Wednesday, April 2, 2008

1 NEW YORK STATE SENATE 2 3 4 THE STENOGRAPHIC RECORD 5 6 7 8 9 ALBANY, NEW YORK 10 April 2, 2008 11 11:10 a.m. 12 13 14 REGULAR SESSION 15 16 17 18 SENATOR THOMAS P. MORAHAN, Acting President 19 STEVEN M. BOGGESS, Secretary 20 21 22 23 24 25

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(518) 371-8910 1 P R O C E E D I N G S 2 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 3 Senate will come to order. 4 I ask everyone present to please 5 rise and join me in pledging allegiance to our 6 Flag. 7 (Whereupon, the assemblage recited 8 the Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.) 9 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: In the 10 absence of clergy, we'll we bow our heads in a 11 moment of silence. 12 (Whereupon, the assemblage 13 respected a moment of silence.) 14 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 15 reading of the Journal. 16 THE SECRETARY: In Senate, 17 Tuesday, April 1, the Senate met pursuant to 18 adjournment. The Journal of Monday, March 31, 19 was read and approved. On motion, Senate 20 adjourned. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 22 Without objection, the Journal stands approved 23 as read. 24 Presentation of petitions. 25 Messages from the Assembly.

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(518) 371-8910 1 Messages from the Governor. 2 Reports of standing committees. 3 Reports of select committees. 4 Communications and reports from 5 state officers. 6 Motions and resolutions. 7 Senator Skelos. 8 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, 9 if we could go to the noncontroversial reading 10 of the calendar. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 12 Secretary will read. 13 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 14 325, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 6747, an 15 act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law and 16 others, in relation to enacting the "Child 17 Sexual Abuse and Exploitation Act of 2008." 18 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Read 19 the last section. 20 THE SECRETARY: Section 59. This 21 act shall take effect on the first of 22 November. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Call 24 the roll. 25 (The Secretary called the roll.)

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(518) 371-8910 1 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 2 Announce the results. 3 THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 41. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 5 bill is passed. 6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 7 399, by Senator Nozzolio, Senate Print 6908, 8 an act to amend the Executive Law, in relation 9 to directing the Division of Parole. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Read 11 the last section. 12 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This 13 act shall take effect immediately. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Call 15 the roll. 16 (The Secretary called the roll.) 17 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 18 Senator Schneiderman. 19 SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Thank you, 20 to explain my vote. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: To 22 explain his vote. 23 SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: I think 24 that this bill has some provisions that are 25 commendable as far as transparency of the

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(518) 371-8910 1 parole process. But it also has a provision 2 which I think is something that no member of 3 this house should vote for, requiring that 4 three members of the Parole Board, instead of 5 the current one, must interview a prisoner, 6 and that it requires a unanimous vote of the 7 Parole Board to release an offender. 8 The system of parole has been 9 operating in this state for many, many 10 decades. It operates pretty well. And I 11 believe that trying to make it more -- this is 12 obviously political in two senses. It's 13 designed to try and make it more difficult for 14 people to obtain parole, which I think 15 contravenes the express purposes of our system 16 and of the parole process, which is to ensure 17 that people who have served their time, who 18 have shown evidence of rehabilitation can 19 return to their communities and participate in 20 the life of their communities as citizens 21 again. 22 Except for a handful of people who 23 die in prison, everyone gets out. "They All 24 Come Home" is the name of a book written by 25 Jeremy Travis of John Jay College recently,

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(518) 371-8910 1 pointing out how we have to make better 2 provisions in our state and in our country for 3 reentry. 4 This bill I think is transparently 5 political in a second sense also. It seems to 6 be designed so that hang-over appointees from 7 the Pataki era can stymie the decisions of the 8 new Governor's appointees to the Parole Board 9 to release people who meet all the 10 requirements for parole. 11 The case law is clear; parole is 12 not supposed to be resentencing. Parole is 13 about conduct in prison. Parole is about 14 enabling us to save money and restore people 15 to their communities in a timely and safe 16 manner. 17 I urge everyone in the house to 18 vote no. This would interfere in the process 19 and would be a political power grab, frankly, 20 on behalf of the now departed -- two Governors 21 ago, that guy. 22 Thank you, Mr. President. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Thank 24 you, Senator. You will be recorded in the 25 negative.

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(518) 371-8910 1 Senator Duane. 2 SENATOR DUANE: Thank you, Mr. 3 President. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: To 5 explain your vote? 6 SENATOR DUANE: Yes, Mr. 7 President. 8 You know, the whole point of having 9 a three-person Parole Board panel is to have a 10 difference of opinion emerge and for the 11 members of the Parole Board to actually read 12 about the person coming before and what 13 they've done while they were incarcerated and 14 about the crime and what's happened and what's 15 happened with rehabilitation. And the whole 16 point is that the Parole Board members would 17 have a discussion among themselves and make an 18 informed decision. 19 You know, if there has to be a 20 unanimous decision, then let's just have one 21 person make the decision. Because you could 22 have a renegade person that holds up the 23 whole -- that could decide it every time. And 24 that's ridiculous. We don't do that in any 25 sort of deliberative body. It's totally

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(518) 371-8910 1 antithetical to our system of making decisions 2 in this state and in this nation. 3 It's fixing something that doesn't 4 need to be fixed and shouldn't be fixed. It's 5 not going to make any kind of a perfect parole 6 board. And I just -- I think it's a very, 7 very bad move and I'm actually shocked that it 8 has come before us today. And I would also 9 urge my colleagues to vote no on this, because 10 it's just plain bad public policy. 11 Thank you, Mr. President. I'm 12 voting no. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Thank 14 you, Senator Duane. You will be recorded in 15 the negative. 16 Announce the results. 17 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 18 the negative on Calendar Number 399 are 19 Senators Adams, Connor, Diaz, Duane, 20 Hassell-Thompson, Huntley, L. Krueger, 21 Montgomery, Parker, Perkins, Sabini, Sampson, 22 Schneiderman, and Smith. 23 Ayes, 34. Nays, 14. 24 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 25 bill is passed.

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(518) 371-8910 1 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 2 419, by Senator DeFrancisco, Senate Print 3 2877, an act to amend the Penal Law and the 4 Criminal Procedure Law, in relation to the 5 crime of engaging in criminal street gang 6 activity. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Read 8 the last section. 9 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 10 act shall take effect on the first of 11 November. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 13 Senator Schneiderman, to explain his vote. 14 SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Thank you, 15 Mr. President. 16 This bill I think is overly broad, 17 and I would argue that it probably has a 18 constitutional problem. 19 The problem of criminal street 20 gangs is very serious. I appreciate that it's 21 intended to add an additional penalty for the 22 participation in a gang, and it establishes 23 the crime of engaging in criminal street gang 24 activity. 25 However, I would urge all of you to

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(518) 371-8910 1 consider that this makes it a crime if one 2 person, acting in concert with an individual 3 member of a street gang -- so if you're just 4 with one other person who happens to be in a 5 street gang, and you engage in any unlawful 6 activity -- which includes parking violations, 7 that's an unlawful activity -- you are guilty 8 of the crime of criminal street gang activity. 9 This can't possibly survive 10 constitutional scrutiny. This is not 11 something that is going to help us get rid of 12 the serious, serious problem of gangs. It's a 13 problem in my district; it's a problem all 14 over the state. 15 Let's take some care in drafting a 16 statute that could work. This statute is 17 drafted so broadly as to, you know, 18 possibly -- I think it's quite possible it 19 could be thrown out, but it also basically 20 criminalizes people for hanging out in their 21 neighborhoods with people they know who may or 22 may not be in street gangs. It doesn't even 23 require you to know the person you're hanging 24 out with is in a street gang if you're parked 25 on the wrong side of the street.

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(518) 371-8910 1 So I'm going to vote no, Mr. 2 President. I think we should take a much more 3 serious look at the problem of gang activity. 4 This is not the way to approach it. 5 Thank you. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Thank 7 you, Senator. You will be recorded in the 8 negative. 9 Senator Montgomery. 10 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes, 11 Mr. President. I see here that the City of 12 New York -- specifically, the Office of the 13 Mayor -- is supporting this legislation. 14 And I just want to remind my 15 colleagues that, number one, those of us who 16 are in our districts and working with young 17 people and talking to them, we understand that 18 the best antidote for dealing with the problem 19 of gang activity is the work that the police 20 department, specifically the youth officers 21 and the community officers, do with young 22 people. They do a tremendous and positive job 23 in intercepting and intervening and preventing 24 this street gang activity. 25 Last year, 25 members of this

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(518) 371-8910 1 Legislature wrote a letter to the mayor and 2 the police commissioner requesting that of 800 3 new police graduates, that at least half of 4 them be assigned to our precincts as youth 5 officers and community officers. And we 6 received absolutely no consideration for that 7 request. That request was made specifically 8 in order for us to be able to deal with the 9 problem of street gangs with the police in our 10 communities. 11 So I'm voting no on this, because 12 this is only to address this issue through 13 criminalization. It has nothing to do with 14 preventing gang activity. 15 And I think that is really a 16 statement by our city, by our mayor, that he 17 doesn't really care about preventing gang 18 activity, he just wants to make sure that he 19 has every tool to arrest young people. So I'm 20 voting no. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Thank 22 you, Senator. You will be recorded in the 23 negative. 24 Senator DeFrancisco, to explain his 25 vote.

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(518) 371-8910 1 SENATOR DeFRANCISCO: Yes, I vote 2 aye, which is no surprise since I'm the 3 sponsor. 4 But this bill was definitely 5 supported by the City of New York. And the 6 proposal arose out of the work of the New York 7 City Police Department Gang Division. 8 Street activity, gang activity 9 isn't limited to the city of New York. It's 10 cropping up all over the state of New York. 11 And the purpose of this bill is not only to 12 stop criminal activity, but it's also to help 13 those same young people that some are 14 concerned that they will be swept up in an 15 overly broad bill. 16 Because what this bill talks about 17 is that even if you're not a member of a 18 street gang but you associate yourself with a 19 street gang, to solicit another to join a 20 street gang or to deter someone from leaving 21 this street gang. 22 You know, there's a lot of peer 23 pressure out on the streets, and it would seem 24 to me that these are tools that should be 25 welcomed by anybody in the community,

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(518) 371-8910 1 especially those parents who are extremely 2 concerned, and rightfully so, that their kids 3 might get scooped up into one of these gangs 4 and, if scooped up, can never get out. 5 And so I think it's a very good 6 bill. And it's not overly broad. And it will 7 pass constitutional scrutiny. And it's a tool 8 that's definitely needed to help those young 9 people. And I agree with Senator Montgomery 10 that the best antidote is work done by youth 11 officers, by various public groups that help 12 kids or where kids have constructive 13 activities. 14 But there are always those out 15 there. No matter how good you can make it for 16 young people to veer off from those 17 activities, there's always some that are going 18 to be involved. And we need to protect those 19 that don't want to be involved to be able to 20 either stay out or get out of these gangs. So 21 I vote aye. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Thank 23 you, Senator DeFrancisco. You will be 24 recorded in the affirmative. 25 Senator Parker.

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(518) 371-8910 1 SENATOR PARKER: Mr. President, 2 to explain my vote. 3 First let me thank Senator 4 DeFrancisco for putting this bill forward and 5 being concerned about gang activity all over 6 the state. And I agree with you and share 7 your concern. This is really one of the major 8 problems that is arising in all of our 9 communities, clearly, in Syracuse, Buffalo, 10 Yonkers, Long Island. And we really need to 11 find a way that we address it. 12 So it's the right problem but this 13 is not, unfortunately, the cure. 14 I rise again to just say that 15 raising penalties doesn't in fact stop crime. 16 It doesn't. Every study says that -- the Vera 17 Institute, the Justice Department. Everything 18 that we've done shows that raising penalties 19 does not stop the commission of crimes. 20 The reality is that we have to hit 21 the crime where it lives and eliminate the 22 environment in which these crimes in fact are 23 created. If we are in fact really concerned 24 about gang activity, which is primarily youth 25 violence, let's bring back the State

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(518) 371-8910 1 Department of Youth which we used to have 10, 2 15 years ago that in fact gave money to youth 3 programs so that we can do that. 4 In New York City we need a new 5 mayor who believes in helping our young 6 people. We need to go back to having a 7 Department of Youth Services that puts, again, 8 money into after-school programs and youth 9 development programs. We've gotten rid of 10 music, art and athletics as regular parts of 11 the curriculum in our schools, and so our 12 young people are not as engaged because all 13 they're doing is teaching to the test. 14 We really have to engage our young 15 people in a real way. And I know that the 16 mayor and the police department, you know, 17 believes in this. But I would say to that 18 that when all you have is a hammer, everything 19 looks like a nail. So, you know, they're 20 doing what they know how to do. 21 And for six years I've sat here and 22 listened to my colleagues on the other side of 23 the aisle make the same argument about 24 addressing this issue, but yet I have yet to 25 see somebody come up with a bill that puts

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(518) 371-8910 1 money for youth services for the whole state. 2 Let's, in fact, everywhere from 3 Brookhaven to Buffalo to Brooklyn, engage our 4 young people every single day in after-school 5 activities, in music, art, dance, athletics, 6 in after-school tutoring. Let's provide the 7 services that they really need instead of 8 putting $12 million additional money to hold 9 open facilities in the budget, you know, that 10 we know have no people in them. 11 And so when I look at the series of 12 bills today, you know, and people start 13 talking about prison closings, what this looks 14 like to me is that we have prison closings is 15 because, Mr. President, because these 16 facilities are empty and so we say let's 17 figure out a way to fill the facilities so we 18 get an agenda that looks like the one we have 19 in front of us today. 20 I object to that, and so I vote no, 21 Mr. President. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Thank 23 you, Senator. You will be recorded in the 24 negative. 25 Senator Hannon.

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(518) 371-8910 1 SENATOR HANNON: Yes, 2 Mr. President. I really want to commend 3 Senator DeFrancisco for bringing this to the 4 floor. 5 The problem of gangs and gang 6 activity has been late in coming to New York 7 State, but it's becoming extremely pervasive. 8 And the tools that law enforcement needs 9 haven't been there. This bill would add that 10 tool. 11 I have seen neighborhoods 12 devastated by the gang activity in recent 13 months. I have seen law enforcement in 14 Nassau County struggling. Just this week, 15 they brought over 20 people to arrests and 16 indictments because of gang activity. But the 17 difficulty they have are the tools, the 18 procedural tools and the criminal laws, are 19 not there. This would add them. And I 20 commend them; I cannot understand why people 21 would be opposed. 22 The other arguments that have been 23 raised by Senator Schneiderman I think are not 24 well-founded. I think this bill ought to be 25 adopted.

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(518) 371-8910 1 Thank you. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Thank 3 you, Senator Hannon. You will be recorded in 4 the affirmative. 5 Senator Hassell-Thompson. 6 SENATOR HASSELL-THOMPSON: 7 Thank you, Mr. President. The 8 majority of the concern that I wanted to raise 9 was raised by Senator Parker. I'm explaining 10 my vote because, as somebody who is seen in 11 their community as somewhat conservative, I 12 certainly don't want to send a message that 13 I'm soft on crime. 14 But I also have been a person who 15 has stood on this floor for the eight years 16 that I have been here and called for us to 17 look at how we choose to address the issue of 18 crime in our communities. 19 One of the reasons that we are 20 faced with the level of gang violence in our 21 communities that we are is that for a very 22 long time, many of the mayors didn't want to 23 acknowledge that there was gang activities. 24 It's not good when you're trying to promote 25 your city and your community to say that we

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(518) 371-8910 1 have gang problems. 2 I know that that was an issue in my 3 city, and yet we saw gang violence escalating. 4 But we also saw that the state was deleting 5 from our budget more and more dollars, more 6 and more concern. 7 And the way in which I think, I 8 believe that we demonstrate how concerned we 9 are is by how much money and creativity. It's 10 not always about money, but it is about how do 11 we creatively look at the problems that are 12 being presented to us. And we have colleges 13 and universities that we continue to support 14 that are turning out reports every day that 15 are telling us and are giving us the answers, 16 and we're not listening. 17 And the answer that we prefer, 18 because it's easier, is to lock them up. 19 Increase the penalties. Lock them up, lock 20 them away. That is better for the economy, 21 because it's very easy. We don't have to 22 think about it. We don't have to see them, we 23 don't have to think about it. 24 We have come to a place and a time 25 where we are incarcerating the brains of the

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(518) 371-8910 1 future. And if that's what you're satisfied 2 with doing, then continue to do that. 3 I suggest that we should not be 4 satisfied with the way in which we look at 5 crimes in our state. I am not soft on crime, 6 but I am not prepared to lock up another 7 generation of young people because we refuse 8 to be creative about what we do in these 9 chambers. 10 It's not always about money, but it 11 is about how do we think-tank this and how do 12 we look at the data that is available to us 13 and use some great intelligence that is 14 already in this state to look at the way we 15 solve problems. 16 We have the power to do that. We 17 choose, we choose to take the easy route. We 18 have to stop it. 19 Thank you, Mr. President. 20 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Thank 21 you, Senator. You will be recorded in the 22 negative. 23 Senator Volker. 24 SENATOR VOLKER: Mr. President, I 25 rise quickly. I agree and disagree with just

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(518) 371-8910 1 about everything I've heard on the floor of 2 this Legislature. 3 First of all, this is a good bill. 4 I wish I had it when I was the youth officer 5 in Depew, New York, a number of years ago. If 6 you don't think there were gangs then, you're 7 wrong. 8 But the problem is -- and by the 9 way, this is a misdemeanor. In New York City, 10 it's like a traffic violation or a -- I mean, 11 nobody goes to jail in New York City for a 12 misdemeanor. It's ridiculous. If you shoot 13 somebody, it may get brought down to a 14 misdemeanor, let's be realistic. 15 Why do you want a bill like this? 16 For the average kid who's involved in a gang? 17 No. What you want this bill for is to get at 18 the leaders. 19 I happen to agree, Senator 20 Montgomery, with your assessment on youth 21 officers. The only trouble is, Ray Kelly, 22 who's probably the best commissioner of 23 police, in my opinion, in the country -- the 24 problem is, how could he get 400 youth 25 officers? The 800 cops he's got still leaves

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(518) 371-8910 1 him about 10,000 short of probably the numbers 2 he should have. And by the way, they're 3 probably underpaid. They really are. It's 4 hard to say that today, but they are. 5 But you've got to remember 6 something. Oh, yes, we should give more 7 treatment. And you're looking at a guy who 8 sponsored and I used to handle all the youth 9 stuff years ago. And we had a much bigger 10 youth budget then, although it's actually 11 not -- it wasn't bigger. It's probably about 12 the same. But the difference is we haven't 13 increased it, and that's true. 14 But I think we have to understand 15 that treatment's fine. By the way, we are not 16 locking up a generation in this state. That 17 is baloney. 75 percent of the inmates in our 18 prison system today are violent inmates. It 19 used to be 35. It's 25 percent nonviolent. 20 Most of them are pretty big offenders. And we 21 have shock incarceration. That's national 22 statistics -- and probably true, by the way. 23 California has got 185,000 inmates, I think it 24 is, and we got 62,0000. We were at the same 25 level just a few years ago.

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(518) 371-8910 1 I agree with you that we probably 2 locked up too many people. That's changed. 3 Thank goodness it's changed. We're now 4 being -- we're different. The only trouble we 5 have to watch out for is that we don't go back 6 to what happened before the Rockefeller Drug 7 Laws: just let everybody out, and sentence 8 them in New York City to one-fifth of what 9 they do upstate. 10 Those studies, by the way, do not 11 show that being tough on crime doesn't deter. 12 It does. But what it shows is that that's not 13 the only thing you've got to do. You've got 14 to do more than that. And I agree with that. 15 I'll only say this. This was Mike 16 Balboni's bill, who's now the head of criminal 17 justice [sic]. I think it was a good bill 18 then. I think it's still a good bill. I 19 commend John DeFrancisco. And I have to say 20 this, that we have to do more on both sides -- 21 more to deal with the criminal end, and we've 22 got to do more with the other side too, for 23 treatment. 24 I vote aye. 25 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Thank

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(518) 371-8910 1 you, Senator. You will be recorded in the 2 affirmative. 3 Senator Marcellino. 4 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Thank you, 5 Mr. President. 6 I, like Senator Volker, agree with 7 a lot of what's been said on both sides of 8 this argument. I commend Senator DeFrancisco 9 for picking up this very important bill. 10 Let's be clear. When we talk about 11 gangs, we are not talking about young people. 12 Many gangs that are out in my district, out in 13 my area, which some would consider mostly 14 affluent, are international gangs. They're 15 not arising from 13-year-olds and 12-year-olds 16 and 14-year-olds, they're 30-, 40- and 17 50-year-olds. And they answer to a higher 18 authority in their own sphere of opportunity 19 and of work. 20 They're a dangerous group. They 21 are recruiting young people by mechanisms of 22 enticement and sometimes flat-out coercion. 23 Any tools we can provide that will help us 24 give young people a means of saying no to 25 these people, a means of avoiding these

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(518) 371-8910 1 people, I think is a good thing. You have to. 2 You have to give them the opportunity to get 3 away from these criminals who are trying to 4 lure a generation of young people into them. 5 Programs for our young people to 6 keep them off the streets, to keep them 7 occupied? Great idea. Many exist. They 8 exist in the city now, and they exist on Long 9 Island. They exist everywhere in the state. 10 If we can find a more effective program that 11 will work and put it in, I'm all for it. Do 12 it. 13 But let's not throw the baby out 14 with the bathwater. You need the tools to 15 make it work. Sometimes the carrot is good, 16 but you also need the stick. 17 And I think Senator DeFrancisco's 18 bill is not an unreasonable measure and not an 19 unreasonable bill. I think it should be 20 passed and probably will be ultimately, if it 21 gets into the other house, negotiated and we 22 can probably include a lot of the other stuff 23 that's needed and that we want to make it a 24 better bill. 25 So let's pass this bill today and

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(518) 371-8910 1 move this discussion forward. I vote aye, 2 Mr. President. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Thank 4 you, Senator. You will be recorded in the 5 affirmative. 6 Senator Bonacic. 7 SENATOR BONACIC: Thank you, 8 Mr. President. 9 You know, gang activity is not an 10 issue that we should be polarized on on each 11 side. I remember a generation ago the biggest 12 threat of harm to our communities was 13 organized crime. And what police had to do at 14 that time, and law enforcement, they had to 15 become sophisticated in monitoring organized 16 crime -- eavesdropping, surveillance, 17 undercover operations. 18 This generation, the growth of gang 19 activity is rising, and it's becoming a threat 20 to our communities like the mob was a 21 generation ago. So the police and law 22 enforcement do not have the tools or the 23 sophistication that they would like to try to 24 impair growing criminal activity when it comes 25 to gangs.

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(518) 371-8910 1 It's in the schools. It's in the 2 inner cities. It's in the communities. It's 3 in African-American neighborhoods. It's in 4 Asian neighborhoods. It's in Caucasian 5 neighborhoods. It's in Hispanic 6 neighborhoods. It is creeping universally in 7 all our communities. 8 So the fact that we want to punish 9 young people more, I don't think that's the 10 intent of this legislation. The fact that we 11 need more money for youth programs, I say yes, 12 we do. Having more educational opportunities 13 and recreational opportunities for our youth. 14 It's not mutually exclusive to also supporting 15 giving law enforcement the tools that they 16 need so they can have more qualified people 17 working to try to stop the growing threat of 18 gang activity. 19 And the last point that I'd like to 20 make is there are parents out there that feel 21 helpless. They love their children, but they 22 can't prevent them from being lured, 23 intimidated, or seduced into gang activity. 24 And when we've had the dissolution 25 of the family unit over the last decade to two

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(518) 371-8910 1 decades, it gave the gangs an opportunity to 2 move in and fill that vacuum of so-called 3 family and belonging. And we know that that 4 is not true of what a real family does with 5 love and nourishment. That's an arena of 6 destruction, maybe death, but certainly maybe 7 jail confinement. 8 We are in this together. And I 9 respect those that vote no for the reasons 10 they've said. But keep in mind, we have to 11 work together on multiple approaches to solve 12 this problem. And I want to commend Senator 13 DeFrancisco for putting forth only a part of 14 the solution. Much more has to be done on 15 that. 16 I vote yes. Thank you, 17 Mr. President. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Thank 19 you, Senator. You will be recorded in the 20 affirmative. 21 Senator Diaz. 22 SENATOR DIAZ: Thank you, 23 Mr. President. 24 This is a bill that in the past I 25 have entertained and I have looked upon this

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(518) 371-8910 1 bill positively in the past. However, I have 2 to tell you that in this budget there were 3 $10 million for youth for after-school 4 programs, $10 million, and it was cut. When 5 we forget about our youth, forget about our 6 after-school programs, they keep on hanging 7 out there and doing nothing. 8 Listening to Senator Parker and 9 reading the paper this morning and listening 10 to the Senator that said that -- Volker -- 11 that said that commissioner -- the police 12 commissioner in the City of New York is the 13 best one in the nation, I agree with that. 14 He's a good police commissioner. However, 15 reading the paper this morning, the mayor of 16 the City of New York has given the kitchen, 17 the sink, the toilet, the bathroom and 18 everything else to those City Council members 19 that voted for the congestion pricing. It 20 says there's close to a billion dollars in 21 perks. 22 Then I have to question myself. 23 Police commissioner the best one, the mayor 24 giving out money for congestion pricing more 25 than what we're going to get from the federal

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(518) 371-8910 1 government. How come there is no money, how 2 come there is no money for after-school 3 programs? How come we have to keep cutting 4 money for our youth to keep them out of the 5 streets, to give them sports? 6 You know, my daughter lives upstate 7 here in New York. And when I visit my 8 daughter and the school that her children 9 goes, I mean they have tennis, they have 10 basketball, they have swimming, they have 11 horse racing, they have all kinds of 12 entertainment in upstate. 13 So, you know, but in the city there 14 is no money. There is no money to give them 15 sports, to give them something to keep them 16 out of the streets. 17 Yeah, gangs, of course we have 18 gangs. In New York we have the Bloods, the 19 Crips, the Latin Kings, the DDP -- Dominicans 20 Don't Play -- we have all kind of gangs. And 21 we have to eliminate them. We have to do away 22 with gangs. 23 But the only way that we're going 24 to do that is, as Senator Parker said, 25 providing our youth with decent, responsive

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(518) 371-8910 1 programs and after-school programs. That's 2 the only way. 3 Today I used to look at this bill 4 positively. After seeing that we cut 5 $10 million that we have put there for 6 after-school programs and to see the mayor 7 giving out the kitchen sink, the toilet, the 8 bathtub, and everything else for congestion 9 pricing and there is no money for youth 10 activity, ladies and gentlemen, I am voting 11 no. This is something that should not be 12 done. 13 Thank you very much. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Thank 15 you, Senator Diaz. You will be recorded in 16 the negative. 17 Senator Adams. 18 SENATOR ADAMS: Thank you, 19 Mr. President. 20 I just want to -- as a member of 21 the law enforcement community, and I will 22 always consider myself to be, I would have 23 loved to have a bill like this. But the 24 reality is police can't have whatever they 25 want. It's important for us to control their

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(518) 371-8910 1 powers. 2 And it's easy for us to sit in the 3 sterilized environment of the Senate floor and 4 talk about a misdemeanor arrest as no big 5 thing. And it concerns me that we have 6 embarked upon a culture of incarceration as 7 tolerable. And as I look up into the 8 bleachers and see these young people up here, 9 and we continue to say to them: So what if 10 you have handcuffs on, so what if you go 11 through central booking, so what if you're 12 arrested? 13 No, it's not "so what." When a 14 child is incarcerated, when they wear 15 handcuffs, every time they hear a police 16 siren, every time they see a police movie, 17 every time they see a police officer, they 18 relive that experience. There's nothing 19 normal about being arrested. There's nothing 20 just laissez-faire about being arrested. When 21 that cell door closes, you will hear it for 22 the rest of your life. 23 And we need to stop with this 24 insidious thought process of so what, they 25 just got a misdemeanor. No, a misdemeanor

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(518) 371-8910 1 stops you from being a police officer, it 2 stops you from having a Civil Service job, it 3 stops you from, when you become an adult, 4 being able to participate in society. 5 We are creating an environment 6 where countless numbers of people, under 7 Police Commissioner Kelly, have been stopped 8 and have been criminalized. And so I'm not 9 going to ever succumb to the belief and the 10 philosophy that handcuffing a person and 11 incarcerating them is a normal form of living 12 in the greatest city in the greatest nation on 13 this planet. No, that's wrong. That's wrong. 14 And I'm voting no to this bill. 15 We do have to do more about gangs; 16 I agree with Senator DeFrancisco. We do have 17 a major problem with gangs, and we do need to 18 find with a way to deal with the issue of 19 gangs. I think the problem has spread from 20 Long Island all the way up to our upstate 21 region. We must stop this issue with gangs. 22 But we can't send a message to our 23 young people that we are more willing to 24 invest in a pair of handcuffs than we are 25 willing to invest in an after-school program.

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(518) 371-8910 1 We can't send a message that we are more 2 willing to see them going to central booking 3 than we are willing to see them go to a 4 centralized environment where they can learn 5 from each other. 6 And I when we continue to submit 7 bills like this, that's the message that we 8 send. So I am voting no on this bill in hopes 9 that we start the process of showing that we 10 want to invest in our children's future and 11 not give them a terrible start from the 12 beginning with a misdemeanor arrest. It's 13 never just a misdemeanor, it is an arrest. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Thank 15 you, Senator. You will be recorded in the 16 negative. 17 Senator Craig Johnson. 18 SENATOR CRAIG JOHNSON: Thank 19 you, Mr. President. 20 I figure since it's my 21 predecessor's bill, I want to channel Senator 22 Balboni for a moment and speak. But I want to 23 speak on behalf and in favor of this 24 legislation. 25 And I remember as a county

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(518) 371-8910 1 legislator working with Senator Balboni in 2 Nassau County as he worked to secure more 3 funds for the Nassau County Police Department 4 for antigang activity and working on these 5 pieces of legislation. Because as my 6 colleague Senator Marcellino pointed out, gang 7 activity is not centralized in New York City 8 and the boroughs, it's spread like wildfire 9 and like weeds all across our great state and, 10 in particular, Long Island, where gangs like 11 MS-13 are popping up all over the place. 12 And like Senator Marcellino said, 13 and I agree, it's not just about teenagers. 14 It's about the 40- and 50-year-olds, the gang 15 leaders who are coming into town. 16 And I commend Senator DeFrancisco 17 for bringing this bill. And I agree with my 18 colleagues, we need to do more in terms of 19 funding. And maybe that day when we can 20 secure those funds and put those bills before 21 the Legislature and the State Senate is coming 22 soon. 23 But right now we need to do 24 something, because there's an important 25 component to this legislation and in reviewing

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(518) 371-8910 1 the bill, and that's about making it a crime 2 to deter somebody or to attempt to deter 3 another from leaving a criminal street gang. 4 I think there's a saying "Blood in and blood 5 out." And when you join a gang, it's blood 6 in, and when you try to leave a gang, it's 7 blood out. 8 And how can we not punish those who 9 attempt to keep within their grasps a young 10 man or a young woman who has decided -- maybe 11 through an after-school program that was lucky 12 to get funded, maybe by meeting a mentor and 13 having them persuade him or her to leave the 14 gang, leave that criminal enterprise -- how 15 can we not punish those who want to keep them 16 in? 17 That's what this bill does. That's 18 what this bill does. It says enough. And it 19 gives those people and those young people, 20 maybe older people, a second chance who are 21 trying to free themselves, and it punishes 22 those who try to keep them in. 23 And so I support this legislation 24 today. And it's not enough, it's not enough 25 for our young people. We don't want them to

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(518) 371-8910 1 even be exposed to these type of activities. 2 And we need to do more as a State Legislature. 3 But until that day when we can, we need to do 4 something else, and that's to punish those who 5 try to keep our young people within these 6 gangs. 7 So I vote yes, Mr. President. 8 Thank you. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Thank 10 you, Senator Johnson. You will be recorded in 11 the affirmative. 12 The clerk will continue to call the 13 roll. 14 (The Secretary called the roll.) 15 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 16 Announce the results when ready. 17 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 18 the negative on Calendar Number 419 are 19 Senators Adams, Diaz, Duane, Hassell-Thompson, 20 Huntley, L. Krueger, Montgomery, Parker, 21 Perkins, Sampson and Schneiderman. 22 Ayes, 43. Nays, 11. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 24 bill is passed. 25 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number

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(518) 371-8910 1 425, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 4295, an 2 act to amend the Penal Law and the Criminal 3 Procedure Law, in relation to creating. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Read 5 the last section. 6 THE SECRETARY: Section 9. This 7 act shall take effect on the first of 8 November. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Call 10 the roll. 11 (The Secretary called the roll.) 12 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 13 Announce the results. 14 THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 55. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 16 bill is passed. 17 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 18 528, by Senator Maziarz, Senate Print 112, an 19 act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law, in 20 relation to enacting criteria. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Read 22 the last section. 23 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This 24 act shall take effect on the first of 25 November.

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(518) 371-8910 1 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Call 2 the roll. 3 (The Secretary called the roll.) 4 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 5 Announce the results. 6 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 7 the negative on Calendar Number 528 are 8 Senators Hassell-Thompson, L. Krueger, 9 Montgomery, Parker, Perkins, Sampson and 10 Schneiderman. Also Senator Huntley. 11 Ayes, 47. Nays, 8. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 13 bill is passed. 14 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 15 532, by Senator Young, Senate Print 378, an 16 act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law, in 17 relation to eligibility for youthful offender 18 status. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Read 20 the last section. 21 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 22 act shall take effect on the first of 23 November. 24 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Call 25 the roll.

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(518) 371-8910 1 (The Secretary called the roll.) 2 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 3 Announce the results. 4 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 5 the negative on Calendar Number 532 are 6 Senators Connor, Duane, Hassell-Thompson, 7 Huntley, L. Krueger, Montgomery, Parker, 8 Perkins, Schneiderman and Stewart-Cousins. 9 Ayes, 46. Nays, 10. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 11 bill is passed. 12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 13 592, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 755, an 14 act authorizing the Town of Brookhaven, 15 Suffolk County. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: There 17 is a home-rule message at the desk. 18 Read the last section. 19 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This 20 act shall take effect immediately. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Call 22 the roll. 23 (The Secretary called the roll.) 24 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 25 Announce the results.

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(518) 371-8910 1 THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 56. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 3 bill is passed. 4 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 5 628, by Senator Alesi, Senate Print 163, an 6 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to the 7 crime of false personation. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Read 9 the last section. 10 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 11 act shall take effect on the first of 12 November. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Call 14 the roll. 15 (The Secretary called the roll.) 16 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 17 Senator Montgomery, to explain your vote. 18 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes, 19 Mr. President. 20 I know that I've debated this bill 21 in the past. I always have voted no on it, 22 and I will continue to do so because it simply 23 is another one of those bills that is 24 particularly, as I interpret it, directed 25 toward youth, and there is no apparent need

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(518) 371-8910 1 for this bill. It does not do anything to 2 improve the capacity of the police to do their 3 job. It simply removes the requirement that a 4 person must be informed by the police officer 5 of the consequences of misrepresenting himself 6 or herself. 7 There is no reason why the police 8 can't just say "If you do not tell me the 9 truth about who you are, you could be charged 10 with a Class A misdemeanor." I don't know why 11 Senator Alesi has decided that he does not 12 want people to have the information. 13 I think that we have -- I've never 14 heard a police officer complain that they had 15 to read the Miranda rights to a person. I've 16 certainly not heard any complaints from any 17 police officer, ever, that there is a problem 18 in them informing a person when they stop the 19 person that if you conduct this behavior, you 20 can be charged with X, Y or Z charge. 21 I think this is just an attempt to 22 make sure that any young person in particular, 23 or any person who makes the mistake, does not 24 know the consequences, can be charged without 25 them realizing that this is not acceptable.

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(518) 371-8910 1 So I'm going to vote no on it. I 2 don't see any need for it. And I think, 3 again, it is directed to young people, and 4 especially young people in districts like I 5 represent. So I'm voting no. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Thank 7 you, Senator Montgomery. You will be recorded 8 in the negative. 9 Announce the results. 10 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 11 the negative on Calendar Number 628 are 12 Senators Adams, Connor, Diaz, Duane, 13 Hassell-Thompson, Huntley, L. Krueger, 14 Montgomery, Parker, Perkins, Savino, 15 Schneiderman and Stewart-Cousins. Also 16 Senator Sampson. 17 Ayes, 43. Nays, 14. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 19 bill is passed. 20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 21 629, by Senator Morahan, Senate Print 248, an 22 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to 23 establishing the crime of unlawful possession. 24 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Read 25 the last section.

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(518) 371-8910 1 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 2 act shall take effect on the first of 3 November. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Call 5 the roll. 6 (The Secretary called the roll.) 7 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 8 Announce the results. 9 THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 57. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 11 bill is passed. 12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 13 631, by Senator Nozzolio, Senate Print 1448, 14 an act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to 15 establishing the crime of unlawful purchase. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Read 17 the last section. 18 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 19 act shall take effect on the first of 20 November. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Call 22 the roll. 23 (The Secretary called the roll.) 24 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 25 Announce the results.

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(518) 371-8910 1 THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 57. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 3 bill is passed. 4 Senator Breslin, why do you rise? 5 SENATOR BRESLIN: Yes, thank you, 6 Mr. President. 7 I would like the record to reflect 8 that on Calendar Number 528, S112, had I been 9 in chambers I would have voted in the 10 negative, as I have in the past. 11 Thank you, Mr. President. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 13 record will so reflect. 14 The Secretary will read. 15 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 16 632, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 1815, an 17 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to 18 assaults at sports contests. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Read 20 the last section. 21 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 22 act shall take effect on the first of 23 November. 24 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Call 25 the roll.

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(518) 371-8910 1 (The Secretary called the roll.) 2 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 3 Announce the results. 4 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 5 the negative on Calendar Number 632 are 6 Senators Hassell-Thompson, Montgomery and 7 Perkins. 8 Ayes, 54. Nays, 3. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 10 bill is passed. 11 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 12 636, by Senator DeFrancisco, Senate Print 13 2878, an act to amend the Criminal Procedure 14 Law, in relation to the victim's statement. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Read 16 the last section. 17 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 18 act shall take effect on the 60th day. 19 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Call 20 the roll. 21 (The Secretary called the roll.) 22 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 23 Announce the results. 24 THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 57. 25 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The

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(518) 371-8910 1 bill is passed. 2 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 3 638, by Senator Golden, Senate Print 3441, an 4 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to 5 assault. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Read 7 the last section. 8 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 9 act shall take effect on the first of 10 November. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Call 12 the roll. 13 (The Secretary called the roll.) 14 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 15 Announce the results. 16 THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 57. 17 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 18 bill is passed. 19 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 20 640, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 3949, an 21 act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law and 22 the Family Court Act, in relation to delivery. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Read 24 the last section. 25 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This

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(518) 371-8910 1 act shall take effect immediately. 2 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Call 3 the roll. 4 (The Secretary called the roll.) 5 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 6 Announce the results. 7 THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 57. 8 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 9 bill is passed. 10 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 11 641, by Senator Nozzolio, Senate Print 4043, 12 an act to amend the Penal Law and the 13 Correction Law, in relation to sexual conduct. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Read 15 the last section. 16 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 17 act shall take effect immediately. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Call 19 the roll. 20 (The Secretary called the roll.) 21 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 22 Announce the results. 23 THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 57. 24 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 25 bill is passed.

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(518) 371-8910 1 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 2 644, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 4789, an 3 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to 4 theft of credit card. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Read 6 the last section. 7 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 8 act shall take effect on the first of 9 November. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Call 11 the roll. 12 (The Secretary called the roll.) 13 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 14 Announce the results. 15 THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 57. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 17 bill is passed. 18 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 19 649, by Senator Golden, Senate Print 5730, an 20 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to 21 assault against employees. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Read 23 the last section. 24 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This 25 act shall take effect on the 90th day.

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(518) 371-8910 1 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Call 2 the roll. 3 (The Secretary called the roll.) 4 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 5 Senator DeFrancisco, to explain his vote. 6 SENATOR DeFRANCISCO: Yes, I vote 7 yes on this and also on Senate 3441, and my 8 remarks apply to both of them. 9 Because what we've been doing over 10 the years, and I've said this before, is we're 11 making so many exceptions as to what degree of 12 assault it is based upon who or what job the 13 individual has that we are almost at the point 14 where the exceptions eat up the general rule. 15 So I vote aye, but I would hope 16 that someday we would be in a position to 17 treat everybody the same. If the crime is 18 serious enough, it should be a certain level 19 of crime. If it's not as serious, it should 20 be a lesser crime no matter who the victim may 21 be. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Thank 23 you, Senator. You will be recorded in the 24 affirmative. 25 Senator Volker, to explain his

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(518) 371-8910 1 vote. 2 SENATOR VOLKER: Mr. President, 3 speaking in favor of this bill, I want to 4 totally agree with Senator DeFrancisco. My 5 problem is that the Assembly will not consider 6 any blanket increases. 7 There is no argument that I know 8 of -- well, outside of the City of New York -- 9 against that assault statutes should be 10 upgraded. This house for a whole decade has 11 passed general statutes, and not unreasonable, 12 I think, upgrading the assault statutes. Our 13 problem is that none of that has occurred. 14 And as a result, we have got some statutes 15 through the Assembly by specifying groups. 16 Personally, I happen to agree 17 entirely with Senator DeFrancisco. And I 18 strongly believe that Senator Golden would 19 probably agree with this. The problem is we 20 have to look at life the way it is. So that's 21 why this bill is here. 22 I vote aye. 23 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Thank 24 you, Senator. You will be recorded in the 25 affirmative.

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(518) 371-8910 1 Announce the results. 2 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 3 the negative on Calendar Number 649 are 4 Senators Montgomery and Perkins. 5 Ayes, 55. Nays, 2. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 7 bill is passed. 8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 9 657, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 6906, an 10 act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law, in 11 relation to notification. 12 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Read 13 the last section. 14 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This 15 act shall take effect immediately. 16 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Call 17 the roll. 18 (The Secretary called the roll.) 19 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 20 Announce the results. 21 THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 57. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 23 bill is passed. 24 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 25 658, by Senator C. Kruger, Senate Print 7011,

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(518) 371-8910 1 an act to amend Chapter 906 of the Laws of 2 1984 amending the Social Services Law. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Read 4 the last section. 5 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 6 act shall take effect immediately. 7 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: Call 8 the roll. 9 (The Secretary called the roll.) 10 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: 11 Announce the results. 12 THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 57. 13 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: The 14 bill is passed. 15 Senator Skelos, that completes the 16 noncontroversial reading of the calendar. 17 SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you, 18 Mr. President. 19 There will be an immediate meeting 20 of the Majority in the Majority Conference 21 Room. 22 And the Senate will stand at ease 23 and reconvene at 3:00 p.m. 24 ACTING PRESIDENT MORAHAN: There 25 will be an immediate meeting of the Majority

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(518) 371-8910 1 in the Majority Conference Room, and the 2 Senate will reconvene at 3:00 p.m. 3 (Whereupon, the Senate stood at 4 ease at 12:12 p.m.) 5 ACTING PRESIDENT HANNON: Senator 6 Skelos. 7 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, 8 there will be an immediate conference of the 9 Majority in the Majority Conference Room, and 10 the Senate will stand at ease. 11 ACTING PRESIDENT HANNON: 12 Immediate conference of the Majority in the 13 Majority Conference Room. 14 The Senate continues to stand at 15 ease. 16 (Whereupon, the Senate reconvened 17 at 4:39 p.m.) 18 ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: 19 Senator Skelos. 20 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, 21 the Senate will reconvene at 6:00 p.m. sharp. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: The 23 Senate will reconvene at 6:00 p.m. sharp. 24 SENATOR SKELOS: And we'll stand 25 at ease.

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(518) 371-8910 1 ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: The 2 Senate will continue to stand at ease. 3 (Whereupon, the Senate stood at 4 ease at 4:40 p.m.) 5 (Whereupon, the Senate reconvened 6 at 6:20 p.m.) 7 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: The 8 Senate will come to order. 9 Senator Skelos. 10 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, 11 there will be an immediate meeting of the 12 Finance Committee in the Majority Conference 13 Room. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: There 15 will be an immediate meeting of the Finance 16 Committee in the Majority Conference Room. 17 The Senate will stand at ease. 18 (Whereupon, the Senate stood at 19 ease at 6:21 p.m.) 20 (Whereupon, the Senate reconvened 21 at 6:27 p.m.) 22 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: Senator 23 Skelos. 24 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, 25 if we could return to reports of standing

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(518) 371-8910 1 committees for the report of the Finance 2 Committee. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: Reports 4 of standing committees. 5 The Secretary will read the report 6 of the Finance Committee. 7 THE SECRETARY: Senator O. 8 Johnson, from the Committee on Finance, 9 reports the following bill direct to third 10 reading: 11 Senate Print 6800D, Senate Budget 12 Bill, an act making appropriations for the 13 support of government: Public Protection and 14 General Government Budget. 15 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: Without 16 objection, the bill is reported direct to 17 third reading. 18 Senator Skelos. 19 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, 20 if we could take up Senate Bill 6800D. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: The 22 Secretary will read. 23 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number 24 712, Senate Budget Bill, Senate Print 6800D, 25 an act making appropriations for the support

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(518) 371-8910 1 of government: Public Protection and General 2 Government Budget. 3 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: Senator 4 Skelos. 5 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, 6 is there a message of necessity at the desk? 7 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: A 8 message of necessity is at the desk. 9 SENATOR SKELOS: Move to accept. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: All in 11 favor signify by saying aye. 12 (Response of "Aye.") 13 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: Any 14 opposed, nay. 15 (No response.) 16 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: The 17 message is accepted. 18 Read the last section. 19 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This 20 act shall take effect immediately. 21 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: Call 22 the roll. 23 (The Secretary called the roll.) 24 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: Senator 25 Krueger, to explain her vote.

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(518) 371-8910 1 SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you, 2 Mr. President. 3 I rise to explain that I cannot 4 vote for this bill. While there are certainly 5 pieces of it that I support, this bill is 6 literally hot off the presses. There is no 7 memo, which is required even with a message of 8 necessity under our new budget rules. 9 We continue to spend money without 10 having a revenue bill, the wrong way to do a 11 budget, to say the least. This is also the 12 general government and public protection bill, 13 but there's no general government money for 14 AIM funding for the City of New York or 15 revenue sharing for various cities and towns 16 and counties throughout the state. 17 So I feel it's an incomplete bill, 18 that we are doing it in the wrong order. We 19 should be figuring out our revenues before 20 we're spending our money. And while I hear 21 rumors that we might do revenue-sharing 22 somewhere else at a later time, the tradition 23 of this Legislature has been to put local 24 government money into the general government 25 budget.

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(518) 371-8910 1 So I do not believe this is a full 2 budget bill or a satisfactory one. I'll be 3 voting no. 4 Thank you, Mr. President. 5 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: Senator 6 Krueger will be recorded in the negative. 7 Anyone wishing to vote no please 8 signify by raising your hand. 9 Senator Schneiderman, to explain 10 his vote. 11 SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Thank you, 12 Mr. President. I also will be voting against 13 this bill. 14 I've been serving on the New York 15 State Sentencing Commission for the last 16 several months, and we've had public hearings, 17 we've had private meetings, we've had an array 18 of experts from all around the country, 19 including people from the universities and 20 programs of our own state. They have 21 consistently advised us, and I have concluded 22 and I think our final report will conclude, 23 that we know what works in terms of criminal 24 justice programing at this point in the 25 history of the United States.

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(518) 371-8910 1 We know that cognitive and 2 behavioral therapy works. We know what kinds 3 of alternative programs work. We know what 4 the rate track in criminal justice policy and 5 what is the wrong track. 6 I'm sorry to say that this budget 7 bill is as good an exhibit of the wrong track 8 in criminal justice policy as you could 9 possibly have. This favors incarceration over 10 treatment. Indeed, it takes it a step 11 further. It favors keeping prisons open, even 12 when we're not incarcerating anyone in those 13 prisons, over treatment. 14 The prisons that are kept open by 15 this bill -- and let's note, Mr. President, 16 that the Governor proposed, the Executive 17 Budget proposed closing prisons and the 18 Senate, this body, has taken responsibility 19 for and is indeed responsible for keeping 20 prisons open we do not need, at a projected 21 cost, this year, of $10 million a year, the 22 next year $33 million, ultimately up to around 23 $70 million a year. 24 In an atmosphere where we have a 25 budget crisis, where we're telling senior

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(518) 371-8910 1 centers we don't have enough money for you, 2 we're telling school districts we don't have 3 enough money for you, we are keeping prisons 4 open we don't need at a cost of $70 million a 5 year. What kind of public policy is that? 6 But wait, there is more. This 7 budget does not restore the funding that was 8 sought by the treatment community to expand 9 alternatives to incarceration treatment 10 programs and reentry programs. There is a 11 small restoration -- and we got the bill so 12 late that it's difficult for us to analyze it 13 as fully as we really should before we have to 14 vote on it -- but there's a $3.1 million 15 restoration in General Fund support for 16 alternatives to incarceration, $3.1 million. 17 The DOCS budget, the budget of the Department 18 of Corrections, is $3 billion. And so what 19 we're doing is adding $3 million for 20 alternatives to incarceration. 21 This is money well-spent. It has 22 been documented in study after study. And I 23 know that Senator Young expressed an interest 24 in studies of recidivism. There are dozens of 25 study of recidivism that we have before us in

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(518) 371-8910 1 the sentencing commission that consistently 2 show that cognitive behavioral therapy, 3 alternative programs, if you use a risk/needs 4 assessment instrument, reduce recidivism 5 significantly. 6 This is money well-spent. This 7 saves the state money. This gets our children 8 back into their communities, back as 9 productive members of society. This undoes 10 the last three decades of criminal justice 11 policy. We should be undoing the last three 12 decades of criminal justice policy that have 13 resulted in the United States having 3 million 14 people in prisons, virtually all of them 15 African-American and Latinos. 16 We are destroying communities by 17 continuing on the wrong track in criminal 18 justice policy. We are costing the taxpayers 19 of New York a fortune by continuing on the 20 wrong track in criminal justice policy. 21 I urge everyone in this house to 22 vote no, first of all because you haven't had 23 time to read the bill so you don't know what's 24 in it, but second of all because, to the 25 extent I have read it, it continues us on that

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(518) 371-8910 1 wrong track. 2 I'm voting no, Mr. President, and 3 urging everyone to do likewise. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: Senator 5 Schneiderman will be recorded in the negative. 6 Senator Nozzolio, to explain his 7 vote. 8 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Thank you, 9 Mr. President and my colleagues. 10 This Senate should be proud of the 11 fact that over the last decade the policies 12 initiated here have resulted in New York 13 State's crime rate dropping more dramatically 14 than any state crime-rate drop in the history 15 of our nation. 16 It's because we stood tall to 17 establish a zero tolerance for violence. We 18 passed, time and time again, legislation that 19 ended parole for violent felons, that 20 established a zero tolerance for violence, 21 that established a zero tolerance for sex 22 offenders, that established a zero tolerance 23 against the criminal element in our state. 24 The result of that has been 25 dramatic. It has been significant, and we

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(518) 371-8910 1 should all be proud of it. But those policies 2 have a consequence. And the consequence is 3 that the most violent of felons are kept 4 behind prison walls for longer periods of 5 time. 6 What we have is a correctional 7 system that requires rightsizing. And this 8 Senate, when hearing of the rightsizing by 9 taking a meat ax and cutting four correctional 10 facilities by the last governor, this Senate 11 conducted a hearing beyond the budget hearing 12 process and held the correctional 13 commissioner's feet to the fire and said: 14 Have you rationalized this system? Have you 15 insured the safety and integrity of the 16 system? And, most importantly, have you 17 protected the 25,000 brave men and women who 18 work in our correctional system today and 19 insured that no facility would be a tinderbox, 20 no facility would be a cause for violent riot 21 behavior? 22 Frankly, I am proud of the Senate, 23 and I thank Senator Volker, I thank those who 24 served on the public protection committees 25 that established that we will not close the

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(518) 371-8910 1 correctional facilities unless we have a total 2 system of our prisons rationalized in a way 3 that makes sense for our taxpayers. 4 And what was penny-wise in the 5 cutting of those facilities was 6 dollar-foolish, and that would cost, if the 7 prior governor's policies went into effect, 8 would cost our taxpayers many, many more 9 dollars than were allegedly being saved under 10 the proposal. 11 So I thank those who supported 12 this. I know that those brave men and women 13 who walk the toughest law enforcement beat in 14 America are thankful for our stand to 15 rationalize the correctional system in a way 16 that is meaningful and protective. 17 Our conference has never stated 18 that you build prisons to grow jobs. That's 19 not why you grow prisons and build prisons and 20 save prisons. You do establish a policy 21 that's protective of our citizenry. And 22 that's why this conference and this Senate is 23 going to support this legislation. 24 Before I sit down, I also wish to 25 add that the school resource officer program,

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(518) 371-8910 1 a way to prevent gang violence, to prevent 2 violence and all kinds of other crime and 3 criminality across our state in our schools, 4 is being maintained by this legislation. And 5 for that, Mr. President, I think it's a great 6 step in the right direction and I thank all 7 those who stood to support this important 8 issue. 9 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: Senator 10 Nozzolio will be recorded in the affirmative. 11 Senator Saland, to explain his 12 vote. 13 SENATOR SALAND: Thank you, 14 Mr. President. 15 I too rise, as did Senator 16 Nozzolio, with regard to the effect that this 17 bill will have on our correction system. 18 A number of weeks ago I had the 19 opportunity to attend a forum in my district 20 at a local community college in which the 21 Commissioner of Corrections was speaking in 22 the context of the closure of Hudson 23 Correctional Facility, a facility that was at 24 or near capacity, had been at or near 25 capacity, a facility that the corrections

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(518) 371-8910 1 people had identified as virtually a model 2 facility, high grades in virtually every 3 aspect you could think of, and very much taken 4 by surprise by the proposal to close. 5 And I had to listen to the 6 commissioner at that event basically say, in 7 response to a question from one of the over 8 400 people there expressing their concerns 9 about the closure, I had to listen to him say: 10 "I don't care what the Legislature does, I'm 11 closing this facility." 12 Well, I suspect that any one of 212 13 legislators would have found that to be a 14 totally unacceptable way to deal with the 15 issue, would have probably been not merely 16 personally offended, but offended on behalf of 17 the entire institution that the administrative 18 official would just basically blow off the 19 Legislature in that fashion. 20 This facility has, as I said, been 21 an exemplary facility. It's been a facility 22 that run at capacity or near capacity for as 23 long as anybody can remember. It's a facility 24 which had seen literally millions of dollars 25 worth of improvements provided to make it an

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(518) 371-8910 1 even better facility. And to say one was 2 perplexed by its suggested closing would be an 3 understatement. 4 The bottom line is that this bill 5 will preserve that facility as an ongoing 6 facility. It will not only serve the same 7 function as it has always served as a 8 correctional facility, but I would add, very 9 vitally, in a community, a city and in a 10 county that has an extraordinarily challenging 11 time today to have disrupted so many lives, 12 will have a major impact not only on the 13 social fabric of the community but also on the 14 economic fabric of the community. 15 And I'm thankful that we were able 16 to accomplish this, and I'm thankful that we 17 will be able to go forward with regard to a 18 mainstay in our corrections system and a 19 mainstay in our community. 20 I vote in favor of this measure, 21 Mr. President, and thank you. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: Senator 23 Saland will be recorded in the affirmative. 24 Senator Diaz, to explain his vote. 25 SENATOR DIAZ: Yes, sir. Thank

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(518) 371-8910 1 you, Mr. President. 2 You know, this is my fifth year 3 here in the Senate. And I could say that 4 those five years there has never been a good 5 budget, the perfect budget. And I don't think 6 that there's ever going to be a perfect budget 7 that we could all agree upon. 8 So there is always going to be 9 problems that some people don't like, other 10 people like. See, in this budget, there is 11 not everything that I would like to see. But 12 as I said before, when is it that we are going 13 to have the perfect budget? I doubt that we 14 are ever going to have one. 15 I have to congratulate the new 16 Governor, David Paterson, because in the few 17 days since he took charge of the governorship, 18 he managed to get to an agreement with Senator 19 Bruno, with Shelly Silver from the Assembly, 20 to come to a budget. 21 It is not a perfect budget. There 22 will never be a perfect budget, and I'm 23 repeating myself again and again on that. But 24 it's a budget that we could live with. 25 And again, I have to congratulate

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(518) 371-8910 1 the three parties, especially the new 2 Governor. In such a short time, he managed to 3 get people together, to work together without 4 the fight that we usually see here in the five 5 years that I have been here. So there have 6 been no bad discrepancies, without big fights. 7 So congratulations to the three 8 parties, congratulations to the new Governor. 9 And you can count me yes. 10 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: Senator 11 Diaz will be recorded in the affirmative. 12 If there are no other Senators 13 wishing to explain their vote -- Senator 14 DeFrancisco. 15 SENATOR DeFRANCISCO: Yes, I just 16 wanted to mention very briefly that I'm going 17 to vote yes on this budget, and there were a 18 couple of comments made earlier that I wanted 19 to respond to. 20 First of all, there was a comment 21 made that it was the Republicans in the Senate 22 that required these prisons to stay open. I 23 was on the Joint Committee for Public 24 Protection, and there was a debate, a very 25 good debate, a very comprehensive debate. And

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(518) 371-8910 1 the decision by both the Democrats and the 2 Republicans from the Senate and the 3 Republicans and Democrats from the Assembly 4 was basically that it was not a wise idea to 5 close the prisons without a comprehensive 6 study done to determine long-range use and 7 needs of the prison system. 8 So I think that was a reasonable 9 determination, rather than cutting prisons 10 just because it's a budgetary issue. So I 11 think there was a bipartisan effort on that 12 part. 13 And lastly, with respect to the 14 comment that was made that we don't have 15 enough money for our schools but we've got 16 money to have prisons open, it's recently been 17 reported that the State of New York is 18 65 percent over the national median in aid to 19 education and number one as far as the amount 20 spent per child in education. 21 So, you know, we can be maybe 22 embarrassed about some things we do, but to 23 suggest that we are not keeping up a 24 reasonable amount of education per pupil I 25 don't think is a fair comparison. And in any

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(518) 371-8910 1 event, it has nothing to do with whether to 2 open or close prisons. Those are issues that 3 should be done as a matter of policy and 4 study. 5 I vote aye. 6 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: Senator 7 DeFrancisco will be recorded in the 8 affirmative. 9 Senator Hassell-Thompson, to 10 explain her vote. 11 SENATOR HASSELL-THOMPSON: Yes, 12 just very briefly. Thank you, Mr. President. 13 This morning I talked about one of 14 the legislative initiatives that was put 15 forward, and I voted no for it because of the 16 direction that it and other bills like it 17 seemed to be taking in this chamber. 18 And while I think that there are 19 many aspects of this budget that I certainly 20 can endorse and am very appreciative of, I too 21 believe that in light of these numbers that I 22 think that Senator Nozzolio quoted earlier, 23 the way crime has been reduced and the 24 policies he gives this chamber credit for 25 instigating, somehow that's not consistent

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(518) 371-8910 1 with the fact that we want to keep prisons 2 open. 3 If there are no prisoners, why are 4 we keeping the prisons open? If we've been as 5 tough on crime as many of my colleagues have 6 said, then the numbers of people going to jail 7 certainly has been reduced. I know that's 8 tongue in cheek, intentionally. The reality 9 is, however, we should not be spending money 10 to keep prisons open. 11 And whether or not we're spending 12 more money in the State of New York than any 13 other state, I applaud the state. I applaud 14 the state because, number one, we have some of 15 the most significant populations of people 16 with the greatest need that come to the State 17 of New York, and they have a right to expect 18 that those needs will be met educationally. 19 So I applaud us for finally taking the major 20 steps that we need to begin to take to talk 21 about education. 22 But I still don't think that when 23 we talk about prisons that we should be 24 comparing the dollars that we put in prisons 25 with the dollars that we put in education. I

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(518) 371-8910 1 think we need to be comparing apples with 2 apples. And the apples are that we need to be 3 doing more alternatives, we ought to be using 4 the lowered numbers of prisoners in our 5 facilities to look at reuse for some of these 6 facilities. We talk about the fact that we 7 have AIDS and HIV in prison and we have no 8 facilities to put them. We should be using 9 them as treatment centers. 10 We have a rare opportunity to do 11 some extraordinary things in the State of 12 New York. And I repeat myself again: When we 13 become more creative and stop throwing money 14 at things and thinking that giving a few 15 dollars and giving a few jobs is what's really 16 important, we need to be retrofitting the 17 people that are in these jobs so that they can 18 do the work of the people of the State of 19 New York based on what is needed, not based on 20 what's expedient. 21 Thank you, Mr. President. 22 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: Senator 23 Hassell-Thompson will be recorded in the 24 negative. 25 Senator Montgomery, to explain her

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(518) 371-8910 1 vote. 2 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes, 3 Mr. President, briefly. 4 I just want to, in carrying further 5 the issue that was raised by my colleague 6 Senator Hassell-Thompson, I certainly -- there 7 are some parts of the budget that I am very 8 appreciative of. I'm very happy that the 9 Governor has recommended that we establish a 10 way of dealing with people who violate parole, 11 especially the technical parole violators. 12 I don't know if you realize, but 13 the largest percent of people who are returned 14 to prison are coming in there for technical 15 violations. Which means they did not commit 16 another crime, they had a technicality breach. 17 And so we're looking for a different way of 18 dealing with that, and I'm thankful for that. 19 And there are some other positive aspects. 20 But I must say that it's very 21 shameful and embarrassing and disgraceful for 22 a state as wealthy as ours to have a system 23 that part of our state that relies so heavily 24 on this incarceration program. I think that 25 other parts of the world look at us and we

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(518) 371-8910 1 should be absolutely ashamed of this. 2 And most of those people who are 3 incarcerated are black and brown, over 4 80 percent of them. Isn't that disgraceful, 5 Mr. President? 6 We cannot allow our state to 7 continue to represent this reprehensible 8 situation. We need an economy that is based 9 on progress, based on our wonderful university 10 system, that should be the engine for creating 11 new opportunities for young people so that our 12 young people don't abandon the upstate regions 13 of our state. 14 We need to have a system where our 15 economy drives our business and that we don't 16 rely on the incarceration, the penitentiary 17 system to carry the region of our state, and 18 that that penitentiary system relies on mining 19 communities like mine of black and brown 20 people so that can you continue to claim that 21 you have an economy upstate. This is 22 disgraceful. 23 And so I'm voting against this not 24 because of the positive things in it -- I wish 25 I could -- but I must make a statement that I

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(518) 371-8910 1 do not agree with this direction. We need 2 to -- if we could save $10 million closing 3 down those facilities, I would be happy to see 4 that $10 million used as a way of looking at 5 where can we go to move our state away from 6 this horrible program that we have to fight 7 every year to keep prisons open because our 8 communities are going to shut down because 9 they don't have jobs and the only jobs that 10 they have that we have to offer are prisons. 11 So I'm against that. We need to do 12 something different. The Governor has tried 13 to move us in that direction. All of us in 14 this room should be willing to take a step 15 away from these prisons as a means of making 16 our economy work. 17 I'm voting no, Mr. President. 18 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: Senator 19 Montgomery will be recorded in the negative. 20 Seeing no other Senator wishing to 21 explain his vote, the clerk will announce the 22 results. 23 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in 24 the negative on Calendar Number 712 are 25 Senators Adams, Hassell-Thompson, Huntley,

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(518) 371-8910 1 L. Krueger, Montgomery, Parker, Perkins and 2 Schneiderman. 3 Ayes, 52. Nays, 8. 4 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: The 5 bill is passed. 6 Senator Skelos. 7 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, 8 is there any other business at the desk? 9 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: There 10 is none. 11 SENATOR SKELOS: There being 12 none, I move we stand adjourned until 13 Thursday, April 3rd, at 1:00 p.m. 14 ACTING PRESIDENT ROBACH: The 15 Senate will stand adjourned until Thursday, 16 April 3rd, at 1:00 p.m. 17 (Whereupon, at 6:53 p.m., the 18 Senate adjourned.) 19 20 21 22 23 24 25

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