect anyone at any 19 time. There are no socioeconomic lines, there 20 are no race lines, there are no gender lines. 21 And we have to make sure that we 22 are legislating both in the best interests of 23 all of our constituents but also with an eye 24 to make making sure that we are 25 double-protecting due process in our system,

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(518) 371-8910 1 because we don't want to have to explain to 2 our constituents that after 12 years, when we 3 finally came to an agreement even on an 4 imperfect bill, that we had not thought these 5 issues through very, very carefully. 6 But I will be voting yes on this 7 bill despite my concerns. 8 Thank you, Madam President. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 10 you, Senator Krueger. 11 Senator Young. 12 SENATOR YOUNG: Thank you, Madam 13 President. 14 First of all, I want to sincerely 15 thank my colleague Dale Volker for his 16 diligence. I know he's worked on this issue 17 for close to 17 years. 18 But I also want to commend Governor 19 Spitzer for his leadership in making sure that 20 this crucial piece of legislation is getting 21 passed. And I'm so proud to stand in support 22 of civil confinement. 23 You know, if you go through the 24 court records in New York State, you can come 25 upon case after case after case of situations

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(518) 371-8910 1 where sexually violent predators were 2 apprehended, went to jail, got out and 3 repeated their behavior. 4 And one very notorious case just 5 comes to my mind, and that is of Arthur 6 Shawcross, who killed a 10-year-old boy, 7 sexually molested him after he was dead, and 8 an 8-year-old girl in Watertown several years 9 ago. After he was caught, he went to prison. 10 And after he served his sentence, he was 11 released. He moved to Rochester and proceeded 12 to become a serial killer. He raped, 13 tortured, and killed 11 women before he was 14 caught. 15 That's in New York State. That's 16 in New York State. And we have other cases 17 that are similar. 18 But there's a very poignant case 19 going on right now in this country in the 20 state of Florida, and that's the trial of John 21 Couey, who killed little Jessica Lunsford. He 22 kidnapped her from her own bedroom, he raped 23 her, and he buried her alive in a black 24 plastic garbage bag behind his house after the 25 police came and visited to see whether Jessica

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(518) 371-8910 1 was there. 2 And one of the things that stands 3 out to me is the fact that Jessica's father 4 was here to meet with the Senate about a year 5 or so ago when we were considering Jessica's 6 Law to upgrade our laws on dealing with sexual 7 predators. And he held a press conference 8 with us. And he said -- it was the day after 9 Father's Day, and he said: "I spent Father's 10 Day in a motel room, look at Jessica's picture 11 and crying." 12 No father should have to spend 13 Father's Day like that. This legislation is 14 going to help us avoid those situations. And 15 maybe if they had had civil confinement in 16 Florida, maybe Jessica would be alive today. 17 These are all things that we need 18 to consider. We have a moral obligation as 19 legislators to protect the public, to protect 20 children, to protect 89-year-old ladies who 21 might be raped. We need to do that. This 22 legislation does that. And I commend everyone 23 who made it happen. 24 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 25 you, Senator Young.

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(518) 371-8910 1 Senator Parker. 2 SENATOR PARKER: Thank you, Madam 3 President. On the bill. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Yes, on 5 the bill. 6 SENATOR PARKER: First let me 7 just congratulate the Governor and the members 8 of house, Senator Volker and others, Senator 9 Duane, who I know represented us on the 10 conference committee in the past. 11 I've voted for this bill in the 12 past, understanding it to be a one-house bill 13 and really, essentially, taking a coward's way 14 out. Because I didn't want to take flack for 15 looking like I was protecting sexual 16 predators. And I no longer can hide behind 17 the veil of a one-house bill. 18 There's a professor at the Kennedy 19 School for Government named Martin Linsky, and 20 he wrote a book called "Leadership on the 21 Line." And what Dr. Linsky says in 22 "Leadership on the Line" is that nobody is a 23 leader, you just have moments in which you're 24 exhibiting leadership. 25 The second thing that he says

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(518) 371-8910 1 that's profound in the book is that leadership 2 by definition is dangerous, that in fact when 3 you're just doing what everybody wants you to 4 do, you're not in fact providing leadership, 5 you're just servicing people. 6 I came in here prepared to service 7 the forces that be that I thought would want 8 me to vote for this bill, despite the fact 9 that I know this is not the right bill to do. 10 And not because, Senator Volker, I am looking 11 to, you know, protect -- this is not -- I'm 12 not in defense of the indefensible. I'm not 13 interested at all in protecting sexual 14 predators, pedophiles or otherwise. But this 15 bill is not the way to do it. 16 And particularly, we spend a lot of 17 time when we talk about crime and criminal 18 justice and our conceptions of seeing white 19 victim/black criminal. Whether people want to 20 admit that or not. Nobody enlightened in 21 here, I mean, but other people. But the 22 reality is that most of the crime that happens 23 in our communities happens intraracially. So 24 that, you know, black crimes happen amongst 25 blacks, white crime happens amongst whites.

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(518) 371-8910 1 But when we look at the fact that 2 only about 16 percent of the population of 3 New York State is African-American male, but 4 40 percent of the jailed population is 5 African-American male, it makes me then have 6 to look at bills like this when they come up. 7 That in fact, since I've been here, 8 almost five years, all we ever do is raise 9 penalties. And we never, ever get to the 10 point of actually treating people. 11 Now, certainly we want to protect 12 our communities. Nobody is more committed to 13 that than I am. Trust me when I tell you. 14 And you talk to the commanders of the 70th 15 Precinct, the 63rd, the 67th, the 79th, the 16 66th, which cover my district, and they'll 17 tell you my biggest complaint is I don't get 18 enough police protection. 19 I have the 70th Precinct in my 20 district, and it's the largest command in the 21 City of New York. And we're still about fifty 22 cops less than we were the morning of 9/11. 23 We want to do something to stop 24 crime, let's pass a bill to increase monies 25 for more police officers. Let's raise the

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(518) 371-8910 1 salaries of police officers. There's been a 2 big thing in the City of New York about the 3 fact that new police officers are only making 4 25 grand, we can't keep them on the force, 5 they're moving over to the Fire Department and 6 leaving and taking other jobs. Let's give 7 them more money. And let's put more cops on 8 the street. 9 As I said when we had a debate 10 around raising penalties for selling drugs 11 near a school, if you want to stop people from 12 selling drugs near a school, post a cop. 13 Don't raise penalties, because we know that 14 raising penalties does not work. 15 I want to protect the people in my 16 community, and particularly the children. And 17 I'm glad so many people here want to protect 18 the children in my community, because I'm 19 hoping that you're going to vote for CFE this 20 year, finally. While we talk about raising 21 penalties, nobody's interested in protecting 22 my children when it's talking about giving 23 more money for their schools. 24 We have not put any significant 25 money in youth services, youth development or

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(518) 371-8910 1 youth leadership in this state in over ten 2 years. Probably longer. Where's the money 3 for youth programs? We've gotten rid of 4 music, art and dance and athletics as regular 5 parts of the curriculum. We have no money 6 coming out of -- the Department of Youth 7 Services is gone, so there's no money going to 8 community organizations to in fact do stuff 9 with our young people after school. 10 The PSAL, which is run by Alan 11 Arbuse, who used to be my football coach when 12 I played football at Midwood High School, is 13 coming to me every week because he's like, We 14 need to get more money. 15 Where's our opportunity to help our 16 young people on that end? And in fact, as we 17 look at how do we in fact stop sexual 18 predators, let's stop them into the future. 19 Let's stop a sexual predator today by in fact 20 doing programming around our families and our 21 children today. Because these sexual 22 predators are not just growing off trees. 23 We're growing them in our communities. 24 And we're growing them in our 25 communities because we are not properly

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(518) 371-8910 1 providing programs for young people and for 2 families. We're not providing proper economic 3 opportunity, we're not providing proper mental 4 health services in our communities as 5 inpatient services. Let's do some of that. 6 And if we did some of that some of 7 the time, I think, Madam President, when we in 8 fact have bills like this that I'd feel easier 9 in fact voting for these bills. But every 10 time these bills come up, we want to raise 11 penalties, we want to keep people in prison 12 for more time. But we never get to the point 13 of actually doing -- and everybody admits, 14 yeah, we need to put more money in for 15 programs, you're right. You're right. Next 16 time. 17 And they said that to me in 2003, 18 and they said that in 2004, they said it in 19 2005. 2006, I heard the same thing. But now, 20 in 2007, I have still have not seen one bill 21 that in fact does any of these things. 22 Thank God, I think, that the 23 Governor is looking like he's going to take 24 care of CFE in the budget this year, so that's 25 a good thing. And I'm going to give him

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(518) 371-8910 1 credit for that. 2 And I know where everybody's coming 3 from. Be clear, this is not about protecting 4 sexual predators. I want them off the streets 5 and away from anybody as well as anybody else. 6 Actually, on my way here I was just told that 7 a young lady in my community was raped by her 8 supervisor. At a psychiatric center, if that 9 makes any sense. I mean, this is real to me. 10 So I'm with you when we say we need to do it. 11 I'm not clear that this bill in 12 fact takes us where we want to go. This looks 13 more like, you know, more economic development 14 for upstate to me, and more of what we see in 15 the prison industrial complex. 16 And Senator Liz Krueger alluded to 17 this, but let me expound on this. That she 18 says she's concerned about the administration 19 of justice. Let me be clear. Because I'm 20 going to make it plain for you so nobody will 21 walk out of here thinking that they weren't 22 sure about what Senator Parker said. That in 23 fact the way that police, the way that judges 24 and the way that other law enforcement 25 officials act in our communities is counter

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(518) 371-8910 1 what you see. 2 There are a lot of racist people 3 out there, and they pick up blacks and Latinos 4 because they feel that they can. And they get 5 away with it. And that's why you see the vast 6 numbers in the disparities between blacks and 7 Latinos and whites as relates to incarceration 8 rates for things across the board. That's 9 absolutely true. 10 And we know -- like let's look at 11 the Rockefeller drug law, which we in fact 12 have had to deal with recently. When we did 13 that, everyone said this is going to end 14 drugs. And you want to tell me that when we 15 look at the disparities between blacks and 16 whites as relates to people who are affected 17 by the Rockefeller drug law, you're saying 18 that many more black people are using drugs 19 and selling drugs than whites in this state? 20 Come on. You all couldn't possibly believe 21 that. I certainly don't believe it. 22 And we had to come back and redo 23 that law and not fully. In fact, I voted 24 against, you know, the sentencing reform -- it 25 wasn't the Rockefeller drug law, the

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(518) 371-8910 1 sentencing reform that we did at that time, 2 because that didn't go far enough. 3 And just like we've had to go back 4 and revisit that because we had not had the 5 intended policy outcome in terms of results in 6 our communities, we're going to have to come 7 back to this in 10 or 15 years exactly for the 8 same reason. And the same way that we are now 9 looking at the death penalty. Why? Because 10 we have gotten no good response from the death 11 penalty. 12 So we talk about, Madam President, 13 we talk about, you know, confining people and, 14 you know, talk about have the death penalty 15 and people will be afraid of being killed and 16 so they're going to do the right thing all of 17 a sudden. And the reality is, it doesn't 18 happen. It hasn't happened in all the states 19 that had the death penalty, and it didn't 20 change the murder rate in this state 21 significantly. 22 So we do the same thing -- you 23 know, the definition of insanity, if we talk 24 about mental health, is to do the same thing 25 over and over and expect a different result.

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(518) 371-8910 1 This bill is too broad. It's way 2 too broad. I could vote for this bill if it 3 was more specific and I was clear that we were 4 just targeting sexual predators and 5 pedophiles. But the reality is that this bill 6 doesn't do what we need it to do. 7 And I know I'm going to take a hit 8 for doing this. When I voted against the 9 Nixzmary law, you know, I took a hit for that 10 too. And the reality is voting no on this 11 bill is the right thing to do, particularly 12 for people who represent large black and 13 Latino populations. Because this is going to 14 insurmountably hurt your communities more than 15 any other community here. 16 Because the numbers of people -- 17 and I disagree with -- very, very respectfully 18 to the Majority Leader, I disagree that we 19 ought to be erring on the side of putting 20 innocent people in jail. I want to protect 21 young children. I want to protect people from 22 sexual violence as much as anybody in here. 23 But the reality is we have a whole government 24 that is predicated on the idea of protecting 25 individual rights, that is based on -- and a

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(518) 371-8910 1 justice system that says better a hundred 2 guilty people go free than one innocent man go 3 to jail. 4 And that's not what we're doing 5 here. We're doing just the opposite. We're 6 saying put a hundred innocent people in jail 7 just so we make sure that we get the one 8 guilty person. And I cannot vote for a bill 9 that does that. And for a system that I know, 10 standing here today, is going to do it. 11 I can't understand why we 12 haven't -- you know, we all know what it's 13 going to do. But we know what the police do. 14 The Attorney General is telling us now what 15 the police do in terms of stops and frisks. 16 Imagine what they're going to do with this. 17 We need to protect our communities, 18 and we certainly need to protect them from 19 sexual predators, but this is not the way to 20 do it. Raising penalties does not work in 21 terms of providing the kind of protection in 22 our community that we need to. 23 We need more police officers. We 24 need better police work. We need to give them 25 the equipment that they need and the

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(518) 371-8910 1 technology and the information technology that 2 they need, the training that they need so they 3 can protect our communities. But this bill 4 doesn't do it. 5 And even civil confinement -- 6 again, I'm not against the idea of civil 7 confinement. But we simply need to do it in a 8 way that is not overarching and sweeping. 9 Because the reality of this in terms of how 10 it's going to be applied is that once somebody 11 is in this system, they are never going to get 12 out. And everybody can blow smoke as much as 13 they want about all the protections and the 14 access to the courts and all the safeguards 15 and constitutional rights that we're 16 protecting. And the reality is no one ever 17 going to get out. Ever. 18 Because just like I have some 19 trepidations about voting no against a bill 20 that I know is bad, although good-intentioned, 21 there are going to be people who sit on those 22 boards, there's going to be judges who oversee 23 them, there's going to be parole officers who 24 are feeling a significant amount of pressure 25 not to let anybody out who's ever been

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(518) 371-8910 1 convicted. 2 And as we know, convictions, you 3 know, are not prayer books, as my grandmother 4 says. You know, no judge in the state his 5 mouth is a prayer book. And so, you know, 6 there's going to be mistakes made, there's 7 going to be people who, you know, are 8 prejudiced for whatever reason or -- none of 9 our judges, but other people's judges. Other 10 cops. Not the cops in your municipality, 11 because I know there are no racist cops in 12 none of our municipalities, but in other 13 people's municipalities, those racist cops are 14 going to be picking people up and charging 15 people. 16 And, you know, African-Americans 17 and Latinos who don't have the money to have 18 the proper representation are going to be 19 shuttled through a system that is going to put 20 them under civil confinement, and they are 21 never going to get out. Ever. I don't care 22 how much money you throw into the Innocence 23 Project and other things, there are people who 24 are never going to get out. And for me, that 25 is too much of a burden for me not to take

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(518) 371-8910 1 leadership on. 2 And if you want to be a leader, a 3 real leader in this state, you vote no on this 4 bill. Let's bring it back. Let's rework it. 5 We can do civil confinement in this state and 6 I'd vote for it, but it can't be this bill, 7 because it can't be this overarching, it can't 8 be this broad. And it needs to be specific 9 and it needs to have some real outcomes. 10 And we need to then revisit how, in 11 fact, justice is administered in this state. 12 Because that's the real danger that we have 13 here, and that's the thing that I'm most 14 afraid of. 15 Thank you, Madam President. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 17 you. 18 Senator Huntley. 19 SENATOR HUNTLEY: Yes, Madam 20 President. 21 First of all, let me just commend 22 Senator Parker for his words. I had frankly 23 planned to vote no for the bill, but after 24 listening to him I really realize deep down 25 all the things that he said would be the

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(518) 371-8910 1 things that would affect my community. 2 Sex offenders in my community. 3 When I was president of the school board many 4 years ago, before I came here, I was one of 5 the presidents who searched out dollars so 6 that we could notify all the schools in the 7 areas about sexual predators. 8 But this bill is not about sexual 9 predators. This bill tells me when I look -- 10 I want to know "sexually motivated" -- a bank 11 robber can be sexually motivated if the people 12 running this, the correction officers, whoever 13 they are, decide that that person is. 14 It's a broad bill. I could not 15 support something that is going to affect the 16 community where I live when, as Senator Parker 17 said, you're basically suspect by being 18 Afro-American. I would not add to that -- 19 there's enough difficulty proving that 20 everyone of African-American descent is not a 21 criminal, as I stand here to tell you that. 22 So I would support a bill if it was 23 about pedophiles, but this is not a bill about 24 pedophilia. This is a bill about people going 25 to jail, being confined, lost in the system,

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(518) 371-8910 1 never getting out. And I could almost at this 2 point guarantee -- in fact, I am so sure I 3 would bet my life that most of them would be 4 my people. 5 So I could never support this. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 7 you, Senator. 8 Senator Adams. 9 SENATOR ADAMS: You know, I've 10 changed my mind and my opinion about the 11 process, in this Senate, of debate. Because I 12 sat here a few moments ago and was voting one 13 way, and then I changed my way of voting 14 because we have opened the opportunity to 15 debate. 16 I met a person who was violated. 17 They were violated, and the scar remained with 18 them. And often we talk about this scar and 19 we romanticize what it does to the individual, 20 but it actually violates and scars the entire 21 family. This person has a scar that will be 22 with them for the rest of their life. Their 23 entire existence was violated. 24 His name was Alan Newton, a young 25 man arrested and charged with a crime that he

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(518) 371-8910 1 never committed. Spent his entire adult life 2 in jail. He was raped of his childhood. He 3 was raped of his ability to raise a family. 4 He was raped. That's who I thought about when 5 I heard my colleague Kevin Parker speak. 6 The law enforcement side of me made 7 me think about the days in Brooklyn Hospital, 8 Kings County Hospital, and so many other 9 hospitals when I saw women with torn clothing, 10 I saw women who were violated by men with 11 their sick minds. So many times I knocked on 12 doors and spoke to parents, telling them that 13 their sons or daughters, babies, were in 14 hospital because they were preyed on by some 15 sick mind. Some sick mind. 16 So truly I know the spirit and 17 heart of my colleague when he presents this 18 bill, because there's something different from 19 those of us who knocked on the doors and wore 20 blue uniforms, only to wear blue suits here. 21 But our desires are the same. We want to 22 protect our children. 23 But the protection of our children 24 don't only end with the violation of those who 25 are sexually preyed on, but the violation of

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(518) 371-8910 1 countless numbers of men and women, 2 particularly who have the skin pigmentation of 3 mine, that are violated by a criminal justice 4 system, that no longer believe justice is 5 blind. I viewed it not only as a man who was 6 arrested as a child, but I also viewed it as a 7 man who rose through the police department as 8 a captain to supervise how we treat people in 9 this state. 10 So my desire is real. I think a 11 person who commits a predatory crime should be 12 locked up and throw away the key. There's no 13 one on either side of this aisle that's more 14 conservative than I am when it comes to people 15 who commit predatory crimes against the people 16 of this state. But it's also a crime what we 17 did to Alan Newton. It's also a crime what we 18 have done historically in this great country 19 of ours of incarcerating people of color. 20 So I agree with my colleague. You 21 changed my mind. You made me realize that I 22 cannot do what is popular, I've got to do what 23 is right. What is right. And if I make the 24 mistake of doing what is popular, then one of 25 my four brothers or my neighbor or my uncle or

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(518) 371-8910 1 my cousin will fall victim to this action. 2 We need a bill that is right, not a 3 bill that feels right. We need a bill that 4 will protect our children from Rochester all 5 the way down to Ralph Avenue. We need a bill 6 that will make sure that people who can no 7 longer exist in our society could not prey on 8 our innocent family members. But it cannot 9 take away those who can exist in our society 10 and are falsely and wrongly accused. 11 So yes, it takes a lot to go back 12 to Park Slope and Bed-Sty and Brownsville and 13 East New York and Crown Heights and tell them 14 that I voted against this bill. Because it's 15 much easier to say that I voted for this bill. 16 But when you look through it and 17 read through it, page by page, they robbed 18 Volker of his desire to deal with the issues 19 of sick predators on our families. They 20 robbed him of that. They took all the years 21 of his experience and desire and commitment, 22 and they put their own will in this. 23 We need to return back to his 24 original spirit, protecting our children. 25 There's no short road. I believe that we

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(518) 371-8910 1 started a process where the boat of concern 2 has left the shores that surround the island 3 of prosperity. We must blow it back on course 4 to ensure everyone is protected. 5 So I will be voting against this 6 bill. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 8 you. 9 Senator Schneiderman. 10 SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Thank you. 11 Madam President, if the sponsor 12 would yield for a few very brief questions. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 14 you. 15 Senator Volker, do you yield? 16 SENATOR VOLKER: I certainly do. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 18 you. The Senator yields. 19 SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Thank you. 20 And I am going to try and expedite 21 the process by proceeding on cross. No, 22 actually, I'm expediting the process because 23 I've gone over this with Senator Volker 24 beforehand. 25 On page 3, where it defines the

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(518) 371-8910 1 offenses that are listed as designated 2 felonies, that includes nonviolent as well as 3 violent crimes, does it not? 4 SENATOR VOLKER: Yeah. In 5 certain cases it could do that, that's true. 6 SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: And on 7 page 4 there's a definition of what's called 8 related offenses, which includes any offenses 9 that are prosecuted as part of the same 10 criminal action. 11 SENATOR VOLKER: That's true. 12 SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: And that 13 refers to the fact that some people can be 14 labeled as designated felons and dangerous sex 15 offenders even if they were not actually 16 convicted of a sex offense; is that correct? 17 SENATOR VOLKER: That's true. 18 And I think you know how that would be. And 19 the problem here is I don't think people 20 realize the difficulty in proving those kinds 21 of things. 22 And there's more protections in 23 this bill, by the way, than any bill I've ever 24 been involved in. I'm not exactly sure what 25 my compatriots from New York City were talking

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(518) 371-8910 1 about. But as you know, there's up and down 2 in this bill. 3 The chances, by the way, of racism 4 involved in mental health is so slim that I've 5 never heard an argument -- I just have to say 6 this -- and an allegation of pedophiles and 7 racism. This is the first time I've ever 8 heard that argument, I just have to say it. 9 I'm sorry, Senator. 10 SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: No, that's 11 okay. I can't move to strike the last part, 12 because we're here in open debate, so 13 that's -- 14 SENATOR VOLKER: We are. We are. 15 SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: But 16 finally -- or not finally, one more to go. 17 Page 3, at the bottom of page 3, line 41, and 18 the bottom of page 8, line 45, it clearly 19 states that a detained sex offender may be 20 someone who is in prison but it also may be 21 someone who is committed having been found not 22 guilty by reason of a mental disease or a 23 person who was determined to be incapable of 24 standing trial, so that the trial never went 25 to a verdict on the underlying offense.

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(518) 371-8910 1 Is that not correct? 2 SENATOR VOLKER: That's true. 3 Because you're talking about, here, a mental 4 health statute. And let's not forget that 5 some of the people involved in these cases are 6 people that have in effect a mental disease. 7 Some of them may well have been found not 8 guilty by reason of a mental disease. 9 But if they're pedophiles, and if 10 there's evidence of it, they need assistance. 11 And the way you get assistance is to come 12 under either the bill as far as a civil 13 confinement or the case could be intensive 14 supervision. 15 SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Thank you. 16 And finally, last question, at page 17 12 and 13 of the bill there are the provisions 18 defining the annual examinations and the 19 petitions for discharge. And at line 55 and 20 56 of page 12 it makes it clear that the 21 evaluation that's conducted annually will be 22 in the Supreme or County Court where the 23 respondent is incarcerated; is that not 24 correct? 25 SENATOR VOLKER: That's true.

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(518) 371-8910 1 SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Okay. I'd 2 like to thank the sponsor for his answers, 3 Madam President, and be heard on the bill. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: On the 5 bill, Senator Schneiderman. 6 SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: I feel a 7 little bit as though I just was laying a 8 foundation after the summations which we've 9 heard from the gentlemen who on this occasion, 10 I must say, sit to my left, which is unusual 11 for me, Senators Adams and Parker, and raised 12 by Senators Diaz and Krueger and others. 13 Whether you're voting for or 14 against this bill, which is a very difficult 15 decision, I think it's important for us to 16 recognize something. This is, as Senator 17 Volker said, a change of epic proportions. 18 And when you're making a change of epic 19 proportions, you certainly have to be careful. 20 Now, this particular version of the 21 bill I gather went into print on Friday. I 22 didn't see it until today. And I would like 23 to have had a little more time to look at it. 24 Because what I'm concluding, based on my 25 review today, is the following. That in an

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(518) 371-8910 1 effort to catch every possible sexual 2 predator, we have cast an extraordinarily 3 broad net. We have defined, we have defined 4 sex offense to include lots of offenses that 5 don't have to do with sex on their face. 6 We've also included in this people who have 7 never committed a sex offense but were accused 8 of a sex offense and pled guilty to some 9 lesser charge. 10 Now, I appreciate it that it's hard 11 to convict. But we do have a principle in 12 this state and this country that says people 13 shouldn't do time for the rest of their lives 14 if they've never been convicted of a crime. I 15 think. I think that's a principle. When I 16 was in law school it was. I don't think 17 that's changed in the last twenty years or so. 18 And I guess my concern is that if 19 we're talking about proceeding with something 20 to stop sexual predators, isn't what we should 21 be looking at -- I mean if you're honest about 22 it, why don't you just say you want life 23 without parole for anyone who commits a 24 serious sex offense? That's the front-door 25 way to deal with this.

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(518) 371-8910 1 What we've got here is kind of a 2 contraption that gets more and more 3 complicated as it -- I actually think it could 4 have been done more simply. And I liked some 5 of the earlier versions of it better, although 6 I would have liked to make some changes. But 7 this is a contraption by its length that 8 demonstrates, this legislation by its length 9 demonstrates how complicated and difficult an 10 issue this is. 11 But I'm afraid I have to come out 12 on the side of saying it doesn't provide 13 adequate protections. It's got a lot of 14 process. It's got a lot of process. But in 15 order to make up for that, I suppose, it casts 16 a very, very broad net. 17 This provides -- this doesn't just 18 change the criminal process to have convicted 19 predators kept in jail longer. This deals 20 with people who were never convicted of any 21 crime who were found incompetent to stand 22 trial, who were found not guilty by reason of 23 mental defect. So it takes away the system of 24 confinement that we have now, of civil 25 commitment and the due-process protections

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(518) 371-8910 1 that are provided in that system. 2 So this is, as Senator Volker said, 3 a change of epic proportions. I would very 4 much like to vote for a bill that addresses 5 this issue. I do support this. And I was 6 convinced by Senator Klein when he was working 7 in the Assembly that civil confinement was 8 something we have to pursue. And I respect 9 the people who will be voting for this for 10 their effort to deal with a very serious 11 problem. 12 But I have to say that this 13 legislation, which deals with people who are 14 burglars and deals with people who are 15 convicted of conspiracy to commit nonviolent 16 offenses, which deals with people who have 17 never been convicted of any crime, is a 18 problem for me. 19 And the final thing, and that has 20 always been my biggest concern -- and I've 21 said every time this bill has come up, or 22 similar bills have come up in this house -- 23 the problem is not so much even with getting 24 people in, because you do have a lot of 25 due-process protection on the front end. The

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(518) 371-8910 1 problem is that once people are incarcerated, 2 once people are put into civil confinement 3 under this bill, they will never -- it's 4 virtually impossible for them to get out. 5 What commissioner is going to err 6 on the side of the predator and take a chance 7 that person to going to commit another crime 8 and you'll be blamed for it? What court is 9 going to err on the side of the incarcerated 10 person, the sex offender, as it's defined? 11 I don't know. But I have to note, 12 with due respect to everyone involved -- and 13 representing one of the most diverse districts 14 in the state, that has both a high white high 15 population, a high Dominican and high black 16 population -- there is a double standard here. 17 And we can see this in sentencing, the 18 sentencing under the Rockefeller drug laws 19 most graphically, where courts in different 20 parts of the state treat like offenses 21 differently. 22 And I strongly object to the 23 provision that the court that determines 24 whether you can get out or not, once you're 25 civilly confined, is the court where the

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(518) 371-8910 1 respondent is located; that is, the court 2 where the prison is located. That is not a 3 place where someone is going to necessarily 4 get a fair hearing. 5 And I have to say, with regard to 6 Senator Diaz, who I disagree with on a lot of 7 issues, I think he did make a fair point about 8 the fact that there are defendants from my 9 district who will have a very hard time 10 explaining themselves, being understood and 11 getting a fair hearing in courts in 12 overwhelmingly white jurisdictions where 13 prisons are located. 14 And I say that without impugning 15 the integrity of any judge in any of those 16 jurisdictions. It's just a fact of life. 17 It's something they're not used to, they don't 18 have experience with. 19 And it would be a very different 20 bill, I believe, if there was a process that 21 provided that people can go back to the 22 community they came from, back to where they 23 were originally convicted, and litigate the 24 issue there. 25 So because of all those problems, I

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(518) 371-8910 1 feel that I have to vote against this bill. I 2 have voted for prior bills and noted my 3 objections on the record and hoped that when 4 we got to a two-house bill that they would be 5 met. They have not been met. 6 I think that there has been a 7 tremendous amount of effort put into this. 8 This will become law. And I hope that we will 9 not wait the decades we waited about the 10 Rockefeller drug laws to revisit it and see if 11 it really is doing the job or if we are just 12 keeping a lot of people in jail doing life 13 without parole without calling it life without 14 parole. Unintended consequences can really be 15 monsters in the area of criminal justice. 16 So, Madam President, I will 17 reluctantly be voting no on this bill. And I 18 hope that we will be able to revisit this 19 issue in the near future. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 21 you, Senator Schneiderman. 22 Senator Thompson. 23 SENATOR THOMPSON: Madam 24 President, I'll be quick, but I just wanted to 25 make a couple of quick things.

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(518) 371-8910 1 One, I stand today in support of 2 the bill, having an 11-year-old daughter who's 3 very active in a number of programs and a 4 number of activities, and also thinking about 5 this bill this morning when I left upstate -- 6 the further part upstate -- at 5:00 a.m., 7 thinking about, when I left the house, my 8 1-year-old son, who I would be devastated if 9 some sexual predator were to break into my 10 home and take him from us in the middle of the 11 night. 12 No, this bill is not a perfect 13 bill. But I know that in the Western New York 14 community it's been a concern for some time. 15 And I think during the implementation process, 16 hopefully, with this Governor and with a lot 17 of concerned activists, we'll make sure that 18 it's properly implemented. 19 I am appreciative of the fact that 20 each year people will have the opportunity to 21 come up for review. We know that there's 22 always going to be a concern to make sure that 23 they have the proper legal representation when 24 they go for their hearing, and we'll be there 25 to make sure that we monitor this situation.

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(518) 371-8910 1 And I think through our various committees we 2 can stay out front of this. 3 The other thing I wanted to mention 4 that I think is important is I think that this 5 body should enhance Megan's Law. Something I 6 talked about about a month ago is that big 7 cities like Buffalo really cannot afford to 8 notify the local police stations, the school 9 districts. And so many of us have sexual 10 predators living right in our neighborhoods. 11 And we have to empower the 12 residents so they can at least know who's 13 living in their neighborhood and take the 14 necessary precautions. Unfortunately, a lot 15 of the cities and communities like Buffalo, 16 even Niagara Falls, cannot afford that. 17 The last thing deals with the issue 18 of making sure that the local police stations 19 begin -- I'm not sure if we can do it as a 20 requirement, but at least all of the local 21 police stations have on their websites, in 22 terms of we look at reforming Megan's Law, in 23 terms of making sure that those sexual 24 predators, particularly the Class 3 ones that 25 are out in the community, that they are on the

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(518) 371-8910 1 local police station websites. 2 So I think I would commend Senator 3 Klein, who spent a lot of time, and a number 4 of members on the Democratic side, also 5 Senator Volker, and all the people on the 6 other side of the aisle for working on this 7 with the Governor. 8 And it's not a perfect law. No law 9 is ever perfect. But I believe that it is a 10 step and if we're not on the right track, we 11 will have the time, through the legislative 12 process, to amend it in the future. 13 Thank you. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 15 you, Senator Thompson. 16 Any Senator wishing to be heard? 17 The debate is closed. 18 The Secretary will ring the bell. 19 And we will read the last section. 20 THE SECRETARY: Section 52. This 21 act shall take effect on the 30th day. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Call 23 the roll. 24 (The Secretary called the roll.) 25 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Senator

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(518) 371-8910 1 Maltese, to explain your vote. 2 SENATOR MALTESE: Madam 3 President, I explain my vote because I know 4 that many of my colleagues have wrestled with 5 this issue for more than 15 years. 6 In addition, many of them have 7 approached this subject with an open mind and 8 have given it a great amount of thought. 9 We've witnessed here today members saying that 10 they were of one mind when they came in and, 11 after giving it more thought and listening to 12 the debate, had undergone a change of mind. 13 This is important to me. I served 14 for years as a prosecutor and deputy chief of 15 the homicide bureau. I came in touch and in 16 contact with victims of sexual predators. I 17 know after those years, and years in different 18 aspects of law enforcement, that they are the 19 lowest form of criminal. They are men that in 20 many -- men and women in many cases that 21 cannot help themselves and ask and plead for 22 assistance or to be incarcerated. 23 We have to do what's best for the 24 victims of the crimes. Certainly anyone 25 listening here, as I did, to Senator Young

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(518) 371-8910 1 speaking of the terrible, heinous crimes that 2 took place in upstate New York can hear young 3 victims crying out from the shrouds, buried 4 alive by sexual predators seeking to work 5 their wills on these poor boys and girls and 6 young men and young women. 7 We have to act after all these 8 years. And we have to make a decision. These 9 victims cannot wait another 10 or 15 or 20 10 years. We cannot rest easy having on our 11 conscience the lives of those or the futures 12 of those victims who would be victims of these 13 sexual predators in the future who would be 14 out on the streets if we fail to do what we 15 feel is right. 16 Madam President, I vote aye. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 18 you. Senator Maltese will be recorded in the 19 affirmative. 20 We have several Senators who wish 21 to explain their vote. Could we refrain from 22 speaking while they are talking? Thank you. 23 Senator DeFrancisco, to explain his 24 vote. 25 SENATOR DeFRANCISCO: Members of

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(518) 371-8910 1 this body from both sides of the aisle opened 2 up the debate by expressing how people in 3 their districts kept asking why it took so 4 long, why 14 years. Well, listening to the 5 debate, you can figure it out. That there are 6 people that have a different point of view, 7 that other issues are important that they feel 8 overlap with the civil confinement. That's 9 why it's difficult to get a consensus. 10 And I hope the people out there 11 that are voting make very clear their 12 decisions in voting as to how people vote and 13 what their reasons are, because people have 14 their own reasons and they should be 15 accordingly. 16 But with respect to this bill, the 17 reason I support it is it's called civil 18 confinement. And the purpose of it is all 19 these different crimes that people commit that 20 relate to a sexual predator or that they were 21 originally charged with that relate to sexual 22 predators, the purpose of civil confinement, 23 through the criminal justice system, we're 24 identifying these people. 25 If the person is found to be a

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(518) 371-8910 1 sexual predator through the investigation and 2 through the process and isn't technically 3 convicted of a sexual offense, that doesn't 4 mean the person hasn't been identified. And 5 if the person is identified, there should be a 6 process to deal with it. And that's what 7 civil confinement is. 8 And the process is to have the 9 person evaluated. If the person is at risk, 10 they stay confined. If they're not, they need 11 treatment, they get treatment. Rather than 12 just ignore someone that they have identified. 13 And with all due respect to Senator 14 Parker, we can have all the programs in the 15 world and fund all the programs in the world. 16 There are certain people in our society that 17 simply are predators, and that isn't going to 18 make a difference. 19 And with due respect to some of the 20 other speakers, I don't think the parent of 21 the young child gives a darn whether the 22 predator is white, black, yellow or red. That 23 person should be out of society until they're 24 capable of acting like a human and not be a 25 predator against other human beings,

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(518) 371-8910 1 especially children. 2 I vote yes. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 4 you. Senator DeFrancisco will be recorded in 5 the affirmative. 6 Senator Volker, to explain his 7 vote. 8 SENATOR VOLKER: Madam President, 9 first of all, unfortunately, Senator Parker, 10 by voting no you don't get to vote for the 11 biggest treatment bill in my time in the 12 Legislature. This bill provides more 13 treatment to more people specifically than any 14 bill I know of. And including in prison. As 15 I said, included in this bill is money and 16 numbers for sexual predators in prison to 17 treat them. 18 I'll give you the total number that 19 it's estimated that will be hired under this 20 bill. Over a thousand. Sixty new parole 21 officers. And this is initial. To say that 22 this bill is not a treatment bill is 23 outrageous. 24 Now, I know it's not understood. 25 The reason that we have put some of these

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(518) 371-8910 1 things in here -- and the problem Senator 2 Schneiderman has -- and we're both criminal 3 justice people. This is not a criminal 4 justice bill. 5 And let me tell you, what irritates 6 me about some college professors, and I 7 personally think that -- especially law 8 professors -- they don't live in our world. 9 They live in a different world than we do. 10 They don't understand that these are real 11 people. They don't understand -- these people 12 are not going to stay in forever, most of 13 them, unless -- now, there are some. One was 14 mentioned in the New York Times story, that 15 he's been there ever since. From what I've 16 heard, he's in a good place. 17 You've got to remember something. 18 Some of these people are bad people. And let 19 me just give you one quick story about one of 20 the most famous cases in Western New York that 21 I happen to have been involved in. We 22 arrested a guy -- I forget, 29, 30 rapes, 23 whatever, burglary, all kinds of things. And 24 it was one of the cases that brought me to the 25 Legislature, and I'll tell you why.

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(518) 371-8910 1 We caught the guy, and I personally 2 was able to tell him after he threatened to 3 kill me, that he was under arrest and so 4 forth. But we convicted him twice of 5 first-degree rape. We were never able to make 6 it stick. They threw those out, and he ended 7 up convicted of burglaries. 8 Here was one of the biggest sexual 9 predators -- we believe he raped as many as a 10 hundred women throughout all of upstate 11 New York. I won't get into the details. He 12 eventually murdered a border patrolman and 13 then made his biggest mistake, he murdered a 14 Mafia chieftain's son and got the death 15 penalty. 16 And I remember telling some of 17 these poor women that were attacked by him, 18 who were airline stewardesses, I said he got 19 the death penalty. "But, Senator, you haven't 20 restored the death penalty." I said: "For 21 some people, there is a death penalty." 22 The gentleman -- gentleman? He 23 wasn't a gentleman. By the way, I was glad, 24 because I was going to start carrying my gun 25 again. I was in the Senate by then -- he

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(518) 371-8910 1 ended up with two bullet holes in the back of 2 his head and a wire around his neck. And a 3 lawyer who I went to school with got him out 4 from federal prison, but I won't get into 5 that. But he got justice. 6 The reason I'm pointing that out 7 is -- I was just thinking about that -- here's 8 a guy that had never been convicted of a 9 sexual crime. He would have been only in on 10 burglary and a couple of federal crimes. And 11 if this guy wasn't a sexual predator, I don't 12 think I -- I don't know one. I mean, he was a 13 really bad dude. 14 That's the problem here. The 15 problem here is this is a civil process. Who 16 is going to want to keep somebody in one of 17 our facilities for no reason? This is not 18 like a criminal thing where you want to put 19 people in jail and keep them there. This is 20 altogether different. 21 The estimates are, by a very good 22 authority -- not by those people in the street 23 who don't believe in this, or by the national 24 people who are, oh, this is not going to work. 25 Because they don't want to try it. They don't

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(518) 371-8910 1 want to try it. Four hundred, they estimate, 2 within the next few years will reach trial. A 3 hundred will be civilly confined. Two hundred 4 fifty will presumably go out on strict and 5 intensive supervision, and 50 will be 6 released. Those are the estimates. 7 This number that they have, that 8 there's this huge number, is crazy. Because 9 most of the people who are reviewed, it's 10 expected by this team, will probably say, 11 well, they should get some sort of treatment. 12 By the way, there's one more thing 13 and I'll finish. I think it was Senator 14 Krueger said we should update criminal 15 sentences. We have, in this bill, 16 dramatically. And we made indefinite 17 sentences definite, so that a lot of people 18 who could be up to 15 years or whatever for 19 serious sex crimes, it's going to be 15. I 20 just want to make that clear. 21 But finally I'm going to say, on 22 behalf of Senator Bruno, anyone who would like 23 to be a cosponsor of this bill is welcome to 24 do so. And just -- we'll just notify the desk 25 or however you want to do it. But you can be

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(518) 371-8910 1 a sponsor of this bill, I just want to tell 2 you. 3 I vote aye. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 5 you. Senator Volker will be recorded in the 6 affirmative. 7 Senator Fuschillo, to explain his 8 vote. 9 SENATOR FUSCHILLO: Thank you, 10 Madam President. 11 Knowing that we only have two 12 minutes to explain my vote, I'll be very 13 brief. 14 (Laughter.) 15 SENATOR FUSCHILLO: Everybody is 16 awake now; right? 17 I must say that I do appreciate the 18 comments that I heard today -- a difficult 19 decision, wrong bill, right bill. With all 20 due respect to my colleagues, I never looked 21 upon civil commitment as a race issue. 22 I'll say it, I haven't heard it 23 said today, these are sick people. These are 24 sick people that prey on the most vulnerable 25 of our society. And I look upon this bill as

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(518) 371-8910 1 an attempt to add greater protection to those 2 who need it. 3 Senator Volker, I commend you. 4 Seventeen years, certainly perseverance on 5 your part to get this bill done. Maybe it 6 took a change in administration. So be it. I 7 compliment the Governor and the Assembly for 8 finally coming to the table. 9 But this is a good bill. This is 10 the right bill. This bill will add protection 11 to those who need it most in our society. 12 I'll be voting in the affirmative. 13 Thank you. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 15 you. Senator Fuschillo will be recorded in 16 the affirmative. 17 Senator Golden, to explain his 18 vote. 19 SENATOR GOLDEN: Thank you, Madam 20 President. 21 I too rise to say congratulations 22 to Senator Volker, to Senator Bruno, to all 23 the Senators here in this chamber, to our 24 colleagues in the Assembly, and to the 25 Governor. We are finally passing a bill that

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(518) 371-8910 1 will work and become law. 2 There are too many children, some 3 of them that would have never been covered by 4 this anyway. But if we just look here in the 5 city and state of New York, it would be Etan 6 Patz, Adam Walsh, or more familiar to most 7 people would be Jessica Lunsford, who the 8 father was up here last year. And the man 9 cried as he tried to get a bill passed here, 10 physically broke down and cried. Not once, 11 but several times, outside here in the 12 hallway. So for him, for Mr. Lunsford, I say 13 to all of you, thank you. 14 For the thousands of children over 15 the last 12 years that have perished, all I 16 can say is that I'm sorry. But I can say one 17 thing. I'm one of those skeptics. I believe 18 this bill doesn't go far enough. But I hope 19 I'm wrong. And I'm hoping that the children 20 here and the families of the city and state of 21 New York will see a real bill and that this 22 bill will work. 23 We don't want to see any more 24 Etans, Adams, or Jessicas. And we want to 25 make sure that the legislation we're putting

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(518) 371-8910 1 here today works for all of those that live 2 here in the city and state of New York. 3 I dare to say there's 550,000 4 sexual predators across this nation, of which 5 we cannot find over 100,000. And today we see 6 the feds down in the city of New York going 7 through public housing, trying to locate 8 sexual predators that have addresses in the 9 city of New York, and they cannot find 10 hundreds of them. The task force this past 11 week talked of that, talked about those that 12 cannot be found that are here in the city and 13 state of New York and those that come into the 14 city of New York and hide in plain sight. 15 This bill I hope will put those who 16 are the most egregious where they belong, in 17 jail and, after that, civilly confined, and 18 that in the future we don't have to deal with 19 this. 20 So for Etan, Adam, Jessica, to all 21 of you I say thank you that there will no more 22 future, that these children, their children 23 will be recognized. 24 Thank you, Madam President. 25 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank

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(518) 371-8910 1 you. Senator Golden, you vote in the 2 affirmative? 3 SENATOR GOLDEN: Yes. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Senator 5 Golden votes in the affirmative. 6 Senator Adams, to explain his vote. 7 SENATOR ADAMS: Thank you. I 8 also want to add my voice to my colleague 9 Senator Volker. I believe that clearly his 10 desire is the desire of many of us who have 11 been in the law enforcement community. And I 12 think that the mere fact that he kept this on 13 the forefront is compelling us to deal with 14 this issue. 15 There is nothing in our 16 conversation that states that the issue of 17 dealing with the sick minds of pedophiles is 18 an issue that deals with race. And for those 19 who misinterpret our concern, I want to be 20 very clear that my vote has nothing to do with 21 the ethnicity of a person that carries out a 22 predatory act. 23 Unlike many in this chamber, I put 24 handcuffs on people. And the last thing I was 25 concerned with was what ethnicity they were.

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(518) 371-8910 1 I was more concerned on the crime they 2 committed against the people. 3 I believe that your heart is right, 4 my colleague. And I stand with you in 5 agreement that we need to get rid of these 6 sick individuals. But I vote negative because 7 of the mere points in this bill that don't do 8 the correct job on taking care of what we need 9 to do. 10 Thank you. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 12 you. Senator Adams will be recorded 13 negatively. 14 Senator Stewart-Cousins, to explain 15 her vote. 16 SENATOR STEWART-COUSINS: Yes, 17 thank you, Madam President. I rise to, yes, 18 explain my vote. 19 I am joined by someone who is 20 working with me for the very first time and 21 was listening to the debate and fascinated by 22 the pros and the cons. And she came over to 23 me, and she said: "This is really hard." And 24 I said, "Yes, it is." And it is what it is 25 that we're here to do, make those very, very

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(518) 371-8910 1 hard decisions. 2 And I've listened to my brothers 3 Adams and Parker talk about what we know 4 happens in terms of the disparate treatment of 5 many people of colors in communities of 6 colors, where whether it was something you 7 could prove or not prove, very often it is the 8 presumption of guilt. And it is the 9 presumption of guilt that so many who are 10 dealing with the safety of their children, 11 parents who are so concerned that their 12 children will be presumed guilty, are 13 frightened of. And that's what was being 14 spoken about. 15 On the other hand, I come from 16 Westchester County. And it's a county like so 17 many other counties that for the past two, 18 three years have been consumed by this 19 discussion of what to do with sexual 20 predators, what to do with people who we know 21 will be recidivists, what to do with people 22 who will be in our communities for lack of 23 action. 24 And I was one of those critics who 25 stood by and said, Why, why can't we make a

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(518) 371-8910 1 decision? Why can we be in a position where 2 everyone agrees something must be done yet 3 nothing is done? 4 I cannot be part of that problem. 5 I cannot go back to the Russo family and for 6 the people in the community who have waited 7 10, 12, 14 years for a decision about civil 8 confinement to say, You know what? We just 9 couldn't get it done. 10 We have to get it done. It is our 11 job to get it done. I am at a moment, I 12 believe a historic moment where things are 13 being done differently. And this getting it 14 done after all these years is very much a part 15 of that for me. And I know that getting it 16 done right time and time again and forcing the 17 issue, putting these issues forward, saying 18 that we don't like the status quo or the way 19 it's been done will help to create the type of 20 justice, in sometimes a very unjust system, 21 that we can all be proud of. 22 But right now, today, I vote in the 23 affirmative for this bill, in this moment, for 24 this moment where we can finally say this is 25 done and hopefully move forward to save the

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(518) 371-8910 1 children who have been languishing because of 2 14 years of debate. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 4 you. Senator Stewart-Cousins will be recorded 5 in the affirmative. 6 Senator Craig Johnson, to explain 7 his vote. 8 SENATOR CRAIG JOHNSON: Thank 9 you. I rise to explain my vote, which will be 10 a vote in the affirmative. And I will take 11 Senator Volker's offer up and ask to join as a 12 cosponsor. 13 I too served in a county 14 legislature, in Nassau County, just up until 15 recently. And we have been faced for years 16 with the problem of sexual predators out of 17 jail, on parole or on probation, coming into 18 our communities. And the hodgepodges of laws 19 that have been developed in Nassau and 20 Suffolk, all across New York State, dealing 21 with where they can live and how far from 22 schools and from parks, we need to do 23 something about that. 24 This bill, a hard-fought battle -- 25 and I commend you, Senator Volker, for

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(518) 371-8910 1 17 years of taking a four-page bill and 2 turning it into a 44-page bill, which shows a 3 thought and dedication and a demonstration of 4 protection for civil liberties. 5 When you read this bill and you 6 understand the step-by-step process that's 7 required in the terms of the treatment, in 8 terms of what needs to be required in order to 9 go through the process to obtain civil 10 confinement, it should give comfort to people 11 to understand that there's a process in place 12 to not just ensure the treatment that's 13 necessary for these monsters -- and it's not 14 just pedophilia, it's the rapists. And it's 15 not just the rapists, it's those who go onto 16 child pornography websites. That's who we're 17 trying to protect our society from. 18 And we have the protections in 19 place to ensure that those cases of misjustice 20 don't get repeated in the process, and to 21 ensure that the monsters stay where the 22 monsters belong. 23 And so when I make this vote I vote 24 yes. It's not just about the victims that 25 Senator Golden talked about, or Senator Bruno,

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(518) 371-8910 1 or others. I think about my 2-year-old; I 2 think about my 5-year-old. I think about my 3 wife and my mother-in-law and my sister, and 4 my father and my brother-in-law, those who 5 potentially could be victims in one way or 6 another of a sexual crime. 7 And so I vote in the affirmative 8 for a bill that today starts the process of 9 protecting our families, protecting our loved 10 ones. 11 Thank you. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 13 you. Senator C. Johnson will be recorded in 14 the affirmative. 15 Senator Diaz, to explain his vote. 16 SENATOR CRAIG JOHNSON: Thank 17 you, Madam President. 18 As I said before, 10 times this 19 bill has come to this Senate floor. I have 20 been here for the last four years. And I said 21 before that every time that the bill has come 22 to this chamber and have passed, the only two 23 persons that have opposed this bill have been 24 Senator Duane and Senator Montgomery. 25 We pass it here, we send it to our

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(518) 371-8910 1 colleagues, our Democratic colleagues in the 2 Assembly, and they have voted no. For 10 3 years we passed it, our democratic colleagues 4 in the Assembly voted no. 5 Now we've got a Democratic 6 governor, he got our Democratic colleagues in 7 the Assembly to join and to vote yes, and now 8 we oppose. So for the last four years, having 9 voted yes, I'm not about to change my vote 10 now. I know I expressed my concern before. I 11 have concern, I had it before, I have it now 12 and I will have it tomorrow. 13 But, ladies and gentlemen, we have 14 voted yes before 10 times. The other side, 15 our Democratic colleagues, have voted no. Now 16 they're voting yes and we are opposing it. 17 So, Madam President, would you please explain 18 that to me? 19 Thank you very much. I'm voting 20 yes. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 22 you. Senator Diaz will be recorded in the 23 affirmative. 24 Senator Padavan, to explain his 25 vote.

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(518) 371-8910 1 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes, Madam 2 President. Earlier one of our colleagues, in 3 indicating his negative vote on this bill, 4 said he was unaware of the fact of any 5 legislation, any law that would put someone in 6 a place of confinement for an extended period 7 of time without having been convicted of a 8 crime. 9 And, you know, I just can't 10 understand how anybody could say that. 11 Everybody here knows that in this state and in 12 most states, probably all the states in our 13 country, we have civil commitment laws for 14 those acquitted by reason of insanity, found 15 incompetent to stand trial. 16 And today there are hundreds of 17 such individuals in our state mental 18 hospitals. Many of them have been there for 19 years, and regrettably many of them will 20 always be there. Just a fact of life. 21 And the Senator in question doesn't 22 have to go far, there's a footbridge over from 23 Manhattan, from Manhattan Psychiatric 24 Hospital, and I'm sure they'll give him a tour 25 of that secure ward. And it is a secure ward.

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(518) 371-8910 1 So we have the precedent here. And 2 by the way, it's been challenged over the 3 decades -- one way or the other, all of these 4 statutes have -- and deemed to be 5 constitutional and appropriate, appropriate 6 for the individuals in question and certainly 7 appropriate and necessary for society in 8 general. 9 I vote aye. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 11 you. Senator Padavan will be recorded in the 12 affirmative. 13 Senator Onorato, to explain his 14 vote. 15 SENATOR ONORATO: Madam 16 President, I rise to join my colleagues in 17 supporting this piece of legislation. We've 18 had it before for many, many years without 19 some of the very, very important safeguards 20 that have now been put in. 21 Some of the questions raised here 22 earlier was that the prior bills had no -- 23 where is the money to provide treatment. 24 Well, this is not a criminal justice bill, as 25 was pointed out. But there is funds now to

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(518) 371-8910 1 treat them. 2 And I can't see any particular 3 reason why we would not support this here to 4 give these people the needed treatment. And 5 in that respect, I vote aye. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 7 you, Senator. Senator Onorato will be 8 recorded in the affirmative. 9 Senator Perkins, to explain his 10 vote. 11 SENATOR PERKINS: Thank you very 12 much. 13 I want to first associate myself 14 with the remarks of my colleagues Senator 15 Adams, Senator Parker, Senator Krueger, 16 Senator Montgomery and Senator Schneiderman. 17 Where I come from, we say if you do 18 the crime, you have to do the time. If you do 19 the crime you should do the time. If you are 20 a pedophile or a predator, then you should do 21 the time, whether it be life or whatever is 22 appropriate. 23 This bill is not speaking to that. 24 This bill says after you do the time, do some 25 more. We say that in terms of something

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(518) 371-8910 1 called civil confinement, or maybe in terms of 2 something called mental abnormality. 3 But the reality is this is, I don't 4 believe, simply a medical treatment or some 5 kind of confinement for health reasons but 6 rather has a potential, as does the death 7 penalty, as has been evidenced by the 8 Rockefeller drug laws, as even has been 9 evidenced by me in terms of the Central Park 10 jogger case, of creating a slippery slope that 11 in the moment of hysteria brings people into a 12 process that is unjust but nevertheless 13 justified. 14 I can't but remember Donald Trump 15 taking out ads in the New York Times during 16 the course of the Central Park jogger case 17 calling for the death penalty. And if in fact 18 his voice had been heard and this Legislature 19 had complied, those five young men, who were 20 ultimately found to be innocent, would no 21 longer be with us today. 22 But nevertheless, they suffered for 23 13 years in jail and in some cases had to be 24 signed up for sex-offender-treatment type of 25 reporting through the system.

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(518) 371-8910 1 I see this as a similar slippery 2 slope, a similar problem as was represented by 3 my colleagues in terms of racial profiling. 4 We don't want to accept the fact that our 5 criminal justice system at times is injustice, 6 and is injustice from a racial point of view. 7 But the evidence is there, so we don't need to 8 face it because that's the fact. 9 So I think that for me, this is 10 that slippery slope once again. I don't doubt 11 that anyone here is truly interested in 12 justice and trying to do the right things by 13 rape victims and trying to prevent rape and 14 providing the appropriate treatment for those 15 who are so-called pedophiles. 16 But this legislation, to me, 17 doesn't speak to that. In fact, it seems to 18 me that, based on what Senator Schneiderman 19 pointed out, it opens up the door to other 20 types of arrangements that would be really 21 unfair and unjust. So I'm strongly voting in 22 the negative on this legislation. 23 And I also wanted to mention one 24 other thing, which is this. I'm concerned 25 about the fact that I recently heard this

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(518) 371-8910 1 legislation being agreed upon by the Governor 2 and the leadership, which I'm concerned about 3 because I did not -- I was not even aware of 4 the legislation. Nor was I aware of the 5 changes in the legislation that took place 6 until today. 7 So that concerns me about the 8 process that we use when we are dealing with 9 very, very important legislation. It would 10 seem to me that beyond just a conference 11 opportunity before today's session, even 12 hearings would be appropriate, so that we can 13 really truly hear what this legislation is all 14 about from the various stakeholders that are a 15 part of it. 16 So I would hope that as we move 17 forward that we would provide for hearings on 18 very, very important pieces of legislation 19 like this. I don't think my constituency 20 wants me simply to be told through a press 21 conference about an agreement or deal or 22 however you want to characterize it, as a 23 signal for how I or any one of us should be 24 voting. 25 So I would hope that in the future

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(518) 371-8910 1 we would avoid that process, even as I am also 2 more strongly in disagreement with the 3 substance of this bill. 4 Thank you. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 6 you. Senator Perkins will be recorded in the 7 negative. 8 Senator Oppenheimer, to explain her 9 vote. 10 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: I think I'm 11 the last. 12 This bill is named for someone who 13 died in my district, a very terrific woman. 14 And this isn't the best of all 15 bills. There's things I find objectionable. 16 But I often say that you can't make the good 17 be the enemy of the best. And we have been 18 struggling with this for so many years. 19 And so I'm definitely going to be 20 supporting it and hope that when we do an 21 analysis of the bill and how it has been 22 implemented in two or three years, we will be 23 able to assess where we have done well and 24 where we have not and make the necessary 25 changes then.

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(518) 371-8910 1 But I'll be voting yes now. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 3 you. Senator Oppenheimer will be recorded in 4 the affirmative. 5 The Secretary will announce the 6 results. 7 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 8 the negative on Calendar Number 251 are 9 Senators Adams, Duane, Hassell-Thompson, 10 Huntley, Montgomery, Parker, Perkins and 11 Schneiderman. Ayes, 53. Nays, 8. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: The 13 bill is passed. 14 Senator Maltese. 15 SENATOR MALTESE: Is there any 16 other business at the desk? 17 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: No, 18 Senator, there is not. 19 SENATOR MALTESE: Madam 20 President, on behalf of Senator Bruno, I hand 21 up the following committee assignments and ask 22 that they be filed in the Journal. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 24 you. They will be filed. 25 SENATOR MALTESE: There being no

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(518) 371-8910 1 further business, I move to adjourn until 2 Tuesday, March 6th, at 3:00 p.m. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT LITTLE: Thank 4 you. The Senate stands adjourned until 5 Tuesday, March 6th, at 3:00 p.m. 6 (Whereupon, at 6:13 p.m., the 7 Senate adjourned.) 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25

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